CANADA Canada - Billionaire Couple Barry & Honey Sherman Murdered @ Home - Toronto #20

[newclues]

I personally don’t see him as controlled by JS. Perhaps the opposite. Speculation. MOO.

Did BS see this and not like this?

 

[newclues]

Just was reading some questions to and answers by KD on his paper's website and it appears that both BS and HS were killed just before or around the time that DH (lawyer) was calling BS that night. Were they killed to stop this conversation from occurring?

 

[48OldColony]

The information provided below does not constitute any assertions of fact with regards to the guilt or action of anyone mentioned. It is conjecture, provided for theoretical, educational, and entertainment purposes. I assume no legal responsibility for the accuracy or correctness of any facts or claims mentioned or for any consequences of relying on any details included. Any theory of supposed action by any party is merely alleged. All narrative characterization is speculative.

-------------------------------------------------------

The Sum of the Parts

Trying to axe AG is probably very important? In line with the rest of his succession behavior? Strange but very calculated? He recorded the Kay episode, tattled on KD to BP, to be on good terms? He’s aware of how legally protective that sort of stuff will be if he’s ever on the stand? This is the stuff reasonable doubt is made from in a close case. Rapport with police, cooperation. Everyone knows that the reward money only likely draws kooks and conspiracy theorists, distracting and bogging TPS down. Who balloons the reward?

The home building company thing (where BS wanted to fund the boyfriend without JS involved) goes well beyond “controlling” in my mind. This was likely leading up to or included in the 2010-2015 stuff? An even bigger reservoir for JS to draw animus from? Was BS actively poking the bear whether he knew it or not? The suicidal comment, the coup attempt, the “what will you do and when” and now this. His response to KD prompting him about the $ motive, was to shrug this all off. He was suicidal but the idea of killing someone else was not even rational to consider from an objective view, that is what his response suggested?

The evidence for him being backed into a corner here, overwhelming? Behavior, upon being backed into a corner, is easier to predict than one might think, given the right circumstances?

One theory: Barry was heading up the efforts to retain capital, but Honey was likely in the know (“dealing with some stuff”)? Honey also had gained control and influence over time. Like how the younger kids got way less dough and how Barry was picking out doors for a 30 million dollar home he didn’t want. She had power over Barry, regardless of whatever big monies she herself didn’t obtain? I doubt she really actually cared based on how she lived life...

With Barry pressing the gas pedal, and getting nowhere, is it not possible she became a loud voice in the background, adding to the pressure to secure liquidity? From her POV, $ security, but also putting that kid in his place as she saw it? BS and HS were as driven in their convictions as JS. Earnest players in the game of life, regardless of how similar or different their actions and behaviors. Tension, probably beyond anything JS would ever admit?

This whole JS thing. I don’t know. It’s so possible to be way off given how little we have compared to TPS. But motivation is a powerful thing. His email behavior, the bizarre eulogy and post murder family interactions, choosing to bring KD in after 3 years and then, after realizing KD was going nowhere, ghosting him, the fact that he has floated under the radar in terms of change in capital allocation after the murders compared to the siblings, the sister (credible by every single document account) calling the brother and partner "money hungry monsters", liquidation and destruction of Apotex (despite the $ runway it had compared to overpriced and underutilized storage company), the behavior of police around shielding the link between the estate and the investigation in a way even beyond their paternalistic norms, the plethora of unknown people in the background (AP most particularly and the way JS wouldn’t let up on him being involved in the literal succession planning), and the strange relationship they seem to have (AP on his deeds but the husband not?). All of this, as is very well know, in the context of the personal animus JS developed for the parents and what they came to represent (an absolute and unfettered road block to his life and work)? All of it, an obvious place to start from?

There’s an old saying used in court when trying to build a legal case. It dovetails with KDs perfect storm analogy. “The sum of the parts”. The circumstantial evidence around potential motive, if we can call it that, rises to great heights? It goes beyond inheritance? As has been said, it’s personal? I also think there’s a mental trap one can fall into in this case as labelling the Sherman’s as rich. Their wealth was really on another scale altogether. I dare say that trap was avoided by the killer(s)?

Is the obvious conclusion that TPS is waiting for some sort of concrete link or break before pulling the trigger, so to speak?

I have no idea what KDs or TPS theory is, obviously. That’s part of the fun and intellectual appeal of spending so much time on the case while things are fluid and it’s so in the press. There are tells in KDs work, however - particularly the way he laid these episodes out, his responses to the q and a, and the last episode, only pushes one further into this sort of theory. Now KD states that Yim and the prosecutor likely brought up JS new storage building on the east side during a recess in court as a potential "tip"... this from the most knowledgeable civilian involved in the case, KD?

