CO - Jessica Ridgeway, 10, Westminster, 5 Oct 2012 - #14

[otto]

if anyone is into the tree and triangle theory, check out this:

http://www.halexandria.org/dward001.htm

Is there anything special about this particular three point connection between three pieces of evidence: abduction location, body location, evidence location (backpack)? That's like abduction location, car location, body location. There are often three location points in a murder ... but the triangulation of them doesn't usually mean anything.

Why would it mean something in this particular case?

Could this perp be into threes?

How does the tree relate to the triangle?

 

[CHERIE.T]

I don't think it really matters what the markings on that little cross represent. Who knows, maybe the perp's name is something like Isadore Isaac Ickes!

What is more important is: who has had possession of this particular little piece of wood in the past? Who did they pass it along to? Can the recipient account for it's whereabouts now?

Is there any religion that doesn't care if the body parts are all there?

Excellent question!

 

[concentric]

I don't think that there were any clothes. In fact, there has been no mention of the clothes after police asked the public to focus on the gap in Jessica's teeth rather than what she was wearing. This was after the backpack was found. there was speculation that her clothes and glasses were found in the backpack.

Since the discovery of Jessica's body, there have been no requests to help locate articles of clothing.

---------------
That is not what I meant.

I was saying that maybe LE found clothing fibers from the PERP that caught on the barbed-wire fence.

 

[MizStery]

If it helps, I saved A-rodd-777's pentagram map. Please delete if not OK to post.

That is awesome.....my a_rod_777 image links didn't work so you saved the day! You get a :goldstar:

 

[spamelope]

Thank you, Reann! I am sooooo glad you saved that! I just missed it when he posted it originally, and I was so frustrated! And then again tonight when his images wouldn't post. Thank you again! You rock!

 

[GrainneDhu]

If it had been worn with any kind of cord, even once, there would be a wear mark on the wood or finish. I don't see anything even remotely resembling a wear mark on this hole. First hand knowledge of this, as I work with wood, and almost every kind of cord and chain imaginable. IMO, it just doesn't look like it was attached to anything.

If it was something he had that he kept in a drawer, it could have been strung but not gotten enough movement to create wear marks.

I don't know why but I just keep thinking it was a memento of sorts for the perp and not necessarily a memento connected with happiness. It wasn't something he wore or carried routinely.

 

[concentric]

True. As long as he really ran. And they should look at the pics for those details and see if they find him - especially once they narrow down which shirt it was. But they may also find one - or dozens - of people in the race wearing green shoes, none of whom were him.

As we saw with John Gardner, preying on people running/walking/working out is a pretty easy deal, especially when people are simultaneously listening to an ipod or something. Chelsea and the other gal he tried to assault and rape both were working out. We don't know that JG was out there posing as a runner, but he probably also wasn't on the trails in a dress suit or something. Workout (or at least more grubbies) would have made him stand out less.

If the three incidents at the lake are related (the two runners and this boy) then he may well use looking like he fits right in as his MO to attract less attention to himself. So he could easily be wearing a running shirt to make it less odd if he's just lingering on trails looking for someone to assault. Heck, it would make it easy for him to run streets around schools, too.

A bunch of people commented on the biker in some of the JR pics earlier on and said he didn't seem to be dress appropriately (though he looked to me like someone biking to/from work or a more middle age person that just didn't invest in more proper biking attire) and they were wanting to send the pic in to the tipline.

If the cases here are all related, dressing like a runner could easily be the way he got around with repeatedly being in (and lingering in) areas where he'd be prone to find people who are vulnerable in more isolated areas.

But, then again, mabye he really is just a runner and it is his shirt.

------------

Absolutely. I followed those cases pretty closely.

As I said before, though, people really need to review the Bike Path Rapist/Murderer cases, Buffalo, NY. Altemio Sanchez eluded capture for decades. Women would jog/run on these bike paths and he was there appearing just like any other runner/jogger, only he was the rapist/murderer. He also regularly participated in memorial runs for the women he murdered.

 

[insatiable]

Agree, and very interesting website, but I think having a cross which is a symbol of Christianity with Hebrew writing, suggesting the Jewish faith, is a little odd. How many crosses have you seen with Herbrew letters on them? Granted the religions are closedly related and studied as such as well, but it's the symbols that are relavant, imo. It would be like finding a star of David with crosses or Islam symbols engraved in it. kwim? iMO

Are the three lines Hebrew? I missed that if it was talked about already. Anyone willing to fill me in
Purty please lease:

 

[spamelope]

I think that this guy, if he accidentally lost his cross at the site, would have just gone back to get it. In fact, I'll bet he cruised by at least a few times after he put Jess's body there to make sure he didn't screw anything up. It's not like he would have had to retrace many steps to do it. Bring a flashlight, use the headlights from his vehicle, or heck, even do it during the daytime. And if he couldn't find it, then he could have just picked the remains back up and relocated them somewhere else. I think it's a red herring.

 

[Cybermom]

That's true that motive, means, and method can shed light. We don't have any of that information though. We don't know where the cross was found, how it was found, who found it, what position it was in, whether it was on the ground, in something else, in the air, hanging, laying, sitting, leaning...we know nothing except what it looks like and it was found "at one of the crime scenes." We don't know if it got to wherever it got to accidentally or on purpose.

So -

- could it have been placed on purpose? Yes
- could it have fallen off accidentally? Yes
- could it have been at the body site? Yes
- could it have been placed on or near the body? Yes
- could it have been hanging on something nearby? Yes
- could it have been found not at the body site but in or near the backpack? Yes
- could it have a religious connotation? Yes
- could it have nothing to do with religion? Yes
- could it be something meaningful to the perp? Yes
- could it be something not meaningful to the perp? Yes
- could it have been worn around the neck? Yes
- could it have been carried in a pocket? Yes
- could it have been on a keychain? Yes
- could the perp be using it to taunt police? Yes
- could the perp be using it to show remorse? Yes
- could the perp have no special secret message and the item just fell off or out? Yes
- could it have been on a chain? Yes. A leather type necklace? Yes.

