Canada - Lucas Fowler, Chynna Deese, and Leonard Dyck, all murdered, Alaska Hwy, BC, Jul 2019 #13

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Kiantra said:
I was just listening to an August 7th, CBC interview, the lawyer interviewed stated Mr Dycks body was burnt (see 4:55 mark). I have never heard this before. Anyone else?
https://www.cbc.ca/player/play/1584469571997
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He is saying if Mr. Dyck was burnt as an example. The lawyer is not saying Prof. Dyck was burnt. How would the lawyer possibly have inside info such as Prof. Dyck being burnt. This is how gossip starts :(
 
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Massasauga Rattler said:
And a complete sham of a report. Probably the poster example for politically motivated police secrecy and whitewashing.

Was really one of biggest reasons I lost a lot of confidence in LE in this country to be transparent and honest.
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What questions do you have that remain unanswered? Really, I think the report explained as much as it could, factually.

Were you hoping that they would conclude that it was terrorism? They didn't find any evidence of a political motivation.
 
JuneBug67 said:
I think we’re mostly saying the same thing. :) Prelims are not automatically pub banned though, at least not in Ontario; bans are considered by request, and defense teams usually request them. I would argue that publication bans can be somewhat more broadly justified than you describe, and not so tightly tied just to the evidentiary considerations you lay out.

Publication ban - Wikipedia
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Well you’re right that the defence has to ask for a publication ban on a preliminary inquiry, but failing to do so would amount to professional malpractice, indeed incompetence :)

Re trials, I said “significant” exception for a reason. There are a number of reasons that a publication ban can be ordered during a trial, but almost all bans relate to reporting on a hearing on the admissibility of evidence. Once the evidence is admitted, the press are free to report on it.
 
Gina20 said:
Publication bans are not automatic in preliminary hearings. They have to be requested. I recall one case where this was not done, and the judge asked, "Are you sure you wouldn't like to ask for ask for a publication ban?" Oops.
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Fewer preliminary hearings occur now than in the past, as the courts move to greater efficiency. Legislation is in place to ensure an accused's right to a timely trial. Often we here of "agreed statement of facts". Complex cases still have preliminary hearings, but perhaps one day in the future this could become archaic.
 
Spy Versus Spy said:
A bit left field but wondering if the cctv store had open displays of Paracetamol or Rat Poison other means of selfharm. A note and empty packets on the riverbank? Eta: I still favour Gunshot somehow
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If one of them was injured, perhaps from being in the boat or falling/breaking an ankle, etc., (or just too weak to continue), then perhaps they stayed together unable to both continue fleeing. If so, then one or both could have chosen any number of ways to forgo the slower process of death from lack of food, water, exposure. Even if they wished to give themselves up at this point, it might not have been possible due to being lost (and perhaps hurt) in the woods.
 
dotr said:
August 10, 2019
Toronto shooting survivor says details helped her as RCMP mum on B.C. cases
"VANCOUVER -- As the RCMP remains tight-lipped about why two young men may have killed three people in northern British Columbia, one of the survivors in Toronto's Danforth shooting says she's been following the story closely.

Danielle Kane said the Toronto police department's decision to release a detailed report on its investigation provided her with clarity about what happened the night she was paralyzed from the waist down and insight into the man who shot her.

"It helped me process the whole thing and it also allowed the public to kind of figure out, well, what are the things that kind of lead up to this sort of thing happening? What are the factors?" she said in an interview.
"I think that's important for the public to know, instead of just wild speculation, because that's what's happening now."
........................................................................................................................................
"They may need to be cautious and careful about how they put things, but I would hope to hear more from police about motivation because ultimately we want to prevent future incidents of this kind," said Neil Boyd, a criminologist at Simon Fraser University in Burnaby, B.C.

Boyd also defended the Mounties handling of the case, arguing that releasing too many details while the fugitives were still at large could have compromised the investigation.

Some details may also be shared with the affected families alone, if they are needlessly gruesome or involve personal information, he said."
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Huge difference. The guy shot himself immediately after the killings and when the report was ready, it was released.

The report will be released in this case, when it's ready.
 
If Mr. Dyck's body was burned, how did they come up with this?

16391880-7282871-Authorities_were_initially_unable_to_identify_Dyck_when_his_body-a-18_1564022193861.jpg
 
Tarika said:
He is saying if Mr. Dyck was as an example.
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I heard it as we don't know how he was murdered, they found his body burnt, but if it's a bullet (that actually killed him)... Mr. Doroshenko certainly appears to know something here and this is only apparent my the way he says it. There is no "...if they found his body burnt." It makes sense of course that, if they torched their camper to destroy evidence, and had killed him, that they may well have tried to burn him as well. JMO I am interested in how others hear this.
 
