Coronavirus COVID-19 - Global Health Pandemic #44

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Trudie said:
I think it is a psychological thing. One can still find plenty of things to do. Again, golf courses are open, walking trails, bicyclists can ride, car washes are open for self detailing, time to mow yards, there is no law against walking on public roads (afaik). Some people might be best served to use their time off work for self improvement. A great time to diet, exercise & declutter, moo.
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Declutter!! YEA. ooo much to clear out.. best time to do it, right? I keep lookin and thinkin.... goona get to it real soon!!
 
oceanblueeyes said:
I know many may disagree with me, but he deserved to be removed.

I come from a military family, and all know there is proper protocol that must be followed. Sending an email is not one of them. He failed to do as expected.

Most importantly HELP WAS ALREADY ON THE WAY. ( capitalized for emphasis since it's a very important fact known to him at the time)

What he did by the leaked email was make ALL family members worry not knowing if their family member was one of the ones infected or not. He caused unnecessary panic for all of them when he knows military families many times cant contact their sailor or marine family members directly.

I have no doubt the DOD was flooded with calls from all family members who had someone on this ship. Imo, it caused unnecessary hysteria, and worry by all family members since ALL on this ship did not have the virus.

He handled it very poorly so he deserved to be removed, imo. Everyone in the military knows very well that all rules in place are to be strictly adhered to at all times. None can just decide on their own to do it differently.

He knows he should have dealt with it differently. Hes not some new kid on the block that wasn't aware of the proper protocals, and chain of commands that must be followed.

And again what was most egregious on his part he already knew help was on the way.

I can understand the sailors, and marines standing by him. They probably didnt know help was already on the way, but he KNEW yet made it sound like no help was coming.

In the military you either follow the rules, and proper protocals or you don't. It's that simple, and everyone in the military no matter which branch knows that all too well.

There are no gray areas. Discipline, and strictly following all rules in place is what sets the military apart from all other careers.

Jmho
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Nice post. You are correct. There is a protocol in the military and unless it is followed, chaos ensues.

At that same time, he is a hero. Things are not always black and white.

I'm glad that he wasn't stripped of rank.
 
ilovewings said:
Coronavirus can spread through talking or breathing, prestigious panel tells White House - CNN

Don't know if this has been posted before: sorry if it has but it is terrifying: Scientists now believe that the virus is aeorosolized so
that you can get the virus by just having a conversation with someone that has the virus or even by the virus lingering in the air and you breathing it in: depends on certain conditions.
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Yes. This has been in the medical literature since almost day 1 of this pandemic. I guess the medical terms or the words of doctors on TV (few as they have been) have not been enough to make this perfectly clear.

This is the reason for social distancing.

Talking, singing, yawning, breathing, sneezing coughing all spread the virus. Virus stays in the air longer in rooms without ventilation. Virus needs water molecules to remain viable until entering a host. Once it hits most surfaces, it starts its deterioration. No one knows exactly how long it lives in air in a closed, still room but the reason for those negative air pressure rooms in hospitals is so that virus-saturated air doesn't escape the room when a carer (with PPE) goes inside.

This is why public transportation is so prone to communicating the virus. Even if everyone were silent, without masks, if they are infected, they are slowly filling the entire vehicle (car, subway, airplane) with their virus. Viral load is real. If just one virion got into your house, you'd likely never notice it and even if you breathed it in, you'd probably be okay (unless very immune compromised). If someone just sneezed near you, you could be surrounded by a crowd of virus, even if several feet away.

But if millions of virions are sitting right outside your face, in the air - well, then, you're going to get a large viral load and become infected. The new Chinese study shows that 80% of people are either asymptomatic or have symptoms just like mine today (cough, no appetite, head congestion).

I have no reason to believe I have CV19, though, as my county has one of the lowest rates in California (95% of the people who presented with symptoms to local hospitals and were tested...are negative for CV19, it was just an ordinary cold).

At this point, in areas where the virus is established in, say 15-20% of the population, who are probably shedding for 2-3 weeks, then places like hospital lobbies and pharmacies and even grocery stores slowly build up a higher viral load. Even if the virus eventually ends up on the floor, denatured and dead, if enough people are in a space (just breathing), the virus will accumulate.

Talking, singing, coughing, yawning - all of these push more of the virus out. Animated talking is not good. Some people take really deep breaths before uttering a string of words, and virus is thereby increased as the deeper part of the lung participates in pushing virus out (that's often where infection is highest anyway).

Wear a mask, stay 6-10 feet away from a conversation partner, keep things brief - especially if that person seems to have a cold.

