beubeubeu
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In the middle of the night maybe, but it didn't have to happen in the middle of the night.
CANADA Canada - Madison Scott, 20, Vanderhoof, BC, 27 May 2011
- Thread starter Patience
- Start date
Investigators ask for help from the public when they have no evidence, no leads. Once they have leads, they go silent until there is a suspect. After arrest, prosecutors will not release the reason for the arrest until trial.
Patience with Canadian law. The family cannot release any information they might have because they do not want to compromise the integrity of the investigation. They prefer to wait for trial justice. After twelve years, there's no point in demanding that the RCMP move faster.
Is there a link to the search warrant? Is it for the property, does it include electronics for people who live at the property? How broad is the search warrant?
beubeubeu
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It's been over ten years since I got interested in this case. And I used to think that I got as much info as I possibly could and thought about every possible scenario..
I never believed in Jordi's involvement or theories that "she knows more than she's saying" but cause there was always soo much twisted info and blame put on her that I never, to this day never thought about Madison's motivation to stay in relation to Jordi's state.
Cause scenario in which Maddie is almost sober and lacks any specific plans for the rest of the night really makes no sense. So your friend get's really drunk (like Jordi did) and gets injured (even if it's small injure) and while soooo drunk she decides to hook up with this new guy who wasn't her boyfriend last evening - even if you know this guy well and are completely sure that he's okay it's IMO NOT the scenario in which you decide to just stay camping cause oh, the tent is set and you're bit sleepy.
Makes negative 100 sense to me. UNLESS Maddie:
a) was really drunk,
b) had plans with someone to possibly do some activities in the morning, like mentioned dirtbiking, taking pictures, making a video together (something, hovewer small, maybe not even seen as important enough to mention it).
JMO and nothing more, but I'm just shocked that I never thought about it.
I never believed in Jordi's involvement or theories that "she knows more than she's saying" but cause there was always soo much twisted info and blame put on her that I never, to this day never thought about Madison's motivation to stay in relation to Jordi's state.
Cause scenario in which Maddie is almost sober and lacks any specific plans for the rest of the night really makes no sense. So your friend get's really drunk (like Jordi did) and gets injured (even if it's small injure) and while soooo drunk she decides to hook up with this new guy who wasn't her boyfriend last evening - even if you know this guy well and are completely sure that he's okay it's IMO NOT the scenario in which you decide to just stay camping cause oh, the tent is set and you're bit sleepy.
Makes negative 100 sense to me. UNLESS Maddie:
a) was really drunk,
b) had plans with someone to possibly do some activities in the morning, like mentioned dirtbiking, taking pictures, making a video together (something, hovewer small, maybe not even seen as important enough to mention it).
JMO and nothing more, but I'm just shocked that I never thought about it.
It’s all bs that’s why
So you're telling me that someone would just be burying a body on a property in the middle of the day?
I completely agree with this. As a lady who hung around with the “party kids” in high school, I experienced many nights where I was more sober than the rest for varying reasons, and tbh found it irritating enough that I’d just want to leave early and sleep in my own bed. Why would Maddie want to go to sleep early in her tent alone and without a guest, sober, all the while listening to the two groups of loud partiers fighting and revving engines? Even if she really did just fall asleep for whatever reason, if sober she must have had the ability to have awareness of whatever tensions were causing everyone to leave and that she would be the only one to spend the night. I’ve spent a lot of time camping, and you can hear absolutely everything happening around you. And at a lake? Everything echoes. You hear every fight, conversation, tent zip, and twig crack. Not to mention the cars gearing up to pull out. You don’t sleep through that in a tent, especially sober.
It doesn’t add up, and this is not just to discount Jordi. Multiple people said that “Maddie was the most sober person there.” Why the emphasis?
