Canada - Barry, 75, & Honey Sherman, 70, found dead, Toronto, 15 Dec 2017 #6

[canadiangirl]

In the US, LE can take anything a person discards. So if a suspect put straw in trash, i.e they could test it.

They did it to someone recently in the Millard case..

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[MrsThreadgoode]

Prior to his death, Dana Winter had been charged with conspiracy to commit murder. I will ETA the MSM link. However, the article doesn’t state whom Dana conspired to murder. Does anyone know?

ETA:

“One cousin, Dana, died of a heroin overdose in 1995 shortly after being charged with conspiracy to commit murder.”

from:

https://www.theglobeandmail.com/rep...family-feud-comes-to-the-fore/article1069800/

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[JDG]

RBBM
What if the suspect discards a water bottle or something that they were drinking in a public trash can?

I think LE were following Christina Noudga and retrieved a drink she threw into a trash can. They then matched the DNA from the straw to DNA found in the Tim Bosma investigation (nitrile gloves found with her DNA, I believe).

Yes, thats how they've obtained DNA from unwilling suspects in the past. i.e. Holly Jones murderer

He was the only male in the area who refused when she went missing, they had him under surveillance and I think they had a warrant to collect his drink cup and straw.

We all toss our DNA away every day but under the Charter Rights, I think they need a warrant for it to be admissible.

 

[Lexiintoronto]

Prior to his death, Dana Winter had been charged with conspiracy to commit murder. I will ETA the MSM link. However, the article doesn’t state whom Dana conspired to murder. Does anyone know?

ETA:

“One cousin, Dana, died of a heroin overdose in 1995 shortly after being charged with conspiracy to commit murder.”

from:

https://www.theglobeandmail.com/rep...family-feud-comes-to-the-fore/article1069800/

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I think it was a fellow drug dealer, but I don't have a link.

 

[deugirtni]

Rsbm. Penalized? You'd be pissed? Over two clauses that looked out for 4 orphaned children?

Absolutely. The company was for sale to any buyer, presumably to the highest bidder. On top of being highest bidder by a substantial $100,000, I get slapped with clauses too, lasting way into the future. That would never have passed muster with any other buyer, and it wouldn't ever have even been asked of any other buyer. I'd be being penalized for simply having had a relationship with the man. If you purchase something from family, sometimes one might get a *better* deal than Joe Blow. In this case, it was the opposite - I get stuck paying *more* AND having 'options' added to the agreement. Durmed right I'd be feeling that way. Not to mention that in addition, I would have also suffered my own personal loss in the death of LW, who had been my father figure. I had been brought under his wing to learn the business, but then when running it well was most needed, I was passed over. If the trustees, whose obligation it actually *was* to look after the interests of those children, wanted them to be taken care of forever, then they should've held onto the company and had someone run it who knew what they were doing, given it better oversight, and etc. How can they pass *their* duty onto a buyer paying full value/top dollar on a sale on the open market? As far as my opinion is concerned, the estate's ability to benefit any of the Winters any further from Empire was given up when they decided to sell it, period.

 

[BeKind_BeWell]

@ deugirtni, thank you for your two, earlier lengthy posts. Both very well said and quite objective.

JMO but TPS are going to follow the evidence and as quick as some readers may want or anticipate results, it's going to be a lengthy investigation. As sad as the story of the orphans is and surmising who would have fared better as they aged and matured, under different care, what individuals were truly like (would guess that no one here has any intimate knowledge or connection) if this, if that, etc., no one can say for certain. Just as others have mentioned, (I too know) people who have grown up in adverse and/or heartbreaking circumstances and turned out to be lovely, well-adjusted, well-balanced, good, and successful people. And conversely others, handed everything (including love and affection) and not having a care in the world if you will, turned out not so great. I find this case interesting, sad, and tragic in many ways, but I'm just an observer, these people are not in my life.

 

[canadiangirl]

RBBM
What if the suspect discards a water bottle or something that they were drinking in a public trash can?

