CANADA - shooter in RCMP vehicle & uniform, 22 killed (plus perp), Portapique, NS, 18 April 2020 #2

[newguy123]

Some time before 10 p.m. — Gabriel Wortman, 51, assaults his girlfriend in the Portapique area. A 911 call comes in about an assault between him and someone he knows.

That quote was from the CBC timeline reference on the previous page of this thread. It says that prior to 10 pm an assault has taken place between the idiot and "someone he knows" Is this "someone" the girlfriend? If so why not say it, it is rather ambiguous to me, esp. when followed by She escapes into the woods where she hides overnight. I don't want to split hairs, but it is a strangely worded paragraph to my reading of it.

Do we know where on the road Ellison was found? He was heading toward a fire but which one since there were several.

Also, I have seen maps of "scenes" but I have no idea if the corresponding numbers are actually in sequence of events, or not. I would like to know the actual sequence, if it is known, as it might help determine how/where he gained access to the field to drive away.

 

[LadyL]

Has it been discussed on this thread whether the shooter had his cell phone with him during his rampage, if it's been recovered by the RCMP, and whether or not it has yielded information about the route he took after leaving Portapique, or any other information helpful to the investigation? I haven't seen it mentioned in MSM articles, or heard it asked about at the press conference today, or last Friday.

good question
I haven't seen it discussed, except in the context of communicating with his (ex?) g/f

 

[Satchie]

dbm

new chrome book!

 

[NBKevadian]

Has it been determined how he set the fires? The houses that I have seen burned down were a total loss. Were they blown up some sort of explosive? what did he use? Possibly a chemical related to making dentures? Did he have a huge stockpile? This really bugs at me for some reason

My understanding was that due to the “active shooter” status fire crews were not permitted to enter the area. That would account for total losses.
I would agree that GW seemed Very quick at engulfing homes.
During today’s PC the question was asked By media if GW had Grenades specifically, or some kind of explosives. To which the answer was very vague.

What was said in the PC was all home and areas have been handed back to owners accept for 5 which continue to remain closed and are being further investigated.
We know there were 5 homes/building fires. I would only be speculating that those places would need more attention.

 

[Satchie]

Some time before 10 p.m. — Gabriel Wortman, 51, assaults his girlfriend in the Portapique area. A 911 call comes in about an assault between him and someone he knows.

That quote was from the CBC timeline reference on the previous page of this thread. It says that prior to 10 pm an assault has taken place between the idiot and "someone he knows" Is this "someone" the girlfriend? If so why not say it, it is rather ambiguous to me, esp. when followed by She escapes into the woods where she hides overnight. I don't want to split hairs, but it is a strangely worded paragraph to my reading of it.

Do we know where on the road Ellison was found? He was heading toward a fire but which one since there were several.

Also, I have seen maps of "scenes" but I have no idea if the corresponding numbers are actually in sequence of events, or not. I would like to know the actual sequence, if it is known, as it might help determine how/where he gained access to the field to drive away.

For your first question, I think the CBC timeline is just a compilation of statements from police, received at different times, laid out in presumed sequence of events. "Here's what we know about what happened and when, based on information from RCMP, audio recordings of scanner traffic and interviews." https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/nova...ing-unfolded-in-central-nova-scotia-1.5547747

An earlier police statement probably talked about the 911 call, then later police released info about what happened to the girlfriend. So CBC is suggesting the 911 call was about that, but can't be sure whether maybe it was a second assault, on someone else.

For your other questions, that info hasn't been released. I think police are still trying to reconstruct his movements as he set the fires.

 

[paganini]

Something that really bothers me (and others I'm sure), which I haven't seen discussed anywhere very much: Police get a 911 call some time shortly after 10PM and arrive at 1026. He and his common-law have left a party, and he does what he does to her. Let's say, after that, he decides he's going to create chaos in Portapique, he changes, equips his car with guns, etc., and starts his rampage. How did he manage to shoot people and dogs, and set so many fires before anyone called 911?

He's caught on camera at 11:12 at Debert. According to google maps, that's a 22 min drive with the "usual" traffic. That kind of makes it seem like he got around the fellow he had wounded and got out before the police arrived. He arrived Debert 16 minutes after the police arrived at Portapique. So, no way he hadn't done everything before the police got there. The noises people thought were gunshots later on were maybe propane tanks and ammunition exploding in fires.

I can assume the Tuck family died in the last gunshots, but there's no real reason to think that other than to wonder if he didn't have time to set the place on fire, and / or if that's part of what Ellison heard. However, that might be way wrong as they could have died in a fire at someone else's place.

