Canada - Lucas Fowler, Chynna Deese, and Leonard Dyck, all murdered, Alaska Hwy, BC, Jul 2019 #13

[otto]

The bodies must have been fairly close to the river or they would have used the major road that's near by to remove them. The road is roughly 400-500m from the river at that point. I'm thinking they must have been found within 250m of the river.

I believe the area has steep terrain. Easier to bring them down to the water than up to the road. Have you read anything about steep terrain on the North side of the Nelson River?

What we know is that personal items were found at 9km. They were found at 8km, one half mile inland in the dense brush.

Maybe 25 meters, maybe 300 meters, hard to say.

 

[FactFinder3000]

Kill them inside, and there’s no reason to drag the bodies away from the vehicle.

Unless you were planning to steal the van.

We do have the witness who said the window was blown outward. I think that strongly suggests somebody was shot at inside the van. Also, the single shoe may indicate she was putting on her shoes to get out of the van when she was interrupted.

By the way, I was very relieved to see in the video that the van was parked well off the road. From previous photos it looked like they were too close to the center line on the highway. But this video shows that the solid white line actually marks the shoulder of the highway, not the center.

 

[otto]

As someone who lives in B.C., Canada, I wish people would get over this need to think we weren't aware. As someone who checks local and national headlines every morning, I was aware of a suspicious death a day or 2 after it happened.

Canadians read the words 'suspicious death' and know somethings not right. We all know what suspicious death means....No definitive cause of death yet but be forewarned - you should be aware.

Too many people posting here from elsewhere think we weren't warned. We were warned...if we cared to pay attention to the news.

Thank you for making that clear.

Everyone in Canada knows perfectly well what it means when RCMP are investigating suspicious deaths and they know that cause of death is irrelevant. It means that people have to be more careful until the situation is resolved. Listening to news is a normal daily activity in the Great White North.

It's now resolved, everyone is back to unlocked doors and helping neighbours.

 

[Optics]

Dr Leonard Dyck was unidentified until after the burning Rav4 was discovered. The Rav4 was burned on July 22, It was connected to the investigation on July 23. On July 24, Dyck was identified.

Mr. Dyck was "unidentified until after the burning Rav4" to us the public. The RCMP knew who he was before they told us all.

 

[Optics]

As someone who lives in B.C., Canada, I wish people would get over this need to think we weren't aware. As someone who checks local and national headlines every morning, I was aware of a suspicious death a day or 2 after it happened.

Canadians read the words 'suspicious death' and know somethings not right. We all know what suspicious death means....No definitive cause of death yet but be forewarned - you should be aware.

Too many people posting here from elsewhere think we weren't warned. We were warned...if we cared to pay attention to the news.

^^^^^^^This! I live in southern BC and was hearing news 2 people were found deceased near Liard......it peaked my interest immediately because I knew those roads and had worked in Whitehorse for 2 1/2 years.

 

[FactFinder3000]

I believe the area has steep terrain. Easier to bring them down to the water than up to the road. Have you read anything about steep terrain on the North side of the Nelson River?

What we know is that personal items were found at 9km. They were found at 8km, one half mile inland in the dense brush.

Maybe 25 meters, maybe 300 meters, hard to say.

View attachment 197677

Checked out the topology. The half toward the water is quite steep. They would definitely want to go downhill. The half toward the road is less steep. Roughly speaking. It depends where exactly. When they say 8 km, that can mean 7.5 - 8.5 km.

There's a little pond right at the 8 km mark. I don't think it means anything. There are rough roads going to the pond.

 

[Optics]

They would have burned the van if it was a bloody mess.

LOL - it was their first kill, they didn't want to draw attention to it yet, they needed to get 'outta dodge' asap and put distance btwn their truck and the van.

 

[otto]

Mr. Dyck was "unidentified until after the burning Rav4" to us the public. The RCMP knew who he was before they told us all.

That would not be surprising. As a university professor, the sketch of his face should have been recognized by a lot of students and colleagues. Still, it could not be confirmed that the teens stole his vehicle until that vehicle was found burned and the VIN was checked.

