Canada - Barry, 75, & Honey Sherman, 70, found dead, Toronto, 15 Dec 2017 #12

[WINDSOR]

rickcross, good points. I have a hunch the TPS have a suspect(s) for the following reasons.
First neither the TPS nor the Greenspan team have asked the public for assistance in quite some time. When LE is stumped, they ask for help, when the have a suspect, they do not.

Second, I am assuming that the perpetrator(s) are sophisticated and have the funds to hire the best legal team if charged. Therefore the TPS will want irrefutable evidence and corroboration before laying charges. That usually takes time and further investigation.

Third, no doubt the TPS is surveilling the suspect(s) in search of further evidence and to ensure the suspect(s) do not commit further crimes.

In some investigations, years go by before charges are laid.

 

[dotr]

Meanwhile, an interesting and in depth article about the pharma industry, not necessarily related to the murders, although Apotex is referenced, obviously..
Aug 12 2019
Part 3
Big pharma pours millions into medical schools — here’s how it can impact education

"This is the third story in a four-part series about the pharmaceutical industry and the hold it has on Canada’s health-care system — swaying doctors’ opinions, funding medical schools and, ultimately, affecting the type of drugs we are prescribed. To read Part 1, click here. To read Part 2, click here.

When Dr. Elia Abi-Jaoude was a medical student at the University of Manitoba in the early 2000s, he found out drug companies were donating textbooks — and he wasn’t pleased."

 

[rickcross]

rickcross, good points. I have a hunch the TPS have a suspect(s) for the following reasons.
First neither the TPS nor the Greenspan team have asked the public for assistance in quite some time. When LE is stumped, they ask for help, when the have a suspect, they do not.

Second, I am assuming that the perpetrator(s) are sophisticated and have the funds to hire the best legal team if charged. Therefore the TPS will want irrefutable evidence and corroboration before laying charges. That usually takes time and further investigation.

Third, no doubt the TPS is surveilling the suspect(s) in search of further evidence and to ensure the suspect(s) do not commit further crimes.

In some investigations, years go by before charges are laid.

I would go along with you on this but for one thing, it was revealed in court some months ago that there was only one officer working full time on the case. Seems to me that given how high profile a case this is and the amount of resources that were put in to the initial investigation, there would be a team dedicated to the case, especially if they had a credible suspect.

 

[ldlager]

rickcross, good points. I have a hunch the TPS have a suspect(s) for the following reasons.
First neither the TPS nor the Greenspan team have asked the public for assistance in quite some time. When LE is stumped, they ask for help, when the have a suspect, they do not.

Second, I am assuming that the perpetrator(s) are sophisticated and have the funds to hire the best legal team if charged. Therefore the TPS will want irrefutable evidence and corroboration before laying charges. That usually takes time and further investigation.

Third, no doubt the TPS is surveilling the suspect(s) in search of further evidence and to ensure the suspect(s) do not commit further crimes.

In some investigations, years go by before charges are laid.

I hope you are correct. My hunch for some time is to follow the money. Who stood to benefit most from both of their deaths?

 

[casesensitive]

I have never heard that TPS ever agreed to the offer to put a rep on the reward panel set up by Greenspan. I recall that Chief Saunders said he would consider it. I wonder why this never happened? I wonder if the tip line has generated any useful suspect names or "theories". That might (hopefully) explain why both TPS and Greenspan are not talking to the media.

 

[Tripod]

Unfortunately for those of us that are following this case there have been no updates since Gomes announced this to be a double murder. Given that LE was under huge scrutiny for even contemplating this was a murder suicide, you would think that they could have made public at least one fact that would confirm their opinion. But no, we never heard another word from her, and despite a relatively unspectacular career as a homicide detective, she was promoted to a very high level management position. This is one of the highest profile cases in Toronto history, yet there is absolutely nothing being said about it by LE. No updates. No appeals to the public for info. Nothing. In my opinion that means one of two things, that they have a suspect, or that they are sweeping this under the carpet.

It has been this case that educated me on just how tight-lipped LE in Canada is. Of course, that has it's pros and cons and totally frustrates we, the public. I do hope family members of victims get at least smidgens of updates every now and then, but it wouldn't surprise me if they did not.

 

[rickcross]

I hope you are correct. My hunch for some time is to follow the money. Who stood to benefit most from both of their deaths?

Well, considering its been reported that Barry was planning to give a large chunk of his fortune to charity, the kids seem to be the biggest benefactors of their early deaths.

 

[rickcross]

I have never heard that TPS ever agreed to the offer to put a rep on the reward panel set up by Greenspan. I recall that Chief Saunders said he would consider it. I wonder why this never happened? I wonder if the tip line has generated any useful suspect names or "theories". That might (hopefully) explain why both TPS and Greenspan are not talking to the media.