At any rate, the question is, how did he manage to start several structural fires significant enough to take hold trapping occupants, take time to scan around for the Ellison brother who got away from him, and fire several shots without anyone figuring out things were burning? How did that happen before someone called 911?

 

[Peace777]

Here's the link. I am hoping we can finally have some of our questions answered and maybe hear a bit about the GF and her story.

What is a "critical witness"? I know the testimony a witness can give may be critical to the case and getting a conviction in a case. But in this case there is not going to be a trial as he died.
Testifying in Court - Information for Witnesses - Province of British Columbia

 

[MistyWaters]

What is a "critical witness"? I know the testimony a witness can give may be critical to the case and getting a conviction in a case. But in this case there is not going to be a trial as he died.
Testifying in Court - Information for Witnesses - Province of British Columbia

During the PC the Supt stated even though the perp was dead, his crimes would be fully investigated to the same extent as if he were to be tried, which I think everyone expects anyway. Maybe “critical witness” is a natural reference for that reason?

 

[Peace777]

I don't think anybody does. They've just never been used before in that context anywhere in the country, in part because the system is relatively new, and in part because, gratefully, we don't experience a lot of this kind of violence. He mentioned in the update that a national association of chiefs of police was discussing, and that's presumably chiefs at all levels of policing across the country.

Whether it would ever be needed (because we don't have such heinous crimes as this 1) I think there should have been some kind of protocol in place for such an emergency/shooting event such as what this guy ended up doing. People knew this guy was off his rocker and knew he had guns, police uniforms and "fake" police cars that looked very authentic. It was a disaster waiting to happen. Not blaming just I wished someone had reported him to the authorities before he went berserk. JMO Hindsight is 20/20 I know. So sad this had to happen and people lost their lives.

 

[ab01]

During the PC the Supt stated even though the perp was dead, his crimes would be fully investigated to the same extent as if he were to be tried, which I think everyone expects anyway. Maybe “critical witness” is a natural reference for that reason?

I thought maybe it was in reference to the fact that she provided critical information at the time about the fact that he was likely dressed as and RCMP officer and driving a replica RCMP vehicle.

Supt Campbell had noted earlier that without that information they would not have known that key detail

I think that may be where it started and now I think it refers to the fact that she may be able to provide them with critical background information about the shooter. JMO

 

[RandomName479]

Some time before 10 p.m. — Gabriel Wortman, 51, assaults his girlfriend in the Portapique area. A 911 call comes in about an assault between him and someone he knows.

That quote was from the CBC timeline reference on the previous page of this thread. It says that prior to 10 pm an assault has taken place between the idiot and "someone he knows" Is this "someone" the girlfriend? If so why not say it, it is rather ambiguous to me, esp. when followed by She escapes into the woods where she hides overnight. I don't want to split hairs, but it is a strangely worded paragraph to my reading of it.

Do we know where on the road Ellison was found? He was heading toward a fire but which one since there were several.

Also, I have seen maps of "scenes" but I have no idea if the corresponding numbers are actually in sequence of events, or not. I would like to know the actual sequence, if it is known, as it might help determine how/where he gained access to the field to drive away.

this makes it seem like an initial 911 call specifically about the domestic assault was made.....then a call came in about gunshots. MOO could be the way it’s written, but that is how I read that article

edited for grammar. Clearly bedtime!

 

[Satchie]

Something that really bothers me (and others I'm sure), which I haven't seen discussed anywhere very much: Police get a 911 call some time shortly after 10PM and arrive at 1026. He and his common-law have left a party, and he does what he does to her. Let's say, after that, he decides he's going to create chaos in Portapique, he changes, equips his car with guns, etc., and starts his rampage. How did he manage to shoot people and dogs, and set so many fires before anyone called 911?

He's caught on camera at 11:12 at Debert. According to google maps, that's a 22 min drive with the "usual" traffic. That kind of makes it seem like he got around the fellow he had wounded and got out before the police arrived. He arrived Debert 16 minutes after the police arrived at Portapique. So, no way he hadn't done everything before the police got there. The noises people thought were gunshots later on were maybe propane tanks and ammunition exploding in fires.

I can assume the Tuck family died in the last gunshots, but there's no real reason to think that other than to wonder if he didn't have time to set the place on fire, and / or if that's part of what Ellison heard. However, that might be way wrong as they could have died in a fire at someone else's place.

At any rate, the question is, how did he manage to start several structural fires significant enough to take hold trapping occupants, take time to scan around for the Ellison brother who got a way from him, and fire several shots without anyone figuring out things were burning? How did that happen before someone called 911?

