CO - The Stalking and Mysterious Death of Morgan Ingram #3

[steff13]

I know that if I lived in a place that had an inordinate amount of suspicious deaths that I felt were'nt being addressed properly, I would notify the F.B.I.

The F.B.I. has jurisdictions for each area of the country and it is their job to handle issues like this.

****Also, has anyone else notice the picture of Tinkerbell in the poster behind M where she's looking in the mirror in Mom's blog "September 22"???***

WoW!

I see the picture, but I'm not sure I understand the significance?

 

[Confusion]

Was the dad not in Morgans room talking to her about being late? I know they talked, and mom sent dad to room to talk to her, right? It was late too, I can see why she would be tired.

The parents seem to go to bed early. I remember her saying that S went to bed around 9:30 after talking to M, but memories can sometimes be faulty.

I must have missed this. Where does she say this? I think I also missed the stuff about the book/documentary. Can anyone point me in the right direction?

The only books I've seen her mention are the 2 novels that M wrote and a book of her photographs someone was compiling. I haven't read that she was taking it down in Decenber (which doesn't mean she didn't say it), but the 'story' will end in December because that's when M died.

 

[ATasteOfHoney]

I see the picture, but I'm not sure I understand the significance?

BBM: I just find it slightly odd for anyone to have a poster of Tinkerbell hanging in their room at age 20. Usually we're all in such a rush to maturity at that age that childlike props are long gone.

 

[BeginnersLuck]

Well, not quite that simple. Perhaps it started out that way in this valley, but then what happens when such a skew towards denial and wanting to appease the wealthy continues for decades? The system begins to go corrupt.

Because the valley as a whole can be thought of as one small town (since most people who live in the valley, even if they don't live in Aspen proper, commute to work in Aspen--tiny Aspen has 4,965 commuters each day coming from as far as Rifle, Eagle, and Newcastle as well as Glenwood, Carbondale and Basalt to work in Aspen), it's not professional relationships that drive the social fabric of this down, but personal relationships. I come from a big city where because things are so impersonal, potential employers rely upon your professional and educational credentials as well as demonstrated skill to determine your fit for a job. Here in this valley, professional and educational credentials and skill/talent matter far less than the extent and kind of personal ties you have in the valley. It's very, very political in that sense. Add to that the transient nature of part of this community (people coming here to work only seasonally, people only coming here seasonally to their vacation homes, etc.), and the fact that understandably those whose strong personal ties (and likely weak professional qualifications) elevated them to some sort of Big Cheese status in this valley want to maintain their status, and there is a very strong distrust of outsiders.

Also, add a transient community to years of insiders doing "favors" here and there for one another, and you have a recipe for people so inclined to be able to get away with almost anything.

And lastly: the denial I mentioned. It's not just denial to appease the very rich. It's also denial along the lines of, "I live in this beautiful place; how can I possibly have any problems?" I cannot tell you how many times I have heard people talk like the mountains' beauty somehow mitigates their very real-world problems. People have a mentality here--many people, anyway--that nothing "bad" can happen. It's a kind of willful denial that I suppose makes the average local feel that their lack of fulfilled career aspirations, or lack of career aspiration, period, or mediocrity, is made up for by living in the mountains.

Add all these elements together, and I can very well understand how the Ingrams could have wound up in the predicament they are in in relation to local LE.

All this is just one person's opinion/observation. This is a wonderful place to live in many ways; don't get me wrong. The very fact of the "personal relationships" that I mention will likely prove the greatest solace to the Ingrams, and I think we're seeing evidence of that on the blog: the local restaurant owners creating a sushi roll in Morgan's name and the many locals more than eager to go in and buy it. I'm going to go have one next week It's just that the reality is that if someone wants to get away with murder in this valley, they can.

I live in a city of 400,000+. There definitely is advantages here on who you know.

The difference, being in a larger city is that you don't have the small town gossip where everyone is in your business. Say for instance a small town, may be aware of who the town drunk is or who a particular person is who has been in trouble with the law.

Our city is currently experiencing a lot of gang shootings. The police pretty much know who the people are that are committing these crimes. There have been many lives lost. The problem is, there is no evidence and no one will talk for fear of retaliation, they don't want to be a snitch or they simply don't trust the police.

Many crimes are committed everyday. For instance a persons property could be vandalized on 50 different occasions. The police are called and respond, but the criminal leaves no evidence, or not enough evidence to prosecute. Therefore, there is no arrest or conviction of a suspect. The police can only do what they can do, with what they have to work with.

