Cocoamom Theory #2

[ellieit]

Please do not think I am being negative as I am not just thinking this out.
you have some great points.

Does anyone know what kind of surveillance the tow yard has? Do they have junk yard dogs on site? I personally know 2 owners of a tow company and their yards are very well secured 24/7 as they should be, after all they have taken peoples cars , and the only way to get them back is to pay for them.
You can not get into either yard to even get close to a car.

GA...this is why I do not think he helped dispose of the body from the yard or anywhere else. If the child was killed by accident (drowning, carbon monoxide from being in the trunk, overdose ) then why have your daughter in jail facing murder 1? He knows that an autopsy of the body would reveal the cause of death, unless he seen signs on the body that it was more then an accident. I just can't digest that a father would go along with disposing of a child that would put his own child (KC) at facing the death penalty.

CA I think your right on with many points. She sent GA back to work, but I think because she had already had plans to retrieve the clothing and laptop and she knew that GA would not agree. I think she also wanted to go through the car and GA would not agree. CA took control because she knew something was wrong! She washed the pants, not sure if GA would have gone along with that as well.


If Caylee died of an accident then why would the family try so hard to cover it up? The most she would be charged with is the original charge of Neglect or involuntary manslaughter and illegal disposing of a body which I believe that is a misdemeanor. So why would anyone cover up the one thing that could save KC and that is the body of that child?

 

[Celt1997]

:clap:

I love reading your theories CCM! You should write mystery novels.

The only thing I can't fit in with your theory, though, is the whole story of Zanny the Nanny and the odyssey that KC took the police on. I can't imagine GA & CA coming up with a script like that "off the cuff." It seems that the stories that KC told, along with the names, and places, were carefully considered. GA & CA didn't know a lot about KC's "new" life, so I can't imagine they'd be able to put in the details that KC came up with.

I'm certain, though, that there are plenty of truths in your theory!

 

[Zoe Bogart]

I haven't read through the entire theory but what I did read sounds, well, unbelievable. It could make a good novel or movie, but I can't see how it could work in reality.

No one has seen Caylee for sure since she visited great grandpa at the nursing facility, or when she left the house the next day when GA claims he saw her, but I have my doubts about that. So here's part of my problem with it, what was she doing with Caylee during all those daylight hours? It's too hot to be in a car, and I doubt if she could stand being in a car at night for any length of time - it's just too hot and humid in June.

I'll have to reread it, but, for me, it's far-fetched. I'm also doubting so many people could have been involved - even the Anthonys. I would have expected one of them to crack by now (GA), especially if they loved Caylee as much as they claim.

I'll look it over later. Maybe I missed something plausible or misread something but I just can't see hiding or dragging Caylee around for two weeks or more in the trunk.

If it were some sort of neglectful accident to begin with, why keep quiet and let Casey be charged with Murder One? It doesn't make sense.

Oh yes, and the lack of odor when the car was picked up, since the guy said he had a cold, perhaps if he did smell anything it didn't register because it was parked next to a dumpster - something that normally has a bad odor anyway. Dumspters just normally don't smell like flowers or perfume.

Great job, though. :woohoo:

 

[It's Not the Nanny]

I don't know.....I agree, there are some very good points and lots of good brainstorming here. It's always good to think outside the box.

I just don't see her drugging her continually and leaving her in a trunk for 2 weeks. That would be way too risky --- Caylee could wake up and cry, start moving and bumping around, the A's could have eventually found where she was staying and come to the car in the parking lot and found an asleep Caylee in the trunk.

KC wouldn't risk that. We all know she is a monster but I don't think she would put her daughter ALIVE in the trunk......that's pure torture. We have all thought all along that it was a soft kill.

I stand by the Church Theory most definitely and REALLY REALLY think AH's car was involved. I wish I knew where her car ended up and where it is now.

I don't think the A's had anything to do with the actual killing and disposal of Caylee's body. I think they figured things out and that KC told LA and he probably shared some of it with them. The A's are guilty of covering for her. I think CA definitely tried to clean up the evidence in the car ("THERE IS NO EVIDENCE") and GA may have testified to that.....and maybe that he knows LA checked out AH's car, and dumped her computer.

