Canada - Lucas Fowler, Chynna Deese, and Leonard Dyck, all murdered, Alaska Hwy, BC, Jul 2019 #10

[Gina20]

did you just describe murderers as gentlemen?!
no, I must be seeing things

Police in this country do often call suspects gentlemen, which they are not. One recently is in jail accused of murdering a mother and toddler. It's a term of exceeding politeness, lawyerly, even. We can only imagine what they're really thinking.

 

[LadyL]

Did he not just graduate?

no he never graduated (ETA: according to some reports; others say he did)
Kam did (graduate - have seen the photo)

 

[LadyL]

Police in this country do often call suspects gentlemen, which they are not. One recently is in jail accused of murdering a mother and toddler. It's a term of exceeding politeness, lawerly, even. We can all imagine what they're really thinking.

I was just teasing Otto
we Canadians are embarrassingly polite sometimes

 

[CanadianMade]

no he never graduated
Kam did

Really?
Because as far as the media reports the last time someone saw him and his father together was at his graduation....
Interesting that people are willing to believe Some things they see in the media when it fits their narrative, but they aren't willing to believe others when it doesn't.

 

[LadyL]

Thank you for proving my point....?

ETA: Working on meaning they are still linking evidence. Once again, it has been two weeks and they have not been charged yet. Why?

I think it's a more complicated crime scene but I can see why you think they may not have enough evidence yet

 

[Trooper]

Working on charges means they are looking for evidence to connect them meaning they don't have enough yet to charge them.....2 weeks later.

ETA: Just think about it...they were charged with LD's death quite quickly meaning they had solid evidence to connect them. If they had solid evidence to connect the other two they would have already charged them. To me, that means they do not have enough to do so.

Assuming the Canadian law works similarly to AU law, charging K and B with the murder of Lucas and Chynna would be redundant and superfluous, considering all the processes fall into place ( alerts, search plans, personnel deployment , all the paraphernalia for a nation wide hunt and chase, )are there with the charging of them for Len Dycks murder. No earthly reason to lay out all the cards at once, and that is why the charge is 2nd degree murder, this is easily raised up to 1st, not so easily dragged down from 1st to 2nd, so this is entirely rational. And common practice. Almost universally common.

Just think about this. The reason they have not been charged with the murder of Lucas and Chynna may rest ENTIRELY on the FACT, that both of them are non citizens of Canada, and a terrific amount of oversight and interest is taken on a diplomatic level, and between the Investigation Orgs of all countries, USA, AU , and Canada, and to charge them with these two murders is not in the best interest of the Investigation , probably agreed to by all concerned.

I am convinced that there is enough evidence to charge them , otherwise they wouldn't be named as suspects and would be still considered 'missing' There is a reason, and the RCMP isn't in the business of buggerising around making up stuff to send entire communities into a spin over nothing.

These young men have had radio's in the vehicles they steal and they certainly would have tuned in , if only to get a hint of weather conditions, since their very lives depend on that info once they burn the vehicles. They know they are wanted. Don't give me this innocent until proven stuff, this is a discussion board, and a victim friendly one, to boot, 3 people , going about their lawful business , were spandaxed and murdered for no known motive.

The charge for murder of Len Dyck doesn't even hint at motive, or provocation. It is murder for the hell of it, and so far, they fit the international criteria for spree killings, it's a reasonable tack to take , all things considered.

 

[ladysamurai]

I needed to see a condensed timeline—so I put this together. Any mistakes are entirely my own, please feel free to bring them to my attention. Reading through it, I must admit, grudgingly, that BS/KM used a very successful strategy of moving VERY quickly, staying ahead of discoveries and announcements. By sticking to the remote areas, they took advantage of people with more trusting mindsets than those in urban settings—people who are used to helping strangers, people who may leave their doors unlocked and keys in the car. Didn’t hurt that they came across as polite, courteous, neat. Wolves in sheep’s’ clothing.

July 12--BS/KM leave Port Alberni headed to Alberta or the Yukon (as per BS father or grandmother)

July 13/14--Last known contact of BS w/Carol Starkey, grandmother.