I hate to be blunt about this but in my opinion Greenspan was hired for one purpose, to sway TPS from pursuing the murder/suicide theory. His job is done and I doubt we'll hear anything more from him, unless LE has a change in direction.

 

[rickcross]

It has been this case that educated me on just how tight-lipped LE in Canada is. Of course, that has it's pros and cons and totally frustrates we, the public. I do hope family members of victims get at least smidgens of updates every now and then, but it wouldn't surprise me if they did not.

I totally understand LE's need to keep quiet about some things. However, lets be perfectly clear, they work for us and should be accountable to us. A year and a half with no updates from LE is simply unacceptable. Also, this site will only allow discussion of information that comes from LE or from mainstream media. Unfortunately MSM for the most part relies on LE to give them information. So ALL our information comes from one source. Now if LE decides to cover something up, in this case by labeling it a double murder rather than a M/S, how would the public ever figure that out? Reporters rely on LE and I highly doubt that they would jeopardize that relationship by suggesting a police coverup. LE obviously aren't going to admit to it. And the one place where discussion of the case exists will not allow the subject to be discussed without LE or MSM discussing it first. Those that have pursued the subject in the past seem to have been banned.

I am not say that this was a police coverup, but I am saying that the possibility certainly exists and there is actually evidence that might support the idea. Unfortunately freedom of speech seems to no longer be tolerated either here or in MSM, so it is very possible that we will never hear another word about this case beyond the annual reminders that another year has passed with no progress.

 

[dotr]

I totally understand LE's need to keep quiet about some things. However, lets be perfectly clear, they work for us and should be accountable to us. A year and a half with no updates from LE is simply unacceptable. Also, this site will only allow discussion of information that comes from LE or from mainstream media. Unfortunately MSM for the most part relies on LE to give them information. So ALL our information comes from one source. Now if LE decides to cover something up, in this case by labeling it a double murder rather than a M/S, how would the public ever figure that out? Reporters rely on LE and I highly doubt that they would jeopardize that relationship by suggesting a police coverup. LE obviously aren't going to admit to it. And the one place where discussion of the case exists will not allow the subject to be discussed without LE or MSM discussing it first. Those that have pursued the subject in the past seem to have been banned.

I am not say that this was a police coverup, but I am saying that the possibility certainly exists and there is actually evidence that might support the idea. Unfortunately freedom of speech seems to no longer be tolerated either here or in MSM, so it is very possible that we will never hear another word about this case beyond the annual reminders that another year has passed with no progress.

KW is still here and as such can override MSM requirements as a verified insider, imo.

 

[WINDSOR]

I would go along with you on this but for one thing, it was revealed in court some months ago that there was only one officer working full time on the case. Seems to me that given how high profile a case this is and the amount of resources that were put in to the initial investigation, there would be a team dedicated to the case, especially if they had a credible suspect.

I do not believe the TPS would admit "we have a whole team surveilling the suspect(s)" as this would tip off the suspects(s). So instead they admit to having one officer working full time on the case. Again I could be wrong.

 

[rickcross]

KW is still here and as such can override MSM requirements as a verified insider, imo.

I don't think he posts here anymore.

 

[rickcross]

I do not believe the TPS would admit "we have a whole team surveilling the suspect(s)" as this would tip off the suspects(s). So instead they admit to having one officer working full time on the case. Again I could be wrong though.

That would constitute a police officer lying to a judge in court, but I guess anything is possible.

 

[deugirtni]

That would constitute a police officer lying to a judge in court, but I guess anything is possible.

No offence but, you seem to imply that everyone is lying, police included, about a M/S being touted as an M/M, so in that light, I suppose it's very possible? At least according to those who subscribe to the theory of police coverup. jmo.

 

[rickcross]

No offence but, you seem to imply that everyone is lying, police included, about a M/S being touted as an M/M, so in that light, I suppose it's very possible? At least according to those who subscribe to the theory of police coverup. jmo.

I didn't say that everyone was lying. If word came from Saunders, Gomes may be the only one that lied. Even then, unless there is one conclusive piece of evidence that says it was definitely a murder/suicide, which I doubt there is, then her opinion is subjective. So even though M/S may have been the most likely scenario, it still could have been M/M, thus it wouldn't be a lie. As I said before, there are plenty of indications that LE believed this was a M/S, right up until Gomes' press conference. So what changed? Why did LE not start collecting DNA samples from people known to have been in the house? Why were people not interviewed even month after the crime? Then after a year, the two people in charge of the investigation get promotions on the same day? No news updates. No pleas for information from the public. One officer working full time on the case, yet many days spent in court to keep information out of the hands of the press. I'm just saying that there are plenty of things about this case that seem very unusual.