I know everyone keeps going back to the jailhouse call to CA when KC says, "You don't know whay MY involvement is????"...... My take is KC is continuing her lying ways and saying, "Really, Mom??? You really think *I* had something to do with this???? I already told you Zanny took her from me!!! Why does everyone want to blame ME???".

 

[CiCi]

Excellent theory! I totally agree that the entire Anthony family was somehow involved in the cover up / disposal of precious Caylee.

I keep going back to when CA picked up KC at TL's with Amy that night. Correct me if I am wrong, but according to TL's interviews, she never asked KC where Caylee was. I would think that would be the first question CA demands of her daughter after not seeing her grandaugher for several weeks. KC made up the nanny story later that night after the 911 calls, so if we assume CA had no idea where Caylee was when she picked her up, why did not ask at that time? So she waited until she got her home to ask her about her beloved grandaughter? This seems highly unlikely.

Unless, of course, CA already knew precious Caylee had perished, which would support your theory that the ANthony's had disposed of her body.

 

[Hope for the Best]

let me toss this thought out there before going to sleep: If ga disposed of caylee would he have left anything in the car that might smell or could be used as evidence?

We know caylee's favorite doll was still there as well as the pants cindy washed, the knife she cleaned, iirc a pair of her shoes and her boots and some other items that were relatively small. The carseat is larger but if ga didn't know where caylee died, he wouldn't know for sure that it wasn't in the seat, so it seems it would have been disposed of also.

i agree. I think he would've cleaned that car completely out and gotten rid of everything inside of it.

so i'm thinking that if a cover up was attempted most of the things in the car should have been cleared out and destroyed -- for that matter the car itself should have been torched or dumped in a lake. Remember the cars they found in the one near the a house during the 'practice' dive by ocsd? That indicates (to me) it wouldn't have been too hard to get a car in the water.

i agree here, too. I think ga would've disposed of the car in some lake as well. Cleaned it out of anything noteworthy and then dumped it in a lake.

looking at it from the point of view of him trying to help/protect kc, i'd say he didn't do a very good job. With the remains perhaps, but not with everything else (the car and it's contents). And as caylee's grandfather it seems he would have put the doll where ever he put caylee.

that gets me, too. Ga & ca did seem to adore little caylee. I can't see either of them ditching her somewhere without a proper burial.

now la was gone for a long time that night but he didn't have access to the car, so i can't see him doing much more than trying to clean up the computer (which he had in his possession). I don't know but this is the part i'm getting hung up at (c, g and or la disposing of caylee's remains once the car was found). I just think ga would have done a better job.

how long was lee really gone for? Wasn't it like two hours? If so, that really doesn't seem like that long of a time, considering drive time and all. Al's apartment is probably a 15-20 minute drive from the anthony's house, each way, so that's 30-40 minutes of driving. By the time he got to al's apartment, gathered up kc's stuff and left again, i'd say that would take a little while, maybe 30 minutes at least. Then, who knows, maybe he got into a conversation with al and his roomies, or maybe he needed to take multiple trips to the car to get all the stuff in there. That sort of thing takes time, going up and down stairs and all. I just think that with all the things he had to do, and the driving time, i don't think that would've left a lot of time to delete things off her computer, unless he knew exactly the files that needed deleted ahead of time, and he didn't need to search through them.

bolded parts by me

 

[ThoughtFox]

This is interesting and parts of it sound plausible (I agree that Casey may have left Caylee in the car on some of the nights). But I agree with others who have pointed out that an unconscious small child without water would dehydrate fast and probably die faster than a few days. Sometimes when children are accidentally left in cars and vans they die faster than that just due to heatstroke. And that's especially true if the child had vomited and urinated.

Even if she was in a drug-induced coma, she'd need fluids or she would die fairly quickly. I'm no health expert or anything, but it just seems more likely to me.

 

[Hope for the Best]

Excellent theory! I totally agree that the entire Anthony family was somehow involved in the cover up / disposal of precious Caylee.

I keep going back to when CA picked up KC at TL's with Amy that night. Correct me if I am wrong, but according to TL's interviews, she never asked KC where Caylee was. I would think that would be the first question CA demands of her daughter after not seeing her grandaugher for several weeks. KC made up the nanny story later that night after the 911 calls, so if we assume CA had no idea where Caylee was when she picked her up, why did not ask at that time? So she waited until she got her home to ask her about her beloved grandaughter? This seems highly unlikely.

