Casey as "co-counsel" ...good strategy or no?

[katydid23]

It is a really bad strategy for one main reason. When she sits up so alert, taking vigorous notes, looking so on top of things, it has to make one wonder. How is it such an intelligent, competent woman was unaware of her long time nanny's contact information? How could such an astute note taker be unable to find her long time babysitter's correct address? And why would such an organized and efficient assistant be incapable of calling 911 before a full month's time? The comparison between the two personas is not helpful for her defense, imo.

 

[Perelandra48]

This website is an easily accessible, free place for the DT to garner a wealth of the kind of detailed information regarding trial strategy and public perception of their client that usually would be quite costly.

I was becoming concerned about all the commentary and especially the poll that clearly quantified opinion on KC's behavior in court. It (the behavior) was bizarre. It was so bizarre that I wondered if it was encouraged by the DT to offer evidence of some kind of dissociative fugue state that, "as you can see, continues to this day, ladies and gentlemen of the jury!"

Today KC's notetaking and general "busyness" at the defense table was severely curtailed. She actually looked at and listened to her mother and even exchanged eye contact and words, albiet silently mouthed. Unless I've missed something (which is always possible) that was the most interaction she has displayed with her mother since the jail tapes.

She also looked at and appeared to be listening to the other witnesses during testimony. She gave the appearance of being more normally engaged than she has previously.

I noticed far less of the self-grooming tics today.

I wonder if she is newly taking psychoactive medications or has had a change in type or a dosage adjustment. That, or she is finally either receiving or paying attention to coaching that is more than likely based on information gathered here.

Anyway, I think this site has been a gold mine of useful advice and information for the people we least want to help in the world. I know of no way to avoid this except to be a lot more careful of what is said and to be sure to offer them no more polls.

If only there were some way to continue to discuss this case and it's characters without allowing them access! Is there?

Casey Anthony Changes Demeanor in Court


http:///viewArticle.action?articleId=281474979194969


I hope it is not too inappropriate to quote my own previous post. If so, I hope I can be forgiven for a breach in forum ettiquette.

Several people responded to my post by saying, to paraphrase, "no problem, she'll get convicted simply based on the 31 days and that first phone call from jail" and "she's not going to be able to hide, for long, who she really is, so what does it matter that the DT is getting information here on how best to present her to a jury?"

I continue to disagree. People who have been following this case "from day 31", including myself, have a very clear picture of who KC really is. We have had the opportunity to read all the interviews, review all the evidence, watch her strutting and hip swinging into and out of the jail and Baez's office. (I was particularly repulsed by one display where she was wearing a "Cayley is Missing" tee-shirt knotted up on the side to accentuate her waist and hips with multiple bangles on her wrists and her pert little pony tail swinging through the open space in the back of her baseball cap.)

The jury is going to be made up, as much as possible, of people who have had not anywhere near the access to information that we have had. They are not going to see the swaggering vision I have just described. They are not going to know that the whole time she was out of jail, on bond, she was spending all day, everyday, secluded in Baez's office. They are only going to be informed of the behaviors and information that the lawyers, mediated by the judge, are going to allow.

Her behavior can, most absolutely, be restrained and modified by medications. I fully believe that, with our help, she can be molded, to a large degree, into a much more sympathetic "creation" than we all know actually exists.

I get worried by, what appears to me, to be a great deal of over-confidence on the part of many WSers. Hubris always scares me.

Some of you made a point of pointing out, for the benefit of the defense, how her out-fits were coming across. Now she has a new, much more acceptable one. Her demeanor has notably changed in the past couple of hearings. The jury is not going to see what we and the others who follow this case have seen.

I think it would have been so great for the jury to have seen her busy, busy co-counsel act, with all the arrogance, self-confidence, and Baez smacking and grabbing self-importance.

Don't forget that guilty people get off all the time for ridiculous and/or cleverly contrived reasons. Look at OJ. Personnally, I would like for the jury to get to see as much of the information we have had access to as possible. And her self-presentation has been as big a clue (to me) as any other piece of evidence. Look at how much time has been spent observing and speculating about her refusal to look at her parents for all these many months. Now that has changed.

I just feel compelled to repeat that I think we should be more careful.

Just because WE have become convinced of her guilt, (and I too was initially pretty well convinced by the one-two punch of the 31 days and the first call home from jail) doesn't mean that 12 people who do not know what we know will be able to feel the personal conviction to take the monumental responsibility of voting for her execution without as much justification as possible.

MOO, of course, and I hope I haven't offended anyone.