KDs point about looking into the other tributaries of benefit post murder is fascinating and important. I can’t get the simple theory out of my head, however. That a major player could be one of the kids?

Finally, the will. The fact that KD seems to have basically shown the document exists, to me, is like this case starting over. KD has someone on record saying she made amendments. That means it exists. This is jaw dropping to me mainly because of the timing. The final say she had was therefore not splitting EVERYTHING four ways. Seeing the post about DHs view of wills only adds to the chaos and confusion. Something was going on that week that did not normally go on. Dealing with some stuff, the missed meeting, the moving around of meetings, the fact so many key players were away or inattentive, and Barry had to go home early. Was it to take a 9pm call from DH with HS present? Is that why they had the architecture meeting at Apotex? Why were they so fixated on shoring up the wills? Why did she have nearly 10k in cash? Strange. Really strange. The key lies in their behavioral patterns in the 72 hours before the murders, no doubt. That will be the key to unlocking the identity of whoever or whatever was propelling against them.

 

[Lexiintoronto]

Just was reading some questions to and answers by KD on his paper's website and it appears that both BS and HS were killed just before or around the time that DH (lawyer) was calling BS that night. Were they killed to stop this conversation from occurring?

I’m curious as to where DH was when he made the call. (Office, home, maybe close to the Shermans’ home?) 9:01 pm seems late, especially during Hanukkah.

And it’s such precise timing, imo.

And KD believes DH’s involvement had something to do with the possible transfer of $500 million to Honey. Maybe it was Barry’s Hanukkah gift to her? That would make it more meaningful, imo.

KD said he found out about the call by someone who had access to Barry’s call logs, but he didn’t specify if it was his cell or work phone.

 

[Lexiintoronto]

The information provided below does not constitute any assertions of fact with regards to the guilt or action of anyone mentioned. It is conjecture, provided for theoretical, educational, and entertainment purposes. I assume no legal responsibility for the accuracy or correctness of any facts or claims mentioned or for any consequences of relying on any details included. Any theory of supposed action by any party is merely alleged. All narrative characterization is speculative.

-------------------------------------------------------

The Sum of the Parts

Trying to axe AG is probably very important? In line with the rest of his succession behavior? Strange but very calculated? He recorded the Kay episode, tattled on KD to BP, to be on good terms? He’s aware of how legally protective that sort of stuff will be if he’s ever on the stand? This is the stuff reasonable doubt is made from in a close case. Rapport with police, cooperation. Everyone knows that the reward money only likely draws kooks and conspiracy theorists, distracting and bogging TPS down. Who balloons the reward?

The home building company thing (where BS wanted to fund the boyfriend without JS involved) goes well beyond “controlling” in my mind. This was likely leading up to or included in the 2010-2015 stuff? An even bigger reservoir for JS to draw animus from? Was BS actively poking the bear whether he knew it or not? The suicidal comment, the coup attempt, the “what will you do and when” and now this. His response to KD prompting him about the $ motive, was to shrug this all off. He was suicidal but the idea of killing someone else was not even rational to consider from an objective view, that is what his response suggested?

The evidence for him being backed into a corner here, overwhelming? Behavior, upon being backed into a corner, is easier to predict than one might think, given the right circumstances?

One theory: Barry was heading up the efforts to retain capital, but Honey was likely in the know (“dealing with some stuff”)? Honey also had gained control and influence over time. Like how the younger kids got way less dough and how Barry was picking out doors for a 30 million dollar home he didn’t want. She had power over Barry, regardless of whatever big monies she herself didn’t obtain? I doubt she really actually cared based on how she lived life...

With Barry pressing the gas pedal, and getting nowhere, is it not possible she became a loud voice in the background, adding to the pressure to secure liquidity? From her POV, $ security, but also putting that kid in his place as she saw it? BS and HS were as driven in their convictions as JS. Earnest players in the game of life, regardless of how similar or different their actions and behaviors. Tension, probably beyond anything JS would ever admit?

This whole JS thing. I don’t know. It’s so possible to be way off given how little we have compared to TPS. But motivation is a powerful thing. His email behavior, the bizarre eulogy and post murder family interactions, choosing to bring KD in after 3 years and then, after realizing KD was going nowhere, ghosting him, the fact that he has floated under the radar in terms of change in capital allocation after the murders compared to the siblings, the sister (credible by every single document account) calling the brother and partner "money hungry monsters", liquidation and destruction of Apotex (despite the $ runway it had compared to overpriced and underutilized storage company), the behavior of police around shielding the link between the estate and the investigation in a way even beyond their paternalistic norms, the plethora of unknown people in the background (AP most particularly and the way JS wouldn’t let up on him being involved in the literal succession planning), and the strange relationship they seem to have (AP on his deeds but the husband not?). All of this, as is very well know, in the context of the personal animus JS developed for the parents and what they came to represent (an absolute and unfettered road block to his life and work)? All of it, an obvious place to start from?

