CT - Jennifer Dulos, 50, deceased/not found, New Canaan, 24 May 2019 *ARRESTS* #66

[Ruminations]

IMO, the Court Supervisor was asking FD if the 5/24/19 meeting date was a go at the time specified or whether FD was still trying to work things out with JF. To me this was confusing as I wasn't sure if it was a reference to FD trying to 'get back together with JF' or whether he was asking if FD was working with JF on the timing for the visitation with the children.

My guess here is that Court Supervisor was questioning the timing so that someone from his office could be made available as it was a holiday weekend and no doubt staff availability was limited.

But, going to the FD texts back and forth with LA it to me seemed like FD was quite clear with her when he wanted the children back in CT but I also don't recall if these messages from Puebla happened before or after the LA texts or if it was all going on at the same time.

People all throughout the trial have been asking if we have ever heard WHETHER MT had made any Memorial Day weekend plans with her daughter as she couldn't be present if the Dulos children were present.

I've gone back and looked at the LE Interviews and NOT ONCE did I see any reference to MT saying what her plans were for Memorial Day weekend with her daughter. If anyone finds anything on this topic please post back as I keep going back in the testimony and cannot find anything.

My guess here is that MT had NO PLANs for Memorial Day weekend other than to spend it with FD at 4Jx.

Moo

Agree. The plan was to blend the family and talk disparagingly about Jennifer's "decision" to abscond.

MOO

 

[pernickety]

JS per usual was word parsing and blowing smoke. Not a surprise.

JS didn't say WHO he might have shared the report with. Mama T perhaps? An office assistant perhaps?

Family Court had a very strict protocol in place for the handling of the discredited report.

My question to JS and Associates is simply this: Did you follow the same requirements in your handling of the document as was outlined in 2 paragraphs very clearly by Judge Heller in Family Court?

My belief is that JS took the report in this trial as evidence due him (I disagree with this original Ruling from Judge Blawie iirc), did zero to secure it, and chose to not follow any of the guidelines set forth by Judge Heller in Family Court to very specifically protect the parties involved and the CHILDREN. In short, more slipshod handling of a sealed document by Jon Schoenhorn. Frankly I think the offices of Jon Schoenhorn should be searched, the report in its original form secured and held by the Court, and the office servers searched by a taint team for any/all evidence of the Report and purged along with any/all backups. Will this ever be done in CT? My strong guess is NO, but I do wish the impacted Victims would sue Jon Schoenhorn to make this all a reality as what he did imo is absolutely wrong on so many levels and also contrary to the original guidelines set forth by Judge Heller in Family Court. Jon Schoenhorn tried to gain an advantage from an 'evidence grab' in the MT trial but then chose to not follow any of safeguards put in place to protect the Victims imo and for this I believe he needs to be punished severely either in the Contempt hearings or in Civil Proceedings or in Family Court by Judge Heller.

My guess is that we will see Jon Schoenhorn with his Tesla in autopilot mode zooming down from Hartford dictating to his assistant to create a log for the report handling. I can further see his assistant being asked about the creation date for the log in the Contempt Hearing and then saying, "Your honour, we created the log yesterday because Jon Schoenhorn said we needed one". Judge then asks Assistant about the report and is told, "Your honour, the report was on our server in the office, I digitised it and it was sent out to multiple parties for review and further discussion"..... On and on and on... IMO simply more disrespect on top of everything else we have seen from Defence Counsel over the past 3+ years. Such behaviour imo deserves to be punished and punished harshly.