 

[LinasK]

Casey Anthony Changes Demeanor in Court


http:///viewArticle.action?articleId=281474979194969


I hope it is not too inappropriate to quote my own previous post. If so, I hope I can be forgiven for a breach in forum ettiquette.

Several people responded to my post by saying, to paraphrase, "no problem, she'll get convicted simply based on the 31 days and that first phone call from jail" and "she's not going to be able to hide, for long, who she really is, so what does it matter that the DT is getting information here on how best to present her to a jury?"

I continue to disagree. People who have been following this case "from day 31", including myself, have a very clear picture of who KC really is. We have had the opportunity to read all the interviews, review all the evidence, watch her strutting and hip swinging into and out of the jail and Baez's office. (I was particularly repulsed by one display where she was wearing a "Cayley is Missing" tee-shirt knotted up on the side to accentuate her waist and hips with multiple bangles on her wrists and her pert little pony tail swinging through the open space in the back of her baseball cap.)

The jury is going to be made up, as much as possible, of people who have had not anywhere near the access to information that we have had. They are not going to see the swaggering vision I have just described. They are not going to know that the whole time she was out of jail, on bond, she was spending all day, everyday, secluded in Baez's office. They are only going to be informed of the behaviors and information that the lawyers, mediated by the judge, are going to allow.

Her behavior can, most absolutely, be restrained and modified by medications. I fully believe that, with our help, she can be molded, to a large degree, into a much more sympathetic "creation" than we all know actually exists.

I get worried by, what appears to me, to be a great deal of over-confidence on the part of many WSers. Hubris always scares me.

Some of you made a point of pointing out, for the benefit of the defense, how her out-fits were coming across. Now she has a new, much more acceptable one. Her demeanor has notably changed in the past couple of hearings. The jury is not going to see what we and the others who follow this case have seen.

I think it would have been so great for the jury to have seen her busy, busy co-counsel act, with all the arrogance, self-confidence, and Baez smacking and grabbing self-importance.

Don't forget that guilty people get off all the time for ridiculous and/or cleverly contrived reasons. Look at OJ. Personnally, I would like for the jury to get to see as much of the information we have had access to as possible. And her self-presentation has been as big a clue (to me) as any other piece of evidence. Look at how much time has been spent observing and speculating about her refusal to look at her parents for all these many months. Now that has changed.

I just feel compelled to repeat that I think we should be more careful.

Just because WE have become convinced of her guilt, (and I too was initially pretty well convinced by the one-two punch of the 31 days and the first call home from jail) doesn't mean that 12 people who do not know what we know will be able to feel the personal conviction to take the monumental responsibility of voting for her execution without as much justification as possible.

MOO, of course, and I hope I haven't offended anyone.

No offense taken but I disagree with a couple of things you have said.
1) her gray/plaid outfit was not a major improvement- it looked slovenly. Someone else best described it as "Seattle grunge"!. I think the lavender sweater was much better. But whether or not the defense is reading here and taking our suggestion or not, they are going to be putting her in different outfits and trying on different looks. Shouldn't stop us from commenting... (Even if they put her in a fancy suit- the evidence alone will convict her- NEVER reported her daughter missing- grandma was the one who called 911 after 31 days, and "All they care about is Caylee".)
2) As I've often stated before, and recently- OJ's trial was an aberration for many reasons, the biggest being his celebrity. Casey doesn't have that. No star-struck jury will refuse to convict her. She's just a common garden-variety sociopath murderer, much like Scott Peterson. Californians do get it right most of the time!

 

[sleutherontheside]

An interesting article...while old....not outdated.
http://articles.latimes.com/1993-04-04/news/vw-18896_1_amy-fisher-michael-milken-jury-behavior-research/2


Snips:
"Studies show people have a harder time remembering what was said, even if it was incriminating, if you can't see the person's eyes," she says.

Clothing fit is another commonly used tool of perception manipulation.

Patty Hearst wore clothes a couple of sizes too large to make her look frail and emphasize her victim role, says Welds, who has a doctorate in psychology and specializes in forensic consulting.

"If Anita Hill had been a client, I would never have put her in short sleeves," Miller says. "It's important not to show skin when working with the opposite sex."

Miller says the more a woman's body is covered, the more respect men tend to feel toward her. Men, she says, are more likely to sexualize a woman, and therefore take her less seriously, if they see her skin. "To dress to get equal respect from men, you need to keep flesh covered," she says.

 

[katydid23]

Casey Anthony Changes Demeanor in Court


http:///viewArticle.action?articleId=281474979194969


I hope it is not too inappropriate to quote my own previous post. If so, I hope I can be forgiven for a breach in forum ettiquette.