Also, wear gloves, as door handles, car door handles, credit card machines etc carry a good viral load (until someone disinfects them).
 
oceanblueeyes said:
I know many may disagree with me, but he deserved to be removed.

I come from a military family, and all know there is proper protocol that must be followed. Sending an email is not one of them. He failed to do as expected.

Most importantly HELP WAS ALREADY ON THE WAY. ( capitalized for emphasis since it's a very important fact known to him at the time)

What he did by the leaked email was make ALL family members worry not knowing if their family member was one of the ones infected or not. He caused unnecessary panic for all of them when he knows military families many times cant contact their sailor or marine family members directly.

I have no doubt the DOD was flooded with calls from all family members who had someone on this ship. Imo, it caused unnecessary hysteria, and worry by all family members since ALL on this ship did not have the virus.

He handled it very poorly so he deserved to be removed, imo. Everyone in the military knows very well that all rules in place are to be strictly adhered to at all times. None can just decide on their own to do it differently.

He knows he should have dealt with it differently. Hes not some new kid on the block that wasn't aware of the proper protocals, and chain of commands that must be followed.

And again what was most egregious on his part he already knew help was on the way.

I can understand the sailors, and marines standing by him. They probably didnt know help was already on the way, but he KNEW yet made it sound like no help was coming.

In the military you either follow the rules, and proper protocals or you don't. It's that simple, and everyone in the military no matter which branch knows that all too well.

There are no gray areas. Discipline, and strictly following all rules in place is what sets the military apart from all other careers.

Jmho
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Yes..this one has been a tough one for me. As most of my friends have cheered him on, I am not convinced. I am not military at all...but i do want to see some factual information of what he had done/not done within military protocol. I do feel extra precaution must be in place to protect our troops, and we cannot have chain of command slip out of command... but I do want more information... Do we have any statistical updates on the health of the people on the ship ?
 
Fireflize said:
Local police are present in the mornings at our local grocery store. Customers line up before the doors open, head straight to toilet paper, then foods. I could easily see unrest if our stores are unable to keep food stocked. We had no pork or beef or eggs; but plenty of other foods.
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I'd be right there with them if I had no TP. Fortunately, I had a three months supply before the plague began, so I have about two months worth left.
 
Massachusetts shoppers tackle man after allegedly coughing, spitting on produce amid coronavirus outbreak
A group of Massachusetts shoppers tackled a man and pinned him to the ground until police arrived after catching him allegedly coughing and spitting on produce, fanning coronavirus fears.
...
Once police arrived, the man was told not to return to the store or face trespassing charges. He was then transported to Beth Israel Deaconess-Plymouth Hospital for an evaluation.
...
Kingston police may pursue charges against the unidentified man, including assault and battery, and destruction of property, The Patriot Ledger reported.
...
 
I want to know how Captain Crozier's letter was leaked to the press.
A source familiar with the matter told Foreign Policy that Capt. Brett Crozier had multiple conversations with the chief of staff to acting Navy Secretary Thomas Modly on Monday, just hours before his plea for help leaked in the San Francisco Chronicle. Crozier was fired as captain of the ship two days after the letter was leaked.
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Navy Brass Felt Blindsided by Fired Carrier Captain’s Emailed Appeal
 
Here's a funny story about the toilet paper shortage of 1973.

Remembering the great toilet paper shortage of 1973

"Here's what happened back in December of 1973: "A congressman from Wisconsin, Harold Froehlich, releases a statement saying, 'The next thing we're gonna have to worry about is a potential toilet paper shortage,'" Gersten said.

The warning was picked up by late night king Johnny Carson's writers, who left out the "potential" part. As Carson said during his "Tonight Show" monologue on Dec. 19, 1973: "There is an acute shortage of toilet paper in the good old United States. We gotta quit writing on it!"
 
10ofRods said:
I'm reading several articles about how ventilators are not the way to go. Unfortunately, the way that CoVid robs us of oxygen is almost certainly related to how it binds with red blood cells and a number of other elements in the blood, robbing us of oxygen that way - lungs are relatively okay.

Even more unfortunately, there is little treatment for that. There are oxygen-saturating machines that can be used effectively. I also read that UK has only three of them. I think we have about 5 of them in California - so not much help. Hyperbaric oxygen chambers also work, but there are few of those as well - it's not at all scaleable. At this point, plasma from people who have survived seems to be promising but again, not scaled up yet. Several researchers are optimistic about drugs that will eventually denature the specific protein in CoVid that does this.

The recommendation to provide as much O2 without a ventilator, as is possible, appears to be the way many Italian and now New York physicians are trying to cope.

