Found Deceased CO - Shanann Watts (34), Celeste"Cece" (3) and Bella (4), Frederick, 13 Aug 2018 *Arrest* #29

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It is interesting that if people like me point out things we find disturbing about her comments and parenting, it is assumed that we are defending CW and saying that we feel that he then has the right to kill her.

I am examing the behavior and why it may have affected him. He seemed to be very subserviant. If the tables were turned and these things were said and done to a woman, how would people respond?

Saying that he was a full grown man and should take control of his life to me is the same as telling a woman she is full grown and she should take care of her life.

I think we have all seen men who are belittled by their wives. I don’t think most murder. What led CW to murder is something really strange within him .He lived for 34 years apparently never showing to anyone that he is filled with rage, is a liar, and apparently has no conscience.

I am still awestruck that no one has ever commented that he is a liar. I cannot believe that no one saw anything that indicated that things were not ok.

But people have their own busy stressful lives so they probably do not think too much of other’s lives. As my husband says, “Everyone’s lives are filled with their lives.”
 
@gitana1 Do you have an idea as to why the defense has not received a copy of the coroner's report yet per their filing today? Is that unusual? Or just a matter of simple process and normal timing?

Trying to figure out if it really is being delayed or if the defense is exploiting that the public doesn't know the process and timeline in conveying that info to the defense and insinuating it is being withheld. Hope that makes sense.
 
Nikynoo said:
That's great! Thank you. Could you explain the DA's determination please?
Click to expand...

Basically they looked at the evidence they had at that time and felt there was probable cause for the charges. In Colorado, apparently, most cases do NOT go before a grand jury. The DA decides if there is probable cause rather than the GJ.

I know they used one in the JBR case years back. But what I found when researching this recently, from a criminal defense attorney site, was that it is more typically only certain cases:

"In those cases that are of public importance, involve public corruption or where witnesses need to be protected, a grand jury can be used."
Colorado Criminal Law – How Colorado Grand Juries Work – From the Inside

From what I've seen, grand juries are sometimes also used in various states when the DA is not sure about probable cause.
 
Johnny1181 said:
@gitana1 Do you have an idea as to why the defense has not received a copy of the coroner's report yet per their filing today? Is that unusual? Or just a matter of simple process and normal timing?

Trying to figure out if it really is being delayed or if the defense is exploiting that the public doesn't know the process and timeline in conveying that info to the defense and insinuating it is being withheld. Hope that makes sense.
Click to expand...

It is very common and a source of constant aggravation to defense counsel across the country.

They may be waiting on some final things. The defense here suggests it is complete but unwarranted delay.

That's possible. The longer the state can keep back discovery, the better for them. I'm not saying that it is purposeful here but it does occur. It's tactic.
 
Nikynoo said:
I think that explains it!
Click to expand...
changed my mind!

@gitana1 am I correct in that if probable cause is not found for some (or all, unlikely I know) of the charges, the prosecution has the option to submit to the Grand Jury? Did I read this correctly? Also, is it correct that this Judge will not hear the trial? Thank you!

Colorado Rules of Criminal Procedure - JD Porter LLC

at 4(IV)

'If from the evidence it appears to the county court that there is not probable cause to believe that any or all of the offenses charged were committed by the defendant, the county court shall dismiss those counts from the complaint and, if all counts are dismissed, discharge the defendant. Upon a finding of no probable cause, the prosecution may appeal pursuant to Rule 5(a)(4)(V), file a direct information pursuant to Rule 5(a)(4)(VI) charging the same offense(s), or submit the matter to a grand jury, but may not file a subsequent felony complaint charging the same offenses.'
 
human said:
It is interesting that if people like me point out things we find disturbing about hee comments and parenting, it is assumed that we are defending CW and saying that we feel that he then has the right to kill her.

I am examing the behavior and why it may have affected him. He seemed to be very subserviant. If the tables were turned and these things were said and done to a woman, how would people respond?

Saying that he was a full grown man and should take control of his life to me is the same as telling a woman she is full grown and she should take care of her life.

I think we have all seen men who are belittled by their wives. I don’t think most murder. What led CW to murder is something really strange within him .He lived for 34 years apparently never showing to anyone that he is filled with rage, is a liar, and apparently has no conscience.

I am still awestruck that no one has ever commented that he is a liar. I cannot believe that no one saw anything that indicated that things were not ok.

But people have their own busy stressful lives so they probably do not think too much of other’s lives. As my husband says, “Everyone’s lives are filled with their lives.”
Click to expand...
Your husband is right! Except for the nosy neighbors habitually watching their Ring videos. ;) But generally yes, people are more tangled up in their own lives.
 
katydid23 said:
Our VI said she had never even seen him get angry. That was a red flag for me.
Click to expand...
Yes, he may have been putting on a nice guy act for the rest of the world. Its common in domestic abuse cases for the abuser to act nicely towards everyone else but behind closed doors he is violent towards the spouse. Then everyone says how nice he was and wouldn't harm a fly so he must have been provoked. Kind of like the pitbull defense?
 
I’m not concerned at all about LE having enough evidence to be able to tie CW to the oil field and the disposal of the bodies and the killing of SW. What we need to know is if there is enough (and tight) evidence to tie him to the murder of the children. I assume there is, and they just know more than we do. Let’s hope.
 
human said:
It is interesting that if people like me point out things we find disturbing about her comments and parenting, it is assumed that we are defending CW and saying that we feel that he then has the right to kill her.

