Canada - Barry, 75, & Honey Sherman, 70, found dead, Toronto, 15 Dec 2017 #1

[Inthedetails]

So it looks like it wasn't him who did it.

I'm thinking that if this was a murder-suicide, the "matching" jackets are to give the impression it was a double-suicide where both victims willingly died together.

jmo

 

[Twinkle]

On a road trip so unable to follow close. Did i read there were staff at the house? Any speculation on who? Possibly a housekeeper? A housekeeper probably never had any reason to be in pool area. The area is very remote from living area of house.

Sent from my SM-G950W using Tapatalk

 

[Researchnut]

Wayne Millard's home sold.So did the farm in Ayer.
When you are worth billions, a mere 7 million is peanuts IMO
Also, wanted to add that donating money to charities in Canada is a huge write off in income taxes.
How much interest is paid on almost 7 billion dollars? Not including investment income.

 

[dotr]

Neighbour and long time friend comments on the state of security at the Sherman household, particularly at night when the female who usually answers the door is presumably absent.
Repost radio interview with Murray Rubin.
http://www.cbc.ca/listen/shows/as-it-happens/segment/15248554
@ 4:50

 

[otto]

Private home with large garage. Floor plans have been posted.

Here are the floor plans:

http://media.houssmax.ca/201711/29/5a1f32afd3797.pdf

This is the photo gallery of the house:

http://houssmax.ca/vtour/h3925515/type/unbrand

 

[BUF]

I'm thinking that if this was a murder-suicide, the "matching" jackets are to give the impression it was a double-suicide where both victims willingly died together.

jmo

Were they 'matching' jackets...sorry (honestly), something I maybe missed? Or could they have been jackets that they had been wearing outside and maybe were abducted when they were returning home from somewhere?

 

[liz b.]

I'm thinking that if this was a murder-suicide, the "matching" jackets are to give the impression it was a double-suicide where both victims willingly died together.

jmo

But LE seems to know that Honey died in another place in the house. So, how did they know this so definitively ? What did the other crime scene look like, I wonder. If LE figures this out so quickly, it must have been somewhat obvious ? So, it kind of defeats the purpose of staging the scene by the pool, with the belts, giving the impression that the COD in BOTH murders was the same ? Really strange, jmo

 

[Inthedetails]

Were they 'matching' jackets...sorry (honestly), something I maybe missed? Or could they have been jackets that they had been wearing outside and maybe we're abducted when they were returning home from somewhere?

I put "matching" in "quotation marks" not because they were literally matching jackets but because they were worn in the same way. Both victims had on jackets that seems to restrain their arms, and in that sense they are "matching."

We have no indication what the jackets looked like.

Hope that clears up my use of the word and quotation marks.

 

[kiwi50]

An assassin could have been in the back of their car forcing them to drive into their garage at gunpoint, emerging once inside the garage and security cameras switched off. Stuff of the Bond movies. Chose not to use the gun to make it look like suicide because BS didn't own a gun possibly.

Or simply hid outside garage and raced in as the door opened, and used couples own jackets to restrain them.
Has it been confirmed if the security camera in the garage was always on, and that it was suddenly switched off?
Still on the fence here. Maybe we will get some clues from the memorial service what those closest to the couple really believe.

 

[dotr]

http://www.metronews.ca/news/canada...erman-will-be-tough-to-replace-at-apotex.html

Apotex has grown to employ more than 10,000 people around the world, with annual revenue of more than $2 billion from sales of about 300 prescription medicines, according to its website.


But while it boasts of providing Canadians with affordable medicines, University of Ottawa law professor Amir Attaran said his research shows that Apotex drugs are often sold in Canada for much higher prices than in other parts of the world.

"The company has got huge challenges," he said on Tuesday. "Barry's management was so integral to the way the company ran.

"He's often portrayed as having launched generic products to save Canadians money. That is abject B.S. because the prices he charged for his generics in Canada are far above what he charged in other countries."

Apotex declined comment on the allegations.

Last spring, a study published in the Canadian Medical Association Journal reported that Canada had the second-highest medication costs to treat certain common conditions in 2015 compared to nine other affluent countries with universal health-care systems.

