GUILTY CO - Shanann Watts (34), Celeste"Cece" (3) and Bella (4), Frederick, 13 Aug 2018 *CW LWOP* #63

[stg]

Friday, December 7 @ 8pm ET
View attachment 158258

Hm. That’s earlier than usual for my central time zone. I wonder if it is different out east. My guide on the TV still shows 9 central.

 

[LittleFleurDeLys]

Sorry if this has been answered/discussed.....I'm listening to RW interview and having a hard time understanding him. I've tried listening to this part twice but what is this story he's telling about Power Ranger masks??

I need to admit same goes for me! And I do not use English in my daily life - for me it's nearly impossible to understand them (applies to the other interview videos as well) . Are there any transcripts available?

 

[BrownRice]

I don't have an AppleWatch, but I have a FitBit I wear to bed most nights (tracks sleep, etc...) I wonder if AppleWatches do that, because if so, maybe she would have been wearing it.

I have an Apple Watch. I charge it every night. I just got a new one and I could probably go 2 days without charging it (huge upgrade from previous models where you’d never be able to do that). But I think most people charge every night.

 

[NanZDrew]

Thanks for your insights, and in this case, you are right, if finances were a motive, which have not been proven, it seems wanting to start fresh with the other woman was a motive too. Finances have been a motive in some familial killings though, haven’t they?

I am just still not a fan of the family court system, having been locked in it for as long as I have. It is my least favorite place to be on the face of this earth, because it so adversarial and sad. I cannot wait until it is over. I completely respect the attorneys and judges, had both in my family lineage, but the money I have had to spend to stay a father to those two kids is just ridiculous. It cost me over $3000 just to cease the child support for my eldest child this spring and determine my college contribution. At least I have usually won in court when I was respondant, so my rights were protected. I know you are an attorney, and probably have a different view than I, but those are my views as a father after a divorce. Still not defending CW in any form or fashion.

I can relate to what you are saying. There are so many deadbeat dads that often the courts seem to expect that all dads are deadbeats. It is very difficult raising two families and expensive as well. Blending families is SO hard. I have seen some men get lower paying jobs to avoid support, and, on the otherhand, seen some women let their kids do without so they can spend all the child support on a super expensive vehicle. It is just a hard situation. I applaud you for taking care of your kids and staying in their lives.

 

[CarolynV]

Has the terabyte been released?

 

[stg]

I have an Apple Watch. I charge it every night. I just got a new one and I could probably go 2 days without charging it (huge upgrade from previous models where you’d never be able to do that). But I think most people charge every night.

I have the AW3, and I only have to charge it every other night as long as I turn it off the other night to sleep. It has great battery life.

 

[kay74]

He’s the white haired gentleman.

No that's the detective isn't it?

 

[BrownRice]

No that's the detective isn't it?

No. Older man with white hair and blue shirt is dad.

 

[curiouschat]

I ciukdnt hear that either. It was while complaining about Shanann so I figured it had to do with all the grandkids.

Yeah I'm not at all sure I caught it all but I think it was that she forgot to bring the masks for the party and drove all the way back for them (along with the kids I guess?) which was 3 hours each way? He may not have it right and I may not even have what he was saying right, but my impression is that she was particular about things and it was the sort of thing that Chris's family thought was unbalanced about her?

 

[esayer]

I agree. I am not defending CW at all, but as a father who was paying over $2000 a month in child support for two children up until just this spring, when my oldest graduated from high school and my support for that child ended (though I am still contributing $15k a year to college for her), it is a huge drain on finances, especially when trying to raise a second family like I have with my second wife. It has been very hard on my second wife too, because it hurts our kids together, losing all that money. The percentages paid by state statute were ridiculous compared with what I would actually have spent on those kids if they still lived with me full time. My attorneys said as much. I also spent tens of thousands to my attorneys as my first wife and I kept ending up in court over and over again over issues involving the children. Thankfully, my second wife and I now live a lifestyle that would be considered upper middle class, and we have always been able to provide for all our children, but it was very hard for many years. It is still hard to think about how much better we would be financially if that support was not there. But, the end is in sight, and I remind myself that I supported my children as the law required.

Thankfully, my state recently and finally got on board with most other states and started considering both parents’ incomes in calculating support, so my amount for the remaining child is now lower than it was under the old statutes. I only have a year and a half of support left after paying for 14.5 years. I want to support my kids, no doubt about it, and I always have, but I do not like the family court system, because it punishes loving fathers too harshly. It is horrible when some fathers decide to annihilate their families just to avoid this hardship. This might be a controversial statement, but the court system has to the take some of the responsibility for this. No offense to any of our attorneys here. I can honestly say, though, I never once had any thoughts of hurting my children or my first wife in any way, and especially not to escape paying support. This case is devastating beyond belief. CW is a monster.