In my mind, if I was attending a party with people who weren’t even my closest friends (Jordi and Maddie hadn’t hung out for a year), I would certainly not be spending the night if I was having a bad time and not wanting to drink, and especially if my acquaintances were leaving. What’s more is that she was sleeping outside in a tent on a cool night with loud people around. I get that she may have been independent and enjoyed the outdoors, but she’s a young adult partying, I just don’t think the camping/solitude thing really adds up for an evening like that. If I wasn’t in the tent with a partner or a close friend, I would just leave if I wasn’t feeling like socializing with the party, personally.
The only reasons that make sense for her to have wanted to stay after two of her friends told her that they were leaving is if she was spending the night with a guest (a hook-up), or if she actually was experiencing some kind of alcohol poisoning or overdose. I’m aware she wasn’t a drug addict, but again, as a former teenager, I tried some substances stronger than weed once or twice throughout high school and college. Especially a summer evening at a lake, lots of young adults will find that as an opportunity to try something new for the first time. A bad batch or bad reaction only takes that one experience.
Perhaps it could have started as something without mal intent, like that she was having a bad trip or was passed out, and some poor decision making from bad and intoxicated friends thought they would leave her to sleep it off, assuming the responsibility to whoever else was going to stay. The missing information here is why she really stayed overnight, the narrative doesn’t add up and it seems that her parents and authorities have not received the full truth.
There are certainly bad actors involved, and it either pertains to an individual or group of individuals who have been covering something up to avoid getting in trouble (through the lens of their young, and poor decision making undeveloped minds 12 years ago), or potentially an unknown romantic interest who had bad intentions.
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I have always viewed the highway of tears as a place that connects victims - they either vanished, or were found, on that desolate stretch of highway. Madison disappeared and was found along hwy 16, BC. I hope she won't be pushed away because she is not indigenous, or hitch hiking, or anything else that is associated with high risk hwy 16 activities like camping alone at the lake.
Is it true that serial murderers take more risks the longer they get away with it, and leave bodies closer to home over time?
Highway 16 is the highway of tears. Has anyone mapped out the locations where highway of tears bodies were found since 1969? That might be interesting given the cluster of murders around Vanderhoof.
She is connected in NO WAY to the highway of tears. She wasn't murdered on the highway. Hogsback is not near the highway. This is a bush party gone wrong and nothing more.
Where do you see that?
(can't find this in the whiteboard photos shared here, but maybe I missed it... )
99% of the time it's the most obvious scenario. She went missing from the lake. She was found on a property not on the routes you'd take to get back. 18 km walk. Simplest explanation is one or more of the individuals associated with that property ended her life.
To this point though, I can’t see it making any sense why she would willingly camp alone. Her mother also stated that Maddie would neverhave made the decision to stay overnight by herself.
Beyond thinking through the obvious safety issues for a single female, a 20 year old partying and car camping is roughing it out there to socialize, it’s not like a backpacking trip where the solitude is the point. If everyone was leaving, she’d almost certainly sleep at whichever house the rest of her friends are sleeping at or in the comfort of her own bed.
Unless, she was already incapacitated in some way and so made no decision at all, or had interest in a partner that she wanted to spend the night with. If it was the latter, maybe someone brand new she met that night, is it really possible that her friends leaving at 1am wouldn’t have any idea of a person she was interested in and flirting with?
Personally, I can’t imagine leaving any friend or even acquaintance alone at a campsite when I know she’ll be all alone or with people she doesn’t know at all. I’d truly be concerned about her level of intoxication if that was her decision and would need a really good explanation beyond, “im tired.” I would possibly accept “I’ve been flirting with __ all night and want to stay with him.” I would certainly have a much longer conversation to recall about how those decisions were made than what we’ve heard, no matter how drunk I was. Especially when multiple people were involved. The story doesn’t add up and multiple people have been covering for each other, or her friends are just wildly selfish and negligent people beyond what I can imagine.
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Andreee
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I agree completely. IMO. You are local and you knew some of the people involved in that night.