 

[ilovewings]

A new, hidden clue in Barry and Honey Shermans' vanishing murder case - Macleans.ca

Don't know if this article was posted earlier: sorry if it is a duplicate but i thought it was very interesting. The article is dated March 2019. Among interesting comments made in the article are the following:
. the children want to raze the Toronto house where their parents bodies were found
in Dec 2017. obviously the residence is impossible to sell.

.The family took the unusual step of obtaining court orders to keep private the progress
of the Toronto police homicide probe and more rarely, seal almost everything related to the couple's estates, estimated to be worth 5 billion, to preserve the "privacy and dignity
of the victims andto protect the heirs from possible violence from the couple's unknown killer or killers". It has been reported that Honey's last will and testament has gone
missing.

.the police officers who initially led the investigation have been promoted "clearly for reasons other than solving it". There is now reported only one full time officer
on the case.

a woman allegedly handed over to the police a surveillance video that showed a
car sitting in the Sherman's driveway on Dec 14, a day before the bodies were
found, and a day after the couple was last reported seen alive. It this video a
man was seen "sometimes sitting in his car for up to 15 minutes than going inside the house".

 

[deugirtni]

I didn't say that everyone was lying. If word came from Saunders, Gomes may be the only one that lied. Even then, unless there is one conclusive piece of evidence that says it was definitely a murder/suicide, which I doubt there is, then her opinion is subjective. So even though M/S may have been the most likely scenario, it still could have been M/M, thus it wouldn't be a lie. As I said before, there are plenty of indications that LE believed this was a M/S, right up until Gomes' press conference. So what changed? Why did LE not start collecting DNA samples from people known to have been in the house? Why were people not interviewed even month after the crime? Then after a year, the two people in charge of the investigation get promotions on the same day? No news updates. No pleas for information from the public. One officer working full time on the case, yet many days spent in court to keep information out of the hands of the press. I'm just saying that there are plenty of things about this case that seem very unusual.

"Gomes may be the only one that lied" - no, Gomes was the speaker at the press conference, however she was speaking not for herself, but on behalf of the TPS - so that would be the entire TPS who would have lied, if it is a lie

"unless there is one conclusive piece of evidence that says it was definitely a murder/suicide, which I doubt there is, then her opinion is subjective." - (first, I assume you mean murder/murder, rather than murder/suicide?) - considering it did take TPS some 6 weeks to announce this determination, wouldn't it be prudent to think it was more likely they carefully evaluated the evidence, and that there must have been at least "one conclusive piece of evidence that says it was definitely a" double homicide, rather than to think they are lying? As well, this once again is not Gomes' opinion, it is the opinion of TPS. TPS don't run with one detective's opinion if it is contrary to the evidence and everyone else's determination, they don't allow officers to just beak off about their individual thoughts on their cases.

"So what changed?" - obviously something which you and we are not privy to, would be my hunch.

"I'm just saying that there are plenty of things about this case that seem very unusual." - I'll give you *that*! Hopefully one day we will have an explanation for all of the questions outstanding regarding (reported) police behavior.

 

[rickcross]

I'll leave you with this list of facts, and they are facts

- On day one TPS says there is no cause for public safety and no suspect is being sought
- Family assembled a legal team with one purpose, to discount the M/S theory
- For 2 months work orders ONLY listed one victim, Honey Sherman
- At the funeral, family members are seen speaking with John Tory
- The next morning Tory is in Chief Saunders office discussing the case
- Despite having no access to evidence besides a secondary autopsy, Greenspan makes front page news proclaiming M/M
- Within days of the Tory meeting, Gomes holds press conference declaring "targeted double murder"
- After 1 year, the two Lead detectives on the case are give promotions
- As of March, there is only one officer assigned to the case
- TPS has not once appealed to the public for assistance
- The Sherman case was not even listed on TPS list of unsolved murders for that year until it was pointed out
- And lets not forget about KWs statements that Barry had discusses killing Honey in the past.

So lets make a list of reasons to believe this was a double murder

- Susan Gomes said it was at her press conference
- Greenspan, the guy hired specifically to prove it was murder, said it was as well.

 

[nuff]

I'll leave you with this list of facts, and they are facts

So lets make a list of reasons to believe this was a double murder

- Susan Gomes said it was at her press conference
- Greenspan, the guy hired specifically to prove it was murder, said it was as well.

- Highly improbable that either BS or HS had the strength or stamina to stage the bodies as they were found
- The belts were not the cause of the strangulation that killed them. If one of them killed themselves, by what means as nothing else (as far as we know) was recovered at the death scene
- There were marks showing their wrists had been tied

 

[ldlager]

It has been this case that educated me on just how tight-lipped LE in Canada is. Of course, that has it's pros and cons and totally frustrates we, the public. I do hope family members of victims get at least smidgens of updates every now and then, but it wouldn't surprise me if they did not.

We already know more about epstein’s “hanging” and cod in a week than we know in almost 2 years for the Sherman’s!