Did your first wife make the same as you? Did you leave her for another gal? Those things also factor in. People should have to pay if they leave or ruin the marriage, especially when the dad leaves and he makes all the money. but if the wife makes more than the hubby, she pays CS if they don't live with her. A lot of couples make the same so they don't pay each other. It makes sense if one parent is doing all the work and the kids are living with them.

 

[NanZDrew]

I agree. Beautiful house, but I cannot believe they bought it as their first home together, and before the kids were even born. If they had the income to afford it, I would get it, but they did not at any point from the info we have. They clearly had expensive taste in everything, and I think it was both of them, honestly.

I think it was both of them. SW's house in NC was even prettier in my opinion. Seems most people in the area that were their age were also living the dream.

 

[kay74]

No. Older man with white hair and blue shirt is dad.

Thanks!

 

[Jessthinkin]

Also, I was creeped out by how CW looks at his own hands.

I missed that! Yes, creepy for sure... :/

 

[PommyMommy]

Jace Larson Denver7 on Twitter
New Chris Watts information. Convicted murderer Chris Watts has been moved from a Colorado prison to another prison out of state. Victims’ families -- who requested to be notified -- have been notified. Location has not been identified publically. Move made for safety.

9:44 PM - 3 Dec 2018

 

[stg]

I can relate to what you are saying. There are so many deadbeat dads that often the courts seem to expect that all dads are deadbeats. It is very difficult raising two families and expensive as well. Blending families is SO hard. I have seen some men get lower paying jobs to avoid support, and, on the otherhand, seen some women let their kids do without so they can spend all the child support on a super expensive vehicle. It is just a hard situation. I applaud you for taking care of your kids and staying in their lives.

Thank you! Their mom tried her darndest to lessen their time with me over and over, for no good reason, but I always won, thankfully. My second wife is a saint to put up with the garbage we have faced because of my first marriage. I don’t think many women would have stuck it out like she has, and she agrees. lol It has gotten a lot more peaceful in the last couple years, thankfully, now that the kids from my first marriage are older and both at schools in other states. I don’t have to talk with their mom much these days.

 

[scdiv]

What a vile family. Why the heck would they think CW did all the housework and childcare? Is it possibly because they visited while SW was in a highrisk pregnancy with CeCe and SW was restricted from doing normal activity for health reasons? CW had to go to work during the day. He wasn't home taking care of the kids. IIRC, the kids only went to school 2 days week until this year. SW worked full time too but her job was flexible so she stayed home to take care of the kids and clean the house-- not CW. SW also paid their bills/balanced their books. When she came back from NC, CW hadn't even opened their mail from 6 weeks. While she was in NC she had to send him the registration renewal to put in the Lexus-- which means she took care of those types of things too. SW had to clean the entire house when she got home from NC because CW didn't bother for 5 weeks while he dallied with his mistress. SW did the cooking and cleaning and most of the grocery shopping too from what I saw.

What a ridiculous statement to say SW didn't do housework! She was known for her organizational skills-- all her friends called her extremely neat and OCD about cleaning. CW didn't know how to cook much either IMO. SW left him 5 weeks worth of freezer meals so he wouldn't starve or waste money eating out for every meal. There was one time where SW left instructions for him on how to cook a roast and he didn't follow them. It was a double pack from Costco and he was supposed to cook one and put the other in the freezer for another meal. CW stacked the two roasts on top of one another and proceeded to try to cook them like that. He's lucky SW had a great sense of humor and thought it was hilarious-- she took a picture of the meat and put it on fb. In contrast to that, SW often made videos of herself cooking things or baking things and she liked to get her girls involved in the kitchen too.

I think CW only kept the girls occupied if she was trying to make a Thrive product promotion video. In many videos you see him wander in and out of the background with CeCe-- but those videos are a small fraction of SW's day. This comment by his dad really upsets me for some reason. It's just such a petty thing to hate her for. It makes me wonder if CW was always telling his family he had to do everything.

MOO.

Agreed. And I think RW is very hostile about SW. Not that it makes it okay, but I bet his wife's favorite topic for years has been to vent about SW. "Shanann said this to me." "Shanann sits on her *advertiser censored* on the phone while Chris does all the housework." "Shanann makes up too many fake allergies for her daughters." And on and on ad nauseam. It's probably gotten to the point he can spit it out just the same. He didn't go to the wedding either. I don't think he's much better. But I still bet most of his comments and observations were all things his wife has b*tched about.