I think LE were following Christina Noudga and retrieved a drink she threw into a trash can. They then matched the DNA from the straw to DNA found in the Tim Bosma investigation (nitrile gloves found with her DNA, I believe).

This was my thoughts too

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[deugirtni]

Prior to his death, Dana Winter had been charged with conspiracy to commit murder. I will ETA the MSM link. However, the article doesn’t state whom Dana conspired to murder. Does anyone know?

ETA:

“One cousin, Dana, died of a heroin overdose in 1995 shortly after being charged with conspiracy to commit murder.”

from:

https://www.theglobeandmail.com/rep...family-feud-comes-to-the-fore/article1069800/

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

"[FONT=&quot]But no amount of money could set things right. In 1995, Barry sent Dana to a remote fishing village in B.C. to get clean. Dana decided to settle in B.C., married a woman named Julia Zwicker, fathered two children and slipped back into drugs. He would later be charged with conspiracy in the murder of a fellow drug dealer. From a holding tank in Vancouver, he called Barry to arrange bail. While he was out, Dana, then 33 years old, died of a heroin overdose."
[/FONT][FONT=&quot]https://torontolife.com/from-the-archives/barry-sherman-bitter-pill-from-the-archives/[/FONT]

 

[JDG]

Never thought I would say this but I do not disbelieve everything that KW is saying.

Workaholics make for distant spouses and absent/remote parents. All noted at the memorial service.

Opposites attract, but only to a point. Nothing attractive about an absent spouse over time.

Not only was the lack of concern and rage at Nancy Olivieri profound but there was no concern, not one iota about the children who would die if this drug hit the market. $$$$$$$ and only $$$$$$$

Apo generics are sub standard in their bioavailability, yet where is the concern about those who died because they needed 100% bioavailability. Generics had 20% leeway, AFAIK.

Political wheeling and dealing allowed billions of $$$$$$ to be skimmed off the over priced, lesser quality drugs paid for by the Canadian taxpayers.

Wow, just wow.

Does anyone else agree that Lawyer Greenspan is there to provide/ensure a coverup of all/some of this crime?

 

[Grey-St]

Absolutely. The company was for sale to any buyer, presumably to the highest bidder. On top of being highest bidder by a substantial $100,000, I get slapped with clauses too, lasting way into the future. That would never have passed muster with any other buyer, and it wouldn't ever have even been asked of any other buyer. I'd be being penalized for simply having had a relationship with the man. If you purchase something from family, sometimes one might get a *better* deal than Joe Blow. In this case, it was the opposite - I get stuck paying *more* AND having 'options' added to the agreement. Durmed right I'd be feeling that way. Not to mention that in addition, I would have also suffered my own personal loss in the death of LW, who had been my father figure. I had been brought under his wing to learn the business, but then when running it well was most needed, I was passed over. If the trustees, whose obligation it actually *was* to look after the interests of those children, wanted them to be taken care of forever, then they should've held onto the company and had someone run it who knew what they were doing, given it better oversight, and etc. How can they pass *their* duty onto a buyer paying full value/top dollar on a sale on the open market? As far as my opinion is concerned, the estate's ability to benefit any of the Winters any further from Empire was given up when they decided to sell it, period.

I agree regarding RT. But I don't know about BS feeling jilted regarding the company, I think that seems pretty selfish. LW had 4 young children and a wife to think about, that's where his money and business goes should anything happen to him. BS should be grateful for LW's care and mentorship. As for buying the company, do we know for sure that these clauses were only put in because it was BS?

 

[Lexiintoronto]

Prior to his death, Dana Winter had been charged with conspiracy to commit murder. I will ETA the MSM link. However, the article doesn’t state whom Dana conspired to murder. Does anyone know?

ETA:

“One cousin, Dana, died of a heroin overdose in 1995 shortly after being charged with conspiracy to commit murder.”

from:

https://www.theglobeandmail.com/rep...family-feud-comes-to-the-fore/article1069800/

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

I'm not sure if this is the same DW, but the date and the facts fit.

