Casey & Family Psychological Profile #3

[Clock's Tickin]

I believe the opposite! I think CA has the line of need and reflects it to GA to "throw the dogs off the scent". IMO GA's behaviors are that of a person who has lived, and learned to cope, with people who are impaired for a long long time. The genetic predisposition for a lot of these disorders are hereditary, but on top of that a child is then raised by the person who carried that genetic marker. I am by no means excusing KC's behavior, millions of people live with these disorders and commit no crimes, but when you look at how these circumstances fell together the family dynamic definitely comes into play. A person with KC's obvious (and yes-they are obvious not only to experts who have gone on record in this case, but also to anyone who has had encounters with people like KC) psychiatric condition will most likely never be able to help put this case to rest without years of therapy. Does she deserve the worst punishment the court can hand down?-of course she does. Is she responsible for her actions? Of course she is. And Yes, the tragedy would have certainly been averted if the child did not live in this household. That said, this was not the case for Caylee and tragedy can happen anywhere, at any time, to anyone.

 

[debs]

I don't think this is necessarily what's going on here. Cindy knows Casey only thinks about herself. She is merely trying to force Casey to think about someone besides herself for a moment. She's trying so hard to help Casey see how her behavior affects the people around her. C & G don't comment about Casey's self-centered remark because they know IT'S NO USE. You can't make an irrational person think rationally.

It is a danse macabre they have danced repeatedly throughout their enmeshed relationship. Cindy and George knew exactly what would happen if they used the "we're suffering" line. It's gone on before.

Casey does something bad
There is a fight with Cindy because she's the one who always handles the first round
Casey plays victim, how mean they're being to her
Cindy goes on the attack, George attempts to placate, and Lee just wants answers.
Casey verbally beats down and then ignores Cindy who has gone into suffering martyrdom, shuts down Lee and sucks up to George because he'll be the most passive path to getting what she wants.
Casey gets what she wants

and the cycle goes on.

 

[OneLostGrl]

ITA.

I was raised by a mentally ill parent and I'm hypersensitive to both the symptoms as well as the reactions from others. When I watch those jailhouse visits I see myself in Cindy. When she asks KC to look at her eyes while talking and says, "You know I need you to do that, honey." And notice that KC bursts into tears when her mother asks her to do that.

This is a mother who knows her daughter's illness. When she asks KC, "Are we gonna see her again ya think, Case?" And KC says, "I hope to God that we do." CA pleads with KC in a hopeless tone of voice, "Casey." Because she knows her daughter isn't being honest. In her tone of voice I hear myself pleading with my mentally ill person to open up and tell me what's going on in their head. Watch the video and imagine yourself as CA, knowing your daughter is lying and just wishing she could tell the truth.

Casey doesn't get along with her mother and fights with her often because her mother is the one person who will call her on the lies and deceptions. She's always challenged her, encouraged her to try therapy, possibly tried to get her help. But if the ill person doesn't want to be helped, if the ill person doesn't believe there's anything wrong with them, anyone who keeps telling them they need help goes on the $hit list.

And I think this is why CA has protected KC the way she has. She knows KC is a psychopath or whatever her diagnosis might be. She protects her because she knows KC can't help the way she is. I won't be one bit surprised if the defense tries to pull an insanity plea.

Their dysfunction created that monster! Cindy taught her everything she knows! How can you say Cindy "calls her on her lies and deceptions" when we know that is NOT the case? That's a big part of the problem here- nobody ever called her on ... they lied for her, covered it up, took money out of their bank account to cover the money she stole from her grandparents.. They did NOTHING when she stole $4,000 of theirs and claimed she was robbed with a gun to her head.