There’s an old saying used in court when trying to build a legal case. It dovetails with KDs perfect storm analogy. “The sum of the parts”. The circumstantial evidence around potential motive, if we can call it that, rises to great heights? It goes beyond inheritance? As has been said, it’s personal? I also think there’s a mental trap one can fall into in this case as labelling the Sherman’s as rich. Their wealth was really on another scale altogether. I dare say that trap was avoided by the killer(s)?

Is the obvious conclusion that TPS is waiting for some sort of concrete link or break before pulling the trigger, so to speak?

I have no idea what KDs or TPS theory is, obviously. That’s part of the fun and intellectual appeal of spending so much time on the case while things are fluid and it’s so in the press. There are tells in KDs work, however - particularly the way he laid these episodes out, his responses to the q and a, and the last episode, only pushes one further into this sort of theory. Now KD states that Yim and the prosecutor likely brought up JS new storage building on the east side during a recess in court as a potential "tip"... this from the most knowledgeable civilian involved in the case, KD?

KDs point about looking into the other tributaries of benefit post murder is fascinating and important. I can’t get the simple theory out of my head, however. That a major player could be one of the kids?

Finally, the will. The fact that KD seems to have basically shown the document exists, to me, is like this case starting over. KD has someone on record saying she made amendments. That means it exists. This is jaw dropping to me mainly because of the timing. The final say she had was therefore not splitting EVERYTHING four ways. Seeing the post about DHs view of wills only adds to the chaos and confusion. Something was going on that week that did not normally go on. Dealing with some stuff, the missed meeting, the moving around of meetings, the fact so many key players were away or inattentive, and Barry had to go home early. Was it to take a 9pm call from DH with HS present? Is that why they had the architecture meeting at Apotex? Why were they so fixated on shoring up the wills? Why did she have nearly 10k in cash? Strange. Really strange. The key lies in their behavioral patterns in the 72 hours before the murders, no doubt. That will be the key to unlocking the identity of whoever or whatever was propelling against them.

This is an interesting post with a lot of good points & questions!

 

[MerlinFalcon]

The information provided below does not constitute any assertions of fact with regards to the guilt or action of anyone mentioned. It is conjecture, provided for theoretical, educational, and entertainment purposes. I assume no legal responsibility for the accuracy or correctness of any facts or claims mentioned or for any consequences of relying on any details included. Any theory of supposed action by any party is merely alleged. All narrative characterization is speculative.

-------------------------------------------------------

The Sum of the Parts

Trying to axe AG is probably very important? In line with the rest of his succession behavior? Strange but very calculated? He recorded the Kay episode, tattled on KD to BP, to be on good terms? He’s aware of how legally protective that sort of stuff will be if he’s ever on the stand? This is the stuff reasonable doubt is made from in a close case. Rapport with police, cooperation. Everyone knows that the reward money only likely draws kooks and conspiracy theorists, distracting and bogging TPS down. Who balloons the reward?

The home building company thing (where BS wanted to fund the boyfriend without JS involved) goes well beyond “controlling” in my mind. This was likely leading up to or included in the 2010-2015 stuff? An even bigger reservoir for JS to draw animus from? Was BS actively poking the bear whether he knew it or not? The suicidal comment, the coup attempt, the “what will you do and when” and now this. His response to KD prompting him about the $ motive, was to shrug this all off. He was suicidal but the idea of killing someone else was not even rational to consider from an objective view, that is what his response suggested?

The evidence for him being backed into a corner here, overwhelming? Behavior, upon being backed into a corner, is easier to predict than one might think, given the right circumstances?

One theory: Barry was heading up the efforts to retain capital, but Honey was likely in the know (“dealing with some stuff”)? Honey also had gained control and influence over time. Like how the younger kids got way less dough and how Barry was picking out doors for a 30 million dollar home he didn’t want. She had power over Barry, regardless of whatever big monies she herself didn’t obtain? I doubt she really actually cared based on how she lived life...

