Found Deceased Canada - Eugene Kim, 38, Markham, Ont, 2 Oct 2017

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So are police allowed to go through bank records, emails, cell phone scripts, etc immediately after someone is reported missing?

It probably depends on circumstances but yes, I would think especially in the case of a man with dependents. For eg his children are dependent on him financially as well as emotionally, a person can't just run off and start a new life to avoid paying child support (not suggesting it's the case, but it could be). I think that's why criminal investigations unit is assigned, they're able to access this information.

I think last sightings of people have to be by someone who knows them by sight, who recognizes them and is therefore completely reliable. A witness who thought they resembled a photo would not be 100% certain.
 
Ah, coincidence. I came to post this, and see discussion of phones. There's some mention in this article.

Google Translate of 10 Oct 2017 Korea Times Daily article:
https://translate.google.com/transl...w.koreatimes.net/ArticleViewer/Article/105191

Original, in Korean:
https://www.koreatimes.net/ArticleViewer/Article/105191

A couple of translated quotes, I found of interest:

Bing Translator (I thought this part was translated clearer than Google):
"In order to obtain a call history for accurate track record, a warrant for a telecommunications company is required, but a warrant application is a difficult situation."

Not sure, but I wonder if the the implication is that the disappearance is being treated as a voluntary one, so that getting a warrant to view the phone records is problematic. The article says that his parents were going to meet with the police to "urge active investigations. The police still see Kim as a simple disappearance."

And,

Google Translate:
"According to the family, Eugene has no history of using cards since disappearing. As the passport is still at home, it seems that it is not a foreign departure."
 
Ah, coincidence. I came to post this, and see discussion of phones. There's some mention in this article.

Google Translate of 10 Oct 2017 Korea Times Daily article:
https://translate.google.com/transl...w.koreatimes.net/ArticleViewer/Article/105191

Original, in Korean:
https://www.koreatimes.net/ArticleViewer/Article/105191

A couple of translated quotes, I found of interest:

Bing Translator (I thought this part was translated clearer than Google):
"In order to obtain a call history for accurate track record, a warrant for a telecommunications company is required, but a warrant application is a difficult situation."

Not sure, but I wonder if the the implication is that the disappearance is being treated as a voluntary one, so that getting a warrant to view the phone records is problematic. The article says that his parents were going to meet with the police to "urge active investigations. The police still see Kim as a simple disappearance."

And,

Google Translate:
"According to the family, Eugene has no history of using cards since disappearing. As the passport is still at home, it seems that it is not a foreign departure."

I do recall in other cases that a warrant was required to check phones . I am not sure if the service provider will give information without one. Maybe it has something to do with the privacy act JMO


Do you have to pay for a permit to enter the park?
How much would that cost?
I guess he could have used cash
 
Ah, coincidence. I came to post this, and see discussion of phones. There's some mention in this article.

Google Translate of 10 Oct 2017 Korea Times Daily article:
https://translate.google.com/transl...w.koreatimes.net/ArticleViewer/Article/105191

Original, in Korean:
https://www.koreatimes.net/ArticleViewer/Article/105191

A couple of translated quotes, I found of interest:

Bing Translator (I thought this part was translated clearer than Google):
"In order to obtain a call history for accurate track record, a warrant for a telecommunications company is required, but a warrant application is a difficult situation."

Not sure, but I wonder if the the implication is that the disappearance is being treated as a voluntary one, so that getting a warrant to view the phone records is problematic. The article says that his parents were going to meet with the police to "urge active investigations. The police still see Kim as a simple disappearance."

And,

Google Translate:
"According to the family, Eugene has no history of using cards since disappearing. As the passport is still at home, it seems that it is not a foreign departure."
In answer to your question
Also: http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/toronto/eugene-kim-north-bay-markham-missing-1.4330447
"At this time there's nothing to indicate any foul play or that this is any criminal offence," Brown said. That in part is why police haven't been able to obtain a judicial order to trace the path Kim may have taken out of Toronto.
 
I believe entrance to all Canadian Provincial Parks this year is free as part of Canada's 150th Birthday.
 
Google Translate:
"According to the family, Eugene has no history of using cards since disappearing. As the passport is still at home, it seems that it is not a foreign departure."