I agree. The map gives a clearer picture of how far Hogsback is from the highway for those not familiar with the area.
Also to add, When one looks at Highway of Tears victims personal lives and situations before disappearing, Maddy's is not similar at all. She had a good home, loving family, was not living in poverty, etc. She wasn't hitchhiking or walking along the highway (nor would she have had to as she had a working cell phone and truck).Gophers_FTW
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Thank you. I agree with all of this. This adds to what I was trying to get at a few days ago. I was in no way trying to bash, blame, or speak poorly of the victim or minimize what happened to her. It is a terrible tragedy no matter what, and the person or people responsible need to be held accountable. I was simply trying to explain a possible scenario that might explain the reported behaviors of several people at the party - based on the available information I've seen and personal experiences in similar situations. Possible 'missing information', as you call it.
Agree here. Simply though, it doesn’t seem plausible that Maddie was just peacefully and knowingly sleeping all alone in a tent at a lake when something went terribly wrong, like her friends have said. There is something missing from the story which is probably why her parents got started with the whiteboards to begin with. Possibly:
1. Someone brought party drugs and she overdoses or gets fatally injured while intoxicated. A group of people that includes those associated with the property collectively decide to cover it up to avoid serious charges. Her friend has a new boyfriend, maybe he or the property owners are close to where those drugs came from. Young people can be convinced to make poor decisions. Regardless, more than just the property owners would have to know about this given the rest of our knowledge about that night.
2. Her friends are not being truthful about events that led to her decision to sleep at the lake that night. They either leave her behind incapacitated, unaware, and vulnerable in her tent, perhaps through miscommunication or in fear of authorities, or they knowingly leave her in the hands of a potential hook-up that ends badly by accident or in bad intentions. Either situatio has some withheld context, and probably involves the property owners in some way,
Regardless, it seems likely information is being withheld by more than one person. I hate to keep driving this point, but I can’t not believe that there weren’t people at that party who weren’t involved with drugs as either users or dealers. I say this just because it doesn’t seem to ever come up anywhere in the timeline or map of that evening. I don’t believe Maddie was an addict in any way or that she necessarily took anything. I do know that partying young adults in rural areas like to experiment with fun things, especially at places like lakes. I do know that when a group is referred to as “bad news,” it usually means drugs are involved. I also know that when young people get close to people who might associate with “bad news” groups, some of your ethics and reasoning skills go out the window. I think the difficulty in mapping out what exactly happened that night probably has a lot to do with protecting people and some association to drugs.
I tend to want to believe that this was more of an accident rather than sinister,
involving seedy characters with poor morals who were worried about facing serious charges.
I can’t remember the names, but I’m reminded of that story about a high school student who drunkenly pulled a wrestling move on his friend and slammed his head on pavement. TL;DR, to avoid consequences, he and his gf did not call an ambulance, thinking he’d be better by morning. They waited till the next afternoon to call authorities, by which point he was brain dead, and both spent time in jail for their decisions.
Given the very odd timelines, relationships, and details that don’t make any sense in this story, I can imagine similar poor decision-making being involved here.
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It wasn’t on the board, I’ll see if I can find the source again.
LovesPeace2
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I haven't been able to find the warrant. i wish our courts and le were more open but it is what it is .I'm just glad that her family can now lay her to rest.
You would be right.
Cordelia Gray
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I can see why Jordi decided to leave, but I don't understand why went she went back to the campground the next morning and did not see Madison she did not contact her parents. I am also not sure as to the extent of their friendship. In one of the videos 48 hours or The Vanishing of Madison Scott I think she refers to her as her best friend. I have heard others say they were not that close.
ya, refers to her as her best friend, yet hadnt seen her for 2 years before the hogsback party. suspicious.
also weird theres not mention of jordi texting maddy in the morning when she woke up(saturday morning), youd expect something like "hey, were heading back out to the lake to grab my stuff, you awake?"