JuneBug67 said:
RSBM

An interesting-to-me anecdote from the Millard/Smich cases. We had several Americans following with us, and one of them said that Canadian cases are her favourites to follow precisely because of the way things work here. The bedrock principles of a public and transparent justice system are the same as they are in the US, but the timelines can be shifted forward. Protection of the course of justice is paramount in all decisions, and that can result in publication bans on parts of the proceedings, particularly in high profile cases. But those bans are virtually always temporary, so information is deferred, not suppressed.

All court proceedings are still open to the public and to journalists, but journalists may be unable to publish some details or proceedings until the ban is lifted, most typically after the trial. It essentially boils down to if the jury can’t hear it, neither can you right now. That’s a key aspect of what that American sleuther loved about it. She was in the position of following along just like a juror with no more information than they had. Once the publication bans are lifted, we learn via media what we missed, and all the court documents reflecting the proceedings and judgments that were temporarily held back end up in full in Canlii, an online legal database. I’m not sure what the Canlii equivalent in the US is - probably something state-by-state - but she loved the implementation here and the scope and detail of what could eventually be accessed.

There will be no trial here of course, but it’s my belief that the RCMP will assess a public interest and there will be adequate information released. It just won’t necessarily be quick, and there may be elements that are protected by our strong privacy laws, like LD’s injuries/cause of death were. The continuing investigation will be very thorough, leaks will be extremely unlikely, and then at some point we will learn what happened and LE’s conclusions will be supported with necessary facts. So, American friends, hang in there and be patient and I think you will be satisfied in the end. :)
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Yep, I followed the Millard trial as well. Can't recall posting much during the trial, but used WS's to follow the 'trial by tweet' (which is what I call Canadian trials lol). And of course, followed and posted when Bosma first went missing, Millard first arrested... then like most Canadian cases, info was hard to find because of our laws.

Try following any trial in the States without all the outside information from media, blogs, SM creeping in... you just can't, it's impossible IMO
 
Kiantra said:
I was just listening to an August 7th, CBC interview, the lawyer interviewed stated Mr Dycks body was burnt (see 4:55 mark). I have never heard this before. Anyone else?
https://www.cbc.ca/player/play/1584469571997
Click to expand...

Wow, I hear that too. "They found his body burnt". That's a bit of info I also haven't heard and wouldn't have expected. That might have somehow been the connection between the burned vehicle and Mr. Dycks body? Curious.
 
Schmoosh said:
Huge difference. The guy shot himself immediately after the killings and when the report was ready, it was released.

The report will be released in this case, when it's ready.
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I wouldn’t assume that this case will result in something like the Danforth report. That was a mass shooting of 15 people in the middle of Toronto. In my view, this is just not comparable. Not saying it won’t happen, but I think that we are talking apples and oranges.

Others may disagree.
 
musicaljoke said:
Oh, I see what you are saying. Yes, keys should not be discarded. I believe the lovely officer (who gave us the massive hint) addressed this when he said that the frontline RCMP officers didn't linger to process the scene because of the potential danger to themselves.
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Meanwhile, the lovely people of the community went about their daily lives on that stretch of road after the vehicle was found, picking berries, finding burnt and unburnt matches, keys, etc. Billy Beardy and TV reporters were there, too. Makes me wonder why they were allowed to be there if it was too dangerous for police.
 
MassGuy said:
Yeah, I’m the kind of guy who is left feeling unsatisfied when the bad guy gets shot to death in a movie.

I would have liked a trial, and enjoyed seeing these two in chains.

I’m sure the families feel the same way.
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I agree. To continue with the movie analogy, it's kind of like, it was a thriller, edge of your seat type of movie, you were always left wondering what would happen next, you were glued to the screen in anticipation.... and then the movie cuts to a black screen and you have to make up your own mind of what actually happened. Darn!
 
Schmoosh said:
If two guys of relatively limited means who had plans to take a road trip with ill intentions, they might consider getting a nightshift job at a store that has all the supplies they need, for only as long as it takes to "obtain" them. Say, a Wal-Mart for 5 weeks, for instance. ;)
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Oh it has occurred to me before that they may have stolen stuff from wal-mart! I guess they could have sold it to raise the cash, but if I knew them and didn't know where the money came from, I'd be giving them some serious side eye over a trip with lots of money. I think it may have been a combination of pilfered supplies from wal-mart and relied on the kindness of generous relatives for a cash advance.

All MOO.
 
Moonlitnight said:
I heard it as we don't know how he was murdered, they found his body burnt, but if it's a bullet (that actually killed him)... Mr. Doroshenko certainly appears to know something here and this is only apparent my the way he says it. There is no "...if they found his body burnt." It makes sense of course that, if they torched their camper to destroy evidence, and had killed him, that they may well have tried to burn him as well. JMO I am interested in how others hear this.
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Doroshenko is a DUI lawyer. I hardly think he has inside information. I think that he misspoke.
 
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