Connecticut school district on lockdown after shooting report at a Newtown elemen-#4

[ami]

I'm becoming more confound by the mother, NL's belief that the economy was going to "collapse" and that she had to arm herself with automatic weapons for that event. And years after her divorce, still complaining to anyone who would listen (this is how I'm assuming she ended up complaining to the landscaper) about her xh?

Put that together with an emotionally/psychologically/neurologically divergent son - whom she allegedly took target shooting...

Did NL instill in Adam Lanza the fear and paranoia that somehow they were at imminent risk, and need to defend themselves with automatic weapons?

Did NL's fear and paranoia about economic collapse and, apparently, anarchy (why else need automatic weapons to defend against the economy) spark in her psychologically challenged son a paranoia and fear?

But that doesn't answer the connection to the school....

I know my own "neuro-divergent' brother gets on kicks about things -- it can be the cell phone companies, or politics, or conspiracy theories - and it becomes his entire world. His thought paths are so convoluted that he may end up with bags of ice all over his body as he lays in the tub shivering... and when you find him there and try to work out why he's covered with ice packs he will explain his reasoning and it will twist and turn upon itself and involve the government, scientists, things that happened in the 1950's, etc., until he finally gets to the thing that sparked his paranoia which was that the tap water smelled funny when he took a drink earlier that day. No reasonable person could have made that leap - his mind doesn't work in a linear way.

So until LE reveals what they found that partially explains his state of mind, I don't think we can even draw lines between things - we are not mentally warped, so our lines will be straight and logical when the killer's lines will not be.

 

[Xavier]

Brother in law is lives with this condition and it is very tough on my brother.
It is very hard to understand the paranoia(phones tapped, alleged person breaking into house and moving things on purpose, taking off not knowing where he is, not caring about hygiene, demanding) the list goes on. Getting to take his meds was difficult. Hubby had to hand him them. Brother in law won't won't visit family ore even let people in side his home...sometimes not even his case workers. He has attempted suicide on several occasions and has been hospitalized. They say he will get worse...never better. Thank God he now has a nurse, aids and a social worker that visit. It has taken an extreme load of DH who tried his hardest to tend to his brother while trying to take care of us at home.
They say that schizophrenics are more of a threat to themselves. This otherwise gentle man has had episodes of violence ..not to others but on his home such as the breaking of windows.
I don't know if the shooter had this illness but if he did his family had a lot to deal with besides his physcical condition.

B]Thanks for replying, Ricki, our brother is real similar to yours...Our brother has turned music up loud and took a golf club and smashed his bedroom windows when younger....when he was younger he was out of control, we've called 911 for police intervention about 50 times

But now he's in his 40s, so none of that out of control stuff goes on anymore

Schizo-affective we were told hits young men in their late teens, our brother was diagnosed at 19.....Do the best you can and it sounds like you have given alot of support,love....It's nothing short of sainthood...I'm sure your friends are amazed at what challenges you have to put up with sometimes....I get that...LOL

God Bless[/B]

 

[BunnyHop]

I'm becoming more confound by the mother, NL's belief that the economy was going to "collapse" and that she had to arm herself with automatic weapons for that event. And years after her divorce, still complaining to anyone who would listen (this is how I'm assuming she ended up complaining to the landscaper) about her xh?

Put that together with an emotionally/psychologically/neurologically divergent son - whom she allegedly took target shooting...

Did NL instill in Adam Lanza the fear and paranoia that somehow they were at imminent risk, and need to defend themselves with automatic weapons?

Did NL's fear and paranoia about economic collapse and, apparently, anarchy (why else need automatic weapons to defend against the economy) spark in her psychologically challenged son a paranoia and fear?

But that doesn't answer the connection to the school....

