CO CO - Kelsey Berreth, 29, Woodland Park, Teller County, 22 Nov 2018 - #35 *ARREST*

[gliving]

Local Woodland Park newspaper:

Flurry Of Rumors Surround Search For Body of Kelsey Berreth | The Mountain Jackpot News

"On the other side of the legal spectrum, local residents who claim to have sat behind bars with Frazee say that he swears by his innocence. Frazee has maintained he didn’t play any role in his fiance’s disappearance.

Rumors circulating the small community say that one of the items that was removed from the waste transfer station in Divide after Frazee was seen dumping some trash there, including an electric saw. Some also think that the backhoes brought onto Frazee’s property during the search warrant of the 35-acre ranch, where he lived with his mother, were aimed at removing the septic tank on his property for possible clues."

More at link

 

[PrairieWind]

I've never seen a discovery requestin criminal law. You don't have to serve a request because they have to give it to you automatically.

I need to ask my law partner about this. But it's CO and we practice in CA and it seems they do things quite different out there.

Wait. Where's @PrairieWind? I think she's out of CO?

He. I'm a he. LOL.
Often prosecutors will just send discovery, but formal request from defense is typical.

 

[InvSmith]

Immediate arrest and hold is mandatory under the Murder in the First Degree statute. It is not mandatory for Class 6 felonies, or a whole range of other Colorado crimes. A convict cannot enter the penal/probation system without the customary "booking", so it will happen eventually. Nowadays, the Hearing on Advisement is more commonly done by utilizing appearance via remote television hookup. If there's a big TV set facing the judge on Friday morning, it's perhaps not there for him to watch GMA.
The case is sealed. I realize that there has been some difficulty in defining exactly what sealed means, but at some point sealed is going to have to mean sealed.

IMO

Initially, if she admitted to having the victim's property that was present at a crime scene, I would have arrested her.

 

[Kapua]

@PommyMommy txs. Waiting on the reporter to offer clarification to help reporting efforts. Talk about shocking.

There's been entirely too much gossip and rumors and too few facts about this case from day 1. It's frustrating. I hope we get some solid facts this month. MOO

 

[NoeticSoul]

Local Woodland Park newspaper:

Flurry Of Rumors Surround Search For Body of Kelsey Berreth | The Mountain Jackpot News

"On the other side of the legal spectrum, local residents who claim to have sat behind bars with Frazee say that he swears by his innocence. Frazee has maintained he didn’t play any role in his fiance’s disappearance.

Rumors circulating the small community say that one of the items that was removed from the waste transfer station in Divide after Frazee was seen dumping some trash there, including an electric saw. Some also think that the backhoes brought onto Frazee’s property during the search warrant of the 35-acre ranch, where he lived with his mother, were aimed at removing the septic tank on his property for possible clues."

More at link

Interesting. There were no reports or video of LE hauling away or removing a big septic tank though. It would be pretty hard to miss! It's a very remote area. eta Sounds like they are reporting on Facebook rumors. moo

 

[Auntie Cipation]

I know the conversation has moved on, but I didn't see these corrected and I always think it's best to get the details clear.

Teller County local police indicated there was evidence to indicate KB was 1) decreased and 2) it occurred in the townhouse. This was an early news conference soon after PF's arrest. The burglary has not been explained but has been listed as an alternative to the crime which is allowable in CO. In articles, I have read there may be indications that PF hired or asked someone to rob KB. The robbery allows for the death penalty as a felony during the commission of homicide and can place the death penalty as an option. This gives the DA more options.

Our lawyers explained in a previous thread that if the murderer/accomplice took KB's purse/phone that would make it a robbery, IIRC. Those items haven't been located that we know of, IMO.

The robbery would be to explain an alternative to what crime was being committed (this is allowable in CO) and is a felony enhancement being committed during the commission of a homicide which can be used to ask for the Death Penalty and not just a Life Sentence, Charge 2 (the crime really is the murder and not the robbery). The other possibility is PF committed the homicide without robbery, Charge 1. One of these will be dropped once the investigation is completed.

I believe this is backward -- it was explained that the felony murder charge/theory is about a homicide that occurs during the commission of a robbery, not the other way around.

whether this a conflict also depends on how you read #2- did the neighbor see the truck exactly between 12:30 and 1pm, or did the neighbor "first see" the truck between 12:30 and 1pm? was it gone after 1 pm? I can see a witness saying "I saw the truck....oh, somewhere around 12:30, 1 pm....."

IIRC the neighbor left their own townhome sometime during that half hour timeframe, on the way out to their TG dinner celebration. Neighbor did not see PF's truck arrive or leave, only saw that it was there at the time they (neighbor) left their own home, which they estimated as being between 12:30 and 1pm.

