Canada - Lucas Fowler, Chynna Deese, and Leonard Dyck, all murdered, Alaska Hwy, BC, Jul 2019 #13

[Schmoosh]

And you think this happened to them twice within a 5 days of each other?

Some people don’t have very good luck. Or, they burned their own vehicles.

I'd love to hear your theory on why they put it in the ditch before intentionally burning it.

 

[grannygates]

Port Alberni isn't on the ocean, per se. It's quite aways inland on Vancouver Island, but it has access to the Pacific Ocean

Google Maps

it’s strange to see it on the map, how far inland it is ! when you are downtown there is a boat marina and (like you can see on the google maps) there’s log booms/tug boats sitting in the water going to and from the mill. i don’t know if the mill is open again or not

 

[Kubirai]

Leonard Dyck's life was no less valuable.

Of course. I was responding to the opinion that Lucas/Chyanna will be remembered mainly because of their murders.

I sincerely hope there is a named foundation that allows young people like them to travel.

 

[10ofRods]

If we’re talking about Steam, which I use, I’d be pretty astounded if ordinary moderators have access to personal information.

And yet, doxxing occurs and is talked about all the time on Reddit. And somehow, people are able to do swatting.

Any thoughts on how that happens?

 

[NJSleuth91]

Edited to add: BS seemed pretty chatty with other gamers. I think he could easily have gleaned enough from that to figure out who they were and dox them with that info alone.

I got the sense that it was more that thing. Like maybe finding out a secret about them from the grapevine, and then outing the secret in front of everyone.

So...let's also now look at millenials. Having a regular job is not high on the list of "wanted things" for many many of them. "Van life" is the new normal. Tiny houses. Living at home until age 30 or older. Gig economy. Seasonal jobs in a variety of places, allowing travel. Couch surfing. Total disdain for the regular economy. Entire forums of young people devoted to living on $5000US per year (and saving as much of that as possible). Very much like the 60's generation (tune in, turn on, drop out). Today's generation must have internet access (easily gotten) and a phone with cellular data, but that's about it (and for the most part, their parents will pay for that indefinitely).

a) Um...that wasn't really a choice. We did want all of those things. It became clear that it wasn't going to happen. Or that even if we did acquire those things, it could easily be lost in an instant. We readjusted our expectations accordingly. 10 years ago we got criticized for thinking we were "entitled" to decent jobs and the same standard of living as our parents. Now we get criticized for not wanting those things anymore. Millennials can't win when it comes to reputation.

b) Bryer and Kam weren't millennials: Defining generations: Where Millennials end and Generation Z begins

c) I don't think it's necessarily that deep. I doubt the killings had to do with any ideological resentment. I do think that societal factors such as the high rate of isolation and alienation in our society contributed to them falling into this dark spiral and not being stopped. But I doubt they were thinking about climate change or capitalism when they decided to do this. I think this was a series of dumb, impulsive, and quickly-regretted decisions due to untreated mental illness and nonspecific rage at the world. JMO.

 

[Gina20]

One more time:

Port Alberni is a deep port city which lies within the Alberni Valley at the head of the Alberni Inlet, Vancouver Island's longest inlet.

Port Alberni - Wikipedia

It even has tugboats that run up the coast to Prince Rupert.

 

[Schmoosh]

<snipped>

c) I don't think it's necessarily that deep. I doubt the killings had to do with any ideological resentment. I do think that societal factors such as the high rate of isolation and alienation in our society contributed to them falling into this dark spiral and not being stopped. But I doubt they were thinking about climate change or capitalism when they decided to do this. I think this was a series of dumb, impulsive, and quickly-regretted decisions due to untreated mental illness and nonspecific rage at the world. JMO.

Any theories on why Bryer wanted to "talk politics" and start a militia months ago? Buy a gas mask, a knife you could gut a cow with, and camo?