They knew she didn't have a job (they both admitted they "had a feeling"- yeah like George's feeling there was a dead body in the car) for the last 2 years yet they let her carry on as if she did, pretending right along with her (just as they are pretending right along with her that Caylee was kidnapped by ZG)! She ran up the cell phone bills, stole money from Lee and his friends. Nobody did anything- nobody called her on it, nobody was a parent to that girl- EVER!! They just let her do as she wished then called her names and belittled her as they covered for her. Even in that video Cindy continues to invalidate everything Casey says she feels (though I agree with her that Casey's lying- It is a good example of how Casey is TOLD what she is feeling. and we know it's not new behavior for Cindy because while Casey was clearly frustrated she even says that is why she didn't want to talk to her mother)

Nope- sorry, I understand way too much about mothers like Cindy... She taught her daughter how to behave not only by example but by doing nothing about Casey's behavior all these years. Cindy is just as sick if not sicker than Casey but I assure you, both CHOOSE their behaviors and neither one of them are even close to being insane. No way an insanity defense will even make it into the courtroom!

MO

 

[OneLostGrl]

KC inherited her disorder from GA. He gets off the hook because he can't help the way he is, either. Read the emails between CA, her mother and brother. CA's mother or brother (I can't remember now) says something to the effect of, "Cindy always said there was a sickness in George's family. George has it. Casey has it, too." Bipolar and schizophrenia are hereditary and I do believe George and Casey have one or the other of those disorders.

eta: Maybe George is medicated. The meds used to control the mood swings involved in psychoaffective disorders generally make the patient very "even." He may be taking Lithium or some other drug that keeps him in check.

The emails did not say "George has it". They brought up that Bipolar is on George's side of the family and maybe that's whats wrong with Casey. But anyone who knows anything about Bipolar knows that is not what Casey OR George's problems are (every therapist, Psychiatrist, mental health worker who has been on TV and here in this very thread, Russell, all say the same thing- personality disorder) I think it's not so good an idea to take an obvious Axis II personality disorder and attempt to mold it and shape it to fit an Axis I MOOD disorder. It's not right and it sure doesn't help with the already awful stigma attached to Bipolar AND schizophrenia. And FYI- They most certainly can "help the way they are"!!

We have done this all already- why are going through it again?!

 

[elissabee]

Their dysfunction created that monster! Cindy taught her everything she knows! How can you say Cindy "calls her on her lies and deceptions" when we know that is NOT the case? That's a big part of the problem here- nobody ever called her on ... they lied for her, covered it up, took money out of their bank account to cover the money she stole from her grandparents.. They did NOTHING when she stole $4,000 of theirs and claimed she was robbed with a gun to her head.

They knew she didn't have a job (they both admitted they "had a feeling"- yeah like George's feeling there was a dead body in the car) for the last 2 years yet they let her carry on as if she did, pretending right along with her (just as they are pretending right along with her that Caylee was kidnapped by ZG)! She ran up the cell phone bills, stole money from Lee and his friends. Nobody did anything- nobody called her on it, nobody was a parent to that girl- EVER!! They just let her do as she wished then called her names and belittled her as they covered for her. Even in that video Cindy continues to invalidate everything Casey says she feels (though I agree with her that Casey's lying- It is a good example of how Casey is TOLD what she is feeling. and we know it's not new behavior for Cindy because while Casey was clearly frustrated she even says that is why she didn't want to talk to her mother)

Nope- sorry, I understand way too much about mothers like Cindy... She taught her daughter how to behave not only by example but by doing nothing about Casey's behavior all these years. Cindy is just as sick if not sicker than Casey but I assure you, both CHOOSE their behaviors and neither one of them are even close to being insane. No way an insanity defense will even make it into the courtroom!

MO

Have you ever lived with a schizophrenic? My opinion is based on experience. All I'm saying is I can totally see how mental illness in that family could have led to the behavior of everyone in that house. All of the burden was on Cindy to try and keep the family together. With 2 mentally ill people (KC and GA) in the house I can only imagine how much harder it was for Cindy. Lee probably couldn't deal at all and that's why he seems sort of detached and is not close to his father.

Like I said in another post, if a mentally ill person doesn't want help or believe there's anything wrong with them, all the family can do is get by the best they can. My family has been doing just that for 30+ years.