Something else in the timeline: in order for the phone to ping in Idaho at 5:13 PM, KK would have had to leave Colorado very early that morning - meaning she wasn't available for any cleanup or dump chores.

I don't think we know which day any potential cleanup took place? No reason it had to be on the 25th.

 

[Noharg]

Local Woodland Park newspaper:

Flurry Of Rumors Surround Search For Body of Kelsey Berreth | The Mountain Jackpot News

"On the other side of the legal spectrum, local residents who claim to have sat behind bars with Frazee say that he swears by his innocence. Frazee has maintained he didn’t play any role in his fiance’s disappearance.

Rumors circulating the small community say that one of the items that was removed from the waste transfer station in Divide after Frazee was seen dumping some trash there, including an electric saw. Some also think that the backhoes brought onto Frazee’s property during the search warrant of the 35-acre ranch, where he lived with his mother, were aimed at removing the septic tank on his property for possible clues."

More at link

This article states that he met KB at Safeway. Did I miss this?

“Police say that Frazee, who was the father of Berreth’s 15-month-old daughter, was the last person to see Berreth alive on that Thanksgiving Day, when Frazee claimed that he met Berreth at the Safeway store with their daughter Kaylee.”


ETA quote

 

[24Brix]

Looking at this request for discovery alone, without the rumors of her entering a plea on 2/8, it might appear they’re preparing for trial on the charge. But I think it’s more likely her attorney is just fulfilling her right to discovery. She is very obviously going to be a prosecution witness. The summons and complaint outlines the single charge, which is likely pled down, and the entry of appearance is just her attorney formally announcing that she is the attorney of record. I think it’s more likely that they just want everything the DA has that the defendant is entitled to.

I’m still a page or two short of being completely caught up on this thread but the Discovery Demand doc does seem to imply the existence of a witness to the tampering act KK is accused of. (One example below, BBM.)

I’m wondering if this is just additional conversations with BFF we haven’t been privy to or if it implies that there is indeed a 3rd party involved that we don’t yet know about. Hmmm...

“In the instant case, almost every version of the Accuser's statement has been contradicted by another version. This leaves every statement made to anyone worthy of impeachment.”

https://www.courts.state.co.us/user...ofinterest/2019CR17/D-02 Discovery Demand.pdf

 

[1mtroyal]

@PommyMommy While we wait for the reporter to comment,,, I spent a good part of yesterday explaining the narrow charges and almost had a heartattack reading "accomplice" literally.

If she disposed of the phone/sent the texts, she was helping in the commission of the murder, to some people. The law sometimes does not use the Webster's Dictionary for writing laws. For example, if you are riding in a riding lawn mower down the highway, the riding lawn mower is not a motor vehicle in the eyes of the law, but is a motor vehicle according to common sense.

 

[PrairieWind]

KK's defense attorney may be just being very thorough and cautious, but I'm getting the impression that this isn't a sewn up plea deal. That is a fairly aggressive and specific discovery demand.

 

[NoeticSoul]

I’m still a page or two short of being completely caught up on this thread but the Discovery Demand doc does seem to imply the existence of a witness to the tampering act KK is accused of. (One example below, BBM.)

I’m wondering if this is just additional conversations with BFF we haven’t been privy to or if it implies that there is indeed a 3rd party involved that we don’t yet know about. Hmmm...

“In the instant case, almost every version of the Accuser's statement has been contradicted by another version. This leaves every statement made to anyone worthy of impeachment.”

https://www.courts.state.co.us/userfiles/file/Court_Probation/04th_Judicial_District/Teller/caseofinterest/2019CR17/D-02 Discovery Demand.pdf

I wonder if PF is one of the contradicting versions? Hmm

 

[ajaylee]

Apologies to all - I must be losing my memory, and I have been following this off and on since the early reports.

Someone please remind me: how did LE get on to KK in the first place?

I'm sure her number was on PF's phone, along with a lot of other people's numbers, but so what? To date, I haven't seen any reports that anyone witnessed KK in Colorado at any time over the Thanksgiving weekend.

It seems like a stretch to think that the phone was planted where it might have been 'lost' if KB was driving from Colorado to her grandmother's for a surprise visit, but somehow the authorities notice that KK lives relatively close by.

 

[Dave F.]

Initially, if she admitted to having the victim's property that was present at a crime scene, I would have arrested her.

That's probably a good indication that is NOT what she admitted then, isn't it? IMO

 

[CarolinePolly]

Apologies to all - I must be losing my memory, and I have been following this off and on since the early reports.

Someone please remind me: how did LE get on to KK in the first place?