Mr. Winter who is charged with first degree murder, and he's charged along with Mr. McCreery

https://www.canlii.org/en/bc/bcsc/d...AAAAQALZGFuYSB3aW50ZXIAAAAAAQ&resultIndex=191

Timothy McCreery was convicted by a Supreme Court jury of first degree murder on December 20, 1996.

https://www.canlii.org/en/bc/bcca/d...CAgICAgICAgICBNY0NSRUVSWQAAAAAB&resultIndex=1

ETA:

[3] The theory of the Crown in this case was that the deceased was killed by the appellant either because he was hired by, or wanted to impress, a local drug dealer, Dana Winter, in Smithers. The Crown theorized that the appellant believed that the deceased owed money to Winter and was about to inform on both Winter and the appellant to the police.

2nd Edit: It reads like a crime novel. BBM

[7] Although Landis Heal's vehicle was found abandoned in the bush, his body had not been recovered by early October that same year. Following a number of tips the RCMP decided to mount an undercover operation.


[8] On October 22 RCMP officer Constable Doran attended the Smithers RCMP detachment dressed as a biker for the purpose of meeting the appellant. The appellant had been invited to the police station on a ruse. Constable Doran befriended the appellant and sought his assistance in locating a woman for a sum of money. The search for the fictitious woman took place in and around Smithers. Doran and the appellant travelled in Doran's vehicle which had been equipped to record their conversations.


[9] Doran presented himself as a enforcer involved in the drug scene. Doran told the appellant that he "did all the dirty work" for a man named "Jake" who was in Prince Rupert. The appellant bragged to Doran that he was a suspect in some breaking and enterings, a robbery and a murder. Eventually the appellant told Doran that he had shot two people, one of whom was in Vernon. The appellant told Doran that he had used a 45 calibre handgun in one of the killings. The story with respect to the Vernon killing was a lie. Both the appellant and Doran discussed the "rush" they both experienced in killing someone.

 

[kay74]

~EAGLES WON~ YAY! Had to put that out there.

 

[human]

I'm not sure if this is the same DW, but the date and the facts fit.



https://www.canlii.org/en/bc/bcsc/d...AAAAQALZGFuYSB3aW50ZXIAAAAAAQ&resultIndex=191


https://www.canlii.org/en/bc/bcca/d...CAgICAgICAgICBNY0NSRUVSWQAAAAAB&resultIndex=1

Maybe someone got an idea because they knew of this case.

———————————



[3] The theory of the Crown in this case was that the deceased was killed by the appellant either because he was hired by, or wanted to impress, a local drug dealer, Dana Winter, in Smithers. The Crown theorized that the appellant believed that the deceased owed money to Winter and was about to inform on both Winter and the appellant to the police.

 

[kay74]

Never thought I would say this but I do not disbelieve everything that KW is saying.

Workaholics make for distant spouses and absent/remote parents. All noted at the memorial service.

Opposites attract, but only to a point. Nothing attractive about an absent spouse over time.

Not only was the lack of concern and rage at Nancy Olivieri profound but there was no concern, not one iota about the children who would die if this drug hit the market. $$$$$$$ and only $$$$$$$

Apo generics are sub standard in their bioavailability, yet where is the concern about those who died because they needed 100% bioavailability. Generics had 20% leeway, AFAIK.

Political wheeling and dealing allowed billions of $$$$$$ to be skimmed off the over priced, lesser quality drugs paid for by the Canadian taxpayers.

Wow, just wow.

Does anyone else agree that Lawyer Greenspan is there to provide/ensure a coverup of all/some of this crime?

Do all generics have a 20% leeway? That's not good.

 

[MrsThreadgoode]

I'm not sure if this is the same DW, but the date and the facts fit.



https://www.canlii.org/en/bc/bcsc/d...AAAAQALZGFuYSB3aW50ZXIAAAAAAQ&resultIndex=191


https://www.canlii.org/en/bc/bcca/d...CAgICAgICAgICBNY0NSRUVSWQAAAAAB&resultIndex=1

ETA:

So kind of you, Lexi, to go to all this trouble to answer my question. I am very grateful. I must remember to search canlii from now on. [emoji4]


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[JDG]

Do all generics have a 20% leeway? That's not good.