It was uncomfortable to watch. Especially with the neighbor standing so still. Made Chris look super sketchy.

In NUA's son video interview with the detective, he says that he was also there watching the camera video with the neighbor, CW, and police. He said that CW kept moving in front of the screen, trying to block the top portion of the tv screen with his body so that that cop wouldn't be able to see whenever he was on the tape. NUA's son said he also had to move his own body to try and see because CW was trying so hard to block. I haven't gone back to watch, but I heard him say that on the tape - police station with NUA and her son video interview #1.)

 

[kay74]

Jace Larson Denver7 on Twitter
New Chris Watts information. Convicted murderer Chris Watts has been moved from a Colorado prison to another prison out of state. Victims’ families -- who requested to be notified -- have been notified. Location has not been identified publically. Move made for safety.

9:44 PM - 3 Dec 2018

Doesn't look like the same person.

 

[LittleFleurDeLys]

A little different insight to the Watts family and the grandkids: My parents admitted to me that they were closer with my children than the rest of the grandkids. I lived the closest to my parents, and involved them in my kids lives, and my kids in my parent's lives. Two of my siblings lived out of state. My parents saw those grandkids typically 2 times a year. They didn't 'know' those grandkids. They cared about them, didn't want harm to come to them but it wasn't the same relationship as with my kids. Before my parents died, there was an argument with my sister in law and brother. They were living at my parents at the time and my sis in law is what I would imagine like Shannann. From the FB posts, to micromanaging, controlling, etc. I don't think that gives anyone a reason to murder someone! It isn't a personality that I would form a friendship with. I don't like people that manipulate. At any rate, my sis in law thought she was going to use the kids as leverage in getting my parents to do what she wanted. It didn't work. My parents refused to be treated like crap in their own home, and bend over backwards to appease others. My parents said kids were NOT to be used as if chess pieces in a game. They refused to be manipulated. They even stated if that meant the kids would not be a part of their lives, they were OK with that. So coming from that experience, I understand the Watts family.

It didn't give Chris the right to murder anyone! NO! It doesn't mean I hate Shannann, how silly, I didn't know her! Just a different perspective on the situation. Throughout the interviews, I could imagine my Mom sayign some of the same things about my sis in law. She was deeply hurt by how she and my Dad were treated.

I would say children should never be used to manipulate other people! And I can understand, if children are kept away from their grandparents (for various reasons) that it would be hard for both parties to establish a good and loving relationship. But in your case you are on the "bright sight", you have been told that your parents prefer your children. How would you feel if this wasn't the case and your brother's children would have been closer to them? I would be jealous, sad and hurt. I'm just honest..

And as you stated: we do not know Shannan. How can we compare her to other people, like your sister in law?

 

[esayer]

If they had 50/50 he wouldn't because their incomes were so similar. I do not believe there's a chance in hell A judge would have given him an equal time share of a newborn baby and two small children when he worked the hours that he did and Shanann worked from home.

There's a presumption in CO in favor of joint physical custody but as many people say it there is nothing in the code that states joint custody means an equal time share.

Further, even if an equal time share is the de facto default position for judges, circumstances can easily change that.

The best interests of the children come first in every state. Having a breastfeeding newborn in a daycare center all day while dad works even though mom is available to care for the baby, would rarely be in a child's best interests.

There's a booming child custody litigation business in CO for a reason.

That makes sense. I get itchy when I hear men complaining about CS when it makes sense in many ways to have the mom have most custody.

 

[wilsodh]

I'm still not sure he killed them first. Some things point to that and some don't. But if he did, can you imagine the absolute panic when her flight was delayed? He could get away with sending an old set of photos once. But the next morning? If she hadn't returned, how would he explain that he didn't have live girls to bring to school? Or take photos of at school? Or put on the phone with mama?

I am imagine him just flipping out and not being able to concentrate or plan anything after he found out the flight was delayed.

Yes, somehow it is easier for me to imagine that CW was killed first. Once the deed was done, CW was 'in for a penny, in for a pound'. In steeling himself to do the unthinkable, it was made somewhat easier having first crossed the line with SW.

One wonders about that final pre-murder conversation between NK and CW, around 9-11:00. While I don't think NK was a co-conspirator, I imagine that that final conversation was very influential in getting CW in the right state of mind for going through with the plan, a plan where the end justified the means, any means, in his warped mind.