With Barry pressing the gas pedal, and getting nowhere, is it not possible she became a loud voice in the background, adding to the pressure to secure liquidity? From her POV, $ security, but also putting that kid in his place as she saw it? BS and HS were as driven in their convictions as JS. Earnest players in the game of life, regardless of how similar or different their actions and behaviors. Tension, probably beyond anything JS would ever admit?

This whole JS thing. I don’t know. It’s so possible to be way off given how little we have compared to TPS. But motivation is a powerful thing. His email behavior, the bizarre eulogy and post murder family interactions, choosing to bring KD in after 3 years and then, after realizing KD was going nowhere, ghosting him, the fact that he has floated under the radar in terms of change in capital allocation after the murders compared to the siblings, the sister (credible by every single document account) calling the brother and partner "money hungry monsters", liquidation and destruction of Apotex (despite the $ runway it had compared to overpriced and underutilized storage company), the behavior of police around shielding the link between the estate and the investigation in a way even beyond their paternalistic norms, the plethora of unknown people in the background (AP most particularly and the way JS wouldn’t let up on him being involved in the literal succession planning), and the strange relationship they seem to have (AP on his deeds but the husband not?). All of this, as is very well know, in the context of the personal animus JS developed for the parents and what they came to represent (an absolute and unfettered road block to his life and work)? All of it, an obvious place to start from?

There’s an old saying used in court when trying to build a legal case. It dovetails with KDs perfect storm analogy. “The sum of the parts”. The circumstantial evidence around potential motive, if we can call it that, rises to great heights? It goes beyond inheritance? As has been said, it’s personal? I also think there’s a mental trap one can fall into in this case as labelling the Sherman’s as rich. Their wealth was really on another scale altogether. I dare say that trap was avoided by the killer(s)?

Is the obvious conclusion that TPS is waiting for some sort of concrete link or break before pulling the trigger, so to speak?

I have no idea what KDs or TPS theory is, obviously. That’s part of the fun and intellectual appeal of spending so much time on the case while things are fluid and it’s so in the press. There are tells in KDs work, however - particularly the way he laid these episodes out, his responses to the q and a, and the last episode, only pushes one further into this sort of theory. Now KD states that Yim and the prosecutor likely brought up JS new storage building on the east side during a recess in court as a potential "tip"... this from the most knowledgeable civilian involved in the case, KD?

KDs point about looking into the other tributaries of benefit post murder is fascinating and important. I can’t get the simple theory out of my head, however. That a major player could be one of the kids?

Finally, the will. The fact that KD seems to have basically shown the document exists, to me, is like this case starting over. KD has someone on record saying she made amendments. That means it exists. This is jaw dropping to me mainly because of the timing. The final say she had was therefore not splitting EVERYTHING four ways. Seeing the post about DHs view of wills only adds to the chaos and confusion. Something was going on that week that did not normally go on. Dealing with some stuff, the missed meeting, the moving around of meetings, the fact so many key players were away or inattentive, and Barry had to go home early. Was it to take a 9pm call from DH with HS present? Is that why they had the architecture meeting at Apotex? Why were they so fixated on shoring up the wills? Why did she have nearly 10k in cash? Strange. Really strange. The key lies in their behavioral patterns in the 72 hours before the murders, no doubt. That will be the key to unlocking the identity of whoever or whatever was propelling against them.

When was JS suicidal?

This is a really good post. I wonder if the phone call from the lawyer was the reason for both of them being home.

I also had a thought about Honey's password-free phones, tablets etc. For someone with even a tiny bit more knowledge than a senior, it wouldn't have been hard to check her schedule. Also, JS and AP had office space at Apotex and could have easily listened in on any conversation between Barry and Honey or anyone else. Barry and JK had an open door between them and would spend most of the time yelling back and forth at each other so anyone who had office space there would have had an easy time hearing them.

Nothing to do with your post, but I noticed that in today's Q & A, KD mentioned that AP's father in law was responsible for getting the demolition done at Old Colony. Did he read a comment about that here, from yesterday?

 

[FPoulet]

Nothing to do with your post, but I noticed that in today's Q & A, KD mentioned that AP's father in law was responsible for getting the demolition done at Old Colony. Did he read a comment about that here, from yesterday?

My guess is that he already knew that. He wouldn’t state any fact that he hadn’t personally fact-checked, IMO.

 

[FPoulet]

This is a really good post. I wonder if the phone call from the lawyer was the reason for both of them being home.

I wondered the same thing - wanting to be at home for a 9pm phone call, which they are meant to join together.

If so, there must be email chains relating to the scheduling of that call. Would those emails have been made available to police? Or would they have been “screened” as privileged as they relate to a lawyer?