Jon Schonehorn imo then proceeded to MINE the confidential information in the discredited report to spend 3+ years discrediting JF and absolutely taint the trial of MT with the mere presence of a report that also imo is irrelevant to the proceedings. He did this knowing that the report could to be part of evidence and as such there was no way the jury would ever see the totality of the report to prove that what he was saying was simply implausible and a lie and that MT and FD could NEVER HAVE BEEN HAPPY IN MAY/APRIL as all the bogus filings put forward by corrupt lawyer Atty Micheal Rose on behalf of FD had been DENIED by Judge Heller and visitation as being supervisory had been reaffirmed also by Judge Heller in April, 2019. Jon Schoenhorn used a discredited report that nobody could see to simply create a false narrative as to the state of things in Family Court that based on the record in Family Court simply imo isn't plausible and I say this as someone who read the Family Court file ages ago with the exception of the sealed documents. That Judge R allowed this to take place in this trial is something that I continue to find simply mind blowing as its an absolute false narrative!

I very much think first Judge White and then Judge R erred greatly in allowing the discredited report into the trial and then Judge R it appears did zero to make sure that the report and its contents were being honoured and respected in the very clear way that was outlined by Judge Heller in Family Court.

I do believe Judge R most likely believed that Jon Schoenhorn would treat the report as it was supposed to be treated as outlined by Judge Heller but per usual we see Jon Schoenhorn disregard protocol, not care about the Dulos children or the victim and treat the discredited report with imo absolute disrespect and lack of care and having unclear security in his office or the required log that Judge Heller demanded be present for the report. Did Jon Schoenhorn allow any copies made of the report? Did Jon Schoenhorn allow the report to be digitised and kept on his office server or given to someone else to review? Did Jon Schoenhorn keep the required log established by Judge Heller for the report once he got a copy? I very much the Contempt hearing is public and I do wonder if public questions might be submitted to the Judge Hernandez on the matter as all I can say is I HAVE QUESTIONS about Jon Schoenhorn and his handling of this report !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Jon Schoenhorn imo had a duty to care for the report and it was given to him with that understanding. To the extent that he breeched this duty of care to the discredited report I do hope he is investigated, prosecuted, fined and censored as I believe his use of this discredited report has been beyond anything remotely acceptable or understandable. I also wonder if Civil Litigation against Jon Schoenhorn might even be possible for his imo mishandling of the report on the behalf of the no doubt impacted victims?

Don't think that Audrey Felson is in the clear here either as anything outlined above applies to her as well.

What a despicable bunch of unethical attorneys here to use a report with safeguards in place TO PROTECT VICTIMS and then we see them simply disregarding the Victims and their rights for their own purposes in defending MT.

Shameful, Disgraceful and IMO MOST PROBABLY ILLEGAL TOO.


MOO

See my reply to Waldojabba above. (Just missed yours)

 

[Catz]

Regarding Hutch’s wife forgetting her purse, Id say its extremely rare a woman does that and then waits till the next day to have it dropped off. Most would probably have their phone in it too.
Couple that with the wife not being called to testify to the event makes it really suspect in my opinion. MT was creating her alibi for that morning. . The forgotten purse, the stop at Petu’s, the supermarket selfie with the robot, just to name a few.
MOO

 

[pernickety]

What a despicable bunch of unethical attorneys here to use a report with safeguards in place TO PROTECT VICTIMS and then we see them simply disregarding the Victims and their rights for their own purposes in defending MT.

 

[Ruminations]

JS per usual was word parsing and blowing smoke. Not a surprise.

JS didn't say WHO he might have shared the report with. Mama T perhaps? An office assistant perhaps?

Family Court had a very strict protocol in place for the handling of the discredited report.

My question to JS and Associates is simply this: Did you follow the same requirements in your handling of the document as was outlined in 2 paragraphs very clearly by Judge Heller in Family Court?

My belief is that JS took the report in this trial, did zero to secure it, did not follow any of the guidelines set forth by Judge Heller in Family Court to very specifically protect the parties involved and the CHILDREN.