I know my own "neuro-divergent' brother gets on kicks about things -- it can be the cell phone companies, or politics, or conspiracy theories - and it becomes his entire world. His thought paths are so convoluted that he may end up with bags of ice all over his body as he lays in the tub shivering... and when you find him there and try to work out why he's covered with ice packs he will explain his reasoning and it will twist and turn upon itself and involve the government, scientists, things that happened in the 1950's, etc., until he finally gets to the thing that sparked his paranoia which was that the tap water smelled funny when he took a drink earlier that day. No reasonable person could have made that leap - his mind doesn't work in a linear way.

So until LE reveals what they found that partially explains his state of mind, I don't think we can even draw lines between things - we are not mentally warped, so our lines will be straight and logical when the killer's lines will not be.

This woman lived on $325,000 per year.

I live on $35,000.

No tears from me in that regard. Sorry.

 

[BunnyHop]

I don't know if this means anything........

Putting it here:
Last night it also emerged Nancy was a member of the Doomsday Preppers movement, which believes people should prepare for end of the world.

Her former sister-in-law Marsha said she had turned her home ‘into a fortress’. She added: ‘Nancy had a survivalist philosophy which is why she was stockpiling guns. She had them for defense.

‘She was stockpiling food. She grew up on a farm in New Hampshire. She was skilled with guns. We talked about preppers and preparing for the economy collapsing.’

Marsha added that her nephew had been raised by ‘kind, nurturing’ parents’. She said she last seen Adam in June but recalled nothing appeared out of the ordinary.

‘Nancy was a good mother, kind-hearted,’ she added. ‘She wasn’t one to deny reality. She would have sought psychiatric help for her son had she felt he needed it.’

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...us-turned-heartless-killer.html#ixzz2FBi8lE9X

I survived Sandy. This woman had much at her disposal. Everything IMHO.

$325,000/year. Helloooooooooooooooooooo

 

[oceanblueeyes]

Ok, I am just thinking out loud. Like most everyone, I am brainstorming WHY AL did this.

Let's say AL is recognized to have something wrong with him when he starts school at Sandy Hook as a little kid. (I am still unsure if he went there. My head is spinning with all the misinformation.) Teachers, the school psychologist, the school admins are all involved.

Fast forward - He's pulled from school to be homeschooled by NL. Divorce happens, dad and brother disappear from his life.

Maybe AL blames losing everything (family etc) on the teachers, docs, and admins who 'started this mess' by saying something is wrong with him. By killing the 'instigators' (in AL's mind), he's getting revenge for himself. By killing the children who are his age when he was recognized as having something wrong with him at school, he's 'saving' them from what happened to him.

I dont know what information will come forth to explain Adam further but honestly as of now I dont see him having an emotional attachment for doing this. I really think Adam didnt 'feel' things like most do and things didnt 'hurt' him and the only response to them were outburst of anger.

Maybe he just planned to make the biggest statement he could in order to get the attention he never got from others. Now everyone in the world knows his name. He will go down in history books now.

I do think he is most likely mentally ill but highly intelligent. He wanted to do something worse than the ones before him. He probably never knew about the Bath Murders in Michican in 1927 that killed more elementary children than any other mass murder case in American history. If he had known of it... he may have devised explosives and used those instead. He was certainly smart enough to do so.

IMO

 

[Ricki]

B]Thanks for replying, Ricki, our brother is real similar to yours...Our brother has turned music up loud and took a golf club and smashed his bedroom windows when younger....when he was younger he was out of control, we've called 911 for police intervention about 50 times

But now he's in his 40s, so none of that out of control stuff goes on anymore

Schizo-affective we were told hits young men in their late teens, our brother was diagnosed at 19.....Do the best you can and it sounds like you have given alot of support,love....It's nothing short of sainthood...I'm sure your friends are amazed at what challenges you have to put up with sometimes....I get that...LOL

God Bless[/B]

He is in his 60's. Diagnosed about 30 yrs ago.