Not definitive, but not a good sign.
Since the family is sharing this information, it would be better to share on an English site AS WELL, as opposed to ONLY Korean.
 
Hello everyone - first post here . . .

I have read everyones posts but there is one thing that I keep wondering about . . . We know that Eugene had links to Sault Ste. Marie at some point in his life:

quote_icon.png
Originally Posted by swanniee11
his FB page https://www.facebook.com/eugene.kim....ns&pnref=story

I wonder if any attempts were made to try and establish contact with family there (according to fb, he refers to Sault Ste. Marie as his hometown) or friends that he may know there?

Also, I know there have been several discussions about being able to ping his phone (even when the phone is switched off). Assuming that his car is equipped with GPS, is it possible to track the car (even if he is not subscribing to the service)? Atlease if the car could be tracked by GPS the last time it was used, it would give an idea in what general area to continue the search.

Personally I do not believe he is any where near Algonquin. It's too long to survive there alone without proper preparation - food, warm clothing etc. especially since it is getting cold at night now.

Hope he is ok.
 
Original Korea Daily Toronto page, dated 2017/10/12 (in Korean):
http://www.koreadaily.com/news/read.asp?page=1&branch=NEWS&source=&category=society&art_id=5678011

Google Translate version:
https://translate.google.com/transl...=NEWS&source=&category=society&art_id=5678011

Really hard to understand clearly due to the awkward translation.

My interpretation of what the translation of the report is saying, but keep in mind I could be off:
Eugene's father met with the police on the 11th to discuss the investigation's progress. The police said they are actively investigating, but there is a lack of leads. Many of the friends who were helping with the search have decided they need to get back to their own daily lives. The police asked that they stop spreading rumors that can confuse the investigation.

The part about rumors is interesting. Do you think they mean the Voyageur Outfitters sighting?

Do we have any WSers who can read and translate Korean? Sure would be helpful here.




*
 
I have to say it's been a frustrating case because so many important details haven't been made public OR clear. I also can't help but feel that because it 'appears' Eugene's actions were voluntary, the police have been slow on the draw from the get-go and didn't appear to be too concerned something malicious was going on here. While the evidence confirms that yes, this was pre-meditated, it doesn't mean that something criminal like an abduction didn't also happen along the way. We can't just have fathers in our community disappearing without a trace, otherwise were basically saying you could technically abduct someone and no one's really going to look too hard because you're an adult.

As people have mentioned in this thread, it's time to stop asking Eugene "to come home" and instead re-examine EVERY DETAIL. There are some BURNING questions that have not been answered, and it seems the only additional details we can get were made on a Korean news site instead of our local news. That's extremely limited. I can't also help but feel that the family themselves haven't been as forthcoming about details as they could be - don't you want to find him??? If it were my husband/brother/friend, I would be spilling every single detail about him and the days/weeks/months leading up to his disappearance that could help piece together the timeline from dropping his kids off to the cellphone ping, to the buying of the Algonquin pass permit. I can't help but feel that they are trying to preserve this image of Eugene, when what we really need is some raw honesty and acknowledgement that, hey, you said he would NEVER leave his family but you cannot deny that he LIED about his whereabouts and purpose on that day so really it is POSSIBLE.

Simple questions like:
- what was he wearing that day?
- where does he like to eat? Its a 3HR drive from Richmond Hill to North Bay, I'd get a little hungry and stop for some food
- does he drink coffee? Did we check all the camera footage from Timmy's / McDonalds where ever?
- what are the names on the Algonquin Pass?
- is someone going through all of his email accounts / computer?
- can you call his workplace and cross reference days he "called in sick" to establish a pattern? Maybe he's done this before
- who was the last person that saw him?
- is it possible he was meeting someone from his home town of Sault Sainte Marie and met halfway

At this point, as much as you wouldn't want to suggest she had anything to do with this, the investigation will probably turn back to the wife. Did she really have no idea what he was up to? What if she actually knew what he was planning to do that day? Of anyone in the world she had the most access to the man.

I just think the case is going cold, and we are ALL wanting to find Eugene Kim. But I think if you want to ask the public for help, we NEED a bit more to go on here. Do everything possible to find him.
 