Jon Schonehorn imo then proceeded to MINE the confidential information in the discredited report to spend 3+ years discredited JF and absolutely taint the trial of MT with the mere presence of a report that also imo is irrelevant to the proceedings. He did this knowing that the report could to be part of evidence and as such there was no way the jury would ever see the totality of the report to prove that what he was saying was simply implausible and a lie and that MT and FD could NEVER HAVE BEEN HAPPY IN MAY/APRIL as all the bogus filings put forward by corrupt lawyer Atty Micheal Rose on behalf of FD had been DENIED by Judge Heller and visitation as being supervisory had been reaffirmed also by Judge Heller in April, 2019. Jon Schoenhorn used a discredited report that nobody could see to simply create a false narrative as to the state of things in Family Court that based on the record in Family Court simply imo isn't plausible and I say this as someone who read the Family Court file ages ago with the exception of the sealed documents. That Judge R allowed this to take place in this trial is something that I continue to find simply mind blowing as its an absolute false narrative!

I very much think first Judge White and then Judge R erred greatly in allowing the discredited report into the trial and then Judge R it appears did zero to make sure that the report and its contents were being honoured and respected in the very clear way that was outlined by Judge Heller in Family Court.

I do believe Judge R most likely believed that Jon Schoenhorn would treat the report as it was supposed to be treated as outlined by Judge Heller but per usual we see Jon Schoenhorn disregard protocol, not care about the Dulos children or the victim and treat the discredited report with imo absolute disrespect and lack of care and having unclear security in his office or the required log that Judge Heller demanded be present for the report. Did Jon Schoenhorn allow any copies made of the report? Did Jon Schoenhorn allow the report to be digitised and kept on his office server or given to someone else to review? Did Jon Schoenhorn keep the required log established by Judge Heller for the report once he got a copy? I very much the Contempt hearing is public and I do wonder if public questions might be submitted to the Judge Hernandez on the matter as all I can say is I HAVE QUESTIONS about Jon Schoenhorn and his handling of this report !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Jon Schoenhorn imo had a duty to care for the report and it was given to him with that understanding. To the extent that he breeched this duty of care to the discredited report I do hope he is investigated, prosecuted, fined and censored as I believe his use of this discredited report has been beyond anything remotely acceptable or understandable. I also wonder if Civil Litigation against Jon Schoenhorn might even be possible for his imo mishandling of the report on the behalf of the no doubt impacted victims?

MOO

I think Michelle had it or at least knew the deets very well since before the murder. As noted above, she asked Bowman if she could mention it.

Bowman had to bow out eventually, and I bet the report was a factor. Michelle couldn't let go of it as a defense. Bowman was aware it was sealed since before the murder and wasn't yet part of the family court's facts- it was being negotiated and from what little I know- it wasn't promising at all for Fotis. It exposed him as a world-class manipulator and willing to weaken the most relevant support in the 5 vulnerable young lives he allegedly cared about. He was throwing 5 babies out with the bath water. After bringing his own soil.

But I think Michelle bought it all and was manipulated into thinking she was the healthy one.

I think Bowman sincerely believed she'd let go of that delusion with distance from Fotis. But she simply wouldn't. She seems very much in that same headspace today, considering her actions that brought her a contempt of court hearing. I don't know who severed that relationship, but no regrets from either side, I bet.

I can't imagine why JS would get mixed up in this. Whatever. It does appear from the outside he is lying about his knowledge of his client and the report. Using insinuation about it is very distasteful as a defense.

I guess Michelle can consider herself lucky she found an attorney at all. Insisting on referring to a sealed report and perseverance on it for years seems like a good reason to find a new client. What astonishingly horrific behavior from such a "healthy" woman.

MOO

 

[afitzy]

Here's portions of CT law re confidentiality of mental health provider records: JFD’s kin may have a civil cause of action against violators of the statutes. Wonder, per Sec. 52-146i, whether the report was labeled confidential by Dr. H or anyone else who passed it on.

Sec. 52-146d. (Formerly Sec. 52-146a). Privileged communications between psychiatric mental health provider and patient. Definitions. As used in sections 52-146d to 52-146i, inclusive...