Several people responded to my post by saying, to paraphrase, "no problem, she'll get convicted simply based on the 31 days and that first phone call from jail" and "she's not going to be able to hide, for long, who she really is, so what does it matter that the DT is getting information here on how best to present her to a jury?"

I continue to disagree. People who have been following this case "from day 31", including myself, have a very clear picture of who KC really is. We have had the opportunity to read all the interviews, review all the evidence, watch her strutting and hip swinging into and out of the jail and Baez's office. (I was particularly repulsed by one display where she was wearing a "Cayley is Missing" tee-shirt knotted up on the side to accentuate her waist and hips with multiple bangles on her wrists and her pert little pony tail swinging through the open space in the back of her baseball cap.)

The jury is going to be made up, as much as possible, of people who have had not anywhere near the access to information that we have had. They are not going to see the swaggering vision I have just described. They are not going to know that the whole time she was out of jail, on bond, she was spending all day, everyday, secluded in Baez's office. They are only going to be informed of the behaviors and information that the lawyers, mediated by the judge, are going to allow.

Her behavior can, most absolutely, be restrained and modified by medications. I fully believe that, with our help, she can be molded, to a large degree, into a much more sympathetic "creation" than we all know actually exists.

I get worried by, what appears to me, to be a great deal of over-confidence on the part of many WSers. Hubris always scares me.

Some of you made a point of pointing out, for the benefit of the defense, how her out-fits were coming across. Now she has a new, much more acceptable one. Her demeanor has notably changed in the past couple of hearings. The jury is not going to see what we and the others who follow this case have seen.

I think it would have been so great for the jury to have seen her busy, busy co-counsel act, with all the arrogance, self-confidence, and Baez smacking and grabbing self-importance.

Don't forget that guilty people get off all the time for ridiculous and/or cleverly contrived reasons. Look at OJ. Personnally, I would like for the jury to get to see as much of the information we have had access to as possible. And her self-presentation has been as big a clue (to me) as any other piece of evidence. Look at how much time has been spent observing and speculating about her refusal to look at her parents for all these many months. Now that has changed.

I just feel compelled to repeat that I think we should be more careful.

Just because WE have become convinced of her guilt, (and I too was initially pretty well convinced by the one-two punch of the 31 days and the first call home from jail) doesn't mean that 12 people who do not know what we know will be able to feel the personal conviction to take the monumental responsibility of voting for her execution without as much justification as possible.

MOO, of course, and I hope I haven't offended anyone.

I agree with a lot of what you are saying about the unpredictability of juries. My father was a defense attorney and I watched a lot of trials play out---it never ceases to amaze me what some gullible jurors will accept.

WE KNOW what has happened over the past few years. But most of the jurors will not really have that much information. There will be at least a few young jurors who do not trust Law Enforcement and who will assume from the start that she is being railroaded. There will be some Hispanic jurors who will sympathize with Baez if the state gives him a hard time during the trial. There might be a male or two who kind of like Casey and will not believe she could ever kill her little girl in such a cold blooded fashion. And believe me, she will be dressed better and she WILL cry at the appropriate times once the trial begins. imo

 

[janine]

Color me optimistic but I believe it is the evidence that will convict Ms. Anthony, not what she is or isn't wearing, whether she's writing things down or staring off into space, the length of her hair, or the looks on her face, etc. The evidence points to one single solitary person.
No railroading...........there is way too much to overcome to accuse the LE of railroading her. She gives herself away in every call, every visit, every interview, every interrogation. Casey told on her self from the word GO. The mystery is missing for there to be a big question mark.
If - IF, there is a juror who can't see the light, the rest of the reasonable ones will light the way.

Let's try to stay focused. This is what causes the emotional rollercoaster ride.

Evidence.

Watch some other cases- all the dressing them up in clothes, glasses, short hair, suits actually changed nothing. It's a lot of effort for very little, if any, pay off.

OJ and the likes are like comparing apples and oranges. He is not the blueprint for what happens in every day courts across the US.

 

[LinasK]

I didn't get to watch Friday's hearing until last night, and even then my DVR didn't catch all of InSession's coverage, but from what I saw I finally get why everyone thinks Casey is acting like a paralegal. At first I thought maybe it was because of how she was being dressed, but that didn't make sense...:waitasec: Then I assumed it was just because of her prolific note-taking and passing notes, but when I saw Friday's hearing coverage- they focused a lot on her and she was asking the other attorney for books, and looking through file folders. Far more than any average client would, like she was finding the supporting case law!!!