June 2008 could very well have been KC's first real "breakdown." Psychoaffective disorders are cyclical, and the patient suffers an "attack" where they have a break with reality. KC is 22 years old, an age where a disorder like this would be diagnosed. She may have been lying for years and behaving strangely, but it was all coming to a head in June.

 

[elissabee]

The emails did not say "George has it". They brought up that Bipolar is on George's side of the family and maybe that's whats wrong with Casey. But anyone who knows anything about Bipolar knows that is not what Casey OR George's problems are. I think it's not so good an idea to take an obvious Axis II personality disorder and attempt to mold it and shape it to fit an Axis I MOOD disorder.

I apologize if my language is not clinically correct. I am not familiar with the clinical terms. I am basing my opinion on my experiences with a schizophrenic parent. Casey's behaviors are similar to the ones I've seen at home, and so are the behaviors of the As. They are not unlike the coping mechanisms my family has used to get through the hard times.

 

[OneLostGrl]

Yes, IMO they know that Casey is just claiming she's getting sick to get sympathy and turn her parents' attention away from asking questions. They don't take the bait but are still on pins and needles trying to get information without making her so mad that she hangs up. That's what I see anyway. But there is something weird about GA. CA is more obvious in her mood swings and on-camera demands to the public but some people seem to excuse GA and let him off the hook for the dysfunction in the family. IMO he's right in the thick of things. I can't figure out what his game is but something is there IMO.

Yeah, he's a doormat. IMO

 

[radio]

I apologize if my language is not clinically correct. I am not familiar with the clinical terms. I am basing my opinion on my experiences with a schizophrenic parent. Casey's behaviors are similar to the ones I've seen at home, and so are the behaviors of the As. They are not unlike the coping mechanisms my family has used to get through the hard times.

Every family is different. Every family reacts differently to the behaviors. jmo

Yes, much is the same, but every family unit is comprised of different people/personalities, thresholds, etc. jmo

 

[elissabee]

We have done this all already- why are going through it again?!

Apologies again, as I've only been here a short time. I see you have over 7,000 posts. I'm just trying to be part of the conversation here. I guess I have some catching up to do...

 

[BuzzieCat]

Yeah, he's a doormat. IMO

I don't see only a doormat. He's very strange. He is probably trying to placate CA because of how he messed up the finances, but I also think he's just very weird. I don't think he is bipolar or even necessarily has a personality disorder. He's just very weird. I thought he was very weird in those videos where he's talking about how "someone" has Caylee and are being watched. I'm sure part of it was that he really wanted it to be true and be able to get her back, but I think he likes to feel like he is big stuff or something. IMO. Also the fact that he would fall for the Nigerian scam (I know a lot of other people have also) and possibly getting explosively angry enough to push his father through a plate glass window, coupled with how explosively angry he gets at protesters and the media (though I can understand that to some degree). I think calling him a "doormat" makes him sound passive and mild when he's really anything but. He just knows what side his bread is buttered on (Cindy) IMO.

 

[OneLostGrl]

Have you ever lived with a schizophrenic? My opinion is based on experience. All I'm saying is I can totally see how mental illness in that family could have led to the behavior of everyone in that house. All of the burden was on Cindy to try and keep the family together. With 2 mentally ill people (KC and GA) in the house I can only imagine how much harder it was for Cindy. Lee probably couldn't deal at all and that's why he seems sort of detached and is not close to his father.

Like I said in another post, if a mentally ill person doesn't want help or believe there's anything wrong with them, all the family can do is get by the best they can. My family has been doing just that for 30+ years.

June 2008 could very well have been KC's first real "breakdown." Psychoaffective disorders are cyclical, and the patient suffers an "attack" where they have a break with reality. KC is 22 years old, an age where a disorder like this would be diagnosed. She may have been lying for years and behaving strangely, but it was all coming to a head in June.

I have Bipolar disorder, I have lived with my own psychosis. I also come from a personality disordered home.

What Casey "had" was no break from reality. She is a manipulative, lying, sneaking personality disordered person doing what they do best.

