CO CO - Kelsey Berreth, 29, Woodland Park, Teller County, 22 Nov 2018 - #26 *ARREST*

[sun16]

Someone earlier today posted something to the effect of ... maybe PF asked someone else to dispose of KB’s phone (other than IN), and that person gave it to IN. But then I thought, the chance of it ending up with someone PF knows...IN.... no amd doesn’t look good.

 

[NoeticSoul]

I agree. I thought the same thing about Chris Watts but then he just folded. I do think PF is different, and I don’t see him confessing. But let’s see what happens!

PF's not ever gonna fold like a cheap suit imo. Not before he sees others fall.

 

[girlhasnoname]

Yes! I have 15 years experience with this, at least in NY. The answer is, no-one has the final say. The parents are to work it out themselves. Law enforcement can only step in if there is a legal document stating who has visitation when. Without a court order, if the parents can't come to an agreement, one parent can take the child somewhere even if the other parent disagrees. That is one reason why it is so important to establish custody and set up some sort of structured visitation. Without it you can expect 18 years of arguments, emotions, and drama. Imo

Thank you so much MsBetsy! I always enjoy hearing from people who've lived it. What do you think would happen if one parent wanted to physically take the child from the other parent if they refused? Would the parent have to call the police to intervene?

 

[SandyQLS]

I'm not an attorney, however I work in the legal field. A civil case can be filed in federal court when the parties reside in different states, when the case involves federal statutes, or when the case involves the US Constitution. Here, I assume they are invoking diversity jurisdiction since KB's parents reside in a different state than PF.

Thank you.

Diversity jurisdiction - Wikipedia

"... Diversity jurisdiction

In the law of the United States, diversity jurisdiction is a form of subject-matterjurisdiction in civil procedure in which a United States district court in the federal judiciaryhas the power to hear a civil case when the amount in controversy exceeds $75,000 and where the persons that are parties are "diverse" in citizenship or state of incorporation (for corporations being legal persons), which generally indicates that they differ in state and/or nationality. Diversity jurisdiction and federal-question jurisdiction(jurisdiction over issues arising under federal law) constitute the two primary categories of subject matter jurisdiction in U.S. federal courts.

The United States Constitution, in Article III, § 2, gives ..."

 

[NoeticSoul]

I think the original attorney was replaced because of cost. PF simply could not afford a private attorney to defend him when a public defender is available.

Thanks, @PrairieWind I'm sure you're right. I was hoping that another JoseBaez wasn't going to swoop in to defend this demented 'cowboy' on his own dime.

 

[The Farm]

I think the original attorney was replaced because of cost. PF simply could not afford a private attorney to defend him when a public defender is available.

I thought it was because he was a "family" lawyer and did not have the capabilities to take on a case of this magnitude?

I could be wrong but my old brain seems to remember reading that somewhere.

 

[MyBelle]

Except in those cases they were actual custody cases. Not wrongful death actions. So they were faced with either answering questions and incriminating themselves or not answering and thus prejudicing themselves in their custody case.

A civil lawsuit does require answering questions and was used in the Cooper and Young cases before either man was even arrested. It is a way for LE to exploit the right to silence. Cooper answered and Young did not but they both lost custody.

Jason Young was sued for wrongful death by Michelle's mother.

Jason Young named in wrongful death lawsuit in Michelle Young's slaying :: WRAL.com

 

[cluciano63]

I understand your opinion. I THINK KB was certain she would not be living with PF in the near future. Otherwise, I don’t believe she would have purchased a home.
If she anticipated him moving in with her, I think she would have purchased a much larger home. 750 sq ft is very small, especially for a two story, imo.
If we assume 250 sq ft for BRs total & another 150 for bath/kitchen, there virtually no space for a third person, imo.
Also, idk that KB did NOT want to live at the “ranchette”. Reportedly she enjoyed horses, outdoors, etc. I think PF did not want her living there. He could easily have said “mom won’t allow it, she owns the place”, & I do think he might have his own place in a barn.

Jmo

Homes are expensive there...well, for a single person or young couple/first time buyer. She paid nearly $200k for a 2-bedroom...that would suit a couple and a baby for 4-5 yrs anyway. I know that is cheap to most of you, but in ABQ I could buy a 2-bdrm condo for under $100k. And a 3-4 bdrm house for $200k. But not so, where she was looking. Jmo

Also, I know families who live in 750 sq ft apartments. It can be done. My apt is less than 600 sq ft and perfectly comfortable for myself and two pets. Good grief, housing is expensive.