 

[Horace Finklestein]

I didn't get to watch Friday's hearing until last night, and even then my DVR didn't catch all of InSession's coverage, but from what I saw I finally get why everyone thinks Casey is acting like a paralegal. At first I thought maybe it was because of how she was being dressed, but that didn't make sense...:waitasec: Then I assumed it was just because of her prolific note-taking and passing notes, but when I saw Friday's hearing coverage- they focused a lot on her and she was asking the other attorney for books, and looking through file folders. Far more than any average client would, like she was finding the supporting case law!!!

There was one hearing recently when she came into court, did the "look at the ground, open eyes wide and smile that 'im frushtrated' smile" then "Baez" hands her a folder to start looking through or organizing or something. I've never seen anything so ridiculous. She is a barely literate high school dropout trying to contribute(?) to people with advanced degrees and years of experience? She doesn't have enough work experience to even be fetching "Baez"'s red bulls. Unbelievable.

 

[sleutherontheside]

Can't remember if I posted this link...
http://course1.winona.edu/CFried/journal/Papers%202009/Kateri%20formatted.pdf

The Effect of Defendant’s Courtroom Attire on Jurors’ Verdicts

 

[ThinkTank]

Originally Posted by LinasK
I didn't get to watch Friday's hearing until last night, and even then my DVR didn't catch all of InSession's coverage, but from what I saw I finally get why everyone thinks Casey is acting like a paralegal. At first I thought maybe it was because of how she was being dressed, but that didn't make sense... Then I assumed it was just because of her prolific note-taking and passing notes, but when I saw Friday's hearing coverage- they focused a lot on her and she was asking the other attorney for books, and looking through file folders. Far more than any average client would, like she was finding the supporting case law!!!

There was one hearing recently when she came into court, did the "look at the ground, open eyes wide and smile that 'im frushtrated' smile" then "Baez" hands her a folder to start looking through or organizing or something. I've never seen anything so ridiculous. She is a barely literate high school dropout trying to contribute(?) to people with advanced degrees and years of experience? She doesn't have enough work experience to even be fetching "Baez"'s red bulls. Unbelievable.

It's the March 24, 2011 Hearing when Baez hands her the folders as soon as she sits down. I was shocked at that too! She started pulling the files out and put them in front of her, along with the binders on the cadaver dogs Gerus and Bones.

She did the same secretary thing in the March 23, 2011 Hearing, and Hearings after that. But I was just floored that Baez gave the folders to her. I would be worried she would mix up papers that the attorneys needed for their presentations!

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/user/S0meRand0mName#p/u/101/9kNaUI3Yg4U"]YouTube - S0meRand0mName's Channel[/ame]
March 24, 2011 Part 1

 

[luvmygarden]

The last court date

I had a moment where I wondered if maybe these are hers. She probably asked them to make her copies of everything. In her wildest dream ( when she gets out) CM will help her carry them to his car when he takes her home. She probably has alot of organizing to do because they don't put things where they belong for her.
When she asked for the container of folders and big book she took a page out of the big book, wrote a note and tossed both back to JB he glanced at them and stuck them under his folder in his lap. If it was that important wouldn't he hand it back so she could put it where she got it? Or... LDB was talking about the dogs so maybe she has an idea what dogs should play the dogs in the movie. She was definately doing all the motions for the camera.

 

[Truthwillsetufree]

It is a really bad strategy for one main reason. When she sits up so alert, taking vigorous notes, looking so on top of things, it has to make one wonder. How is it such an intelligent, competent woman was unaware of her long time nanny's contact information? How could such an astute note taker be unable to find her long time babysitter's correct address? And why would such an organized and efficient assistant be incapable of calling 911 before a full month's time? The comparison between the two personas is not helpful for her defense, imo.

:goodpost::goodpost::goodpost:

 

[Tulessa]

There was one hearing recently when she came into court, did the "look at the ground, open eyes wide and smile that 'im frushtrated' smile" then "Baez" hands her a folder to start looking through or organizing or something. I've never seen anything so ridiculous. She is a barely literate high school dropout trying to contribute(?) to people with advanced degrees and years of experience? She doesn't have enough work experience to even be fetching "Baez"'s red bulls. Unbelievable.

Bold mine. Please tell me you are not talking about JB? :floorlaugh:

 

[K9Snoop]

Has anyone noticed that CM spends alot of time sitting with his arm across the back of CA's chair. I can't decide if he is trying to project a grandfatherly figure or placing himself in a position to derail unfavorable CA antics?