A shoe print and some blurred photos of a human figure are not enough to convict a criminal. We do not know all the time that LE put into investigating a stalker because we do not have their reports. It sounds like they did quite a bit but found nothing to go with. They did more than they would here in my city because they have less manpower to devote to all the crime that we have.

I don't see any indication that any less was done, or anything incompetent was done in Morgan's case.

The impression I am getting is that if everyone or anyone doesn't agree with the Ingrams, then they are incompetent and "fired". Then a search begins to find others that will agree with them.

I would rather be honest about my opinion on what I have to work with in this case, which isn't much, than agree with the parents because I feel very sympathetic towards them.

By agreeing, I feel I would just be enabling them to continue to pursue something that will never give them the outcome that they desire and potentially cause harm to others.

 

[mysterygirl]

Well when LE doesn't even take a cast of a footprint, I'd say that right there doesn't scream doing everything they can.

 

[BeginnersLuck]

Respectfully, we don't know what LE did or didn't do.

 

[lillygator]

I haven't finished reading yet, so not sure if anyone mentioned this but this story reminds me of the case of Cindy James, a nurse who claimed she was being stalked and was eventually found dead in a ditch. She was hog tied and injected with morphine. The police called it a suicide/accident and claimed she had been staging the stalking incidents herself.

http://www.unsolved.com/ajaxfiles/une_cindy_james.htm

http://youtu.be/sbrAggQE2EA

very interesting.....thanks for sharing.

Exactly. Sometimes the LE lies. Why is is so hard for people to believe this "could" be the same thing with this case?
Not sure why you are comparing this case to a racist crime?
JMO

I'm sure they do, but why is it so hard for people to believe otherwise in this case? That is was suicide?

FrayedKnot....not quite sure what the issue is? Nobody on here is speaking anybody's name. That is against tos.

Nobody is taking moms word for anything.....have you read some of the comments on here? Actually, people have been questioning the mom and this whole story.

It's just a blog. Either you believe or not or you form your own opinion. Doesn't mean either of those will amount to much in the long run.

JMO

I read all the comments and I didn't see much of anyone that was questioning them, a couple did and they were completely JUMPED on......god forbid anyone have a doubt about the story. We are all supposed to believe 100% without any eveidence?
No thank you!

And that's fine, if allowed by mods then okey-dokey by me but I am going to keep pointing out inconsistancies and things that make no sense.
an example is: if there were prints in the snow, why did they not document them in photo or video form?

exactly.......I mean theis "stalker" caused le to come out over 50 times to the same location, yet there is ONE photo of what we think is a shoe print, one photo of a ghostly like human - nothing else was caught on film in those other 50 times??

I can't get past the cremation...
Even if they did not suspect murder right away, surely her death was unexplained, and the need for further analysis was almost certain to there, at some point. That just boggles my mind.

because her mother did NOT suspect that initially until it was suggested to her later on.

I see no reason we can't point out inconsistencies as long as they're documented. For instance, in Mom's blog she said M slept thru the ordeal on the night the picture was captured on the wild life camera, but then in the interview she said M was the one experiencing the noises and that's they the police were called. It can't be both ways, and if we're to try to figure out what's happened using only her account at this point, then I think we should be able to point out the contradictions in her account.

me either and there are consistencies all over the place...it can't be both.

I agree. If she does finally release some credible evidence that there was a stalker, and more importantly a murderer, I will be the first to admit I was wrong. I have no problem doing that. In fact, in a weird way I hope there IS a murder so the family can be vindicated. The alternative is that they're going to have to come to terms with their daughter's suicide and stop pointing fingers, and I fear they're just not in a place to do that yet, healing wise. In the mean time, innocent lives may be adversely affected by the accusations, not to mention setting themselves up for a major lawsuit; The missing trash makes me think someone has hired an attorney and PI.

I would happily admit that I am wrong if she has actual evidence. I will say it again, I hope those people being mentioned are aware and are taking some action to have their names removed.

OK, I'm going to throw out an observation here (because I haven't made nearly enough enemies on this board yet), but did anyone else notice in the interview that when Mom directly quoted M, she did it in a little girl's voice? M was 20, sleeping half the time in her parents' closet, had a curfew, had to call in all the time, couldn't even go to her GYN without mom. She had a lot of her life controlled.

Maybe M took control of the only thing she had left to control.

I aagree and I thought her texting sounded immature along with the photo of her room, most 19 yr olds rooms don't look like that.

