CANADA Canada - Samuel Lottery, 17, London, Ont, 19 Jan 1996

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I wonder how thoroughly the church connection was investigated. Was every member of the congregation interviewed at the time of the letters being sent?

There has to be something of forensic value to lead them to believe that it's foul play rather than accidental, or suicide. I wonder if his skull showed signs of a fracture

I can't get past the church connection, whoever dropped off the note had knowledge of the murder and felt comfortable dropping it off at the church, makes me think that they had insider knowledge of the church and it wouldn't look suspicious them being seen at the church.
 
I wonder how thoroughly the church connection was investigated. Was every member of the congregation interviewed at the time of the letters being sent?

There has to be something of forensic value to lead them to believe that it's foul play rather than accidental, or suicide. I wonder if his skull showed signs of a fracture

I can't get past the church connection, whoever dropped off the note had knowledge of the murder and felt comfortable dropping it off at the church, makes me think that they had insider knowledge of the church and it wouldn't look suspicious them being seen at the church.

totally agree with points you raise!

''hiding in plain sight'' comes to mind MOO
 
January 18th? Or January 19th? Why would London Police post 19th yet Free Press posts 18th? More confusion >_<

@skinnycat I agree on all points & question those same things. Aside from the letters, there must have been proof within Samuels remains. As they say, blunt force trauma or marks left on his bones, tool impressions. If Samuel were dismembered (or shot), there were be evidence of this as well. A member of church staff or volunteer could easily come & go from Gunn St without anyone suspecting a thing. Also the proximity between the church & where Samuel was left, that is the coincidence of all coincidences!

Why & how would/could anyone other than a church member choose to leave a letter there? If it were a peer from say, Whiteoaks Crew or Beal, would they even know about POF or where Gunn Street is & even if so, why bother? If the person knew Samuel well enough to get him alone & knew where the Lotterys' worshipped & felt it neccessary to send letters, it seems that this person might also display other "guilty behaviour" or possibly a major lack of grief?

I had the opportunity to talk to an old friend from Beal the other day. He was the same age as Samuel & attended in 94/95/96 but he didn't remember Samuel at all. I showed him Samuels photo (from the LPS site) & told him what happened & he was quite shocked. Nobody deserves to be forgotten like this.
 
The more I think of the parents, I think that when they called the police to say Samuel didn't return, that the investigators played it down to being a teen that just didn't come home. I have also wondered if they were fairly new immigrants to Canada, so therefore might not have felt comfortable being public about Samuel missing. Maybe they felt nobody would care.

I have went over a ton of different possibilities, I keep coming back to the POF.

I find it sad that Samuel isn't remembered by a fellow Beal student, but it also confirms that Samuel wasn't one of the "bad kids" at school, cause everyone remembers the bad kids.

I wish the investigators would release a little bit more information, everything is so vague, no chance for anyone in the public to have a light bulb moment with such little information
 
January 18th? Or January 19th? Why would London Police post 19th yet Free Press posts 18th? More confusion >_<

@skinnycat I agree on all points & question those same things. Aside from the letters, there must have been proof within Samuels remains. As they say, blunt force trauma or marks left on his bones, tool impressions. If Samuel were dismembered (or shot), there were be evidence of this as well. A member of church staff or volunteer could easily come & go from Gunn St without anyone suspecting a thing. Also the proximity between the church & where Samuel was left, that is the coincidence of all coincidences!

Why & how would/could anyone other than a church member choose to leave a letter there? If it were a peer from say, Whiteoaks Crew or Beal, would they even know about POF or where Gunn Street is & even if so, why bother? If the person knew Samuel well enough to get him alone & knew where the Lotterys' worshipped & felt it neccessary to send letters, it seems that this person might also display other "guilty behaviour" or possibly a major lack of grief?

I had the opportunity to talk to an old friend from Beal the other day. He was the same age as Samuel & attended in 94/95/96 but he didn't remember Samuel at all. I showed him Samuels photo (from the LPS site) & told him what happened & he was quite shocked. Nobody deserves to be forgotten like this.


If there was a student SL's age who had all of their yearbooks they could leaf through the class years and see when Sam first appeared at that school. We don't know if he was there for one semester or if he had been there from grade 9. Is it possible your friend could find out for us if anyone in his/her circle has old yearbooks from Beal?
 