I found Kevin’s comment in the Q&A today about how the Sherman lawyers are “expensive” and as such would do their bidding a bit perplexing. Is that really fair or true? Who is hiring and controlling these lawyers? What are the lawyers’ own professional obligations?

 

[FPoulet]

The information provided below does not constitute any assertions of fact with regards to the guilt or action of anyone mentioned. It is conjecture, provided for theoretical, educational, and entertainment purposes. I assume no legal responsibility for the accuracy or correctness of any facts or claims mentioned or for any consequences of relying on any details included. Any theory of supposed action by any party is merely alleged. All narrative characterization is speculative.

-------------------------------------------------------

The Sum of the Parts

Trying to axe AG is probably very important? In line with the rest of his succession behavior? Strange but very calculated? He recorded the Kay episode, tattled on KD to BP, to be on good terms? He’s aware of how legally protective that sort of stuff will be if he’s ever on the stand? This is the stuff reasonable doubt is made from in a close case. Rapport with police, cooperation. Everyone knows that the reward money only likely draws kooks and conspiracy theorists, distracting and bogging TPS down. Who balloons the reward?

The home building company thing (where BS wanted to fund the boyfriend without JS involved) goes well beyond “controlling” in my mind. This was likely leading up to or included in the 2010-2015 stuff? An even bigger reservoir for JS to draw animus from? Was BS actively poking the bear whether he knew it or not? The suicidal comment, the coup attempt, the “what will you do and when” and now this. His response to KD prompting him about the $ motive, was to shrug this all off. He was suicidal but the idea of killing someone else was not even rational to consider from an objective view, that is what his response suggested?

The evidence for him being backed into a corner here, overwhelming? Behavior, upon being backed into a corner, is easier to predict than one might think, given the right circumstances?

One theory: Barry was heading up the efforts to retain capital, but Honey was likely in the know (“dealing with some stuff”)? Honey also had gained control and influence over time. Like how the younger kids got way less dough and how Barry was picking out doors for a 30 million dollar home he didn’t want. She had power over Barry, regardless of whatever big monies she herself didn’t obtain? I doubt she really actually cared based on how she lived life...

With Barry pressing the gas pedal, and getting nowhere, is it not possible she became a loud voice in the background, adding to the pressure to secure liquidity? From her POV, $ security, but also putting that kid in his place as she saw it? BS and HS were as driven in their convictions as JS. Earnest players in the game of life, regardless of how similar or different their actions and behaviors. Tension, probably beyond anything JS would ever admit?

This whole JS thing. I don’t know. It’s so possible to be way off given how little we have compared to TPS. But motivation is a powerful thing. His email behavior, the bizarre eulogy and post murder family interactions, choosing to bring KD in after 3 years and then, after realizing KD was going nowhere, ghosting him, the fact that he has floated under the radar in terms of change in capital allocation after the murders compared to the siblings, the sister (credible by every single document account) calling the brother and partner "money hungry monsters", liquidation and destruction of Apotex (despite the $ runway it had compared to overpriced and underutilized storage company), the behavior of police around shielding the link between the estate and the investigation in a way even beyond their paternalistic norms, the plethora of unknown people in the background (AP most particularly and the way JS wouldn’t let up on him being involved in the literal succession planning), and the strange relationship they seem to have (AP on his deeds but the husband not?). All of this, as is very well know, in the context of the personal animus JS developed for the parents and what they came to represent (an absolute and unfettered road block to his life and work)? All of it, an obvious place to start from?

There’s an old saying used in court when trying to build a legal case. It dovetails with KDs perfect storm analogy. “The sum of the parts”. The circumstantial evidence around potential motive, if we can call it that, rises to great heights? It goes beyond inheritance? As has been said, it’s personal? I also think there’s a mental trap one can fall into in this case as labelling the Sherman’s as rich. Their wealth was really on another scale altogether. I dare say that trap was avoided by the killer(s)?

Is the obvious conclusion that TPS is waiting for some sort of concrete link or break before pulling the trigger, so to speak?

I have no idea what KDs or TPS theory is, obviously. That’s part of the fun and intellectual appeal of spending so much time on the case while things are fluid and it’s so in the press. There are tells in KDs work, however - particularly the way he laid these episodes out, his responses to the q and a, and the last episode, only pushes one further into this sort of theory. Now KD states that Yim and the prosecutor likely brought up JS new storage building on the east side during a recess in court as a potential "tip"... this from the most knowledgeable civilian involved in the case, KD?

KDs point about looking into the other tributaries of benefit post murder is fascinating and important. I can’t get the simple theory out of my head, however. That a major player could be one of the kids?