July 14 11:30PM--C. Deese and L. Fowler seen alive, at van, Alaska Highway/Hwy 97, Liard Hot Springs

July 15 6:45AM--Deese’s and Fowler’s bodies spotted behind van by trucker

July 17—RCMP says Deese, Fowler deaths are suspicious

July 18—RCMP announces Deese, Fowler as homicide victims

July 18—BS/KM spotted 350km away in Jade City store where they stopped for free coffee

July 18 3:15PM--BS/KM spotted traveling south from Super A General Store, Dease Lake

July 19—BS/KM’s burning pickup, Hwy 37, 50km south of Dease Lake, 470km from Deese/Fowler

July 19—Man’s body reported at highway pullout 2km from burning pickup truck

July 19—BS/KM announced as missing by RCMP

July 21--BS/KM in grey 2011 Toyota RAV4, get SUV stuck in Cold Lake, AB. A local assists them.

July 21—BS/KM recorded on security camera in store at Meadow Lake, AB

July 22—BS/KM are passed through the alcohol checkpoint by band constables at Split Lake, MB

July 23—RCMP announce BS/KN as suspects in the 3 deaths, and possibly driving 2011 Toyota RAV4

July 23—Burning RAV4 reported northeast of Gillam, MB, 170km east of Split Lake, MB. Manhunt.

July 24—RCMP ID body as that of Len Dyck

July 24—RCMP confirm BS/KM connected with burnt RAV4. Manhunt, house-to-house, continues.

July 28—Alleged sighting, massive manhunt in York Landing, southwest of Gillam, but no luck

References used—those below, plus many others courtesy of the Websleuths community:

RCMP not ruling out link between missing Alberni teens, body found near truck, double slaying

(The above reference has some interesting points I have not seen elsewhere, including that BS’s father said he was closer to 125lbs, not 170lbs as reported by RCMP.)

Timeline of events in the deaths of three people in northern B.C.

Teens missing after burning truck and body found in Northern BC | News

 

[MistyWaters]

I’m grateful WS does it’s best not contribute to this SM frenzy.

‘It’s been blown out of proportion’: Online speculation causing havoc in manhunt for B.C. fugitives

It's been blown out of proportion': Online speculation causing havoc in manhunt for B.C. fugitives

“Online speculation that the pair has crossed into Ontario from Manitoba has led to a host of calls to police reporting possible sightings in nine different towns in the province, including at a Tim Hortons restaurant in Timmins.

While police are encouraging people to continue calling in anything suspicious, Acting Sgt. Shona Camirand with the Ontario Provincial Police in North Bay said social media users are taking things too far......

......But with no trace of the fugitives since then, paranoia about the duo crossing provincial borders into Ontario has merged with the age of social media, leading to mass speculation online that has dominated police calls during the past 24 hours.....

........Depatie, the Timmins dispatch co-ordinator, said the public needs to be careful with what they see online.

“That’s the speculative aspect of social media that allows for misinformation to be forwarded,” he said.

“The public should only be concerned with what comes from accredited news sources or a policing agency, anything other than that should be greeted with healthy skepticism......

......Regardless of where the suspects may be, police say the process is simple — don’t post tips to social media and call the police directly....”

 

[tcfpne]

Police in this country do often call suspects gentlemen, which they are not. One recently is in jail accused of murdering a mother and toddler. It's a term of exceeding politeness, lawerly, even. We can all imagine what they're really thinking.

Its the innocent until proven guilty. If police don't want a lawsuit, they won't call suspects anything else.
On the forums these guys are guilty but to police and judicial system they are technically innocent, even if everyone knows what they've done.

/

No earthly reason to lay out all the cards at once, and that is why the charge is 2nd degree murder, this is easily raised up to 1st, not so easily dragged down from 1st to 2nd, so this is entirely rational. And common practice. Almost universally common.

The charge of 2nd degree comes from the fact that there is no evidence that shows that they meticulously planned to murder LD. Going from 2nd degree to 1st is very hard because the prosecution has to prove that it was planned well in advance.

Robert Pickton, who killed 27! people was on trial for 2nd degree of murder of 6 people. And supposedly killed 49 "The Crown reported that Pickton told the officer that he wanted to kill another woman to make it an even fifty, and that he was caught because he was "sloppy""

A 2nd degree murder charge would place these two behind bars, which the prosecution feels is enough at least at this time.

 

[SteveP]

We don’t have the death penalty!

Canadian law says adults convicted of murder, either 1st or 2nd degree, will be sentenced to life in prison, and the amount of time served before being eligible for parole is what differentiates between the two...is that basically correct? Is parole always an option in time, or is there a Canadian version of LWOP?

 

[Trooper]

They SUSPECT they murdered the couple. SUSPECT.