 

[elissabee]

Apologies again, as I've only been here a short time. I see you have over 7,000 posts. I'm just trying to be part of the conversation here. I guess I have some catching up to do...

Quoting myself.

 

[OneLostGrl]

I don't see only a doormat. He's very strange. He is probably trying to placate CA because of how he messed up the finances, but I also think he's just very weird. I don't think he is bipolar or even necessarily has a personality disorder. He's just very weird. I thought he was very weird in those videos where he's talking about how "someone" has Caylee and are being watched. I'm sure part of it was that he really wanted it to be true and be able to get her back, but I think he likes to feel like he is big stuff or something.

Well, that's kinda how I meant it. At home, with his family he is a doormat so when he is away from them he tries to make it seem, to outsiders that he is a big deal... make himself feel better but then when faced with one of his family members he's just "poor George" again. Did you see his reaction to Lee coming to the police station when George was already there but he didn't want Lee to know he went there without him or Cindy? Dude started to vomit!

I totally agree that he is odd..

ETA- I see you added to your post... It's only logical that someone who is treated the way he is by his family (they all make fun of him!) that he'd blow up once in awhile (If I was married to that B!tch I think I'd be in jail!!). He sure does get mad but it seems he takes quite a bit of before finally blowing up!

 

[Dr. Pennypacker]

I don't see only a doormat. He's very strange. He is probably trying to placate CA because of how he messed up the finances, but I also think he's just very weird. I don't think he is bipolar or even necessarily has a personality disorder. He's just very weird. I thought he was very weird in those videos where he's talking about how "someone" has Caylee and are being watched. I'm sure part of it was that he really wanted it to be true and be able to get her back, but I think he likes to feel like he is big stuff or something. IMO. Also the fact that he would fall for the Nigerian scam (I know a lot of other people have also) and possibly getting explosively angry enough to push his father through a plate glass window, coupled with how explosively angry he gets at protesters and the media (though I can understand that to some degree). I think calling him a "doormat" makes him sound passive and mild when he's really anything but. He just knows what side his bread is buttered on (Cindy) IMO.

He doses have a temper. Casey may have inhireted that trait also.

 

[OneLostGrl]

Quoting myself.

I am just so sick of people saying "She's got Bipolar" or that she's psychotic when she clearly isn't. It's like every couple of weeks we go through this, providing links etc to show that neither are the case.

I didn't mean to jump on you, I'm sorry! :blowkiss:

 

[radio]

I am just so sick of people saying "She's got Bipolar" or that she's psychotic when she clearly isn't. It's like every couple of weeks we go through this, providing links etc to show that neither are the case.

I didn't mean to jump on you, I'm sorry! :blowkiss:

Casey's childhood????

 

[OneLostGrl]

He doses have a temper. Casey may have inhireted that trait also.

My guess is it's learned behavior like much of what Casey's behaviors are. If ya lie, steal, cheat, and generally treat others badly your kids will pick up on that.. not to mention Casey probably already had the predisposition for a personality disorder so she got a double whammy, ya know?

 

[Dr. Pennypacker]

My guess is it's learned behavior like much of what Casey's behaviors are. If ya lie, steal, cheat, and generally treat others badly your kids will pick up on that.. not to mention Casey probably already had the predisposition for a personality disorder so she got a double whammy, ya know?

yep


between what was inhirited and what was learned and reinforced.....YIKES!!!

 

[OneLostGrl]

Every family is different. Every family reacts differently to the behaviors. jmo

Yes, much is the same, but every family unit is comprised of different people/personalities, thresholds, etc. jmo

See, I don't see them as the same in any way other than her having a couple of the same traits as Bipolar (moods, sleeping around, shopping, partying) but nothing else about the illnesses even match up. People with these disorders deal with delusions, hallucinations, depression, suicidal ideation.. they are in a fight for their LIFE.. People with personality disorders are in a fight for control.

 

[OneLostGrl]

yep


between what was inhirited and what was learned and reinforced.....YIKES!!!

I agree.. Scary chit!