@skinnycat: I'm stuck on what happened in the initial reporting as well. Missing is missing, even if he ran away bc of a fight, he was a teenager & obv his mom was worried. Maybe there was something in the parents' statements that made LE suspect Sam ran away? If they mentioned having a disagreement or recent conflict, it might have caused police to hang back & wait. For over 12 months...

I thought I'd read somewhere that there was a reward offered for information from "friends of the Lottery family"? So they did have some support from whoever these friends were. I also don't understand why LPD didn't seem to look in the Thames very hard after those 2 letters. It's not that wide or deep, especially at the forks so it wouldn't be that difficult to search. All it took was some guy walking his dog. I've read about cold cases from decades previous that were more detailed than Samuels'. Even if they released the word "the" or "river" from the letters, it would be something at least. Who is going to recognize stationary 20 years later? Handwriting doesn't change.

The thing about Beal is there were over 1500 students when I went there. As sad as it is I'm not surprised people don't remember. I feel like I'm the only one who vaguely remembers. At least that's something?

@newone: Tbh, this guy was supposed to give me back a book I lent him 2 years ago so I'm not sure I can count on him for help lol! He's also working on a PhD so I don't want to impose. I only know about 5 people from Beal & don't speak to any of them now. Not even on FB so it might be hard (awkward) to pin someone down.

I will say that this case has me going back in time. Beal was very much like that movie Dangerous Minds only a little bit nicer facilities. I can see why Samuel would have chosen Beal though. It was a technical school with electrical, plumbing, welding, broadcasting & arts programs. He probably took a few tech classes. In fact I think that could be the part of Beal I used to see him in? Either math or science or tech stuff was all in one wing of the school (on different floors). Not 100% on that tho : /
 
Wow I didn't know Beal had that many students, I wonder what public school Samuel went to.

I agree if they would release even a few examples of the hand writing it may just break this case, they could publish the common words that shouldn't jeopardize the case.

The search that was done for Samuel, I don't think was much of a search. If the police searched the river, how did they not see him, or did they not even search the river. Could they have taken those letters as hoaxes when they received them, didn't even bother to investigate them.

I wonder if there is anyway to get a list of those that belonged to that particular church at the time, and whether they had any guest church officials visiting.
 
I have been following this thread and I am hooked......Would it be a dumb idea to contact LPD to see if they are going to release anymore info to the public
Sorry if that has already been suggested
 
The suggested movie " Dangerous Minds", differs from my perception of Sam's school as being more"Glee" style. imo

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w-nYl-iZKyg

"An ex-marine teacher struggles to connect with her students in an inner city schools"


Sorry I didn't describe the movie or link it. It's a remake or adaptation of "Stand And Deliver" for anyone interested.

Don't get me wrong, Beal was a decent school but I personally caught my art & drama teachers smoking a joint in the parking lot. Do the teachers smoke pot in Glee? ; ) There were other schools with bad reputations, Beal was not unique. Of course this is just my perception/recollection & not fact. But most people would probably consider teen pregnancy, drug dealing & daily fights to be bad.
 
I understood that there was a $10K reward but that expired without any 'contenders'.

I would like to think that it would be possible for a local to check in at the school and ask to use the library to look up yearbooks in the reference section to see when his first year was and if there were any comments made by him under his photos ....
 
@skinnycat: How absolutely terrible if LE took the whole thing as a hoax. I'd like to think they investigate every missing person with an unbiased attitude & would take letters claiming responsibility for a death of a missing person very seriously. Completely heartbreaking to see how Samuel was treated.

@sheshecanada: Thanks so much for taking an interest & joining the thread! I'm hoping that maybe LPS will see activity linking Samuels page & the link here on WS. I'm not sure if it works the same way but when you provide links on a blog, you can view the traffic/activity and where pageviews come from. That was not a proper explanation but I hope that makes sense?

I'd love to call the police & ask them but do I have that right? I've thought about contacting the reporters who wrote about Samuel in the Free Press but can I do that? To be honest, with so many women going missing in Canada recently & when you look into Londons past missing women/cold cases, it scares me a little. Especially with my personal experience (the guy who tried to pick me up twice) & both Vanessa Fotheringham and Patricia Bordato missing, it makes one feel very unsafe in this city.