Sure.. I am giving a long leash to my strong suspicions. I owe Kam and Bryer nothing at all. Not even a skerrick of leeway. They are on the run, no doubt about that, or they are dead, and if that is the case, they died unpleasantly, I would think, and that's ok with me, too.

And they are thieves, also. Trivial, in comparison with murder, but murder is theft , as well. Nothing remotely indicative of them being caught up in some convoluted plot to pin the blame on little Bryer and little Kam. Nothing of the sort.

 

[CanadianMade]

Assuming the Canadian law works similarly to AU law, charging K and B with the murder of Lucas and Chynna would be redundant and superfluous, considering all the processes fall into place ( alerts, search plans, personnel deployment , all the paraphernalia for a nation wide hunt and chase, are there with the charging of them for Len Dycks murder. No earthly reason to lay out all the cards at once, and that is why the charge is 2nd degree murder, this is easily raised up to 1st, not so easily dragged down from 1st to 2nd, so this is entirely rational. And common practice. Almost universally common.

Just think about this. The reason they have not been charged with the murder of Lucas and Chynna may rest ENTIRELY on the FACT, that both of them are non citizens of Canada, and a terrific amount of oversight and interest is taken on a diplomatic level, and between the Investigation Orgs of all countries, USA, AU , and Canada, and to charge them with these two murders is not in the best interest of the Investigation , probably agreed to by all concerned.

I am convinced that there is enough evidence to charge them , otherwise they wouldn't be named as suspects and would be still considered 'missing' There is a reason, and the RCMP isn't in the business of buggerising around making up stuff to send entire communities into a spin over nothing.

These young men have had radio's in the vehicles they steal and they certainly would have tuned in , if only to get a hint of weather conditions, since their very lives depend on that info once they burn the vehicles. They know they are wanted. Don't give me this innocent until proven stuff, this is a discussion board, and a victim friendly one, to boot, 3 people , going about their lawful business , were spandaxed and murdered for no known motive.

The charge for murder of Len Dyck doesn't even hint at motive, or provocation. It is murder for the hell of it, and so far, they fit the international criteria for spree killings, it's a reasonable tack to take , all things considered.

You are assuming it was for the hell of it. You are assuming it was for fun. You are assuming all of it based on media reports.
I am not denying that they very likely killed LD. I am saying I personally do not believe they killed the couple and I don't see why I am not entitled to My opinion if everyone else is?
If they are charged with the other two murders, you are all welcome to say 'I told you so' but for now I am basing My opinion on the facts that have come directly from LE and Nothing else.

 

[jeb jeb]

yes I, too, found it curious that they repeated the request

It also says, between the lines, that they really don't know.

 

[esayer]

You are assuming it was for the hell of it. You are assuming it was for fun. You are assuming all of it based on media reports.
I am not denying that they very likely killed LD. I am saying I personally do not believe they killed the couple and I don't see why I am not entitled to My opinion if everyone else is?
If they are charged with the other two murders, you are all welcome to say 'I told you so' but for now I am basing My opinion on the facts the have come directly from LE and Nothing else.

Fine but you're being super contrary in a weird and not productive way. There is common sense involved here as well and this isn't a court of law.

 

[Elley Mae]

I needed to see a condensed timeline—so I put this together. Any mistakes are entirely my own, please feel free to bring them to my attention. Reading through it, I must admit, grudgingly, that BS/KM used a very successful strategy of moving VERY quickly, staying ahead of discoveries and announcements. By sticking to the remote areas, they took advantage of people with more trusting mindsets than those in urban settings—people who are used to helping strangers, people who may leave their doors unlocked and keys in the car. Didn’t hurt that they came across as polite, courteous, neat. Wolves in sheep’s’ clothing.

July 12--BS/KM leave Port Alberni headed to Alberta or the Yukon (as per BS father or grandmother)

July 13/14--Last known contact of BS w/Carol Starkey, grandmother.

July 14 11:30PM--C. Deese and L. Fowler seen alive, at van, Alaska Highway/Hwy 97, Liard Hot Springs

July 15 6:45AM--Deese’s and Fowler’s bodies spotted behind van by trucker

July 17—RCMP says Deese, Fowler deaths are suspicious

July 18—RCMP announces Deese, Fowler as homicide victims

July 18—BS/KM spotted 350km away in Jade City store where they stopped for free coffee

July 18 3:15PM--BS/KM spotted traveling south from Super A General Store, Dease Lake

July 19—BS/KM’s burning pickup, Hwy 37, 50km south of Dease Lake, 470km from Deese/Fowler

July 19—Man’s body reported at highway pullout 2km from burning pickup truck

July 19—BS/KM announced as missing by RCMP

July 21--BS/KM in grey 2011 Toyota RAV4, get SUV stuck in Cold Lake, AB. A local assists them.