 

[AfterSunset]

It seems to me the mother was just kind of deserted as far as taking care of the younger brother. Seems they all just went away and said okay mom you deal with it. I don't know that for sure just an observation. jmo

Just MHO but possibly, the mother had such affection, love..maybe all-consuming love of son AL that she pushed the dad and brother away...maybe she could not, would not see any of this son's issues...maybe said brother and ex-hubby got tired of trying...this is just my opinion, but I know of parents, or mothers, who obsessively love one child out of her children above and beyond and refuse to see that they (the chosen child) has any faults.
It could be that other family members had decided they were done being a part of the dysfunction...
Again not fact just my opinion ...


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD

 

[ami]

This woman lived on $325,000 per year.

I live on $35,000.

No tears from me in that regard. Sorry.

Even more -she lived on ALIMONY - she was dependent on her apparently reviled xH's salary. The picture we're getting is that she complained about him years after the divorce while living on his alimony and living in paranoia that someone would steal it all from her, and arming herself with automatic weapons.

I can't quite wrap my head around describing that same woman as a kind and nurturing parent who was so in touch with reality that she would have helped Adam Lanza seek psychiatric help "if he needed it".

He didn't have friends. His issues made it impossible for him to go to school with his peers for several years. He was a "genius" who had to get his GED. He had no job. If all of those aren't signs that he quite possibly needed some psychiatric help - what would be??

 

[Ricki]

I have read about the people who are stock piling goods, ammunition and guns to prepare for whatever. With 12/21/12 just days away and reading about the many people who think the world will end, do you think in the following days we will be seeing more violence, strange behavior or anything that is extremely out of the ordinary?

 

[JodyMT]

I had a feeling Nancy was a prepper. Her owning that many weapons just didn't make sense otherwise. It's sad she didn't take more care in keeping those firearms out of her son's hands.

I wonder if she was constantly talking about the end of the world with her son and it set him off somehow and made him paranoid? No excuse for hitting a school, but I do wonder what he took away from her own mindset.

 

[wfgodot]

I don't know if this means anything........

Putting it here:
Last night it also emerged Nancy was a member of the Doomsday Preppers movement, which believes people should prepare for end of the world.

Her former sister-in-law Marsha said she had turned her home ‘into a fortress’. She added: ‘Nancy had a survivalist philosophy which is why she was stockpiling guns. She had them for defense.

‘She was stockpiling food. She grew up on a farm in New Hampshire. She was skilled with guns. We talked about preppers and preparing for the economy collapsing.’

snip

(smh) Would help explain the abundance of guns and insanity.

 

[Ricki]

snip

(smh) Would help explain the abundance of guns and insanity.

Yes, it would. I do not think the world will end Friday because of my faith based reasons. If God wants any of us it won't help what kind of arsenal we have stored. JMO

Is there a link that state NL was a prepper?

 

[ami]

I had a feeling Nancy was a prepper. Her owning that many weapons just didn't make sense otherwise. It's sad she didn't take more care in keeping those firearms out of her son's hands.

I wonder if she was constantly talking about the end of the world with her son and it set him off somehow and made him paranoid? No excuse for hitting a school, but I do wonder what he took away from her own mindset.

In the 48 hours video ~36 minutes or so: 48 Hours: Newtown - 48 Hours - CBS News one point they made was about "warning signs" that someone might be about to commit gun violence. They said, (paraphrasing since the player doesn't allow rewinding) "If someone you know isolates themselves, begins to stockpile guns, talks about committing an act like this...." etc.

Weirdly, two of the three of the warning signs equally apply to NL. NOT saying she was responsible as she clearly was not the killer and was herself a victim, but to me it really does seem like her apparent isolation and collection of guns and fear of the future are "warning signs" of serious problems... only in a mentally healthy person those signs might be red herrings, whereas in a mentally unstable person those signs are horribly serious.

 

[wfgodot]

Yes, it would. I do not think the world will end Friday because of my faith based reasons. If God wants any of us it won't help what kind of arsenal we have stored. JMO

Is there a link that state NL was a prepper?