In fact just recently a man was charged with human trafficking here in London. Idk where to post that story but the guy was drugging underage girls & transporting them to hotels in a carpet cleaning van! (Sean Leadston fyi) Imho, LPD need to do more to make it's people feel safe. It's getting scary.
 
I hope that they didn't take it like a hoax, but it really feels like nothing about Samuel's case was taken serious. There wasn't a lot of media coverage, like there has been for other cases.

I still think that the church is the place where Samuel knew his killer from. I'd never heard of that particular church, I had only known of the mainstream churchs', so I did some reading found it disturbing that the founding lady was a racist linked to the Klu Klux Klan, I'll post what I found out about her in the morning if no one else has. I think the investigators need to go over a complete list of all church members,congregation,church affiliates at the time of Samuel's disappearance. I do hope that the police did request and get a complete list of all people that had affiliation with the POF.

Some times I do wonder about the police work in the London area not just Samuel's case, there are too many unsolved cases, or are there just that many smart killers in the London area
 
@skinnycat: How absolutely terrible if LE took the whole thing as a hoax. I'd like to think they investigate every missing person with an unbiased attitude & would take letters claiming responsibility for a death of a missing person very seriously. Completely heartbreaking to see how Samuel was treated.

@sheshecanada: Thanks so much for taking an interest & joining the thread! I'm hoping that maybe LPS will see activity linking Samuels page & the link here on WS. I'm not sure if it works the same way but when you provide links on a blog, you can view the traffic/activity and where pageviews come from. That was not a proper explanation but I hope that makes sense?

I'd love to call the police & ask them but do I have that right? I've thought about contacting the reporters who wrote about Samuel in the Free Press but can I do that? To be honest, with so many women going missing in Canada recently & when you look into Londons past missing women/cold cases, it scares me a little. Especially with my personal experience (the guy who tried to pick me up twice) & both Vanessa Fotheringham and Patricia Bordato missing, it makes one feel very unsafe in this city.

In fact just recently a man was charged with human trafficking here in London. Idk where to post that story but the guy was drugging underage girls & transporting them to hotels in a carpet cleaning van! (Sean Leadston fyi) Imho, LPD need to do more to make it's people feel safe. It's getting scary.

whiterhino I think it would be great if you contacted LFP, I myself have had a good experience and response from media in the past when looking for information. As far as contacting LPS, if you do not want to call you could possibly email them. I can send some emails out for you if you like

I know somewhere on the forum there is a spot for human trafficking.....let me see if I can find it and then you can start a thread
 
In this article down near the bottom it talks of the KKK and racism,



“Bishop” Alma White: Pillar of Fire and Pedestal of Folly
4 Votes

Every authentic move of God meets with opposition; and when the experience of the Pentecostal baptism evidenced by speaking in other tongues began to spread, there were many detractors. Some of the most active opponents of the new message came from within the Holiness Movement. Theologically, they equated the Pentecostal baptism with the crisis of sanctification. The notion of a “third blessing” seemed absurd and even heretical to many within the Holiness camp. One of the most prolific and vocal adversaries of Pentecostalism was Bishop Alma White, founder of the Pillar of Fire Church.
White began preaching in the Methodist Church, occasionally occupying the pulpit of her husband, Kent White. In 1902, she founded the sect that became the Pillar of Fire and was consecrated as “Bishop” of the church in 1918, a flagrant violation of scriptural teaching on church leadership (“Bishop Alma White . . . 21). White split with the Methodists because of their progressive “loosening up.” The Pillar of Fire was pejoratively known as “Holy Jumpers” and was described in the New York Times as ” . . . pretty much like the Methodists except that they are more in the habit of working themselves up to a state of religious frenzy which calls for groans and dancing and laughing and shouts to give it adequate vent” (“‘Holy Jumpers’ . . .” SM7). Interestingly, one follower, William Werner, met his death when he was jumping on the roof of one of the commune’s buildings in New Jersey. He lost his balance and fell thirty feet to his death (“Fall Kills a ‘Holy Jumper'” 2).
Despite their zealous worship, which bears some similarity to Pentecostal enthusiasm, Alma White outright rejected the Pentecostal message and authored Demons and Tongues, an extended refutation of Pentecostal theology and practice. In the book, she describes her encounter with William Joseph Seymour, pastor of the Azusa Street Mission. En route to Los Angeles, Bro. Seymour stopped at White’s Bible School in Denver, Colorado. According to Mrs. White, Seymour introduced himself as a “man of God,” and she asked him to lead a prayer at the close of a meal: “He responded with a good deal of fervor, but before he had finished I felt that serpents and other slimy creatures were creeping all around me. After he had left the room, a number of the students said they felt he was devil possessed” (White, D&T 67). Certainly Alma White could not have sensed Seymour’s Pentecostal experience as he had not yet received the baptism of the Holy Ghost when he went to Los Angeles (Sanders 87).
White recorded her “impressions” of Seymour:

He was very untidy in his appearance, wearing no collar, and had a greenish-looking brass button exposed in the band of his shirt. In my evangelistic and missionary tours I had met all kinds of religious fakirs and tramps, but I felt that he excelled them all. There was a cause for this. The Lord knew that Satan was going to use him the outbreaking of the so-called “Pentecostal” movement with the baptism of unknown tongues, on the Pacific coast; and permitted me to see the person that the devil was going to use, before the winds of perdition began to blow. (White, D&T 68)

White should hardly have been surprised at Seymour’s disheveled appearance considering the strict transportation laws that separated the races and disallowed African Americans from occupying berth or parlor cars (Stephenson 193). Certainly, when he boarded the train in Houston, where Jim Crow laws were fully enforced, he would have had inferior accommodation, and interstate rail travel was not particularly easy or posh for anyone at the turn of the century.
White even suspects that Seymour was chosen by Satan because of his race: ” . . . I must say that it is very fitting that the devil should choose on of the sons of Ham to launch out the Tongues or so-called Pentecostal movement in which the works of the flesh are so plainly manifest” (White, D&T 100-101).
Despite repeated claims that she was interested in the spiritual welfare and enlightenment of African Americans, White was a confirmed racist and a member of, or at least a sympathizer with, the Ku Klux Klan. She toured rallies and viewed the supremacists as the true salvation of America. She repeatedly extolled the hateful society and published a book entitled The Ku Klux Klan in Prophecy, in which she clearly reveals the depths of her own demonic possession with her false and evil prophecies:

Klansmen, with their undying principles, will yet be promoted to the highest offices of the country and will hold the reins of government, as truly as Omnipotence rules. They will see the time when their enemies will be humbled in the dust for ever having raised the religious issue, making it necessary for them to rise up on defense of Americanism. (White, KKK 78-79)

Further, she writes:

The Klansmen are the prophets of a new and better age . . . These men with the banner of truth and the tenets of the Christian religion are now running before the Chariot of State, trying in every way possible to arouse the sleeping multitudes. Their program must be carried out if the country is saved from moral, social, and political ruin. (White, KKK 78-79)

Her passionate support of the Klan explains her condescending attitude toward William Seymour and her uncharitable description of the humble preacher.
Her publication, The Pillar of Fire, satirized Pentecostals and railed against the “Tongues Movement,” with tirades and cartoons. Ironically, her own husband deserted the Pillar of Fire sect and converted to the Pentecostal Movement in 1909, and the two separated. Kent White associated himself with the Apostolic Faith movement and moved to England in 1922, where he served as a pastor and teacher until 1939 (Burgess & McGee 883).
Alma White died in 1946, convinced that the Pentecostal Movement was “one of the worst abominations yet known” (White, D&T 45). Despite her venomous attacks against Pentecostals, the Apostolic Faith continued to grow. “Bishop” White continued in the gross error and foul folly. She would have benefited from the wise counsel of Gamaliel, “Refrain from these men, and let them alone: for if this counsel or this work be of men, it will come to nought: But if it be of God, ye cannot overthrow it; lest haply ye be found even to fight against God” (Acts 5.38-39). Her fervent efforts could not derail God’s work. Ultimately her criticism of Pentecostalism had no real impact on the movement and her grand predictions about the future glory of the Klan never materialized. Seymour went on to lead a mighty revival that brought together every creed and color in the humble Azusa Street Mission. The Pillar of Fire has been reduced to a veritable column of smoke with only a small number of adherents and only 6 congregations in the United States while Pentecostalism has become the fastest growing form of Christianity worldwide!