All of this according to a blog posted on the interwebz by a grieving mother with nothing to substantiate any of it.

I could post anything I like on the net and it does not make any of it true, coincidental, or connected to something greater.

I think people are forgetting that it is a blog, and a story the mother is trying to tell.

I may not know what is going on in someone's mind, but I know about suicide. I know that there are almost always signs of it ahead of time, and someone almost always notices something is wrong (even if they don't expect the person to commit suicide.) There has been no evidence that anyone noticed anything wrong, including her friends, family and doctor. Since several people have posted about their experiences with stalkers here, it's obvious that not every victim of one commits suicide, so knowing M had problems with one does not mean she did. MOO

But I think there were signs towards the end. I posted yesterday
"This is a picture taken of Morgan 2 weeks before she died. Her mother took her to get her hair cut to try to cheer her up – Morgan was happy to have her make up on and her hair all done, but as you can see she looks gaunt, her eyes look sunken with dark circles under them, and she appears exhausted. Her hairdresser was very upset when she saw her and commented that she thought “this __ __ __ stalker is literally sucking the life out of her.”

Morgan started to lose her appetite and in what became her last week of life, she was so exhausted, and weak that she even missed a few of her ballet classes that she loved so much because she did not feel well enough to go."

that is not consistent with the story of a young healthy girl. She was having issues at the time.


<modsnip>

 

[BeginnersLuck]

I have friends that call me all the time to vent. I listen, provide comfort and in some cases encourage then to get professional counseling. Do I believe everything they say? No, because there are always two sides to a story.

My friends experiences may very well be as they see them to be, but emotional turmoil can cloud perception.

This is just me though and how I work. I am one that has to look at the overall big picture. In this case we are talking about murder. These are very serious accusations that should be supported by facts and not hearsay or emotions.

 

[Confusion]

BBM: I just find it slightly odd for anyone to have a poster of Tinkerbell hanging in their room at age 20. Usually we're all in such a rush to maturity at that age that childlike props are long gone.

I know a very mature woman of 55 who is fascinated by fairies and butterflies, and she has figurines and pictures of them scattered throughout her house. There's no accounting for taste; I didn't even like fairies when I was a kid.

 

[JBean]

Please do not discuss EACH OTHER.
When WE become the topic- it is off track.

If you see a post that violates- ALERT on it. Don't address it or respond to it. Mods do NOT READ EVERY POST. We rely on you to alert on anything that violates because chances are it has not been seen or read by a moderator.

Thanks.

 

[steff13]

Well when LE doesn't even take a cast of a footprint, I'd say that right there doesn't scream doing everything they can.

I would like to hear LE's side of that story. If they refused to take a casting because it was just a trespassing case as Morgan's mother said in the blog, then I agree that LE should have taken a casting of the print. With only her side of the story, though, I can't say for sure that they weren't doing everything they can.

 

[JBean]

I think many of us have several issues with this case, one of which is that there is no other source for information other than a blog and for us, that seems to be subjective. We only read, on the blog, what is deliberately written to get an expected reaction by the reader. It is crafted to pull the heart strings, worded to cause an emotional charge, and even used (as has happened) to chastise posters here at WS who have questioned parts of the saga.

And that's fine, if allowed by mods then okey-dokey by me but I am going to keep pointing out inconsistancies and things that make no sense.
an example is: if there were prints in the snow, why did they not document them in photo or video form?

It is allowed now and has been since the case discussion began.

Things not allowed as is always the case here at WS:
1. No family bashing- victim or surviving family members
2. No naming or investigating anyone that has not been named by LE through the MS as a POI or suspect.

 

[mysterygirl]

Respectfully, we don't know what LE did or didn't do.

And yet your post said there was no indication that they didn't do everything possible.

Can't have it both ways. lol.

 

[texasgirl2]

Hi y'all! :seeya:

I posted several questions for Morgan's family in the question thread for no-discussion but didn't want y'all to think I was being antisocial by not posting over here! I have been trying to catch up with all of you amazing sleuthers on these threads and just haven't had anything even remotely intelligent to add at this point. :blushing:

I think about this case all day long these days. I read the blog in one night (after seeing it posted here) and was so creeped out that I felt like I was reading a Dean Koontz book. I just have so many questions I want answers to. Just wondering if I am the only one wishing that the Forensic Astrology thread was still active? I admit that I have scoured the internet looking for anything on this case that could provide answers as to what happened to Morgan. Psychic blogs (without having an opinion as to whether or not I believe in psychics), message boards, etc. I know that TI is doing the best she can to relay information but I just want answers NOW so I can start understanding where she is coming from and why she feels the way she does. I am having such a hard time keeping up with all of the information so far that the only thing that I do have an opinion on is that I don't think that Morgan committed suicide. I can't really explain why I don't think so but I can't say either that I am looking at this case objectively because it is so different than any other case I have read about on WS.