I am examing the behavior and why it may have affected him. He seemed to be very subserviant. If the tables were turned and these things were said and done to a woman, how would people respond?

Saying that he was a full grown man and should take control of his life to me is the same as telling a woman she is full grown and she should take care of her life.

I think we have all seen men who are belittled by their wives. I don’t think most murder. What led CW to murder is something really strange within him .He lived for 34 years apparently never showing to anyone that he is filled with rage, is a liar, and apparently has no conscience.

I am still awestruck that no one has ever commented that he is a liar. I cannot believe that no one saw anything that indicated that things were not ok.

But people have their own busy stressful lives so they probably do not think too much of other’s lives. As my husband says, “Everyone’s lives are filled with their lives.”
Click to expand...

With or without people in his life commenting he was a liar, he has shown himself to be. He was having an affair. That entails usually a lot of lying. He preened for the cameras smiling in his shirt all the while acting as if he didn't know what truly happened to Bella, CeCe, Nico and Shanann. When he clearly knew exactly where those victims were. He told NUA per her statements, the babies and Shanann were at a play date. There are a lot of examples of him proving himself to be a liar.

Men can be victims of DV. I have not seen DV in victim Shanann's SM posts.

Sometimes liars are really good liars... and people are truly fooled.

JMO
 
human said:
It is interesting that if people like me point out things we find disturbing about her comments and parenting, it is assumed that we are defending CW and saying that we feel that he then has the right to kill her.

I am examing the behavior and why it may have affected him. He seemed to be very subserviant. If the tables were turned and these things were said and done to a woman, how would people respond?

Saying that he was a full grown man and should take control of his life to me is the same as telling a woman she is full grown and she should take care of her life.

I think we have all seen men who are belittled by their wives. I don’t think most murder. What led CW to murder is something really strange within him .He lived for 34 years apparently never showing to anyone that he is filled with rage, is a liar, and apparently has no conscience.

I am still awestruck that no one has ever commented that he is a liar. I cannot believe that no one saw anything that indicated that things were not ok.

But people have their own busy stressful lives so they probably do not think too much of other’s lives. As my husband says, “Everyone’s lives are filled with their lives.”
Click to expand...

I am still trying to understand how he was 'belittled.' I watched the Santa tape again. She was directing the video so she told Santa where to sit and what was going on, so they could make the video. I didn't see it as belittling.

He was supposed to come back in as Santa, and bring the phone, to take pix with. He left it on the car in the garage. MISTAKE on his part. So as she is still live streaming, she says, with a big smile, obviously joking, 'he doesn't listen' grumble grumble...., is that seriously considered 'belittling' someone?

I think my husband listens to about half of what I say to him, and I tell him that too, but he doesn't feel belittled by that...he is proud of it, lol... he tells me that after 37 yrs, I'm lucky he listens to half...
 
nwmouse said:
Yes, he may have been putting on a nice guy act for the rest of the world. Its common in domestic abuse cases for the abuser to act nicely towards everyone else but behind closed doors he is violent towards the spouse. Then everyone says how nice he was and wouldn't harm a fly so he must have been provoked. Kind of like the pitbull defense?
Click to expand...
Also, if he is a true sociopath, he’d be especially adept at putting on a mask in public.

He appears to care very much about his image, and this would motivate him to behave a certain way when other people are around.
 
human said:
It is interesting that if people like me point out things we find disturbing about her comments and parenting, it is assumed that we are defending CW and saying that we feel that he then has the right to kill her.

I am examing the behavior and why it may have affected him. He seemed to be very subserviant. If the tables were turned and these things were said and done to a woman, how would people respond?

Saying that he was a full grown man and should take control of his life to me is the same as telling a woman she is full grown and she should take care of her life.

I think we have all seen men who are belittled by their wives. I don’t think most murder. What led CW to murder is something really strange within him .He lived for 34 years apparently never showing to anyone that he is filled with rage, is a liar, and apparently has no conscience.

I am still awestruck that no one has ever commented that he is a liar. I cannot believe that no one saw anything that indicated that things were not ok.

But people have their own busy stressful lives so they probably do not think too much of other’s lives. As my husband says, “Everyone’s lives are filled with their lives.”
Click to expand...
Thank you for such a great post! I wonder if CW has siblings (cannot find mention of them online) and if they will be called to the stand as witnesses on his marriage, character etc. He has been outed for his lies here on WS and I think he will be outed on the witness stand as well. Wonder if he'll crack under pressure.
 
kizzykat said:
I just read the Motion for Protective Order at the link that Mo Thuairim just posted at the end of the last thread. The PO refers to defendant as "she".
Colorado Judicial Branch

"The Defendant does not wish to be interviewed, contacted or questioned unless her
attorney is present.The Defendant wishes all of her contacts with state agents to take place
through her legal counsel."
Defendant wishes to exercise both her right to silence (and against self-incrimination) and her
right to counsel under the federal and state constitution."

Apologies if this has been discussed, I've tried to keep up, but did I miss something? Who is "she"?
Edit: trying to fix bad link: https://www.courts.state.co.us/userfiles/file/Court_Probation/19th_Judicial_District/caseofinterest/2018CR2003/001/(3) MOTION FOR PROTECTIVE ORDER.pdf
Click to expand...
Whaaa? What in the world does that mean? The AP?
I am, again, 4 pages behind.
So I will most likely be reading the answers when I reach the end. Lol o_O
Thanks in advance for the answers. :)
 
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