CO CO - Kelsey Berreth, 29, Woodland Park, Teller County, 22 Nov 2018 - #26 *ARREST*

[OldLadyBlues]

Twelve days after the initial WPPD news conference regarding Kelsey's disappearance, and with no body found; PF is charged with first degree murder (premeditated), and three count of solicitation to commit murder. Lightning speed.

We are now about 20 days after PF's arrest, and no one else has been arrested, ie the people he solicited, maybe actually helped in the crime, or covered up the crime. Paint drying.

I think this is unusual. Is it?

We think somebody(s) is talking. Some ways to deal with suspects-

1) arrest them, and work down the charges in exchange for information and agreement to testify.

2) have them on notice that they will be arrested pending a lack of cooperation.

3) bluff them regarding charges, in hope they give information.

4) other approaches that I can't think of.

I don't understand 20 days without an arrest. I'm getting impatient (selfishly, haha).


And I'm starting to question if there will actually be more arrests. This may be a bad thing, but not necessarily so. Thoughts?

I'm thinking there's a supporting cast in the back round that LE is waiting on to slip up, be identified by evidence, whatever. I also think this crime will get more appalling.
Having said that? The more I know about this case (which ain't much, folks) the more I simply don't know about this case. My first inclination is to go on about my retired life, wait for every one of our characters to quit playin and get serious and then come back and take it from there. I'm not saying it's cold by ANY means but it seems to be entering the "cluster" stage and speaking personally, time to let all of our characters sit in their stew and marinate.
MOO, MOO
Edited to correct some pretty stinky spelling.

 

[Hopefullyhelpful]

A lot of people are hung up on the purchase of the condo, the size of it and the distance to job. Has anyone considered that it was an investment purchase that acted as a temporary residence for KB and baby? It could be that the plan was to purchase a family home for KB, PF and baby when things were on track, and use the condo for income and also for a place for KB’s family to stay when they visit from out of town? Didn’t I see that complex was full of Air BnB type rentals? So the fact the purchase was made, I don’t think really indicates anything other than a smart financial move, as it’s often cheaper to own than it is to rent.

Edited to clean up typing errors

 

[cody22]

No. But what is unusual, is the living arrangement between PF and KB.

Him living with his mother, not so unusual.

Him living apart from the fiancé that he has a child with, unusual.

The account that they had been broken up for a length of time, would certainly explain this.

But it came from PF, and I don’t trust anything that comes from PF.

Is there any proof that they ever really lived together for a period of time in the same home ?..... Lots of shacking up, baby daddy stuff , going on nowadays.......MOO....oldfashionedfuddyduddycody22

 

[Concernedmamaof3]

I just bet there will be a leak sometime soon. IMO

That would be awesome for us, but are you guessing the defense would leak things or someone else? Would that benefit them or would that be to try to claim the jury pool has been tainted?

 

[tmar]

A man believed to be PF's father reportedly died in Sept 2018 as cited by the local Woodland Park Underground (re. public probate records). MOO

ETA: referring you to WPU previously approved by Tricia. Not sleuthing family here.

It was Sept that PF began his soliciting also!!

 

[NoeticSoul]

Is there any proof that they ever really lived together for a period of time in the same home ?..... Lots of shacking up, baby daddy stuff , going on nowadays.......MOO....oldfashionedfuddyduddycody22

Nothing other than a neighbor saying that he was there frequently and for overnights I believe.

 

[NoeticSoul]

It was Sept that PF began his soliciting also!!

Yep. But we are not allowed to sluth him and would hate to get the thread shut down :/

 

[Seattle1]

A lot of people are hung up on the purchase of the condo, the size of it and the distance to job. Has anyone considered that it was an investment purchase that acted as a temporary residence for KB and baby? It could be that the plan was to purchase a family home for KB, PF and baby when things were on track, and use the condo for income and also for a place for KB’s family to stay when they visit from out of town? Didn’t I see that complex was full of Air BnB type rentals? So the fact the purchase was made, I don’t think really indicates anything other than a smart financial move, as it’s often cheapen town than it is to rent.

Edited to clean up typing errors

KB reportedly had been living in the complex prior to purchasing her unit. Very good chance mortgage was equivalent to her rent. CB also reported that original plan was for KB and PF to purchase their own ranch, but alleged drop in cattle market put a wrench in the plan. MOO

 

[Mercedes]

Nope. @riolove77 cleared that up for us.

Morally, it’s disgusting.

Legally, no crime.

See, I think this is a double-edged sword.

Let’s say, for example, one of your friends asked you to help kill someone and you, of course, turned him down. But, you reported him to the authorities and he was investigated. The friend lies to LE and says noways did he
ask you for help or suggest you commit the crime.

The friend is livid, says you are lying, and sues you for slander (spoken) or criticizes you around town.

Yes, morally you did the right thing, but who knows if the friend was serious when he asked you or not. Knowing you, (from your comments on WS) I think you would take a chance with a slander suit to save a life, but “snitches get stitches.”

