Car Seat in 98 Pontiac POLL ADDED

[Truth Prevails]

Hi everyone. I mostly lurk but the other day I came across this picture while browsing through old doc dumps and this thread came to mind.

If you click on this link http://www.wftv.com/slideshow/news/19106388/detail.html (Picture 52 if it doesn’t take you right there) you will see another version of Picture #1 with slightly more of the lower portion of the car seat showing. If you look right down beneath Mama doll’s feet, the Eddie Bauer logo is displayed in the center.

The picture below is another angle of Picture 3, and if you look at the bottom, notice that the Eddie Bauer logo appears to be to the right.

I haven’t voted yet, but I’m leaning toward all three are different seats.

Please forgive me if this doesn’t post correctly. This is my first attempt at trying pictures and links.

Before I go hide out in lurkdom, I would like to tell you all how much I enjoy Webslueths and appreciate the interesting discussions.

 

[lizzysf]

Hi everyone. I mostly lurk but the other day I came across this picture while browsing through old doc dumps and this thread came to mind.

If you click on this link http://www.wftv.com/slideshow/news/19106388/detail.html (Picture 52 if it doesn’t take you right there) you will see another version of Picture #1 with slightly more of the lower portion of the car seat showing. If you look right down beneath Mama doll’s feet, the Eddie Bauer logo is displayed in the center.

The picture below is another angle of Picture 3, and if you look at the bottom, notice that the Eddie Bauer logo appears to be to the right.

I haven’t voted yet, but I’m leaning toward all three are different seats.

Please forgive me if this doesn’t post correctly. This is my first attempt at trying pictures and links.

Before I go hide out in lurkdom, I would like to tell you all how much I enjoy Webslueths and appreciate the interesting discussions.

It appears you are correct.. here is the photo of chair #1:

I think 1 and 2 are the same (Casey's) and #3 is George's fresh out of the attic for the switch, with the straps still adjusted for age 0-4 months.. That would be my guess. Best find yet find TP! Good job! Her leg in pic#1 would be covering the logo if it were on the right like in chair #3. So, logos different, height of the chair different. The strap pads are different too. In chair 1 the black edging goes all the way around the pad, in 3 it does not. In chair 2 with a younger Caylee, it does wrap around also..look at the left pad and compare.

 

[ExpectingUnicorns]

Hi everyone. I mostly lurk but the other day I came across this picture while browsing through old doc dumps and this thread came to mind.

If you click on this link http://www.wftv.com/slideshow/news/19106388/detail.html (Picture 52 if it doesn’t take you right there) you will see another version of Picture #1 with slightly more of the lower portion of the car seat showing. If you look right down beneath Mama doll’s feet, the Eddie Bauer logo is displayed in the center.

The picture below is another angle of Picture 3, and if you look at the bottom, notice that the Eddie Bauer logo appears to be to the right.

I haven’t voted yet, but I’m leaning toward all three are different seats.

Please forgive me if this doesn’t post correctly. This is my first attempt at trying pictures and links.

Before I go hide out in lurkdom, I would like to tell you all how much I enjoy Webslueths and appreciate the interesting discussions.

Great find, Truth Prevails! This photo sure shows that the shoulder belts are not black like they appear in the other photos of Caylee with her doll. Good sluthin'!!!

 

[ExpectingUnicorns]

It appears you are correct.. here is the photo of chair #1:

I think 1 and 2 are the same (Casey's) and #3 is George's fresh out of the attic for the switch, with the straps still adjusted for age 0-4 months.. That would be my guess. Best find yet find TP! Good job! Her leg in pic#1 would be covering the logo if it were on the right like in chair #3. So, logos different, height of the chair different. The strap pads are different too. In chair 1 the black edging goes all the way around the pad, in 3 it does not.

Wow, it sure looks like you were right, Lizzy. You kept on keepin' on and now it sure seems like something suspicious has been uncovered, huh? Good job!

 

[lizzysf]

Wow, it sure looks like you were right, Lizzy. You kept on keepin' on and now it sure seems like something suspicious has been uncovered, huh? Good job!

TruthPrevails find seriously was the last deciding factor for me to move from 99% sure to 100% sure.. Good job EVERYONE!! (Especially TP!!) You rock by the way.

 

[lizzysf]

Things we know now:
1. Cindy was protecting Casey before LE even took the car.
2. The doll switch possibility is even more likely.
3. Nothing Cindy ever says is just mind-numbing, irrelevant Blah-Blah-Blah. (even though it sounds that way)..look for calculated hidden agendas in everything she says. Yes..even the yard sale mumbo jumbo.