The public new that the suspects were driving a Rav4. Maybe RCMP were holding back information that was not relevant to the search for the suspects, but which confirmed that the 3rd victim owned a 2011 Rav4.

 

[otto]

Checked out the topology. The half toward the water is quite steep. They would definitely want to go downhill. The half toward the road is less steep. Roughly speaking. It depends where exactly. When they say 8 km, that can mean 7.5 - 8.5 km.

There's a little pond right at the 8 km mark. I don't think it means anything. There are rough roads going to the pond.

Yes and no. Boat was found at 13 km. Personal items were found at 9km. Bodies were found at 8km. Bodies were 1km from personal items. How fuzzy should that be?

 

[otto]

LOL - it was their first kill, they didn't want to draw attention to it yet, they needed to get 'outta dodge' asap and put distance btwn their truck and the van.

Stealing ID and vehicles, burning vehicles and killing, is about evading detection.

The first two victims were wearing at least 3 shoes, and we know from Fort Nelson gas station footage that they removed their shoes in the van even for driving. They would not be wearing any shoes if they were in the van when they were shot.

 

[FactFinder3000]

Too many people posting here from elsewhere think we weren't warned. We were warned...if we cared to pay attention to the news.

I don't recall reading that argument. I think what folks are saying is that the 'warning' did not adequately convey the full gravity of the situation.

 

[Seattle1]

Observation: On 7/21/19 - just before midnight in British Columbia, AUS news was announcing that Canadian police revealed they're hunting for the teens after a third body is found (later identified as LD).

7/23 around 11 am, for the first time -- CBC News issues alert that the missing teens are considered suspects in the double homicide of LF/CD and unidentified male.

7/23 -- about 2:45 pm-- RCMP issue PUBLIC ALERT warning that the teens are considered dangerous, and may be in Manitoba. This date is consistent with the "tip" date cited below.

What led police to first suspect Schmegelsky and McLeod?

The RCMP have previously told Star Vancouver that a tip changed the status of the two men from “missing persons” to “suspects” on July 23 — and it was very sudden. What was that tip?

Alexis Daish‏Verified account @LexiDaish
Tonight @9NewsAUS Canadian police reveal they’re hunting for two men after finding a third body on the same stretch of highway where Lucas Fowler and Chynna Deese were killed. I’ll be LIVE from the Nothern Rockies at 6pm.

11:53 PM - 21 Jul 2019

CBC News Alerts‏Verified account @CBCAlerts
Two men reported missing in northern BC now considered suspects in double homicide of couple from Australia/US, and body of unidentified man: RCMP. Police say Kam McLeod, 19, and Bryer Schmegelsky, 18, have left the province and are now travelling in Saskatchewan.

11:10 AM - 23 Jul 2019

RCMP Manitoba‏Verified account @rcmpmb
PUBLIC SAFETY - Kam McLeod and Bryer Schmegelsky MAY be in Manitoba and are considered dangerous. We have reasons to believe they were recently in the Gillam area. If you spot them - take no actions – do not approach – call 911 or your local police immediately. #rcmpmb

2:43 PM - 23 Jul 2019

 

[otto]

I don't recall reading that argument. I think what folks are saying is that the 'warning' did not adequately convey the full gravity of the situation.

I think the counter question is : who is saying that?

Is it people who are curious about how the victims were killed and shocked that this detail was omitted from the July 16 public warning? Is it people who do not live in Canada and do not understand that Canadians know what a public warning is, even if it sounds different in another country? It is people who live in Alaska who are sorely disappointed that their government did not post any warnings for 3 days until after the victims were identified?

What was inadequate in the warning? Certainly not the timing or the message to Canadians.

 

[otto]

Observation: On 7/21/19 - just before midnight in British Columbia, AUS news was announcing that Canadian police revealed they're hunting for the teens after a third body is found (later identified as LD).

7/23 around 11 am, CBC News issues alert that the missing teens are considered suspects in the double homicide of LF/CD and unidentified male.