That low O2 level would explain why some people go to sleep feeling pretty okay and then wake up unable to move or almost unable to move.
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I'm curious whether you or anyone else here knows whether it might be a good idea to skip alcohol for the time being given the impact of COVID19 on red blood cells?

"Alcohol also combines with red blood cells for the process of "blood sludging." In this process, red blood cells clump together and cause smaller blood vessels to plug up. This reduces the flow of oxygen to many vital organs. With less than an optimal amount of oxygen, your organs and your immune system will not operate at peak efficiency."

How Does Alcohol Affect the Immune System? | Livestrong.com
 
Simply Southern said:
I think the recommendations are due to lack of ventilators.

When we give a lot of oxygen, the lung becomes "lazy" and doesn't have to work to breath. This increases the CO2 levels, complicating the patient by trapping CO2 in the bottom of the lung. We tend to "starve" CPOD patients, just a little. By setting the oxygen just below the need, the patient is forced to take a deep breath, which in turn "blows" off the CO2 trapped in the bottom of the lung.

In a ideal setting. The ventilator would be used on a very low volume of air, with a rate - times a ventilator breathes for you, in an assist mode- gives a breath only of the patient doesn't. These setting allows the patient to breath on their own when they can, reduces the "work/struggle" to breath, allowing the body to spend its " energy" healing and for other functions.

We are using drastic measures due to lack of equipment.
Moo...
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No, that's not what they are saying at all. Watch this video

Twitter
 
Diddian said:
I'm curious whether you or anyone else here knows whether it might be a good idea to skip alcohol for the time being given the impact of COVID19 on red blood cells?

"Alcohol also combines with red blood cells for the process of "blood sludging." In this process, red blood cells clump together and cause smaller blood vessels to plug up. This reduces the flow of oxygen to many vital organs. With less than an optimal amount of oxygen, your organs and your immune system will not operate at peak efficiency."

How Does Alcohol Affect the Immune System? | Livestrong.com
Click to expand...

Fascinating. Thank you for that. I'd certainly say that if a person feels as if they are fighting off any kind of "thing" (viral, bacterial) that they should d/c the alcohol (unless of course they are an actual active alcoholic in which case they need a doctor's help).

The doctors I know are in fact seeing an uptick in people trying to down-regulate alcohol intake without dying from the DT's - a very real possibility for these particular people.
 
oceanblueeyes said:
I know many may disagree with me, but he deserved to be removed.

I come from a military family, and all know there is proper protocol that must be followed. Sending an email is not one of them. He failed to do as expected.

Most importantly HELP WAS ALREADY ON THE WAY. ( capitalized for emphasis since it's a very important fact known to him at the time)


And again what was most egregious on his part he already knew help was on the way.

I can understand the sailors, and marines standing by him. They probably didnt know help was already on the way, but he KNEW yet made it sound like no help was coming.

In the military you either follow the rules, and proper protocals or you don't. It's that simple, and everyone in the military no matter which branch knows that all too well.

There are no gray areas. Discipline, and strictly following all rules in place is what sets the military apart from all other careers.

Jmho
Click to expand...
snipped by me
Having served 20 years in the Navy, and on the USS Nimitz, I agree. We were always trained that operational maneuvers and such were to be kept secret, there is no way we can let the enemy know we are compromised in any way. I was flabbergasted when I heard he leaked this to his hometown paper.
I also thought, that he had already tried to get help and the higher ups were brushing him off...so he did it out of desperation for his crew, come to find out that wasn't the complete truth.
 
mickey2942 said:
Oddly, my friend is a nurse, and she may be laid off.? What?! There is literally an absolute standstill at the clinic. No appointments, no surgeries. They are only accepting emergency appointments and pediatric care.

Same with the dentist, the offices are shut down, except for emergencies. Hearing exams, eye exams, podiatry, ortho, every single thing is shut down.
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DH, a locum physician, was sent home from the clinical he was doing out west. In one day, he only had one CT and one MRI. He’s 74 so I’m sure he won’t be asked to do hospital work, RNs & MDs out of work??
 
Boston Corbett said:
Only her fifth televised address in 68 years, other than at Christmas:
Those she has made include addresses at the time of the Gulf war in 1991, on the eve of the funeral of Diana, Princess of Wales, in 1997, following the death of the Queen Mother in 2002, and at the time of her diamond jubilee celebrations in 2012. (Guardian)​
Click to expand...

I grew up in Canada and every Christmas morning the whole family would watch the Queen give her speech on television. Part of the Christmas tradition in those days, not sure if it still is.
 
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