Sources:

Burgess, Stanley M. and Gary B. McGee. Dictionary of Pentecostal and Charismatic
Movements. Grand Rapids: Regency Reference Library, 1988.

“Fall Kills ‘Holy Jumper.'” New York Times. 14 Mar 1907, p. 2.

“‘Holy Jumpers': an Old Religion Headed by a Woman.” New York Times 11 Dec
1910, SM 7.

Sanders, Rufus G.W. William Joseph Seymour: Black Father of the Twentieth Century
Pentecostal/Charismatic Movement. Sandusky, OH: Aldexandria Press, 2000.

Stephenson, Gilbert Thomas. “The Separation of the Races in Public Conveyances.”
The American Political Science Review 3(2) May 1909, pp. 180-204.

White, Alma. Demons and Tongues. Zarephath, NJ: Pillar of Fire Publishers, 1936.

—. The Ku Klux Klan in Prophecy. Zarephath, JN: Pillar of Fire Publishers, 1925.

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whiterhino I think it would be great if you contacted LFP, I myself have had a good experience and response from media in the past when looking for information. As far as contacting LPS, if you do not want to call you could possibly email them. I can send some emails out for you if you like

I know somewhere on the forum there is a spot for human trafficking.....let me see if I can find it and then you can start a thread

Human Trafficking awareness thread...

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...-Thread&highlight=human+trafficking+awareness
 
whiterhino I think it would be great if you contacted LFP, I myself have had a good experience and response from media in the past when looking for information. As far as contacting LPS, if you do not want to call you could possibly email them. I can send some emails out for you if you like

As much as I would like answers, I'm really not comfortable with making any phonecalls or emails. At least not yet. This is just literally too close to home & makes me nervous for some reason.

When I first posted about Samuels' case, I didn't think I'd get much response or find anything at all. Now there's all this creepy fanatical church stuff, weird phone #'s & addresses crossing over... but nothing tangible. It would be nice to have some clarification though, considering some Free Press articles conflict with LPS "chronology" (such as Samuels age & the date he went missing). Maybe if someone were to inquire about those dates, it could open up the possibility of an update?
 
Thank you! I really do not think it's wise for me to do that. At all. Nope.

I remember a little bit about Vanessas' case. Actually one night I was walking home from downtown when some police stopped & asked me to stop & remove my hat, then said "nevermind" & kept driving. Now I think they were looking for Vanessa bc we have a similar physical description. Idk? I'd like to think they were searching for her. That creep who tried to pick me up in his car, that has always bothered me. He would seem to be a POI based off his strange behaviour (I say strange bc he actually got out of his car & ran behind me on the sidewalk. Who does that?!). Of course that is off topic & I can't really say anything about the person but yeah... There are definitely strange & dangerous people lurking around this city.

Did he look like this recently arrested in B.C. suspect, who is also wanted by London , Ont. LE? :eek:

http://www.theobserver.ca/2015/03/3...ncouver-sex-assault-wanted-by-london-ont-cops

"LONDON, Ont. -- A 25-year-old man who racked up a string of charges in Kitchener-Waterloo, Ont., and has been wanted by London police since November is charged with a brutal sexual assault in Vancouver".
 
Did he look like this recently arrested in B.C. suspect, who is also wanted by London , Ont. LE? :eek:

http://www.theobserver.ca/2015/03/3...ncouver-sex-assault-wanted-by-london-ont-cops

"LONDON, Ont. -- A 25-year-old man who racked up a string of charges in Kitchener-Waterloo, Ont., and has been wanted by London police since November is charged with a brutal sexual assault in Vancouver".

Yikes! He cut off a womans fingers!? Thankfully they got this person but it isn't the same guy. I ended up "finding out" who the guy was & gave the info to the officer that took my complaint. What upset me most was what I found in my search. Photos of this guy coaching teenage girls & children, literally hands on. Hopefully he was just a harmless nutjob but there really are too many psychopaths out there.
 

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