Toward the bottom of the DM article here:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...us-turned-heartless-killer.html#ixzz2FBi8lE9X

The world's not ending Friday as

1. The world's just not going to end Friday
2. The Mayans never "prophesied" the world was ending Friday

I do feel sympathy for those caught up in the paranoid lifestyle; sympathy, but no empathy. Beliefs like this only offer an excuse for narcissistic exercises in personal calamity which eventually may spill over and affect quality of life.

 

[manzana]

It seems to be quite a slippery slope here, I just hope we are able to explore why this happened. I feel many of us here believe that the arsenal that she had was not typical defense weapons. Clearly we should be able to address the mother and whatever issues she may have fostered without posters saying we are trying to bash the victim.

 

[Bonnie Blue]

I don't think it matters what his mom was/wasn't. This wasn't an attack on a government building that was threatening their lively hood. And I'm pretty sure 6 year olds are not a threat to anyone. He was 20, a legal adult and he was the shooter, not his mother. JMO

 

[iSleuth]

I'm becoming more confound by the mother, NL's belief that the economy was going to "collapse" and that she had to arm herself with automatic weapons for that event. And years after her divorce, still complaining to anyone who would listen (this is how I'm assuming she ended up complaining to the landscaper) about her xh?

Put that together with an emotionally/psychologically/neurologically divergent son - whom she allegedly took target shooting...

Did NL instill in Adam Lanza the fear and paranoia that somehow they were at imminent risk, and need to defend themselves with automatic weapons?

Did NL's fear and paranoia about economic collapse and, apparently, anarchy (why else need automatic weapons to defend against the economy) spark in her psychologically challenged son a paranoia and fear?

But that doesn't answer the connection to the school....

I know my own "neuro-divergent' brother gets on kicks about things -- it can be the cell phone companies, or politics, or conspiracy theories - and it becomes his entire world. His thought paths are so convoluted that he may end up with bags of ice all over his body as he lays in the tub shivering... and when you find him there and try to work out why he's covered with ice packs he will explain his reasoning and it will twist and turn upon itself and involve the government, scientists, things that happened in the 1950's, etc., until he finally gets to the thing that sparked his paranoia which was that the tap water smelled funny when he took a drink earlier that day. No reasonable person could have made that leap - his mind doesn't work in a linear way.

So until LE reveals what they found that partially explains his state of mind, I don't think we can even draw lines between things - we are not mentally warped, so our lines will be straight and logical when the killer's lines will not be.

Not that the fact that I live in Bethel CT less than 10 miles from Sandyhook CT- would propel anyone to believe that the news around and about is very reliable- as there have been plenty of mistakes in the MSM.

From what I have pieced together.
Here is the connection to the school.

They moved to NEwtown in 1998 if you do the math - he went to that school when he was 6- years old. The school psych ( who was about to retire) was there at the time he attended.

The mother was like so many parents in this state ( wealthy- entitled- very litigious ( ready to sue to school system for just about any infraction of IEPs ( individualized ed. plans for teachers to deal with special education needs of students in their classes ( I have taught for many years and have taught in CT for the since 2002)

Parents move to towns with " good" special ed programs- but expect the school to miraculously fix everything- when in reality mant of these student's needs would be better met in other ( possibly) " private" settings. The denial in this area is profound. People deny ( all types of things in all types of ways) their kids issues to themselves and to friends and then completely torture the school system.

I have heard that the parent "did not like the plans the school had for son" and removed him from HS and chose to Homeschool him.
I have been hired as a certified homeschool teacher as well - except i go into homes and have taught US history citizenship and government ( ALL REQUIRED courses for HS students in the USA)

WHat a travesty! A woman like that homeschooling a boy with obviously more needs that she was equipped to handle. She took him out exactly atthe time where the school would have intervened and help...Students in sp ed. in CT get schooling through 21!!!!!!!!! we have excellent regional and charter schools throughout the state. And yet don't get me started about the state of ct allowing for profit schools to buy up and close 2 of the best career training schools in the state equipped to help people like him.