 

[Deleted member 248860]

So...let's also now look at millenials. Having a regular job is not high on the list of "wanted things" for many many of them. "Van life" is the new normal. Tiny houses. Living at home until age 30 or older. Gig economy. Seasonal jobs in a variety of places, allowing travel. Couch surfing. Total disdain for the regular economy. Entire forums of young people devoted to living on $5000US per year (and saving as much of that as possible). Very much like the 60's generation (tune in, turn on, drop out). Today's generation must have internet access (easily gotten) and a phone with cellular data, but that's about it (and for the most part, their parents will pay for that indefinitely).

Suicide is on the rise in that group. Their sense that things are collapsing is exaggerated, but I do think their chances of owning their own home, with a bedroom for each kid and at least two bathrooms is...very much in doubt.

I see students whose parents die and now 4 kids and their families are living in the parental home (often in disharmony) and trying to make ends meet. They still have more square feet per person than someone living in an apartment in Beijing or even Tokyo. They have cars and gadgets. They have to participate in the cash economy to keep their phones and pay utilities (although so many know workarounds, it's amazing to me).

Their existential dilemma: Why do humans bother to do anything, when most of it is destroying the planet and no one cares that polar bears are going to be extinct and that gorillas are being poached? That's the question I get, all the time. Why bother?

Someone deep in that mindset usually also dislikes and avoids people who have the opposite worldview. And they may hate more than one type of people: people who are in the regular economy (for sure) and people who are outside it (like Chynna and Lucas) but who are positive, happy and having a good time. They also hate rich people, capitalists, baby boomers (for stealing all the resources), foreigners (for stealing their local resources), all politicians, the judicial system and, of course, LE. They are very sex-divided these days, as well. While there are certainly girl/women gamers, it is largely a male domain; and while there are certainly girl survivalists, that's largely a male preoccupation. Rates of teen sex keep dropping. Girls are totally not interested, too many risks and the boys are unkind and not at all chivalrous (some girls don't mind that...but many girls/women do, so engaging with the opposite sex becomes one more thing you can fail at...so why do it?)

I'm not saying they were incels. At all. But I am saying that it would be hard to pick out these two in a sea swimming with similar worldviews, including some that are much more hostile. SO many kids go through a phase where they are wannabe Nazis or Communists or Ninjas or Mafiosi or Drug Lords or...I'm sure I'm behind the times, but you get the picture.

If they did turn out to be incels (and let's say, they were of the worst sort of incel), then that would be very interesting. Someone will write a book some day, I'm thinking.

The thing is, we know zip about their online lives outside gaming. The RCMP probably know plenty, including any involvement in extreme Internet forums, whether 8Chan, 4Chan, Storm Front, Gab, etc. I’d be interested in whether they were spending time on certain YouTube channels, such as those associated with Generation Identity.

I don’t know, one way or the other, how much your interesting millennial profile applies to small town Vancouver Island. I spend much more time in Newfoundland, where it doesn’t fit very well, but maybe it has more application to the island on the other coast. One thing I’m fairly sure of is that island life and mainland life tend to be quite different.

Maybe I’ll raise this question with my brother in Victoria later today.

 

[10ofRods]

I know it’s against the rules to post the LINK but I went to Australia 60 minutes FB page. There is new footage of AS and BS. One with BS on the ground holding a gun.
If this is not ok to post and is completely irrelevant please delete.

That is the "airsoft" gun that his dad gave him for Christmas (the same one in the photo taken inside the living room. This is why I kept bringing up that there's "airsoft" and then there's "air gun." As someone pointed out up thread (THANK you), there's no completely hard line dividing the two, but there are rules about which ones can be sold to children.

Bryer's was given to him by his dad. He had a specific weapon in mind. If it's one of the so-called "sniper airsoft guns" then it might have accepted metal BB's and it certainly had a higher muzzle velocity than those used in "airsoft gaming."

While it's probably still low caliber (but we don't know that), they are made in higher calibers and even the .177 has been used successfully in deer hunting.

 

[Gina20]

Inside an Arsonist's Mind

Since there seemed to be some fixation on starting fires everywhere they went, and AS's suggestion of a "blaze" of glory, I submit this for your consideration.

 

[ldlager]

I think it's more about trusting the RCMP when they make an official statement that they have substantial evidence that the murders are connected. The proof will come.