Finally, the will. The fact that KD seems to have basically shown the document exists, to me, is like this case starting over. KD has someone on record saying she made amendments. That means it exists. This is jaw dropping to me mainly because of the timing. The final say she had was therefore not splitting EVERYTHING four ways. Seeing the post about DHs view of wills only adds to the chaos and confusion. Something was going on that week that did not normally go on. Dealing with some stuff, the missed meeting, the moving around of meetings, the fact so many key players were away or inattentive, and Barry had to go home early. Was it to take a 9pm call from DH with HS present? Is that why they had the architecture meeting at Apotex? Why were they so fixated on shoring up the wills? Why did she have nearly 10k in cash? Strange. Really strange. The key lies in their behavioral patterns in the 72 hours before the murders, no doubt. That will be the key to unlocking the identity of whoever or whatever was propelling against them.

This is a very considered analysis, especially for a first post. Welcome! It seems you’ve been developing your thoughts on this for a while.

 

[MerlinFalcon]

My guess is that he already knew that. He wouldn’t state any fact that he hadn’t personally fact-checked, IMO.

I'm sure he did, I had never heard of that until it was posted yesterday and found it interesting that he would also mention it. I'm sure he reads this forum and others.

 

[Lexiintoronto]

When was JS suicidal?

This is a really good post. I wonder if the phone call from the lawyer was the reason for both of them being home.

I also had a thought about Honey's password-free phones, tablets etc. For someone with even a tiny bit more knowledge than a senior, it wouldn't have been hard to check her schedule. Also, JS and AP had office space at Apotex and could have easily listened in on any conversation between Barry and Honey or anyone else. Barry and JK had an open door between them and would spend most of the time yelling back and forth at each other so anyone who had office space there would have had an easy time hearing them.

Nothing to do with your post, but I noticed that in today's Q & A, KD mentioned that AP's father in law was responsible for getting the demolition done at Old Colony. Did he read a comment about that here, from yesterday?

Jonathon wrote Barry an email in 2011 where he said he was ‘slowly becoming suicidal’,Episode 7, ‘Pointing Fingers’ at around the 27:50 mark. He was upset that Barry was funding FD’A and not him.

Off-topic, but I’m listening to that episode right now. At around the 32:00 minute mark Jonathon talks a bit about his own theory. He didn’t want to go into details, but KD said he (J) believed JK, FD’A and a 3rd trusted employee wanted more money and conspired to kill Barry.

I’m guessing the 3rd person may be AG (?) I haven’t heard one bad thing about JK or AG, they’re both highly respected. But as trustees they stood to earn a fortune from the estate if Barry and Honey died.

 

[Lexiintoronto]

I wondered the same thing - wanting to be at home for a 9pm phone call, which they are meant to join together.

If so, there must be email chains relating to the scheduling of that call. Would those emails have been made available to police? Or would they have been “screened” as privileged as they relate to a lawyer?

I found Kevin’s comment in the Q&A today about how the Sherman lawyers are “expensive” and as such would do their bidding a bit perplexing. Is that really fair or true? Who is hiring and controlling these lawyers? What are the lawyers’ own professional obligations?

KD said today that he believed Honey was emailing ‘Blanys’ on Wednesday. In the last podcast episode he said the police have the emails, KD knows ‘@Blanys’ is who she was emailing, but the content is considered privileged so the police cannot review it.

 

[FPoulet]

KD said today that he believed Honey was emailing ‘Blanys’ on Wednesday. In the last podcast episode he said the police have the emails, KD knows ‘@Blanys’ is who she was emailing, but the content is considered privileged so the police cannot review it.

It could have been even more rankling for JS if his dad was pursuing repayment from him and AP, while at the same time funding many tens of millions for the One building *and* planning to transfer $500m to his mom.

Also quite the timing that Honey and Blaneys were emailing that very day. And especially odd that the Blaneys lawyer was trying to call Barry that night. The communications with both spouses suggests a joint retainer with Barry and Honey. If the lawyer were acting for Honey alone, it would be unlikely he’d be calling Barry directly at all much less at 9:01pm.

The fact of the call from the Blaneys partner that night, combined with the emails between Honey and Blaneys that day, strongly suggests either a coordinated call at 9pm that night — or a very active matter that they were trying to conclude quickly. Both of which make the timing of the murders even more of a “perfect storm”.

 

[ldlager]

Jonathon wrote Barry an email in 2011 where he said he was ‘slowly becoming suicidal’,Episode 7, ‘Pointing Fingers’ at around the 27:50 mark. He was upset that Barry was funding FD’A and not him.