 

[Jupiter05]

I thought it was because he was a "family" lawyer and did not have the capabilities to take on a case of this magnitude?

I could be wrong but my old brain seems to remember reading that somewhere.

Yes, I beleive he does mostly dui and personal injury type work. Criminal law on a much smaller scale.

 

[Trudie]

He isn’t confessing, no way.

My post references if he confessed to his attorney (privately).
I have absolutely no idea what he may or not do, down the road. I think a defendant never knows until the case is close to trial & they are fully aware of the evidence against them. That’s how I would be. I would not plead guilty if I thought the state could not prove me guilty.

 

[cluciano63]

A civil lawsuit does require answering questions and was used in the Cooper and Young cases before either man was even arrested. It is a way for LE to exploit the right to silence. Cooper answered and Young did not but they both lost custody.

Jason Young was sued for wrongful death by Michelle's mother.

Jason Young named in wrongful death lawsuit in Michelle Young's slaying :: WRAL.com

I doubt any accused would tell the truth if forced to answer questions...jmo

 

[MsBetsy]

Thank you so much MsBetsy! I always enjoy hearing from people who've lived it. What do you think would happen if one parent wanted to physically take the child from the other parent if they refused? Would the parent have to call the police to intervene?

Yes, they likely would. I just gave an example of this in a post above, only I'm not sure I made clear that the parents had not been to court to establish custody. (hopefully that was assumed)
When things escalate and get out of hand, calling the police is typically what someone ends up doing. It can be incredibly traumatic for the child. Imo

 

[MyBelle]

Is there any proof that they ever really lived together for a period of time in the same home ?..... Lots of shacking up, baby daddy stuff , going on nowadays.......MOO....oldfashionedfuddyduddycody22

iirc, CB told reporters at the first press conference that the couple never lived together.

 

[Trudie]

Someone earlier today posted something to the effect of ... maybe PF asked someone else to dispose of KB’s phone (other than IN), and that person gave it to IN. But then I thought, the chance of it ending up with someone PF knows...IN.... no amd doesn’t look good.

That would be very coincidental. But, who Knows?

 

[Trudie]

iirc, CB told reporters at the first press conference that the couple never lived together.

Yup, I was just thinking she commented about living arrangements.

 

[MyBelle]

I doubt any accused would tell the truth if forced to answer questions...jmo

Neither man had been formally accused but the lawsuits certainly sealed their fate in the court of public opinion when they were charged. JMO

 

[StarEyes]

I’m anxious to see what evidence LE collected from KBs home. I’ve been following along. It’s piqued my curiosity. I wonder if they decided to spray Luminol just to see if anything showed up? If a decent amount of blood caused it to light up like a Christmas Tree, that could be why they decided she’s deceased; if there was enough blood loss that they knew it wouldn’t be survivable. That may be why they were taking large pieces of something (drywall?) out of the home. This is completely JMO, of course. I can’t stop thinking about it.

 

[Trudie]

I doubt any accused would tell the truth if forced to answer questions...jmo

Ita & I think people are naive to think an “oath” means much to a murderer. He’s likely going down. What’s lying in court going to add to a LWOP?
I wish I could find a link, I read an article, a recently retired Judge of almost 40 yrs claims he never had a case w/o lies from both sides, imo & my interpretation.
I find it annoying for someone to say “he HAS to tell the truth”. No, no he does not. Many don’t, IMO.

 

[v0x]

Chris Halsne on Twitter

“Search warrants served in #Idaho related to #kelseyberreth murder. Twin Falls Co Sheriff Tom Carter says FBI contacted him in December to help execute. @KDVR investigates at 5,7,9”

Live-stream link: Live Streaming

 

[cluciano63]

Ita & I think people are naive to think an “oath” means much to a murderer. He’s likely going down. What’s lying in court going to add to a LWOP?
I wish I could find a link, I read an article, a recently retired Judge of almost 40 yrs claims he never had a case w/o lies from both sides, imo & my interpretation.
I find it annoying for someone to say “he HAS to tell the truth”. No, no he does not. Many don’t, IMO.

Yes, as if a convicted murderer who never spoke during trial is going to confess in a civil case...sure, chances are the family will win the case but will not obtain any true info.
Jmo