Also, Cindy's carseat straps would be adjusted to the correct position for Caylee at age 2+...she did take Caylee to Mt. Dora in her car. As pointed out earlier by another poster, the height of the pad/straps, when adjusted, do stay put until you readjust.
So the pad in chair #3 LE has, did not just slide down on it's own. It was adjusted to that position.

That's why she was asked in the depo if she moved the straps/adjusted the chair. They know by the FBI interview there are more than 2 chairs. They know the straps should not be in that position for her age. They know George's might still be if it was not used since he returned after the separation. He likely would have stored it at home when he left for 6-7 months. He left when Caylee was 4 months old. And they know it is not Casey's by the photos alone, as we now know. And they know now after the depo that Cindy may likely say Georges went unused so it was sold in the yard sale around Caylee's 2nd birthday.
It also may explain why the carseat, as we know of yet, sits in a box in evidence only visually examined as described in the most up to date documents we have seen. No other testing has occured that we have been made aware of yet.

 

[La.Sandy]

Great sleuthing everyone! So, why would they switch/hide/get rid of a car seat? What evidence might have been in the car seat? How does this fit in to your theory of the crime?

(I have no idea!)

 

[lizzysf]

Rut roh. I can't find any EB seats with a center seat logo, other than extra seat covers and infant seats. The ones I looked through, however, are newer models, so I can't verify if any older models may have had some with center logos. The positions of the logos vary (L, R, to edge of seat surface)... even the ones I looked at that had right side logos were in different locations on the right. Some closer to the center, some further away. I still think seat 3 is longer on top than seat 1. The logo does appear to be more centererd. But what IS that indentation in the seat left of the logo in seat 1 (pic#52)? Is that the edge of that circular cut out like in TP's pic possibly?
I hold by my theory though, that it is still George's either way.. be it the same model as Casey's or not. Just not sure 100% again if George's is the same or different. :blushing:
Here is a video of the seat.. EB Deluxe Convertible
Newer and color scheme a bit different, but basically the same chair.
[ame="http://video.yahoo.com/watch/1295793/5603683"]Eddie Bauer Deluxe Convertible Car Seat, Charcoal and Light Gray User Review on Yahoo! Video[/ame]

 

[Baxter]

Lizzy,

I think I found picture #3 with the same logo, but I can't get it to post. Here is the link:

http://www.target.com/Eddie-Bauer-D...rchSize=30&id=Eddie Bauer Deluxe High Booster

 

[CarrieSis]

I do believe pic #52 still shows the logo to the right of the harness adjuster (the black piece in the cutout). Angle of pic taken makes a HUGE difference.

Also, thank you for posting this pic as it does show that the interior pad the harness threads through DOES move up and down with the harness, as you can see here the bottom is several inches above the crease.

 

[JBean]

Hi everyone. I mostly lurk but the other day I came across this picture while browsing through old doc dumps and this thread came to mind.

If you click on this link http://www.wftv.com/slideshow/news/19106388/detail.html (Picture 52 if it doesn’t take you right there) you will see another version of Picture #1 with slightly more of the lower portion of the car seat showing. If you look right down beneath Mama doll’s feet, the Eddie Bauer logo is displayed in the center.

The picture below is another angle of Picture 3, and if you look at the bottom, notice that the Eddie Bauer logo appears to be to the right.

I haven’t voted yet, but I’m leaning toward all three are different seats.

Please forgive me if this doesn’t post correctly. This is my first attempt at trying pictures and links.

Before I go hide out in lurkdom, I would like to tell you all how much I enjoy Webslueths and appreciate the interesting discussions.

Is there discussion in the docs about that stain on the car seat? If so can someone direct me to it? Is that why this picture is taken at that odd angle?
If you follow the right black back straps up to where it originates and then look at the inside liner of the lip of the car seat, it is just below where her head might rest if she were asleep.

 

[lizzysf]

I am not sure where the mention of stains comes in. I can't find any docs that mention it. Here is the report from when they took the carseat. It doesn't mention any staining.
http://blogs.discovery.com/files/18530237.pdf

And there is a link in this thread to later doc where the lab is saying they will only examine the seat visually for any stains. It is still sealed in the box in evidence.

FBI report that car seat (sample Q47) was tested for blood and Chloroform. Both negative. Still no mention of stains.
http://www.wftv.com/pdf/18740657/detail.html

Note- Specimen was labeled item # Q45 per OCSO and changed to Q47 per FBI.

 

[Truth Prevails]

Hi JBean. Sorry, I haven’t learned how to quote yet but I would like to let you know that I haven’t come across anything about a stain on the car seat.