7/23 -- about 2:45 pm RCMP issue PUBLIC ALERT warning that the teens are considered dangerous, and may be in Manitoba.




Alexis Daish‏Verified account @LexiDaish
Tonight @9NewsAUS Canadian police reveal they’re hunting for two men after finding a third body on the same stretch of highway where Lucas Fowler and Chynna Deese were killed. I’ll be LIVE from the Nothern Rockies at 6pm.

11:53 PM - 21 Jul 2019

CBC News Alerts‏Verified account @CBCAlerts
Two men reported missing in northern BC now considered suspects in double homicide of couple from Australia/US, and body of unidentified man: RCMP. Police say Kam McLeod, 19, and Bryer Schmegelsky, 18, have left the province and are now travelling in Saskatchewan.

11:10 AM - 23 Jul 2019

RCMP Manitoba‏Verified account @rcmpmb
PUBLIC SAFETY - Kam McLeod and Bryer Schmegelsky MAY be in Manitoba and are considered dangerous. We have reasons to believe they were recently in the Gillam area. If you spot them - take no actions – do not approach – call 911 or your local police immediately. #rcmpmb

2:43 PM - 23 Jul 2019

I too thought is was July 21 that they became suspects.

 

[Seattle1]

I too thought is was July 21 that they became suspects.

I listed 2 examples how RCMP and CBC did not announce the teens as suspects until 7/23. Which also follows why Meadow Lake and Constable sightings said they did not know they were suspects when seen on 7/21-22.

Also, the recent article citing a tip changed the status also gives the date 7/23.

 

[otto]

Canada is bigger than the USA. Imagine a country wide manhunt in the USA where jurisdictions failed to post digital signs on highways warning of 2 random murders on the Alaska Highway. Would people be upset that the cause of death was not released first? Would people care that 2 people were randomly shot in some other part of the country?

Perspective.

 

[FactFinder3000]

What was inadequate in the warning? Certainly not the timing or the message to Canadians.

We are never going to agree on this issue. I've been trying hard to stay out of it as the discussion goes on and on and on because I know for a fact we will never agree on this issue. Some folks think the public should have been told earlier that Lucas and Chynna were shot. Some folks think the warnings given were adequate. It's a difference of opinion.

 

[otto]

I listed 2 examples how RCMP and CBC did not announce the teens as suspects until 7/23. Which also follows why Meadow Lake and Constable sightings said they did not know they were suspects when seen on 7/21-22.

Meadow Lake SK gas station reported the teens to RCMP and CCTV footage was obtained of the teens with the Rav4 on July 21. CBC News. Employees at the gas station reported the sighting and footage to RCMP because the teens were all over the news as 'missing.' That footage proved that they were not missing.

Clearly they were not suspects prior to the Meadow Lake sighting, but afterward they were. Their vehicle was burned near a murder victim, and they were driving the wrong vehicle.

 

[JudgeJudi]

Any footwear means they were outside the van.

When their bodies were found, Lucas had bare feet and Chynna had one shoe. Lucas may have been ready for bed and she was still in the process of removing her shoes.

Alternatively, if any conversation was taking place between the teens and Lucas, Chynna may have started putting on her shoes in anticipation of leaving the van for whatever reason.

 

[Optics]

11:53 PM - 21 Jul 2019

CBC News Alerts‏Verified account @CBCAlerts
Two men reported missing in northern BC now considered suspects in double homicide of couple from Australia/US, and body of unidentified man: RCMP. Police say Kam McLeod, 19, and Bryer Schmegelsky, 18, have left the province and are now travelling in Saskatchewan.

@Seattle1 I think you have the July 21 date incorrect. On July 22 at 4:51pm PST the BCRCMP were asking "the public if anyone could identify the drawing of the deceased man" (Mr. Dyck) as well asking for Bryer and Kam to "contact police right away to let them know they were okay". Here is a link to the BC RCMP webpage and dates and alert request: RCMP in British Columbia - BC RCMP announce update in the ongoing northern BC homicide investigations