Sec. 52-146j. Judicial relief. (a) Any person aggrieved by a violation of sections 52-146d to 52-146j, inclusive, may petition the superior court for the judicial district in which he resides, or, in the case of a nonresident of the state, the superior court for the judicial district of Hartford, for appropriate relief, including temporary and permanent injunctions, and the petition shall be privileged with respect to assignment for trial.

(b) Any person aggrieved by a violation of sections 52-146d to 52-146j, inclusive, may prove a cause of action for civil damages.

Sec. 52-146i. Labeling of confidential records. All written communications or records disclosed to another person or agency shall bear the following statement: “The confidentiality of this record is required under chapter 899 of the Connecticut general statutes. This material shall not be transmitted to anyone without written consent or other authorization as provided in the aforementioned statutes.” A copy of the consent form specifying to whom and for what specific use the communication or record is transmitted or a statement setting forth any other statutory authorization for transmittal and the limitations imposed thereon shall accompany such communication or record. In cases where the disclosure is made orally, the person disclosing the information shall inform the recipient that such information is governed by the provisions of sections 52-146d to 52-146j, inclusive.

See citations of above statutes in CT SC ruling: Freedom of Information Officer, Department of Mental Health and Addiction Services, et al. v. Freedom of Information Commission et al. No. 19371. Decided: September 22, 2015

Thank you for this! I will go back and get the language on the handling of the report and publish it here as it imo was quite clear as to confidentiality and the logging requirements and no copies etc.... Very well developed security for this report that was breeched early on by FD, GAL Michael Meehan and FD Atty Micheal Rose which was investigated and punished by Judge Heller at the time.

The 2 attorneys I mentioned in my post above essentially confirmed precisely what you have outlined here. This would all apply my understanding is to MT, Troconis Crew who have been repeating aspects of this now for 3+ years, and any/all attorneys that touched the report. I couldn't get clear guidance on whether Judge Blawie or Judge R have exposure as well. Judge Blawie had the ability long ago to review the report and its history when it was found by CSP and so far as I can see did zero to secure the report. Judge R simply followed along and allowed the report entry into the MT trial and thought he did enough by simply not allowing the sealed report into evidence. I do think BOTH Judge Blawie and Randolph here need to be part of any investigation and the findings PUBLISHED so that this doesn't happen to someone again in CT!

MOO

 

[afitzy]

View attachment 486043

Sadly so true....

Simply enrages me on behalf of the Victims.

WHERE IS ATTY WEINSTEIN?????

MOO

 

[afitzy]

Regarding Hutch’s wife forgetting her purse, Id say its extremely rare a woman does that and then waits till the next day to have it dropped off. Most would probably have their phone in it too.
Couple that with the wife not being called to testify to the event makes it really suspect in my opinion. MT was creating her alibi for that morning. . The forgotten purse, the stop at Petu’s, the supermarket selfie with the robot, just to name a few.
MOO

Yes, so agree. IMO even highly intoxicated women WILL NOT FORGET THEIR BAGS! Wish we had seen her be subpoenaed by the State but probably not worth their time given what was heard from HH imo.

Criminals are usually not that smart and so to see MT document a day that isn't her typical day imo simply provides the Jury with more data points for awareness of the plan and premeditation of the murder of JF.
MOO

 

[Diddian]

I paged back in this thread to return to your post today to ask you if you have any answers as to the difficult question of 'Why' for MT? On Petu comment you made I absolutely agree, not a good friend, self serving and yet another person in the FD/MT orbit who didn't really care about the Victims in the case.

I read your comment initially yesterday and I do think you have brought us back yet again to a question that nobody seems to have an answer to about MT and its been talked about here since the beginning as we have watched this all play out for nearly 4 years in the legal system in CT.

Your view that, "Michelle's best defence was probably the truth with an explanation' is one that I would bet that if you polled 10 defence attorney's that they would agree with you completely. Atty Bowman obviously imo believed it and he worked hard to facilitate resolution outside of a long court proceeding too. Yet, MT and her family have done nothing but vilify him and his efforts now for 3+ years. WHY?