I think the way to solve this is to see what he was up to during the day. If his phone was on they could trace the pings and see what he was up to before he left to go to Algonquin. If he was in a certain area maybe they could check the cameras there and see if he was with anyone before he left. Also police weren't contacted until Wednesday he went missing on Monday even if he did stay the night in Algonquin park that would give him almost 2 days of a head start to get away from there.
 
Here's another report.

Original, dated 12 Oct 2017, in Korean:
https://www.koreatimes.net/ArticleViewer/Article/105267

Google Translate:
https://translate.google.com/transl...w.koreatimes.net/ArticleViewer/Article/105267

Quotes from the translation:

"I will believe in the police and wait for the return of the son."

"I think it is important to cooperate with the police now. "


"On the other hand, Eugene Kim's family emphasized that money raised through crowdfunding will be used only for search, not for living expenses.
The high-funded website for Mr. Kim ([....]) collected about $ 45,000 in four days."


Me: Wow, incredible amount of donations!
 
LE has mentioned that they do not believe this incident is criminal in nature and at this point, that has not changed, as I'm sure the public would have been updated if there was any change. They are "concerned for his well being" - generally that can be a harmless statement, but most often times, its code word for "they are concerned for his mental well being".

Mental illness is more often than not shrouded in secrecy when portrayed in the media. Often times the family will not want any of that revealed. So they stick to the basics and offer no other info. This is what feeds the stigma of mental illness. This is what deters people (including LE) from putting in some elbow grease to find these kinds of missing people because "they left on their own accord". Rather than there being evidence that they were taken against their will, which would give the situation more urgency IMHO. Conversely, you may find those who are mentally ill, and who go missing, portrayed as "he/she requires medication". etc, and they offer up the bare minimum to let people know that there is an illness of some sort that afflicts this missing person. But often times, you won't hear "They committed suicide". Now - SOMETIMES you will. But not often. You'll hear "the investigation is closed" or "no foul play suspected". It's the same as our transit system. "Injury at track level" - usually a suicide. You never used to hear that. You just heard "There are delays on Bloor/Danforth or "Yonge/University". They would be very vague.

They do this so that anyone in the general public is not "triggered".

Hey, I appreciate what you're trying to say, but fair warning, you've gone and rattled my cage here. Lol... I know a little bit about mental illness.
(This may be lengthy.)

The last 15 years of my nursing career I worked as an RN on an acute adult in-patient, locked psychiatric unit of a large general hospital.

The last 7 of those years I was the Charge Nurse, working directly with the hospital psychiatrists, and supervising other RNs and ancillary staff.

So yeah, I know about mental illness. I know too how LE and the media couch their terminology. I worked directly with them too.

The plight of the mentally ill was brought into sharp focus for me during the preceding 10 years that I worked as an RN in the Emergency Department.

I gazed into the face of every single mental illness, up close and personal. Overdoses, self-harm behavior, paranoia, hallucinations, delusions, etc.

Every 'Biblical' and historical 'renowned' figure, graced our doors.

It was the tragedy of those with schizophrenia that touched my heart to the core.

They were often all alone, with no one to make sure they took their meds, or help them keep the post-discharge mental health appointments we dutifully made.

'Julius Caesar' certainly wasn't going to.

Trying to grasp the magnitude of their daily tragedy was the catalyst for my change to psychiatric nursing.

Retired now, I'm forever indebted to my patients. From them I learned the true meaning of courage: Putting one foot in front of the other when the illness is dictating the terms.

Which brings me to my point. My # 1 flag-waving cause for the mentally ill.

First of all, we don't know whether Eugene has been diagnosed with any mental illness. We don't know for certain what LE or the media are trying to portray. Yes, we can guess, but we don't know.

My problem though is the feeling (and not necessarily directed at you, but you quoted my post,) that the public is somehow entitled to know if he does!

Not only that, but the feeling that the public also feels entitled to parse every action and word, by him and his family, and make judgements about them. About what they should or should not be doing.

All of this from behind a computer screen.

No matter what LE or the media does, or does not do, I will respect and support Eugene's family totally. They have a right to privacy of their health and marital issues, whatever they may be.

They don't owe me a thing. I'm not entitled to any information about Eugene's mental health. I don't get a vote in their right to privacy.

Yeah, there shouldn't be a stigma to any mental issues. Hey, I held family education classes for years. I preached that very thing! But I don't get the right to decide for someone else whether they want to share that history.

