Found Deceased CO - Shanann Watts (34), Celeste"Cece" (3) and Bella (4), Frederick, 13 Aug 2018 *Arrest* #23

[Mosaic]

Speaking of fake FB happy family photos and videos reminded me of Louise and David Turpin the monsters here in CA that tortured, starved, abused and imprisoned their 13 children. LT sisters didn’t even know that was happening. That’s why I take FB posts with a grain of salt you don’t know false from fact.

Whiteorchids: FakeBook, that's how I call it; way before this case. But, maybe I'm too old fashioned. Lol

 

[dixiegirl1035]

Add in the thought of child support until each is 18 y/o. That may or may not have been discussed if CW/SW discussed a divorce, but I think he would have at least thought about it. For two children -- part of his future earnings. A divorce attorney would certainly put that on the table -- and it can affect visitation privileges.

@Bill Carson iirc said that if it went to court, that no one could use what was discussed with the HIRED divorce lawyers. I guess the only thing they could bring into evidence, is any paperwork they found of divorce proceedings or meeting with divorce attorneys?

That just sounds so strange to me, although I do understand confidentiality, if it is key in a case as far as motive. But I guess the law is the law.

 

[Starkville]

I'm one of the few (I think) who don't think that's related, just kids play and creepy in hindsight. I taught preschool for a long time--putting a cover over the head of a doll when "tucking in" isn't unusual in my years of experience.

I am not even making this up: my daughter’s friend, who’s here on a play date just put a throw blanket over my lap and said she’s tucking me in. As I’m reading this thread!

ETA: They’re not toddlers, she’s 8. But yes, they still play that way.

 

[Nikynoo]

That brings up a good question - if you're in a married partnership and the husband does have sperm frozen somewhere, do both parties need to sign a consent to "use it" in the future?

in the UK, you need the donors consent

 

[cottonweaver]

welcome @Colorado303 and @Mrspratcher.

Colorado , can you give us just a vague/general idea of how long you have known CW or SW (or both) . I'm not looking for dates or anything too specific as I do respect the sensitivity & privacy issues.

Mrs Pratcher, can you let us know which field you worked or work in so I can know what to ask. I know every other WS lawyer's field , as they told us

TIA

 

[borndem]

Yes, demeanor is very 'chill' and 'relaxed'. There's a tinge of nervousness but there's also a sense of calm composure.

I think he was very confident in his ability to fool people...

Years of experience hiding his colors. IMO

bbm
Many of us can remember how calm and confident Ted Bundy was when he was pulled by LF for a traffic problem, or during an interview with LE, etc. He was glib, confident, in control of the situation (in his mind, anyway), etc., etc. Classic signs of sociopathy and Narcissism.
That was what I saw from CW on that interview. But -- he lacked the insight to know how he should have looked/acted. If/when the jury sees that interview, it should paint a picture for them, and it should further indicate that he was totally at ease with what had just occurred. Guilty, guilty, guilty, IMO.

 

[pocketaccent]

Oh really? I thought he saw one blue (from strangulation), the other being strangled so he strangled her (SW).

Yes, that's it. He saw Bella blue. Assumed from strangulation. Could be from another cause, IMO.
LE also never said all 3 were strangled.

 

[MassGuy]

I don't know who asked for a separation first and who resisted.

IMO,
If CW is the one who asked first, then it's less likely he premeditated the murders.

If SW is the one who wanted the separation, he likely planned the murders.

It makes far more sense to me that if someone did ask for a separation, it was Shanann.

I don’t buy his story for a minute, so if was him who wanted a separation or divorce, the killings don’t make sense to me.

I think that she may have asked, and he said no. Violently.

 

[kkdj]

The moreI think about it, I do think CW told the order of their deaths. That points to SW being last.
Bella, CeeCee, Shannan.

 

[Colorado303]

welcome @Colorado303 and @Mrspratcher.

Colorado , can you give us just a vague/general idea of how long you have known CW ( I'm not looking for dates or anything too specific as I do respect the sensitivity & privacy issues. )

Mrs Pratcher, can you let us know which field you worked or work in so I can know what to ask. I know every other WS lawyer's field , as they told us

TIA

I’ve known SW for about a year.

 

[kkdj]

Yes, that's it. He saw Bella blue. Assumed from strangulation. Could be from another cause, IMO.
LE also never said all 3 were strangled.

I'll bet manner of death will be the same for all 3.

 

[Davia18]

I’ve known SW for about a year.

Sorry for your loss Colorado303.
I'm going to assume you knew the girls also.
Prayers to you.

 

[MassGuy]

I’ve known SW for about a year.

Sorry if you’ve already answered this, but did you know her through work?

 

[gitana1]

Exactly. I wouldn't be surprised if he dosed them first.
Wouldn't the mom scream?

Well if he put his hands around her neck and began squeezing as she lay in bed asleep, I don't think she'd have the chance to scream. Or if he just came at her suddenly.

But this has me thinking. And re-thinking certain, possible scenarios. He took the bedding off the master bedroom bed, right? Which suggests she may have been in it when he strangled her, because why else remove the pillow cases and the sheets and try to hide them? He seemed concerned about getting rid of any possible evidence that he murdered his wife.

Unless that is where he killed the girls, who may have been sleeping in mommy and daddy's bed? But otherwise, that removal of the bedding, coupled with no neighbor hearing screaming suggests she may have come home, checked on the babies and then gone to bed before he killed everyone. So it's possible he did kill them second.