Off-topic, but I’m listening to that episode right now. At around the 32:00 minute mark Jonathon talks a bit about his own theory. He didn’t want to go into details, but KD said he (J) believed JK, FD’A and a 3rd trusted employee wanted more money and conspired to kill Barry.

I’m guessing the 3rd person may be AG (?) I haven’t heard one bad thing about JK or AG, they’re both highly respected. But as trustees they stood to earn a fortune from the estate if Barry and Honey died.

JK and AG werent involved in these murders. Period. Both were longtime associates and trusted friends of BS. Neither had any motive. Do you really think JK needed more money? And BS certainly would have given either one of them anything they asked for.

 

[Rush4087]

The information provided below does not constitute any assertions of fact with regards to the guilt or action of anyone mentioned. It is conjecture, provided for theoretical, educational, and entertainment purposes. I assume no legal responsibility for the accuracy or correctness of any facts or claims mentioned or for any consequences of relying on any details included. Any theory of supposed action by any party is merely alleged. All narrative characterization is speculative.

-------------------------------------------------------

The Sum of the Parts

Trying to axe AG is probably very important? In line with the rest of his succession behavior? Strange but very calculated? He recorded the Kay episode, tattled on KD to BP, to be on good terms? He’s aware of how legally protective that sort of stuff will be if he’s ever on the stand? This is the stuff reasonable doubt is made from in a close case. Rapport with police, cooperation. Everyone knows that the reward money only likely draws kooks and conspiracy theorists, distracting and bogging TPS down. Who balloons the reward?

The home building company thing (where BS wanted to fund the boyfriend without JS involved) goes well beyond “controlling” in my mind. This was likely leading up to or included in the 2010-2015 stuff? An even bigger reservoir for JS to draw animus from? Was BS actively poking the bear whether he knew it or not? The suicidal comment, the coup attempt, the “what will you do and when” and now this. His response to KD prompting him about the $ motive, was to shrug this all off. He was suicidal but the idea of killing someone else was not even rational to consider from an objective view, that is what his response suggested?

The evidence for him being backed into a corner here, overwhelming? Behavior, upon being backed into a corner, is easier to predict than one might think, given the right circumstances?

One theory: Barry was heading up the efforts to retain capital, but Honey was likely in the know (“dealing with some stuff”)? Honey also had gained control and influence over time. Like how the younger kids got way less dough and how Barry was picking out doors for a 30 million dollar home he didn’t want. She had power over Barry, regardless of whatever big monies she herself didn’t obtain? I doubt she really actually cared based on how she lived life...

With Barry pressing the gas pedal, and getting nowhere, is it not possible she became a loud voice in the background, adding to the pressure to secure liquidity? From her POV, $ security, but also putting that kid in his place as she saw it? BS and HS were as driven in their convictions as JS. Earnest players in the game of life, regardless of how similar or different their actions and behaviors. Tension, probably beyond anything JS would ever admit?

This whole JS thing. I don’t know. It’s so possible to be way off given how little we have compared to TPS. But motivation is a powerful thing. His email behavior, the bizarre eulogy and post murder family interactions, choosing to bring KD in after 3 years and then, after realizing KD was going nowhere, ghosting him, the fact that he has floated under the radar in terms of change in capital allocation after the murders compared to the siblings, the sister (credible by every single document account) calling the brother and partner "money hungry monsters", liquidation and destruction of Apotex (despite the $ runway it had compared to overpriced and underutilized storage company), the behavior of police around shielding the link between the estate and the investigation in a way even beyond their paternalistic norms, the plethora of unknown people in the background (AP most particularly and the way JS wouldn’t let up on him being involved in the literal succession planning), and the strange relationship they seem to have (AP on his deeds but the husband not?). All of this, as is very well know, in the context of the personal animus JS developed for the parents and what they came to represent (an absolute and unfettered road block to his life and work)? All of it, an obvious place to start from?

There’s an old saying used in court when trying to build a legal case. It dovetails with KDs perfect storm analogy. “The sum of the parts”. The circumstantial evidence around potential motive, if we can call it that, rises to great heights? It goes beyond inheritance? As has been said, it’s personal? I also think there’s a mental trap one can fall into in this case as labelling the Sherman’s as rich. Their wealth was really on another scale altogether. I dare say that trap was avoided by the killer(s)?

Is the obvious conclusion that TPS is waiting for some sort of concrete link or break before pulling the trigger, so to speak?