And yes, they are still entitled to ask for my help. If I feel I can't give it without knowing the 'whole' story, then I can just bow out.

Would it help to know his history? Possibly. But again, that is not my right to know. Laws have been passed to protect everyone's health records.

I want to help Eugene's family, I will do that by showing them my respect and support. I wouldn't think of trying to force them to 'fess up and stop deluding themselves.'

That just feels mean to me. Anything that feels mean, usually is.

Their hearts are heavy enough without me burdening them with one more 'inth' of pain.

I don't intend to come across as telling people how to post. As long as it is within the TOS, all opinions are legit.

People are entitled to believe whatever they want. I get the sharing of views. But I climb on my soapbox when I fail to see consideration for other possibilities.

I want to keep my mind open. I do owe the family that much.

It may end up being proven that there are mental issues. If so, I am solidly in their camp. If it's proven there are none, I am also solidly in their camp.

I am sending this family my sympathy, respect, and prayers they will find Eugene safe and sound...

Off my soapbox now...




JMO
 
Hey, I appreciate what you're trying to say, but fair warning, you've gone and rattled my cage here. Lol... I know a little bit about mental illness.
(This may be lengthy.)

The last 15 years of my nursing career I worked as an RN on an acute adult in-patient, locked psychiatric unit of a large general hospital.

The last 7 of those years I was the Charge Nurse, working directly with the hospital psychiatrists, and supervising other RNs and ancillary staff.

So yeah, I know about mental illness. I know too how LE and the media couch their terminology. I worked directly with them too.

The plight of the mentally ill was brought into sharp focus for me during the preceding 10 years that I worked as an RN in the Emergency Department.

I gazed into the face of every single mental illness, up close and personal. Overdoses, self-harm behavior, paranoia, hallucinations, delusions, etc.

Every 'Biblical' and historical 'renowned' figure, graced our doors.

It was the tragedy of those with schizophrenia that touched my heart to the core.

They were often all alone, with no one to make sure they took their meds, or help them keep the post-discharge mental health appointments we dutifully made.

'Julius Caesar' certainly wasn't going to.

Trying to grasp the magnitude of their daily tragedy was the catalyst for my change to psychiatric nursing.

Retired now, I'm forever indebted to my patients. From them I learned the true meaning of courage: Putting one foot in front of the other when the illness is dictating the terms.

Which brings me to my point. My # 1 flag-waving cause for the mentally ill.

First of all, we don't know whether Eugene has been diagnosed with any mental illness. We don't know for certain what LE or the media are trying to portray. Yes, we can guess, but we don't know.

My problem though is the feeling (and not necessarily directed at you, but you quoted my post,) that the public is somehow entitled to know if he does!

Not only that, but the feeling that the public also feels entitled to parse every action and word, by him and his family, and make judgements about them. About what they should or should not be doing.

All of this from behind a computer screen.

No matter what LE or the media does, or does not do, I will respect and support Eugene's family totally. They have a right to privacy of their health and marital issues, whatever they may be.

They don't owe me a thing. I'm not entitled to any information about Eugene's mental health. I don't get a vote in their right to privacy.

Yeah, there shouldn't be a stigma to any mental issues. Hey, I held family education classes for years. I preached that very thing! But I don't get the right to decide for someone else whether they want to share that history.

And yes, they are still entitled to ask for my help. If I feel I can't give it without knowing the 'whole' story, then I can just bow out.

Would it help to know his history? Possibly. But again, that is not my right to know. Laws have been passed to protect everyone's health records.

I want to help Eugene's family, I will do that by showing them my respect and support. I wouldn't think of trying to force them to 'fess up and stop deluding themselves.'

That just feels mean to me. Anything that feels mean, usually is.

Their hearts are heavy enough without me burdening them with one more 'inth' of pain.

I don't intend to come across as telling people how to post. As long as it is within the TOS, all opinions are legit.

People are entitled to believe whatever they want. I get the sharing of views. But I climb on my soapbox when I fail to see consideration for other possibilities.

I want to keep my mind open. I do owe the family that much.

It may end up being proven that there are mental issues. If so, I am solidly in their camp. If it's proven there are none, I am also solidly in their camp.