I have a sincere question for posters here. I am honestly curious how posters feel.
At this this point, given all the chasing that occurred, all the manpower devoted, and the subsequent apparent deaths of the 2 suspected killers, do postersthink the RCMP is at present in an unbiased and independent position in trying to link the boys to the couple’s murders? I am casting no aspersions one way or the other here, I just wonder what people think.

 

[Gina20]

That is the "airsoft" gun that his dad gave him for Christmas (the same one in the photo taken inside the living room. This is why I kept bringing up that there's "airsoft" and then there's "air gun." As someone pointed out up thread (THANK you), there's no completely hard line dividing the two, but there are rules about which ones can be sold to children.

Bryer's was given to him by his dad. He had a specific weapon in mind. If it's one of the so-called "sniper airsoft guns" then it might have accepted metal BB's and it certainly had a higher muzzle velocity than those used in "airsoft gaming."

While it's probably still low caliber (but we don't know that), they are made in higher calibers and even the .177 has been used successfully in deer hunting.

Maybe this will help.

Air Guns - Royal Canadian Mounted Police

 

[Jen-Knee]

If I remember correctly, it was mentioned Kam was a moderator on the game Rust. Players can host their own server and appoint players as moderators. I don't think they have any access to players information, owners might but not moderators.

 

[dameagatha]

I'd love to hear your theory on why they put it in the ditch before intentionally burning it.

I’d love to hear your theory on why two guys looking for work in Whitehorse are dead in Gillam.

 

[Zella]

If I remember correctly, it was mentioned Kam was a moderator on the game Rust. Players can host their own server and appoint players as moderators. I don't think they have any access to players information, owners might but not moderators.

This is very helpful! I think the library I work for does this for Minecraft, actually.

 

[Schmoosh]

I have a sincere question for posters here. I am honestly curious how posters feel.
At this this point, given all the chasing that occurred, all the manpower devoted, and the subsequent apparent deaths of the 2 suspected killers, do postersthink the RCMP is at present in an unbiased and independent position in trying to link the boys to the couple’s murders? I am casting no aspersions one way or the other here, I just wonder what people think.

I think the RCMP and the military had very good reason to issue a Canada-wide warning and go all-out like never before in trying to find these two, and not just because they believed he killed Dyck.

 

[Deleted member 248860]

Maybe this will help.

Air Guns - Royal Canadian Mounted Police

Which means that Schmegelsky’s father could not have purchased the higher power gun that @10ofRods is talking about without a license, which it’s almost certain he didn’t have. I don’t think that he could have gotten through the gun safety course, let alone met the other requirements. Even if he had a license, letting his son use such a gun without supervision would have been a violation of the Criminal Code; but I don’t believe that we even get there.

 

[Zella]

I have a sincere question for posters here. I am honestly curious how posters feel.
At this this point, given all the chasing that occurred, all the manpower devoted, and the subsequent apparent deaths of the 2 suspected killers, do postersthink the RCMP is at present in an unbiased and independent position in trying to link the boys to the couple’s murders? I am casting no aspersions one way or the other here, I just wonder what people think.

I've avoided discussions about the RCMP because I'm American and don't think it is my place to engage in the debate. But I really don't see how the manpower/the deaths/the pursuit would impact their declaration of them being involved in killing LF/CD or their continued investigation into it.

They've stated they are continuing to investigate to rule out anyone else's involvement, though they also doubt such involvement, and I have no reason to doubt them on that point or that they will follow where the evidence leads them. Even if they end up declaring BS and KM not suspects in that--which I just don't see happening--it doesn't negate the fact they are charged with LD's death, so it's not like the pursuit was a waste of time if someone else is guilty of killing LF and CD or being an accomplice.

 

[Schmoosh]

I’d love to hear your theory on why two guys looking for work in Whitehorse are dead in Gillam.

I think I've been obvious in my theory. I haven't been here for long so it won't take you long to read my posts.

Your turn to answer my question.

 

[Gina20]

Those generation definitions aren't scientific. For example, the baby boom generation includes people whose parents were still school children when WWII was over. So, not the sons and daughters of soldiers returning from the war. Pop culture definitions overgeneralize. Maybe useful in a Faith Popcorn kind of way.