He had to have known he didn't have time to linger over setting fires, or he'd be caught by police. What if he had it all planned out, at least a day or so in advance. Went around after dark, setting things up ready to start the fires. Then maybe trapped his girlfriend and unleashed his apocalypse. To me, this is suggested by his escape across the field, that had to be planned in advance and not just good luck.

 

[Satchie]

This might be unanswerable at this time but........if he went and killed the couple early Sunday morning and a few hours later set fire to the house, would it not have been smarter to take one of their cars, hide his there and not set fire? He could have got a huge head start on a "getaway" at that point. The fact that he set fire to the house and stayed with his uniform and car, would suggest his "business" was not yet done. How much of what unfolded was planned and how much circumstance I guess we will never know. However, it suggests to me that he knew he would not get away.

I was wondering about the circumstances of his shooting at the first police officer, was that in self-defense or had he actually been cruising around hoping to get a chance to kill an officer or two.

 

[Errrr]

No worries, we've all been new to this before.

I think there’s a glitch here that causes double posts.

 

[MistyWaters]

this makes it seem like an initial 911 call specifically about the domestic assault was maken......then a call came in about gunshots. MOO could be the way it’s written, but that is how I read that article

It does seem like that. I notice only CBC has this tidbit hidden in their timeline, unsourced. I can’t find any other MSM is reporting on it but CBC did recently run a headline story regarding the time of the first 911 call about the shooting. No mention whatsoever about an earlier 911 domestic assault call which would be as, if not more, significant. If it’s true, that it’s not being questioned by MSM is highly unusual IMO.

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/novia-scotia-911-call-1.5546299
RCMP have not disclosed when first 911 call came in about N.S. mass shooting
UPDATE | RCMP said at an April 28 press conference that the first 911 call about the shooting came in "just after 10 p.m." Atlantic time on April 18. Read the latest story.

 

[Satchie]

It is. I suspected that too. Maybe LE didn’t want to say that outright for some reason.

At this point, I think police will not share much personal information about her situation, without her permission. It's very hard on someone, under any circumstances, to have your personal life delved into by police, much less published in the media and to know that people are talking about you..

 

[Errrr]

Maybe she didn't have access to her cell while she was in the trees? If an ex beat the living crap out of me, tied me up and left me to die in a burning house, I'd be shell shocked and wouldn't come out of hiding for hours either.

If the perp phoned in hiding, her phone could alert him to her location. Like the other guy hiding in the woods, opening the screen would produce light he could see.

 

[Ell2020]

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/novia-scotia-911-call-1.5546299
RCMP have not disclosed when first 911 call came in about N.S. mass shooting
UPDATE | RCMP said at an April 28 press conference that the first 911 call about the shooting came in "just after 10 p.m." Atlantic time on April 18. Read the latest story.[/QUOTE]



So if the 4 children were on the phone with 911 for over 2 hours, that means they weren’t rescued until after midnight? That part really bothers me

 

[paganini]

He had to have known he didn't have time to linger over setting fires, or he'd be caught by police. What if he had it all planned out, at least a day or so in advance. Went around after dark, setting things up ready to start the fires. Then maybe trapped his girlfriend and unleashed his apocalypse. To me, this is suggested by his escape across the field, that had to be planned in advance and not just good luck.

I’ve wonder about that as well.

 

[MistyWaters]

I was wondering about the circumstances of his shooting at the first police officer, was that in self-defense or had he actually been cruising around hoping to get a chance to kill an officer or two.

I was thinking about that too. And what if he had targeted an officer with the intention of stealing an authentic cruiser with access to communication equipment, if he knew how to use it.

Something else I was wondering about - do police vehicles, including those which are decommissioned have shatterproof glass in all the windows? If so, this may have saved the life of the officer who was shot and wounded and drove himself to the hospital. GW might’ve also anticipated bulletproof glass would serve as an element of additional protection for him. The Mazda 3, not so much.

“Bulletproof" glass is very different to ordinary glass. More correctly called bullet-resistant glass (because no glass is totally bulletproof), it's made from multiple layers of tough glass with "interlayers" of various plastics. Sometimes, there's a final inner layer of polycarbonate (a tough type of plastic) or plastic film to prevent "spalling" (where dangerous shards of glass or plastic splinter off following the impact of a bullet). This sandwich of layers is called a laminate. It can be up to ten times thicker than a single pane of ordinary glass and it's usually very heavy....”
How does bulletproof glass work?