I am sending this family my sympathy, respect, and prayers they will find Eugene safe and sound...

Off my soapbox now...




JMO

Thanks for your considerate and thoughtful post! The family should get our support and help in keeping an eye out without them telling us their business!
 
Stop making personal comments about other posters. That is considered off-topic and will result in a timeout if it continues.
 
The family doesn't owe us anything. They've asked us for help in locating their loved one. They want us to watch for the car and Eugene. They are not prepared to air their laundry in public. They don't want us to delve into their private lives. TBH it's none of our business.

I think they just want us to be on the lookout and no more.

I know it's frustrating. We have many questions and they are not going to be answered.

MOO

THANK YOU. My thoughts exactly.
 
Hey, I appreciate what you're trying to say, but fair warning, you've gone and rattled my cage here. Lol... I know a little bit about mental illness.
(This may be lengthy.)

The last 15 years of my nursing career I worked as an RN on an acute adult in-patient, locked psychiatric unit of a large general hospital.

The last 7 of those years I was the Charge Nurse, working directly with the hospital psychiatrists, and supervising other RNs and ancillary staff.

So yeah, I know about mental illness. I know too how LE and the media couch their terminology. I worked directly with them too.

The plight of the mentally ill was brought into sharp focus for me during the preceding 10 years that I worked as an RN in the Emergency Department.

I gazed into the face of every single mental illness, up close and personal. Overdoses, self-harm behavior, paranoia, hallucinations, delusions, etc.

Every 'Biblical' and historical 'renowned' figure, graced our doors.

It was the tragedy of those with schizophrenia that touched my heart to the core.

They were often all alone, with no one to make sure they took their meds, or help them keep the post-discharge mental health appointments we dutifully made.

'Julius Caesar' certainly wasn't going to.

Trying to grasp the magnitude of their daily tragedy was the catalyst for my change to psychiatric nursing.

Retired now, I'm forever indebted to my patients. From them I learned the true meaning of courage: Putting one foot in front of the other when the illness is dictating the terms.

Which brings me to my point. My # 1 flag-waving cause for the mentally ill.

First of all, we don't know whether Eugene has been diagnosed with any mental illness. We don't know for certain what LE or the media are trying to portray. Yes, we can guess, but we don't know.

My problem though is the feeling (and not necessarily directed at you, but you quoted my post,) that the public is somehow entitled to know if he does!

Not only that, but the feeling that the public also feels entitled to parse every action and word, by him and his family, and make judgements about them. About what they should or should not be doing.

All of this from behind a computer screen.

No matter what LE or the media does, or does not do, I will respect and support Eugene's family totally. They have a right to privacy of their health and marital issues, whatever they may be.

They don't owe me a thing. I'm not entitled to any information about Eugene's mental health. I don't get a vote in their right to privacy.

Yeah, there shouldn't be a stigma to any mental issues. Hey, I held family education classes for years. I preached that very thing! But I don't get the right to decide for someone else whether they want to share that history.

And yes, they are still entitled to ask for my help. If I feel I can't give it without knowing the 'whole' story, then I can just bow out.

Would it help to know his history? Possibly. But again, that is not my right to know. Laws have been passed to protect everyone's health records.

I want to help Eugene's family, I will do that by showing them my respect and support. I wouldn't think of trying to force them to 'fess up and stop deluding themselves.'

That just feels mean to me. Anything that feels mean, usually is.

Their hearts are heavy enough without me burdening them with one more 'inth' of pain.

I don't intend to come across as telling people how to post. As long as it is within the TOS, all opinions are legit.

People are entitled to believe whatever they want. I get the sharing of views. But I climb on my soapbox when I fail to see consideration for other possibilities.

I want to keep my mind open. I do owe the family that much.

It may end up being proven that there are mental issues. If so, I am solidly in their camp. If it's proven there are none, I am also solidly in their camp.

I am sending this family my sympathy, respect, and prayers they will find Eugene safe and sound...

Off my soapbox now...




JMO
Bless you for all you did for your patients and their families. No doubt you touched many, many lives.

Sent from my SCH-I435L using Tapatalk
 
Just wanted to quickly say...We've quite a few new posters here, and I just want to say it does sometimes take a bit of time to learn the ropes for posting here, but don't give up. We need your great minds!
 

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