July 21—BS/KM recorded on security camera in store at Meadow Lake, AB

July 22—BS/KM are passed through the alcohol checkpoint by band constables at Split Lake, MB

July 23—RCMP announce BS/KN as suspects in the 3 deaths, and possibly driving 2011 Toyota RAV4

July 23—Burning RAV4 reported northeast of Gillam, MB, 170km east of Split Lake, MB. Manhunt.

July 24—RCMP ID body as that of Len Dyck

July 24—RCMP confirm BS/KM connected with burnt RAV4. Manhunt, house-to-house, continues.

July 28—Alleged sighting, massive manhunt in York Landing, southwest of Gillam, but no luck

References used—those below, plus many others courtesy of the Websleuths community:

RCMP not ruling out link between missing Alberni teens, body found near truck, double slaying

(The above reference has some interesting points I have not seen elsewhere, including that BS’s father said he was closer to 125lbs, not 170lbs as reported by RCMP.)

Timeline of events in the deaths of three people in northern B.C.

Teens missing after burning truck and body found in Northern BC | News

I saw the weight listed at 125 last week but couldn’t find it again. I do wonder how the weight is off by 45 lbs, did he once weigh 170? Did he lose 45 lbs?

 

[CaptainSanchez]

This is ridiculous there is no evidence these guys committed any crimes for all we know they’re on a gap year road trip having the time of their lives. If they were doing it for the gram we’d hear from them if they did it for the thrill there would be a bigger body count by now. None of this adds up and smells like a setup. Every day a new fake reporting

 

[tcfpne]

I saw the weight listed at 125 last week but couldn’t find it again. I do wonder how the weight is off by 45 lbs, did he once weigh 170? Did he lose 45 lbs?

He lost 45Lbs in nervous anticipation of their murderous trip

This is ridiculous there is no evidence these guys committed any crimes for all we know they’re on a gap year road trip having the time of their lives. If they were doing it for the gram we’d hear from them if they did it for the thrill there would be a bigger body count by now. None of this adds up and smells like a setup. Every day a new fake reporting

In before the RCMP is wrong, these two didn't do anything and we all accused them for nothing.

But seriously, maybe they did have some twisted plan and they did manage to get to their destination to carry it out but preparation is taking time. Otherwise, where are they?!

 

[esayer]

This is ridiculous there is no evidence these guys committed any crimes for all we know they’re on a gap year road trip having the time of their lives. If they were doing it for the gram we’d hear from them if they did it for the thrill there would be a bigger body count by now. None of this adds up and smells like a setup. Every day a new fake reporting

The authorities have evidence. They wouldn't charge them with murder if they did not. <modsnip>

 

[Trooper]

You are assuming it was for the hell of it. You are assuming it was for fun. You are assuming all of it based on media reports.
I am not denying that they very likely killed LD. I am saying I personally do not believe they killed the couple and I don't see why I am not entitled to My opinion if everyone else is?
If they are charged with the other two murders, you are all welcome to say 'I told you so' but for now I am basing My opinion on the facts that have come directly from LE and Nothing else.

Go right ahead. Nothing to stop you from having a point of view. It is , however, irrational to keep trying to shoot people down ( no pun intended) over their views. This forum is solely for the victims of crime, it has nothing to do with people who hold a brief and an empathy with the perpetrators, or , in this case HEAVILY SUSPECTED ABSCONDING MEN , and I am sure there are a million websites created peculiarly and particularly in support of little Bry and little Kam. Web sleuths isn't one of them, and has never been a forum for supporting those suspected, by accredited law enforcement entities of a revolting crime , in this case, the death of 3 people, for no damn reason whatsoever.

 

[CaptainSanchez]

The authorities have evidence. They wouldn't charge them with murder if they did not. <modsnip>

They didn’t charge with Chynna and Fowler deaths. What evidence do we have regarding the old man? How was he killed? Did he even own the rav4? Nothing supports this

<Admin Note: The "old man" is Len, Leonard, Leonard Dyck>