On another note, I mentioned this in the early threads about the shooting in New fairlfield CT which is near by. People in CT are freaked out. Since the Cheshire home invasion- even people who were not dooms day preppers have sought out weapons for protection.

The idea that- that parent- homeschooled her kid- that kid...and had weapons like that around for any reason...makes me ill. It could be any one's neighborhood or neighborhood schools and stores., malls.

I have so many thoughts - mainly I am beside myself here in Connecticut.
I am also beside myself here on WS

my heart aches for us all
my love goes out to my state, my neighbors- fellow nutmeggers.
:-(

Gun..control. Kid control...and school reform. And the school reform we need is not the kind we have ever considered.
IMHO the crazies have taken control of the asylum.

Thank you for letting me vent.
:furious:

This all after a week where my very urban college students told me stories that made me feel so afraid ( one has 3 different baby father's - and one of the baby fathers was shot 9 times and burned in her car- but these are not the people who shoot up our schools theaters and malls) that i was considering , trying to get a more local teaching position. ( I teach in farmington - umm in the same town where the autopsies are taking place) of the 4 closest schools...one is sandyhook ct. :-(

Too close to home.

 

[Trident]

JMO, I think it's pretty pointless to argue about whether autism etc. are mental illnesses or neurological. The whole distinction between mental disorders and neurological/other physical diseases is a remnant of an older age of thinking when it was thought that there were diseases of the body and diseases of the mind where they couldn't find any underlying body pathology. But the more we learn about diseases and disorders the more we find that there are physiological factors in mental illness and mental factors in neurological illness. The line is going to become more and more blurred imo.



http://bjp.rcpsych.org/content/178/6/490.full

I wonder if we could have a thread dedicated to mental illnesses, or autism, or whatever the PTB choose to call them. There seem to be enough here with experience to at least discuss it, if not come to some conclusions.

I have children, and grandchildren, plus myself with interesting traits, some diagnosed, some not.

At any rate, maybe it would be better, and more enlightening to have a seperate threat for this?

 

[Donjeta]

In the 48 hours video ~36 minutes or so: 48 Hours: Newtown - 48 Hours - CBS News one point they made was about "warning signs" that someone might be about to commit gun violence. They said, (paraphrasing since the player doesn't allow rewinding) "If someone you know isolates themselves, begins to stockpile guns, talks about committing an act like this...." etc.

Weirdly, two of the three of the warning signs equally apply to NL. NOT saying she was responsible as she clearly was not the killer and was herself a victim, but to me it really does seem like her apparent isolation and collection of guns and fear of the future are "warning signs" of serious problems... only in a mentally healthy person those signs might be red herrings, whereas in a mentally unstable person those signs are horribly serious.

She was described as somewhat rigid, I forget by whom.
I don't want to armchair diagnose but it occurred to me that sometimes Asperger- like traits run in the family.

 

[Dr.Fessel]

In the 48 hours video ~36 minutes or so: 48 Hours: Newtown - 48 Hours - CBS News one point they made was about "warning signs" that someone might be about to commit gun violence. They said, (paraphrasing since the player doesn't allow rewinding) "If someone you know isolates themselves, begins to stockpile guns, talks about committing an act like this...." etc.

Weirdly, two of the three of the warning signs equally apply to NL. NOT saying she was responsible as she clearly was not the killer and was herself a victim, but to me it really does seem like her apparent isolation and collection of guns and fear of the future are "warning signs" of serious problems... only in a mentally healthy person those signs might be red herrings, whereas in a mentally unstable person those signs are horribly serious.

I think this is a real warning sign of insanity.

http://emergency.cdc.gov/socialmedia/zombies.asp