I'm sure her number was on PF's phone, along with a lot of other people's numbers, but so what? To date, I haven't seen any reports that anyone witnessed KK in Colorado at any time over the Thanksgiving weekend.

It seems like a stretch to think that the phone was planted where it might have been 'lost' if KB was driving from Colorado to her grandmother's for a surprise visit, but somehow the authorities notice that KK lives relatively close by.

OK maybe we don’t have a witness but We have the interviews with the R’s.
Lol

 

[ajaylee]

OK maybe we don’t have a witness but We have the interviews with the R’s.
‍

I thought there were rumors about KK before the R's interview.

 

[dkryder]

i keep thinking about the "Proof evident, presumption great" burden that the DA needs to meet in keeping the judge from granting bail at PF prelim hearing on 2/19/19. i have my fingers crossed that KK testimony is part of that and it will be important that she in some fashion admits to some of her involvement but most of all helps establish that in fact PF did do this crime. for KK to show up this friday and basically say "Huh?" to the charge could be a blow to the prosecution, IMO. it could also be a blow to KK since the prosecution would probably no longer treat her with kid gloves, so to speak. i just hope that something that very strongly points to PF comes out of this friday hearing. fingers crossed. as usual, MOO.

 

[ajaylee]

Interesting. There were no reports or video of LE hauling away or removing a big septic tank though. It would be pretty hard to miss! It's a very remote area. eta Sounds like they are reporting on Facebook rumors. moo

I can't think of any reason for hauling away a septic tank. If they did suspect there was evidence inside, I would have expected them to pump it out. Pumping it out is a routine part of septic tank maintenance.

That said, the pump trucks aren't small, obviously, so I think if they'd pumpted the septic tank it would have been reported.

 

[Hatfield]

Apologies to all - I must be losing my memory, and I have been following this off and on since the early reports.

Someone please remind me: how did LE get on to KK in the first place?

I'm sure her number was on PF's phone, along with a lot of other people's numbers, but so what? To date, I haven't seen any reports that anyone witnessed KK in Colorado at any time over the Thanksgiving weekend.

It seems like a stretch to think that the phone was planted where it might have been 'lost' if KB was driving from Colorado to her grandmother's for a surprise visit, but somehow the authorities notice that KK lives relatively close by.

IMO
We dont know for sure how LE made the actual tie to KK but we do know they knew of the infamous mysterious "ping" in Idaho of KB's phone.

LE even went as far as calling it a possible "false ping" at first, which none of us believed it was false.

So LE knew there was a ping there and so I am sure they were looking to see if anyone PF knew lived in the area and you could be right that PF's own Cell Phone may have had direct communication with KK. So bingo, there is how LE may have focused on her.

 

[1mtroyal]

Apologies to all - I must be losing my memory, and I have been following this off and on since the early reports.

Someone please remind me: how did LE get on to KK in the first place?

I'm sure her number was on PF's phone, along with a lot of other people's numbers, but so what? To date, I haven't seen any reports that anyone witnessed KK in Colorado at any time over the Thanksgiving weekend.

It seems like a stretch to think that the phone was planted where it might have been 'lost' if KB was driving from Colorado to her grandmother's for a surprise visit, but somehow the authorities notice that KK lives relatively close by.

It is my understanding that the attorney who had a secretary who was KKL's best friend saw her mother's plea that someone knows something and the attorney or his wife told KKL that if she (KKL) was not going to the police, they were going to the police. I think they did go to the police.

 

[Tippy Lynn]

Apologies to all - I must be losing my memory, and I have been following this off and on since the early reports.

Someone please remind me: how did LE get on to KK in the first place?

I'm sure her number was on PF's phone, along with a lot of other people's numbers, but so what? To date, I haven't seen any reports that anyone witnessed KK in Colorado at any time over the Thanksgiving weekend.

It seems like a stretch to think that the phone was planted where it might have been 'lost' if KB was driving from Colorado to her grandmother's for a surprise visit, but somehow the authorities notice that KK lives relatively close by.

OK maybe we don’t have a witness but We have the interviews with the R’s.
Lol

I thought there were rumors about KK before the R's interview.

According to my timeline the search warrant for the Frazee Property was on Friday, December 14th and Twin Falls law enforcement was requested to help on Saturday, December 15th. A week later, on Saturday December 22nd Twin Falls, ID Police Department issued a statement that they are working with CBI and FBI to prepare and serve several search warrants, including processing items of possible evidence with the assistance of the Twin Falls County and Twin Falls Evidence Technicians.

ETA: IMO the search warrant at the Frazee property on the 14th and KB's phone pinging in ID is what led LE to look at KK.