 

[NanZDrew]

I think the fact that PF's lawyer asked for a continuance of a month to have time to respond indicates there is considerable evidence. I also wonder if he was surprised by it. Could one wonder about how much PF is working with his attorney?

 

[srg]

Yes, a person can absolutely commit a crime like this and not have a Narcissistic Personality. We don't have anywhere near enough information to determine if this is the case, in my opinion. But it is true that many murders are committed by people with APD or have Narcissistic tendencies. Imo

Good point to clarify 1) that murder can be committed by people who do not have NPD and 2) we haven’t heard that PF has that diagnosis or any other dx.

I should have been more careful myself when I mentioned him and narcissism signs in previous posts! My apologies. There is significant amounts of info to be gathered to understand PF’s psyche and whether he would even meet DSM-5 criteria for a personality disorder or other disorder, such as ASPD. And only a qualified professional would do a forensic assessment.

However, it is always interesting to speculate given what we do seem to know, and because we often seek to understand the incomprehensible acts of those who commit murder. Here is a link to a quick read about “dangerous narcissism.” This is not to suggest that PF has this dx, by the way.

Are Narcissists Dangerous? The 9 Traits of a Narcissistic Personality [Infographic]

 

[Hopefullyhelpful]

KB reportedly had been living in the complex prior to purchasing her unit. Very good chance mortgage was equivalent to her rent. CB also reported that original plan was for KB and PF to purchase their own ranch, but alleged drop in cattle market put a wrench in the plan. MOO

Exactly, so why keep paying rent when they could build equity, and then pull income?

 

[tmar]

A lot of people are hung up on the purchase of the condo, the size of it and the distance to job. Has anyone considered that it was an investment purchase that acted as a temporary residence for KB and baby? It could be that the plan was to purchase a family home for KB, PF and baby when things were on track, and use the condo for income and also for a place for KB’s family to stay when they visit from out of town? Didn’t I see that complex was full of Air BnB type rentals? So the fact the purchase was made, I don’t think really indicates anything other than a smart financial move, as it’s often cheapen town than it is to rent.

Edited to clean up typing errors

I agree with your thoughts about Kelsey's home.
Buying a small property, with its investment opportunities is certainly a wise move.
Kelsey is not paying rent, while living there.
Possible future plans may have been discussed, but this property could later be rented out/sold etc.
MOO.

 

[NoeticSoul]

See, I think this is a double-edged sword.

Let’s say, for example, one of your friends asked you to help kill someone and you, of course, turned him down. But, you reported him to the authorities and he was investigated. The friend lies to LE and says noways did he
ask you for help or suggest you commit the crime.

The friend is livid, says you are lying, and sues you for slander (spoken) or criticized you around town.

Yes, morally you did the right thing, but who knows if the friend was serious when he asked you or not. Knowing you, (from your comments on WS) I think you would take a chance with a slander suit to save a life, but “snitches get stitches.”

BBM It seems that in this case, LE is/was protecting these 'snitches' so that they didn't get those "stitches". moo

 

[NoeticSoul]

I agree with your thoughts about Kelsey's home.
Buying a small property, with its investment opportunities is certainly a wise move.
Kelsey is not paying rent, while living there.
Possible future plans may have been discussed, but this property could later be rented out/sold etc.
MOO.

It's a beautiful area for many outdoor recreational activities and I'm sure there are many VRBO's around there renting at a very decent rate.

 

[NanZDrew]

BBM It seems that in this case, LE is/was protecting these 'snitches' so that they didn't get those "stitches". moo

Well, the good thing about Protective Custody is that LE still has them under their control and surveillance, but the POI still has a phone, e-mail, etc. and could possibly mess up or LE may find the other person trying to contact them.

 

[tmar]

WOODLAND PARK – The Woodland Park Police Department is asking for the public’s help in locating a missing 29-year-old woman.

According to Woodland Park PD, Kesely Berreth was last seen in Woodland Park on Nov. 22nd.

Berreth is described as a white female, 5’3″ tall, 110 pounds, with brown hair.

If you have any information on her whereabouts, please contact the Woodland Park Police Department at (719) 687-9262.

Woodland Park PD seeking public’s help in locating missing woman

Woodland Park Police Department

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[NoeticSoul]

It was Sept that PF began his soliciting also!!

Things that make ya go hmmmmmmm.

 

[Hopefullyhelpful]

To expound on my thoughts about the condo purchase. What I do think we can surmise from it is; KB was entrenched in Colorado. At least as of May, she wasn’t planning on leaving. I also think it speaks to a logical mind planning a future. Her profession speaks to that as well. In contrast, the things PF was telling people just don’t make sense when you view them against the actual tangible evidence. Suddenly I feel very sad.

 

[v0x]

What We Know About the Nurse Reportedly Being Investigated in Kelsey Berreth's Disappearance