Unless, of course, CA already knew precious Caylee had perished, which would support your theory that the ANthony's had disposed of her body.

Actually, I think she did ask KC where Caylee was and KC said she was with the nanny. CA told her to take her to the nanny's house then, but then KC started with her song and dance about how Caylee was sleeping or whatever. AH was still with them at that time. IIRC, after they dropped Amy off, CA was going to drive KC to the police station (I think as an empty threat) to get her to talk, but KC convinced her to go back the the Anthony's house instead and they would go get Caylee after that. At least that is what I remember from CA and AH's LE interviews.

 

[It's Not the Nanny]

CiCi - Maybe CA didn't immediately demand to know where Caylee was in front of AH because, up to that moment, KC had been telling CA all the lies about going to some other city, The Nanny taking Caylee to the parks while she worked, etc. I CA was probably still REALLY hoping there was a Nanny and Caylee was with her.

I don't think CA would have involved AH and picked her up at the mall and had her take AH to KC if they had disposed of the body. Why bring in another person??

 

[CiCi]

Another thought - When AL picked up KC at the amscot when she allegedly ran out of the gas and left her car there, she had gotten groceries and clothes from her parents home, and I remember reading that she had not picked up any clothes for Caylee. If this is true, it could indicate that Caylee had already perished by this time. If Caylee was still alive in the trunk and KC had intention of coming back for her, than why wouldn't she pick up a change of clothes for as well? Just a thought.

 

[tfrohning]

I think LA is involve, at first I didn't, there seem to be some actions from him that are very interesting and now no one knows where he is and what he been doing.

 

[PhoneBoothBandit]

Interesting.

Initially while independently looking at this story and before I started posting and reading here - I was convinced CA and GA knew.

 

[MamaBird]

Okay, after reading Cocoa's theory and thinking back to all that has transpired so far, I stick with my gut feeling that GA and CA did not find Caylee's body. However, I do believe that they are guilty of a coverup. Especially when it comes to the car. I think that a major cleanup job was done in that trunk. They may not have removed any trash or whatnot, but I believe that someone worked on that stain. IIRC there would be no way that CA would know about the pizza box in the trunk because GA was the one who was with SB at the car. CA was either still in the office or had already left. She was already at home and waiting for GA when he got there. So unless he told her once he got home about the pizza box, she would not have known about it. I also believe that LA did clean out that computer. Why else was gone for so long that night? There may be other things that LA knows that could implicate him or someone else. Other than the coverup for their daughter, the only other thing that I believe that CA and GA are guilty of in this particular case is denial.

I also agree with other posters here that there is no way that Caylee could have been left in that car for that long period of time without someone hearing her or without her dying. No one saw her after the 15th. Not during the day or the night. In my opinion, Caylee died on the 16th. I do believe that KC was drugging her beforehand, however, I think that the trunk deal only happened after she began seeing TL. According to Amy, KC would lay Caylee on the couch at their place. So while she was hanging with this group, who didn't mind Caylee being there, she could let her sleep there. But once she became serious with TL and she and CA were on the outs due to their fight, that's when she started to use the trunk as Caylee's bed.

One more point, TL did say that every time KC would talk on her phone to her mom she would go outside. I don't think that it was to check on Caylee or her car. I believe that it was so she could tell CA all those elaborate lies about her being in Tampa, the nanny's accident, staying with Jeff, etc. She could have never got by with telling all that in front of anyone else.

 

[maur33]

You know, call me cyncial but I just don't see GA or CA finding the body and disposing of it , disposing of their Granddaughter Caylee...

I just think , I really do that Casey stuffed up big time and by way of neglect killed her daughter in the end with oversedation and then went on a elaborate soap opera drama life filled with partying and lie after lie after lie

I don't believe GA and CA had anything to do with it


I think maybe the Brother knows something hence his staying out of the limelight

Whether he knows KC used to Drug Caylee or whether he knows something else

I just don't believe that GA OR CA could do that to their beloved grandchild ie getting rid of her in some horrid place and not a proper burial

I totally agree there is no way anyone could convince me that cindy had anything at all to with Caylee's death or disposing of her dead body...no way. As for george, well I just don't know any more how I feel about him, but I don't believe that george found Caylee's body and independently disposed of her and casey is unaware of that...I could be convinced that he helped her in some way, not sure what specifically. As for Lee well my hinky meter is all over this guy, I don't trust him and I believe he is hiding something big.