Yet, instead we have seen MT and her new Counsel pursue a very different path. The different path to me as a non atty is basically the old 'catch me if you can' and 'I know nothing' strategy. But, WHY? Is this the better strategy and strategy with a higher probability outcome? To me as a non atty this seems like a high risk strategy with a high probability of negative outcome as you are pitting your defence against the much greater resources of the State and a very motivated CSP evidence gathering operation and with a highly sympathetic Victim in the form of JF and her 5 beloved children.

I'm confused seeing what I've seen from MT and have been watching this all play out now for years!

I'd be curious to hear what you or the the same group of 10 defence attorneys mentioned above would think about the MT legal strategy so far?

As a non lawyer the strategy we have seen from MT just seems like its a cynical and calculated time based bet on the ineptitude or high turnover of CT States Atty's and a bet that CSP LE evidence not making it to trial for jury to hear and the laxity and lack of professional standards required of legal professionals in CT where we have seen Defence Counsel taking a whip saw to the mountain of evidence for 3+ years and Judges allowing it or the State not responding appropriately to the point where what makes it to trial is quite different from what many here possibly expected.

All this is then combined with years of seeing Jon Schoenhorn imo choosing to not really follow appropriate CT procedures in his behaviour representing his client, leaking case evidence to the public via court motions, leaking confidential information to the public/media and conducting a now 3+ year disinformation campaign in the media on behalf of his client which effectively polluted the jury pool imo along with a social media campaign by MT and the Troconis crew that imo had the same effect.

I've watched most of the MT LE interviews a number of times (painful but there was SO much going on) and I simply see Atty Bowman working very hard on behalf of his client to assist her with presenting what she knows to LE and getting to the truth. The dangling of a deal in front of MT at any point in these interviews wasn't even really hidden as we even see then States Atty Colangelo present in Interview 2. Most folks with a similar charge wouldn't have these opportunities from LE and the State and would simply sit in jail pending trial as they couldn't afford bond imo. Any number of times we see Atty Bowman refocusing and clarifying discussion and questions for MT and he almost always was highly effective in getting to the heart of what was being discussed at the time and yet so many times we saw MT very actively imo working against what Atty Bowman was trying to do to move closer to the 'truth'. LE effectiveness imo in this regard was more of a mixed bag in terms of questioning effectiveness imo but they made it very clear to MT that their goal was always to find JF and they kept emphasising the need for truth and information that could move the investigation forward. MT had 3 obvious shots at a deal THAT WE KNOW OF for her cooperation and dismissed them.

Why?

We have seen the Defence posit the idea that MT in LE faced language barriers (think we can put a pin in this idea as she was offered an interpreter and told to ask if she ever didn't understand something), high stress interviews from LE that resulted in MT shutting down or seeking to simply pacify LE by feeding them what she believed they wanted to hear (not sure here either as while frustration and disbelief was evident imo from LE, I saw nothing but courtesy and professionalism from LE and we saw zero to suggest Russian tactics such as those endured by Navalny either!) and given the overall situation and the stress of the investigation I give LE nothing but credit. LE also regrouped and made Interview 3 smaller and less overwhelming for MT which seemed less stressful but yet the deception and lying from MT continued. Why? We saw Atty Bowman in Interview 3 continuing to assist MT with questions as by this time it seemed that he thought he could still make a difference for his client but by the end of this interview it seemed like he too along with LE simply gave up on MT making any attempt to assist or tell the truth. Again, why?

In this case we see a privileged white woman charged with conspiracy murder (top charge) who has spent less than 4 days in jail and has been freely able to travel now for nearly 4 years imo given every opportunity to cooperate and plea down her involvement and YET she never does so. WHY? Also, based on her treatment by the Courts in CT (no jail pending trial) and imo no valid claims for mistreatment or mishandling of her by LE as the interviews imo were all professionally handled imo there is no evidence imo of coercion or mishandling of MT by LE.