Lead author Steven Morgan, a professor at the University of British Columbia's Public School of Health, said prices in Canada for generic drugs like those made by Apotex are among the highest in the world.

Goodman remembers being Sherman's boss after his employer at the time, California-based ICN Pharmaceuticals, bought Empire from Sherman in the early 1970s. After about six months, he was ordered to fire Sherman and reluctantly did so.


"I fired him. He would tell me later that was the best thing that ever happened to him," said Goodman. "He says, 'Don't worry about it, Morris, I was planning to quit anyhow.' And he started Apotex (in 1974).

"So we stayed competitors and more or less friends. He was a very competitive guy."

Goodman said times are tough in the generic drug industry these days, pointing out the largest company in the world, Teva Pharmaceutical Industries Ltd. of Israel, announced earlier this month it would cut 14,000 jobs, more than a quarter of its workforce, to save $3 billion in annual costs by the end of 2019.

Teva hasn't said how the cuts might affect its 1,100 staff in Canada.

 

[Tortoise]

But LE seems to know that Honey died in another place in the house. So, how did they know this so definitively ? What did the other crime scene look like, I wonder. If LE figures this out so quickly, it must have been somewhat obvious ? So, it kind of defeats the purpose of staging the scene by the pool, with the belts, giving the impression that the COD in BOTH murders was the same ? Really strange, jmo

What comes to my mind is the elimination of body waste that occurs with death.

 

[Boodles]

I'm thinking that if this was a murder-suicide, the "matching" jackets are to give the impression it was a double-suicide where both victims willingly died together.

jmo

I’m trying to catch up on this case. Where is there a reference to the “jackets” being mentioned? I’ve only read a few of the articles linked, but so far haven’t seen anything about jackets. TIA.

 

[otto]

I’m trying to catch up on this case. Where is there a reference to the “jackets” being mentioned? I’ve only read a few of the articles linked, but so far haven’t seen anything about jackets. TIA.

"Sources say investigators found the Shermans, side by side, in their windowless pool room, each with a men’s leather belt wrapped around their necks and tied to the pool railing. Both had on jackets that were pulled “behind their backs” and rolled down over their arms.

It is believed the camera in the pool area had been disconnected."

http://torontosun.com/news/local-news/warmington-mystery-shrouds-deaths-of-billionaire-couple

 

[dotr]

I’m trying to catch up on this case. Where is there a reference to the “jackets” being mentioned? I’ve only read a few of the articles linked, but so far haven’t seen anything about jackets. TIA.

That information was not released by LE. but from a local news source.
http://www.foxnews.com/world/2017/1...ife-cant-be-murder-suicide-friends-claim.html

Barry and Honey Sherman were found hanging side by side Friday in a windowless room at their North York home with men’s leather belts tied around their necks and a pool railing, wearing jackets that bound their arms behind their backs, the Toronto Sun reported.
"I don't believe for a second, I think it's impossible," Fred Waks, a longtime family friend, told CBC Toronto on Monday when asked if he thought the deaths were a case of murder-suicide. "I don't believe it, and none of us believe it."
Waks said that he knew Sherman, the chairman of generic-drug maker Apotex, for 14 years, and that one of his daughters was set to be married while another just had a baby.
"They still walked hand in hand; they had everything in life to be looking forward to,” Waks said.

 

[JDG]

Why not to wait and finish selling the house? Who will want to pay millions to live in a house with a double (...)?
If it was planned, why even start selling the house? What was that trigger to abrupt own live(s)?

Seems a lot of dignitaries (including PM) will come to a memorial. Would they really go to a murders's funeral?

Yes, still many questions to answer or to hear more details. Hope, that Toronto LE learnt their lesson from the Wyane Millard case, it will be not closed too soon.

If one could afford the upkeep of the home, it will sell for a very reasonable price but one would need to get past the crime that occurred there. Its a lovely home, in a great part of Toronto. I imagine developers will be lined up to buy it, knock it down and build a new house on the property.
I wouldn't let the crime keep me from purchasing it once its been cleaned up. Crime scenes are all over the place but we go to them. Just my opinion.