As for what this family has done after the fact, I do believe there is lots and lots of covering up and out-and-out lying by all three parties. JMO

 

[cocoamom]

OK, OK! I'm hemorraging here from all the hole poking! Before this gets any bigger than 3 pages, I'm going to try to start posting replies. I think there is like 90% agreement that 2 weeks of drugging and keeping in trunk wouldn't work so we can go back to the 16th for that to begin. That's when she started staying at TL's full time anyway right? That would be a little over a week that she did the trunk thing with poor Caylee.

Lots of people are questioning and discounting about this theory based on comments like this:, "what did she do with her during the day if she didn't keep her in the trunk?" My answer is Fl heat too hot for trunk all day or even a few hours. During the day she did whatever she has been doing with Caylee for the last 2 years that she didn't have a job!!!! Parks, home, TL's, Amy's CHURCH playground, etc.

Partying without a care in the world - what were those dates? Before the car was towed? If so, well she didn't have any cares, Caylee was still alive! I will start replying soon!

 

[Whyamisointerested]

Nice theory. I agree with parts.I dont think that the 16th is the right date either. The thing is she was pinging from the house or very close the 15th through the 16th .I agree that she had been drugging her off and on probably her whole life. I often wonder if LA was involved and G&C A know this then if the 'truth' comes out they will lose LA.Caylee,and KC and they cant do that...therefore all the coverup...I think the whole family is guilty and am very surprised that LE hasnt charged anyone else yet.

 

[IWannaKnow]

CCM - how does the 2.6 days fit with your theory? That has me stumped. If Caylee died in the trunk on 6/26 or 27 and was carried to the tow yard in the trunk, unless someone moved the body that would be way more than 2.6 days. And who moved it, if not KC, 'cause I don't believe it could have been CA/GA or LA before the 15th. Plus, KC didn't even know where it had been towed, IMO (I doubt she waltzed into AMSCOT and asked where they had the car towed that was left by the dumpster, LOL). It would account for the smell, however. As another poster stated that 3 days not bad, 2 weeks - BAD. Also, I can't believe the tow yard guy would open a trunk, see a dead body and not report it. After all, AMSCOT called the tow yard, not the A's, so there cannot be complicity between the two, as far as I can see. GA or CA wouldn't have even known the guy till they got there, so no way to apply pressure if he saw something he shouldn't, IMO.

I do think she could have been using the "fun trunk bed", it's the only thing that explains where Caylee was. If she were drugged the whole time, KC wouldn't have wanted people to see her that way, so no contact. I don't believe she used the trunk bed during the day, unless she left the car running for A/C (possible use for gas cans?), but it would explain why she kept running out of gas. Maybe that is why she had FROZEN chicken nuggets and popscicles? Trying to cool Caylee down? Not trying to bash your theory, just can't make those things fit. Maybe I am just missing it.

Love all your hard work, CCM. :clap::clap: YOU ROCK!!! KEEP GOING!! Your stuff is the most plausible I've seen. Bravo!

 

[TripleA]

I really think that we must be missing something here. I think that she must have kept Caylee in some kind of storage container or freezer for some time before she disposed of her body.

 

[Celt1997]

I really think that we must be missing something here. I think that she must have kept Caylee in some kind of storage container or freezer for some time before she disposed of her body.

Is there any reason to suspect she may have also been using AH's public storage unit for anything?

 

[FloridaKatz]

Is there any reason to suspect she may have also been using AH's public storage unit for anything?

AND, could that have been the key that LA told AH he destroyed? Has LE or FBI checked out that storage unit ? I haven't seen anything to confirm/deny if they have....

Something else I can't quite resolve in my mind. When KC was talking to Lee in one of those first jail house calls, he had asked her where her other phone was (the Blackjack), she made a reference to "bottom left", but never explained further what that meant, before LA knew what she was referring to. What in the he!! is the "bottom left" ????? Bottom left drawer, bottom left of the computer screen, bottom left of the car trunk, bottom left area of someone's back yard perhaps ?