Honestly, I was just searching for something totally off topic (concerning KC’s high school education) and found an uncropped version of picture #1. My picture #3 is from the deposition photos Muzikman posted. (Photo 10-11.)

But now I’m confused over these car seats because if they were switched (which I believe they were--moo), it would be #1 that should have been found in the back of KC’s car; thus, if there is a stain on #3 would it make sense that it’s just something Caylee spilled? I agree that there appears to be a stain on it.

 

[3doglady]

The stain appears to have a straight edge at the top. Duck tape adhesive? When something is spilled it runs or looks blotchy.

 

[carrie]

Hi everyone. I mostly lurk but the other day I came across this picture while browsing through old doc dumps and this thread came to mind.

If you click on this link http://www.wftv.com/slideshow/news/19106388/detail.html (Picture 52 if it doesn’t take you right there) you will see another version of Picture #1 with slightly more of the lower portion of the car seat showing. If you look right down beneath Mama doll’s feet, the Eddie Bauer logo is displayed in the center.

The picture below is another angle of Picture 3, and if you look at the bottom, notice that the Eddie Bauer logo appears to be to the right.

I haven’t voted yet, but I’m leaning toward all three are different seats.

Please forgive me if this doesn’t post correctly. This is my first attempt at trying pictures and links.

Before I go hide out in lurkdom, I would like to tell you all how much I enjoy Webslueths and appreciate the interesting discussions.

Thanks for the pic TP. In the evidence pic you've posted here one can see the straps more clearly. They look the same height as the straps in photo #52 that you linked. In #52 as well as what were calling car seat #1 in the other photos, you can't see openings where the straps are coming out of the back of the car seat because, obviously, Caylee is sitting there and her shoulders hide them. If you imagine approximately where the openings would be based on what you see of the straps coming over Caylee's shoulders, they are at exactly the same height as in the LE evidence photo. IMO.

 

[Misfitdolly]

I think in the picture of Caylee in the seat with the doll, the logo IS off to the right side. Notice her left leg is up over the side of the car seat somewhat and near the inside of her right leg you can see where the adjuster strap comes out of the lower front of the seat which is in the center. The straps should be adjusted to the height of the child's shoulders but not all people follow the instructions and adjust them when the child grows taller. I am still not convinced these are different seats.

 

[lizzysf]

Interesting FBI note.http://www.wftv.com/pdf/21147519/detail.html
Pg 8390

Hard to read..but it says:

(Siebert)- Will do a visual on carseat- unsure of value due to circumstances.

 

[cecybeans]

It sure does look like a stain, but the film is very grainy and it might be a shadow like other patches that appear similar on the bench seat where the top and bottom meet.

Very interesting FBI quote lizzy - I wonder to what "circumstances" they are referring. It almost sounds like they feel that whatever is mentioned was altered somehow and may not have evidentiary value.

 

[lizzysf]

It sure does look like a stain, but the film is very grainy and it might be a shadow like other patches that appear similar on the bench seat where the top and bottom meet.

Very interesting FBI quote lizzy - I wonder to what "circumstances" they are referring. It almost sounds like they feel that whatever is mentioned was altered somehow and may not have evidentiary value.

As in...they know it is the wrong chair. I think they would need to test anyway just to show it had no Chloroform, blood etc. to further support a claim that it was the wrong chair, otherwise the defense would say.." You didn't even test the chair?"
Besides, a visual would still be valuable in the event it was only washed (not switched)..they would be looking for stains she may have missed or just distorted by washing. So I don't think we are talking about a washed chair here.

 

[carrie]

I think in the picture of Caylee in the seat with the doll, the logo IS off to the right side. Notice her left leg is up over the side of the car seat somewhat and near the inside of her right leg you can see where the adjuster strap comes out of the lower front of the seat which is in the center. The straps should be adjusted to the height of the child's shoulders but not all people follow the instructions and adjust them when the child grows taller. I am still not convinced these are different seats.

ITA. You're right. Now that I look at it the way you explain it, I'm sure the logo is in the same place in both pics.

The logo is to the right, just below her right leg because she has her leg sort of up and over the side of the seat instead of straight in front of her (or her left leg if you take into account the reverse effect/mirror image of the photo as you did, is up over the seat with the logo-which is off to the side-just below it). And just below the other leg you can see the adjuster strap which is in the middle-just like in the evidence photo.

I really believe they are the same seat. It does seem as if LE was getting at something with the car seats in their questioning and the remark they made that lizzy posted a couple posts above in #297. Maybe the car seat was cleaned? I don't know what they were getting at but I still think it's the same seat.