Varies from country to country. Canada yes, although thats about to change for financial and health reasons.

Thats where the huge profit margins where, once you have the policies all in order. <wink, wink>

Donations to political parties do buy influence, don't they? Some were eating out of someones hand but no longer.

Seriously, imagine how many poor people were unaware of the lesser potency in their heart/blood pressure pills, blood thinners etc. Thyroid meds, like blood thinners must be at therapeutic levels and theres a fine line between safe or not.

 

[kay74]

Varies from country to country. Canada yes, although thats about to change for financial and health reasons.

Thats where the huge profit margins where, once you have the policies all in order. <wink, wink>

Donations to political parties do buy influence, don't they? Some were eating out of someones hand but no longer.

Seriously, imagine how many poor people were unaware of the lesser potency in their heart/blood pressure pills, blood thinners etc. Thyroid meds, like blood thinners must be at therapeutic levels and theres a fine line between safe or not.

Thanks Yes,I agree on all of this. My doctor here in the states who is ironically from Canada said never to get a generic form of the synthroid I take. In fact the pharmacy at the clinic/hospital he works doesn't even carry the generic form. That's just one example.

 

[AllyJane]

Does anyone else agree that Lawyer Greenspan is there to provide/ensure a coverup of all/some of this crime?

Why would Greenspan risk being disbarred because deliberately causing a coverup of a crime will result in that.

KW has lied about never being in the house and admitted that he embellished about a great deal of his story. With the evidence that we know, why would you dispute that but believe someone who admitted not being truthful and failed a lie detector test he wanted to take.

 

[Sphinx]

What did the pastor say? Something negative about Jewish people not being saved?

I do not think that was explained in the article I read. It did give the impression that BS would just pick a fight with the pastor. IMO

 

[deugirtni]

I agree regarding RT. But I don't know about BS feeling jilted regarding the company, I think that seems pretty selfish. LW had 4 young children and a wife to think about, that's where his money and business goes should anything happen to him. BS should be grateful for LW's care and mentorship. As for buying the company, do we know for sure that these clauses were only put in because it was BS?

I always *try* to put myself in another's shoes and I do strive to be nonjudgmental. When I think about what BS, as a young guy who'd lost his dad at 9 or 10, might have felt like through all of this whole story, it certainly gives me a different perspective - possibly something closer to his perspective. I also keep in mind his particular personality, and what we know of it. In having some guesses into BS's perspective, it doesn't preclude also having sympathy for the 4 children. It does however, disturb me that such a family, with a prosperous business, 4 children, and a dying wife, could leave their 4 preschoolers without somewhere to go, with someone who loved them, and a person in place to at least run the business, should tragedy strike and take both parents.
Why *wouldn't* BS have felt jilted? He'd been entrusted by LW to take charge while he went on a last vacation with his dying wife, he'd been trained on running the business, the business required someone competent to run it, but yet they denied his offer to take care of it for a year or less, only because he asked for first right of refusal, *should* the company be sold in future. That is all he asked for. And why not? Then paying more than other arm's length bidders, he still got stuck with a clause to take care of people 15+ years into the future. Just seems unfair to me, and seems like through all of the tragic feelings surrounding everything else, BS's own feelings of loss and etc, were completely disregarded.
When you're purchasing a business, making an offer, paying more than JoeBlowNextGuy, the biz excites you, you're good at it, you can gather up the financing, you're even related to the owner who took you under his wing to train you - but you're treated differently than JoeBlow - wouldn't you wonder why? Everyone is heartbroken to hear about 4 young kids losing their parents, but no other buyer would have been asked, expected, or have agreed to such 'options', imho. Was the Montreal bidder selfish too, for not thinking about the previous owner's children's financial future while the estate is selling him the business?