The other baffling thing about what we have seen is MT and the Troconis crew going after Atty Bowman with a vengeance in Social Media and we also see MT artist 'friend' imo hiding behind 1st amendment to put on an 'exhibition' in Avon to continue with the theme that MT was 'betrayed' in some way by Atty Bowman and that she is absolutely innocent. We see the Troconis Crew, MT and the 1st Amendment loving/abusing 'artist' going after PG with a vengeance and we also see MT effectively use her atty and Farmington PD to 'steal back' her motor bike from PG when it appears he paid FD who most likely pocketed MT's cash (this to me was a cherry on top of the sundae moment in Court as it showed FD possibly pick pocking MT).

All this came nearly 2 years after the very aggressive campaign by Schoenhorn in pretrial period to have the MT LE Interviews removed from evidence while he also put forward to the Court I believe that Atty Bowman's counsel to MT was effectively legal malpractice if I understood those proceedings properly.

I have no answers to any of this as its probably above my pay grade but my guess is that if a plea had been made long ago at the time of the murder that MT would have been out of jail by now and free to ski the world to her hearts content. We see MT all through this process making her defence choices willingly and YET complaining bitterly of everything that has happened to her as if she were the victim in this tragic case.

I don't see this either as the only victims I see are JF and her children and MT daughter!



MOO

IANAL, but a plea deal only works if the defendant tells the truth. I suspect MT cannot tell the truth without telling what happened to JFD's body and MT's own part in disposing of it. So, any deal she would get would likely still have her serving time.

MT isn't like PG, who - after JFD had gone missing - capitulated to FD's relentless pressure to replace the seats in the Tacoma (but who retained the seats and told LE about them when they began asking questions and continued to cooperate thereafter).

MT cannot corroborate her alibi past 11 am. In her recent testimony, MT's friend Petu attempted to scoot the corroboration of MT's alibi to noon, but that conflicts with MT's own representation of events and it is inconsistent with Petu's own stated claim that she had told MT she was only available for a narrow window of time around 10:45 am. On her alibi script (aka timeline) MT indicated that she went to Petu's store at 11 and was at the waterski pond by 11:20, but "there was no one there to pull me." At 11:52, MT indicated she made an outgoing call and at 11:53 received an incoming FaceTime from "Nicole."

After 11 am, the next time MT surfaces is two-and-a-half hours later at 1:36 pm on the surveillance near 80 MS Rd, when she arrives in tandem with FD (MT in Jeep, FD in his Suburban). Multiple times subsequent to that MT returns to 4JC and white smoke exits the chimney there.

I really think that 2-1/2 hours is critical to the depth of MT's role and as long as LE is unable to find any evidence about where she was from 11 to 1:36, she needs it to remain a black hole. So much so that her friend Petu attempted to stretch the time she spent with her friend that day to reduce the time unaccounted for.

 

[Diddian]

I have a question:

If burning 10 rolls worth of bloody paper towels in a home's fireplace to eliminate evidence, why not burn the rest - JFD's t-shirt and bra, the gloves, and the ponchos?

I don't know, but suspect this:

The bloody paper towels returned with the Tacoma to 80 MS Rd. So, they were there in Farmington, an easy ride to 4JC to burn to ash.

The others - JFD's cut open t-shirt and bra, the gloves, and the ponchos - were somewhere else, not in Farmington, but someplace FD and/or MT traveled to sometime after the multiple burnings at 4JC and the musical-chairs game with the Tacoma's keys after PG arrived at the end of the workday, but before the Albany Ave trip.

I wish more was known about the movements and locations of the ghoulish couple in the hours between 11 and 1:36 pm and the hours between 5 and 7 pm (the first a black hole identified as "at home" and "lunch with Fotis" in the alibi script aka timeline and the second not mentioned at all).