The Shermans raised a lot of money for the Prime Minister and the Liberal Party, of course he's coming to their Memorial Service.

I agree about the LE learning from the Wayne Millard case, along with others. This case is very unusual though, wonder if it will ever get sorted?

These are just my opinions.

 

[Snoop Sister]

Neighbour and long time friend comments on the state of security at the Sherman household, particularly at night when the female who usually answers the door is presumably absent.
Repost radio interview with Murray Rubin.
http://www.cbc.ca/listen/shows/as-it-happens/segment/15248554
@ 4:50

From the above radio link....The neighbour stated that if someone rang the doorbell at night, the door would open. No clue what he means by this. With the well established security firm/system the Shermans used, one would think there would be door bell cameras ( I have them). The neighbour makes it sound like the doors would automatically open. Am I misunderstanding something?

 

[zencompass]

The first mention of "sources" stating jackets pulled back onto their arms is from this Toronto Sun article:

http://torontosun.com/news/local-news/warmington-mystery-shrouds-deaths-of-billionaire-couple

The second mention is from the Daily Mail, quoting the Toronto Sun statement:
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-5195537/Billionaire-Canadian-couple-strangled-belts.html



We still do not know how reliable this "source" is that the Toronto Sun mentioned about the jackets.

In my opinion, jackets being pulled back onto their arms looks like a double murder happened.

However, until I learn how "viable" this source is, or to hear it from another reporter, I can't really believe the jackets story.

The "source" could be unreliable or the source could be wrong. Who knows at this point? Until it's confirmed.

 

[Abundance]

Is the memorial service going to be televised or on the internet?

 

[kemo]

Along with the family, most people do not want this to turn out to be a murder-suicide. The possibility that a well respected, prominent civic leader, businessman and father could have had some dark character flaw lurking behind his admired facade is disconcerting. It raises the possibility that anyone could be hiding the same ugly tendencies.

Elderly men, of all demographic groups, are the most likely to commit suicide. Declining health or a very serious medical diagnosis is usually the prime factor but loneliness, perceived loss of status or fear of dependency are often factors. I can find no correlation of that type of suicide with Murder-Suicides.

Murder-Suicides of spouses usually involve situations where the wife is leaving the husband and the husband feels humiliated and sees his live going downhill while his wife will go on to a better life without him. Some murder-suicides do occur when one person kills the other in a fit of rage an then commit suicide out of remorse or just fear of legal consequences. It such a case, the injuries to the victim would be obvious. Is it possible that Sherman strangled Honey and thought of the double suicide by hanging afterward?

Occasionally, when both members of the couple are extremely infirm, there could be a “ mercy killing-suicide but that does nor appear to be the case.

I don’t know how things work in Canada but it seems highly unlikely that political pressure to force a cover up of a murder-suicide. I would expect the police or Coroner or who ever would make such a determination to be especially diligent in this case and to be prepared to defend that ruling. It this found to be a double murder, this would become the #1 open investigation in Canada and would require a tremendous expenditure of resources until solved and would threaten the careers of LE personnel who are unable to solve it. A double homicide of this nature that goes unsolved would create serious political problems. Nobody is going to rule this a double murder to appease the family no matter how much influence they have.

We do not yet know the condition of both bodies, the evidence found at the crime scenes, what has been found on the security video and whether it was possible for someone to enter and leave the house undetected. Presumably this will all come out.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

 

[zencompass]

I agree, Kemo.

As you say: "We do not yet know the condition of both bodies, the evidence found at the crime scenes, what has been found on the security video and whether it was possible for someone to enter and leave the house undetected. Presumably this will all come out."

Were there defense wounds on one person but not the other?

I feel the "clues" needed to differentiate between a murder-suicide and a double-murder just have not been released yet.

If the jackets story is true and verified, then it looks to me as if it were a double murder.

I see that other Canadian newspapers are not running with the jackets story. Only the DailyMail which quotes the Toronto Sun.

I agree with their children that this needs to be an objective and thorough investigation.

Every single event like this needs that.