I have no idea what KDs or TPS theory is, obviously. That’s part of the fun and intellectual appeal of spending so much time on the case while things are fluid and it’s so in the press. There are tells in KDs work, however - particularly the way he laid these episodes out, his responses to the q and a, and the last episode, only pushes one further into this sort of theory. Now KD states that Yim and the prosecutor likely brought up JS new storage building on the east side during a recess in court as a potential "tip"... this from the most knowledgeable civilian involved in the case, KD?

KDs point about looking into the other tributaries of benefit post murder is fascinating and important. I can’t get the simple theory out of my head, however. That a major player could be one of the kids?

Finally, the will. The fact that KD seems to have basically shown the document exists, to me, is like this case starting over. KD has someone on record saying she made amendments. That means it exists. This is jaw dropping to me mainly because of the timing. The final say she had was therefore not splitting EVERYTHING four ways. Seeing the post about DHs view of wills only adds to the chaos and confusion. Something was going on that week that did not normally go on. Dealing with some stuff, the missed meeting, the moving around of meetings, the fact so many key players were away or inattentive, and Barry had to go home early. Was it to take a 9pm call from DH with HS present? Is that why they had the architecture meeting at Apotex? Why were they so fixated on shoring up the wills? Why did she have nearly 10k in cash? Strange. Really strange. The key lies in their behavioral patterns in the 72 hours before the murders, no doubt. That will be the key to unlocking the identity of whoever or whatever was propelling against them

Per several Star articles, the amount of money found in Honey’s purse was $7500. I always assumed that she had recently withdrawn the money in preparation for her trip to FL (she was planning to leave on 12/18; BS was to join her on 12/24). All jmo

 

[AndrewM71]

I have to laugh at JS keeping KD in the cold, no water or food etc.

It reminds me of something Michael Scott would do to have “home court advantage” and control the meeting. It’s laughably obvious.

 

[RHR]

Brennan and/or RKS?

RKS

 

[RHR]

I went down a very deep rabbit hole a long time ago in regard to 'Harlo'. I find it interesting that AP is no longer listed on the leadership list. I'm wondering if the players thought it best to keep his name off, just as they have kept JS's name off?

Also, there are photos floating around, perhaps y'all have seen them.. long ago.. from when JS was young... like a teen maybe, or young adult? Pictured with others? Have any of you caught who it looks like in the pics? For me, it's a direct match with one of the leadership of Harlo. imo.

I think they all went to the same summer camp. That is how they met. They also went to the same schools I think.

 

[Lexiintoronto]

I wondered the same thing - wanting to be at home for a 9pm phone call, which they are meant to join together.

If so, there must be email chains relating to the scheduling of that call. Would those emails have been made available to police? Or would they have been “screened” as privileged as they relate to a lawyer?

I found Kevin’s comment in the Q&A today about how the Sherman lawyers are “expensive” and as such would do their bidding a bit perplexing. Is that really fair or true? Who is hiring and controlling these lawyers? What are the lawyers’ own professional obligations?

I think it goes back to the deal that was struck between the lawyers for the Attorney General and the lawyers for Apotex & the estates of both Honey and Barry. The police wanted to search Barry’s office, computer, his cell phone and three other electronic devices (it seems like one was Honey’s phone & there were two iPads found in the master bedroom, maybe those are the devices, imo), but the lawyers for both estates and Apotex were concerned about privileged information that may have been within them.

“The ministry lawyers agreed “to a protocol by which Goodmans LLP, acting for Apotex and for the estate trustees of Bernard (Barry) Sherman and Honey Sherman, will review the data extracted from the five devices first, to ensure legal privileges are protected, before the data are released to investigators,” reads a statement describing the protocol unsealed following a Toronto Star application in court.

Rare though this arrangement is in a homicide investigation, the concept of legal privilege is recognized by the highest court in Canada and is increasingly an issue in many investigations.”

Lawyers for Ontario, Apotex struck deal on what detectives could access in Sherman murder investigation. It took one month

Documents unsealed by a judge last week reveal details of legal wrangling that took place over what detectives could access in their investigation of the murders of Honey and Barry Sherman.

www.thestar.com

So that part of the investigation stalled for a month as they worked out a deal about what the police could and could not access.

(…Two iPads in the master bedroom—if they were expecting a call from DH possibly regarding Honey’s estate, maybe that’s why the two iPads were there? The master bedroom had an adjoining sitting area with couches, and an office.)




images from the houssmax.com original real estate photos.

 

[newclues]

RKS

AP's father-in-law RK (RKS) also builds houses but was not chosen by BS/HS who used Brennan as the builder for their new Forest Hill planned house. Also, BS wanted millions back from JS/AP. Was it for the new house building?