 

[Ruminations]

I have a question:

If burning 10 rolls worth of bloody paper towels in a home's fireplace to eliminate evidence, why not burn the rest - JFD's t-shirt and bra, the gloves, and the ponchos?

I don't know, but suspect this:

The bloody paper towels returned with the Tacoma to 80 MS Rd. So, they were there in Farmington, an easy ride to 4JC to burn to ash.

The others - JFD's cut open t-shirt and bra, the gloves, and the ponchos - were somewhere else, not in Farmington, but someplace FD and/or MT traveled to sometime after the multiple burnings at 4JC and the musical-chairs game with the Tacoma's keys after PG arrived at the end of the workday, but before the Albany Ave trip.

I wish more was known about the movements and locations of the ghoulish couple in the hours between 11 and 1:36 pm and the hours between 5 and 7 pm (the first a black hole identified as "at home" and "lunch with Fotis" in the alibi script aka timeline and the second not mentioned at all).

No idea- but I think Fotis and Michelle appeared more focused on eliminating traces of their DNA and not Jennifer's. They also possibly wanted to NOT introduce Jennifer's DNA to their own residence and vehicles. They never thought bloody evidence found in Hartford would be compared to Jennifer's DNA profile.

MOO

 

[Gardenista]

IANAL, but a plea deal only works if the defendant tells the truth. I suspect MT cannot tell the truth without telling what happened to JFD's body and MT's own part in disposing of it. So, any deal she would get would likely still have her serving time.

MT isn't like PG, who - after JFD had gone missing - capitulated to FD's relentless pressure to replace the seats in the Tacoma (but who retained the seats and told LE about them when they began asking questions and continued to cooperate thereafter).

MT cannot corroborate her alibi past 11 am. In her recent testimony, MT's friend Petu attempted to scoot the corroboration of MT's alibi to noon, but that conflicts with MT's own representation of events and it is inconsistent with Petu's own stated claim that she had told MT she was only available for a narrow window of time around 10:45 am. On her alibi script (aka timeline) MT indicated that she went to Petu's store at 11 and was at the waterski pond by 11:20, but "there was no one there to pull me." At 11:52, MT indicated she made an outgoing call and at 11:53 received an incoming FaceTime from "Nicole."

After 11 am, the next time MT surfaces is two-and-a-half hours later at 1:36 pm on the surveillance near 80 MS Rd, when she arrives in tandem with FD (MT in Jeep, FD in his Suburban). Multiple times subsequent to that MT returns to 4JC and white smoke exits the chimney there.

I really think that 2-1/2 hours is critical to the depth of MT's role and as long as LE is unable to find any evidence about where she was from 11 to 1:36, she needs it to remain a black hole. So much so that her friend Petu attempted to stretch the time she spent with her friend that day to reduce the time unaccounted for.

The only thing I have different is that MT's phone location on 4J's home network was verified by the CAST report for that 11:52 call with Barbara.

 

[Jmoose]

Did anyone notice that Petu rushed to answer the questions AF asked her, to avoid being cut off by Manning’s objections?

 

[angelainwi]

Did anyone notice that Petu rushed to answer the questions AF asked her, to avoid being cut off by Manning’s objections?

yep!!! so Manning had to object earlier and earlier

 

[Diddian]

The only thing I have different is that MT's phone location on 4J's home network was verified by the CAST report for that 11:52 call with Barbara.

Oh yes, I had forgotten that fact from the trial. I was surprised by it and obviously still have not incorporated it into my own thinking about who was where when.

I still spend a lot of time considering: where is Jennifer? Her loved ones deserve to know and it is infuriating that information is/was only known by FD (who took it with him into death) and possibly KM and/or MT - neither of whom gives a damn about what is right or wrong, but only "what serves me?"

 

[Jmoose]

yep!!! so Manning had to object earlier and earlier

Do you suppose that the defense coached her to do this? And-why didn’t the defense ask her any questions about the secret information that she had, which would blow up the state’s case?