All that to say, I wish we had more information and I hope TI understands how important it is to have the whole story. I understand that the way the blog has been written would be a marvelous way to reach others on the web and educate them about stalking IF a suspect had been apprehended or there was an ending that resulted in justice. However, this isn't the case and all I see is everyone going over the small amount of evidence being relayed without having a full picture and I find that to be a dangerous and unbalanced way of doing things. It is just so difficult to form an opinion without all of the information necessary.

Still praying for Morgan's sweet family. She was a beautiful girl and I hope we see resolution in this case in my lifetime in whatever way is meant to be (unlike so many of the cases I hold so personally dear to my heart that have provided no answers in many years!)

 

[ATasteOfHoney]

I know a very mature woman of 55 who is fascinated by fairies and butterflies, and she has figurines and pictures of them scattered throughout her house. There's no accounting for taste; I didn't even like fairies when I was a kid.

In general, the problem with stating an observation about a case that we're sleuthing is when presenting something that seems out of sync with the norm -- it can be expected that another poster will always post an example of the exception.

That being said, I found Mom's inflection in her voice when speaking about M in the interview with Tricia to change to that of a sweetsy child-like voice. I felt that Mom calling M's pajamas "jammies" in the interview was a little "off". Knowing how important it is to be cool and adult-like at the age of 20, I find a poster of Tinkerbell in M's room a little "off". Mom's continuous texting, walking to the door with pepperspray yet it's ok to let the puppy out during the middle of the night out back, M sleeping in the closet, M referencing texts from her teacher which was her dance instructor and M getting her GED (cap and gown pic of her speaking at her GED ceremony--no, that's *not* a college graduation pic) all a little "off". I'm not implying anything thing other than things seem a little "off" just enough times that it is unsettling.

 

[21merc7]

Nothing new to add, just personal experience to join with the others that have shared.

I have had several friends o.d.

3 were in their 20's. None left a note, one left a mother and child behind with no note. They were simply confused and troubled, however, their parents knew nothing of it. The funerals were an odd, and of course sad, observation of past versus present. The parents in total confusion about what the friends were getting up and sharing, some laughter, pride, love that they had no knowledge of. The parents seemed left in the background with their memories of the beloved child, the past-and only new found knowledge of the present and all of our hopefuls for the friend's futures had they stayed on with us.

20 some years later, my sister told me of all my friends from my very small hometown that had done the same. Small towns are very difficult, no employment potential/advancement, complacent lifestyles and minds that have no access to growth. It becomes overwhelming when there is no light to see, no end of the dark tunnel.

It is very easy for someone to take an entire bottle of pills, add any others a friend gives you, add alcohol, any drugs, in one last final night of fun - which you have chosen. You take everything you possibly can to be sure you are gone and not be revived. When that low, you don't always show signs, you can be happier than you ever have, after having a period of being down. Others will think you have finally come around. You have, but only to the lifting of the heaviness of the darkness, you are not going to feel it anymore. No more worries, no more burdens, finally peace is on the way.

I understand the reasons for those I knew. I wish they had not made that decision, but I had a lot of knowledge of who the were and why they chose. I held no anger, never was embarrassed, no shame, no fear, no guilt, no denial (but I knew the why). I loved them the same, and try to keep them alive in my heart and with those of us that knew them by celebrating who they were and how much they gave to all of us while they were here.

 

[lillygator]

wait what is this about a GED? Is that cap and gown pic from high school graduation? I thought she was home schooled.....I'm confused about the schooling....

 

[lillygator]

and I think I asked in another thread - she was only taking a couple dance classes that last semester - what was the reason for not taking a full load? Sign ups would have been before the incidents took place since they started in August......

 

[texasgirl2]

Anyone know if a TOD was ever released? I may have missed that somewhere so my apologies if so!

TIA!

 

[21merc7]

wait what is this about a GED? Is that cap and gown pic from high school graduation? I thought she was home schooled.....I'm confused about the schooling....

In some places you can get a GED and still walk in the school ceremony with cap and gown. Or you could about 30 some odd years ago. Or it is just an at home celebration if there is a photo.