 

[MsBetsy]

I disagree. I'm going to assume we both have excellent related credentials (I do), but I'm not going to argue, just disagree. Different opinions.

ETA: I don't disagree with all of that. Just, the last bit Kids' play is meaningful much of the time, for certain. I personally don't think there was anything nefarious in this particular incident (I for certain don't think CW did it), but that's just my own opinion based on experience and education and yours may vary, which is fine, of course)

I'm not sure where this originated from, but I do agree that play is not necessarily therapy for kids and their actions don't always signal abuse. Certainly covering up a dolls head is not a sign of abuse. I've seen kids pound the heck out of their action figures and it may not necessarily mean anything other than they are a little aggressive. Children's play is their " job" , that's what they do. They could be emulating something they saw on TV. Play therapy is an entirely different thing. Jmo

 

[kkdj]

I’ve known SW for about a year.

Thank you. Were you around SW and CW and the girls where you could form an opinion of their relationship(s)?

 

[cottonweaver]

I’ve known SW for about a year.

I just edited my post to add that you may be a SW friend. Thanks.
Did you know her mainly through work?

 

[dixiegirl1035]

As promised, I read “Two Face: The Man Underneath Christopher Watts” by Nick van der Leek. It’s free on Kindle Unlimited and $3.99 if you don’t have it.

Fortunately I didn’t have to pay for it, as I can think of better ways to spend $3.99 (like buying 4 packs of gum and chewing them all at once).

The book presents the timeline and evidence, as we know it. From there, the author speculates as to C.W.’s motive, how the crime occurred, and analyzes some of the major players.

He recounts a premeditated scenario, where C.W. is lying in wait for Shanann as she returns home that fateful night.

He speculates that the kids were killed first, because cadaver dogs were heard barking during CW’s interview with the media. The logic is that cadaver dogs bark when they get a hit, they would only get a hit if there was the scent of decomposition, so the kids must have been killed before Shanann arrived home.

As for motive, the author says that their entire life was a facade, both were living a lie (not happy), and financial problems were compounding their struggles.

Chris was overshadowed by Shanann and was losing his identity. The prospect of another child was too much to handle, and Chris felt that he was in too deep.

He speculates that Shanann and the kids returning to North Carolina, was a trial separation of sorts.

The decrease in Facebook videos leading up to the murders, is a sign of a marriage that is no longer a viable one.

*He makes an interesting point when he says that the kids may have been placed in different tanks, because the oil levels would have triggered a sensor if they deviated too much.

Some tid bits:

Author blasts Thrive for isolating Shanann from her real friends. People get sick of all the posts, and the only friends left were people within the “Thrive Cult.”

Her entire life was revolves around this MLM company, and her Facebook posts paint a picture that is in direct conflict with the truth. She is “faking it, until she makes it.”

He blasts fellow Thrivers for using her death to promote themselves, all of them changing their Facebook profile photos, to make themselves the center of attention.

*He cites a 2013 family annihilator study from the Harvard Journal of Criminal Justice. All were loving husbands and good fathers. The motives generally included family breakup, financial problems, and greed (killing his family would solve these problems).

The reason I don’t think this book is worthwhile, is because it does exactly what we do on here. We use the evidence and timeline to build a narrative in regards to what we think happened.

There’s just not a lot here, and his scenario of this being quite premeditated, is contingent on some barking dogs. It’s definitely plausible, but just too flimsy for me.

Read his blog, not his book, unless you have Kindle Unlimited.

Something he discussed, which we I don't think have here, is that when you get with these multi-level marketing folks, everything is about that again and again with very long post. The old friends turn off the feed to that person because they are overwhelmed and don't want to see it anymore. That's exactly what I did.

I have a very very close family member who has 1400 or more people down line in multi-level marketing. This person, I turned off the feed even though it is a family member. Because I was just tired of so much stuff for her multi-level marketing.

So ....I have no idea what is going on with their family unless I specifically search it out because another family member asked me about something and I have to look at it.

 

[pocketaccent]

The moreI think about it, I do think CW told the order of their deaths. That points to SW being last.
Bella, CeeCee, Shannan.

That's my speculation too. Bella killed first (maybe didn't really mean to) and Celeste strangled (on purpose) prior to SW's arrival.

 

[MassGuy]

Well if he put his hands around her neck and began squeezing as she lay in bed asleep, I don't think she'd have the chance to scream. Or if he just came at her suddenly.

But this has me thinking. And re-thinking certain, possible scenarios. He took the bedding off the master bedroom bed, right? Which suggests she may have been in it when he strangled her, because why else remove the pillow cases and the sheets and try to hide them? He seemed concerned about getting rid of any possible evidence that he murdered his wife.

Unless that is where he killed the girls, who may have been sleeping in mommy and daddy's bed? But otherwise, that removal of the bedding, coupled with no neighbor hearing screaming suggests she may have come home, checked on the babies and then gone to bed before he killed everyone. So it's possible he did kill them second.

I agree. Stripping the bed sounds like an effort to conceal evidence. Perhaps she did go to bed, and she struggled during the strangulation. This kids likely wouldn’t show signs of a struggle, so there wouldn’t be a reason to strip their beds.

Another possibility, and one that I don’t lean towards, is that he killed the kids first, perhaps in the master bedroom. If they were laying there for a while, he’d want the beds stripped to hide evidence of decomposition.

He would have then killed Shanann as she walked in the door. I don’t like this theory because I think this crime was based on rage, and I’d expect evidence of a struggle downstairs.