 

[angelainwi]

Do you suppose that the defense coached her to do this? And-why didn’t the defense ask her any questions about the secret information that she had, which would blow up the state’s case?

I think she might have done it on her own, but could have easily been coached to do it too. I think she had a copy of the custody report....I don't know if the defense wanted to try yet again to get into it and it may have backfired and the court and jury may have thought why the EFF does Petu have a copy of it? Not a good way to close your case.

 

[Baby baby Jane]

I have a question:

If burning 10 rolls worth of bloody paper towels in a home's fireplace to eliminate evidence, why not burn the rest - JFD's t-shirt and bra, the gloves, and the ponchos?

I don't know, but suspect this:

The bloody paper towels returned with the Tacoma to 80 MS Rd. So, they were there in Farmington, an easy ride to 4JC to burn to ash.

The others - JFD's cut open t-shirt and bra, the gloves, and the ponchos - were somewhere else, not in Farmington, but someplace FD and/or MT traveled to sometime after the multiple burnings at 4JC and the musical-chairs game with the Tacoma's keys after PG arrived at the end of the workday, but before the Albany Ave trip.

I wish more was known about the movements and locations of the ghoulish couple in the hours between 11 and 1:36 pm and the hours between 5 and 7 pm (the first a black hole identified as "at home" and "lunch with Fotis" in the alibi script aka timeline and the second not mentioned at all).

Maybe
-MT ran out of time to burn final items & they had to get out of house because expecting police visit & needed to be somewhere far enough away (Starbucks)

-MT ran out of the duraflame starters and needed that accelerant to really burn remaining things

-The wet clothing didn’t burn so easily … maybe they smelled when burned (there are other items of JF clothing never found they maybe did burn those, or burned too slowly & they just didn’t have time. )

JS going to blame the cliffs, trees, climbing radio signals, mountains and downward pointing cell masts for any phone issues.

 

[Megnut]

I have had multiple theories but most likely no evidence went to 4 JC. I bet she was burning divorce papers. She was having burning parties. She was done with it.

Somebody could test the theory. No logs. No Duraflame. Just papers. Burn white?

If LE hadn't been all over FD and his phone, and if LA and GF hadn't been so wise, FD would've had the children at the Pond. And with no one able to object, MT would have been there too, with her fresh dye and her daughter.

Remember, the Pond, where everyone is family. And where everyone ought to be outraged at FD and MT's sacrilege -- that's where anger ought to be directed.

JMO

 

[afitzy]

Oh yes, I had forgotten that fact from the trial. I was surprised by it and obviously still have not incorporated it into my own thinking about who was where when.

I still spend a lot of time considering: where is Jennifer? Her loved ones deserve to know and it is infuriating that information is/was only known by FD (who took it with him into death) and possibly KM and/or MT - neither of whom gives a damn about what is right or wrong, but only "what serves me?"

Seems like more than a few theories - but I don't believe the co conspirators know nothing about the body, simply imo is implausible.

Body removed from NC and taken to place/s unknown by unknown third party with assistance of co conspirator.

Body taken to Farmington area and disposed of by FD and MT and KM [enough time existed in timeline imo and MT timeline still has a gap where her presence/participation imo is HIGHLY LIKELY].

Body taken to Farmington area and given to 3rd party unknown or one of the co conspirators and disposed of

Forensic evidence at known locations seen in this MT trial (most likely not ALL of the evidence as that will have to wait for KM trial) seem to support the idea that whatever happened did not occur at a known location seen in MT trial.

FD and MT planned entire murder with precision imo so having a prearranged spot to deal with body is something that I've always thought probable, especially seeing the pre dug grave that KM did at Granby Gun Club. Who can't see some other similar set up but just in a location that LE never found?

Whole situation is heartbreaking as you point out. I hope that LE shared what they knew with GF and that she and the children achieve peace on the issue.

MOO