With the fact that we know nothing, any of those scenarios and many more are possible.

We know that it was found at a crime scene, it is pertinent. In a crime where the perp seems to be brazen yet calculating.
You can disregard my opinions, I will not be offended. I just think that it needs to be considered, worked over,
In the end it will all make sense but we aren't there yet, so it's a puzzle.

 

[tiredblondy]

Just got my internet connection back and have to ask from reading a few pages back, what is the green shoes connection?

 

[spoonco]

he could've gotten the shirt at a thrift store.

btw - I dislike greatly the "proper" biking attire

I'm not convinced the attempted abduction of the boy is linked to the other ones.

But, nevertheless, I am convinced the guy who attempted to abduct the boy in Westcliff is a runner. The kids said they watched him do a few laps. That, the description of his physique and outfit all lead me to believe he really is a runner.

 

[koalabear]

I cant see very good, but here is a guy wearing a cross.. If i cant post it here, please delete.

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?...5822.-2207520000.1350798061&type=1&permPage=1

Oh boy that freaked me out. Look at that guy! Are they rosary beads he is wearing?

 

[GrainneDhu]

I think the kidnapper is taunting LE.
A kidnapping in plain sight
A backpack in plain sight
A body in plain sight
I'm assuming a cross in plain sight also.
I also think he is in plain sight.
Jmo

Which is, of course, one of the most effective ways to hide.

 

[spamelope]

I cant see very good, but here is a guy wearing a cross.. If i cant post it here, please delete.

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?...5822.-2207520000.1350798061&type=1&permPage=1

Way to go, Wendy! That is some awesome sleuthing right there! . But that's what this case is going to take. Someone noticing details about human beings.

 

[over-thinker]

Oh boy that freaked me out. Look at that guy! Are they rosary beads he is wearing?

I think "that guy" is a generous tattoo artist that donated his time to tattoo in the park the other day.

ETA: when I blow that pic up it looks like that cross gas something in the center. Like a piece or metal or something. Can anyone else see that? I guess if he was one of those tattoo artists he would be on the other side. I can't really tell, but it looks like he is holding his wallet or something, but it appears those people next to him are asking him something, etc

 

[Madeleine74]

We know that it was found at a crime scene, it is pertinent. In a crime where the perp seems to be brazen yet calculating.
You can disregard my opinions, I will not be offended. I just think that it needs to be considered, worked over,
In the end it will all make sense but we aren't there yet, so it's a puzzle.

Yes we know it was found at a crime scene, but we don't know which one. We can guess. Maybe we'll guess correctly. Not sure who is going to verify the guess as being correct or incorrect at this time. If the perp placed the cross there, he's calculating. If the cross fell off accidentally, he's not calculating (in terms of the cross only). I don't know how to put the puzzle together without the pieces. We have just a few pieces out of a large puzzle.

 

[Backwoods]

You are correct.
But motive and means and method can sometimes shed light.
Sometimes clues need to be turned over and inspected again and again and then there up is a "a ha" .
I get equally frustrated when people post things without reading the facts.
Some of us don't live local so chances are we haven't crossed paths with the perp. Our insight might help, even if it is only about the mindset of this person.

:goodpost:

Thanks for this, Cybermom!

 

[spoonco]

That would probably be like looking for a needle in a haystack. But I'm curious to look through a variety of city event pictures. We never know what we may find

It's tough - there are events every weekend here. There was a run nearby in September called the Panerathon (Panera Bread, proceeds help support hunger relief). It's popular. Olde Town Arvada has had events on many weekends - farmers' markets, festivals, and the weekend the body was ID'ed, there was a Halloween-type festival.

But, I'd still say the green shoes and other description are worth looking through the Bolder Boulder pics. People tend to make that an annual event. Based on how fit the kids seem to think he was, he could be in one of the earlier waves, certainly a running wave. There are pictures taken all throughout that route, lots of angles.

The other thing...there can only be so many green/white shoes. IF he's really local, they could check the main sports stores for people who have purchased those kinds of shoes in the last year. Knowing approx height might be able to whittle down the shoes sizes. Big long shot, but you never know...

 

[OwlMom]

I really think Kim Remmel may be a victim of this guy, though.

I've wondered that. There's tons of open space so the fact that she spent time in open space isn't nearly as important as the fact that she was tiny--probably 2" taller and 15-20 lbs heavier than Jessica Ridgeway, and most likely was out in open space alone. Some open space is really close to homes and usually has a good number of people out there (like Ketner Reservoir), but other areas can be fairly isolated. A small female--even a strong one--might be easy enough prey for a larger guy, especially one with chloroform or something similar. (It's a reality I usually choose to ignore; I've only had a scary incident happen once--in Westminster's City Park--hardly a remote location!)

You're totally right!!! I missed the Westcliff reference. You're right - this was at Big Dry Creek. (No clue where the other poster got Louisville??)

I think the only reason I saw the reference to this incident was because a member here posted it. Does LE think this is related?

BBM. LE has not mentioned it thus far. It showed up in the news today.


FWIW, no one needs to "pose" as anything on the trails in this part of Colorado. Some people only walk, some bike, some run, some do the jog/walk thing. Tons and tons of people are out on the trails every day, and for that matter, there are tons of runners in the area too. The only thing that would make a person look out of place on a trail is odd behavior--like circling an area as was the case with the 8-year-old.

it will be interesting to see if there is a connection between these incidents and Jessica's case.