DC - Savvas Savopoulos, family & Veralicia Figueroa murdered; Daron Wint Arrested #7

[i.b.nora]

In the last thread near the end there was some ongoing back and forth discussion regarding the Savopoulos' parking of their cars on 32nd Street across from the driveway of their home.

Some expressed concern about neighborly protocols, etc. From the very beginning I have been curious about that property across 32nd Street. Specifically because of the set back and because of the fence.

So, what I have determined, at least to my own satisfaction, is that the property directly across the street on 32nd Street is owned by the Government of The Commonwealth of Australia and is part of the official residence of the Australian Ambassador which fronts on 3120 Cleveland Avenue and backs on Woodland Drive (unsure of exact address of house that can be seen on Woodland but it is a 3100 blk address). Anyhow, its all part of the official residence of the Australian Ambassador, imo.

Therefore, from Google aerials, it appears to me that the Australian Ambassador has a considerable amount of his own off street parking available for hired help and visitors (except for maybe a big party) that he probably isn't too worried about a car or two parking next to the property on 32nd Street.

 

[Joe Friday]

The part in the article about the burnt Porsche being found immediately adjacent to a parking lot of the apartment complex where the Wallace family lived while Jordan Wallace was a teenager is pretty interesting. The pictures of Wallace certainly show a well groomed short hair style too.

I think LE needs to scour for video footage that might show vehicles entering and exiting that apartment complex to see if any vehicles match the description of vehicles owned by JW.

JMO

http://webcache.googleusercontent.c...e-race-car-driver/ &cd=10&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=us

In information which has never been made public, the rear of the parking lot of St. Christopher’s Episcopal Church is located immediately adjacent to a parking lot of the apartment complex where the Wallace family lived while Jordan Wallace was a teenager, records show.

 

[pinkandgreenmom]

In the last thread near the end there was some ongoing back and forth discussion regarding the Savopoulos' parking of their cars on 32nd Street across from the driveway of their home.

Some expressed concern about neighborly protocols, etc. From the very beginning I have been curious about that property across 32nd Street. Specifically because of the set back and because of the fence.

So, what I have determined, at least to my own satisfaction, is that the property directly across the street on 32nd Street is owned by the Government of The Commonwealth of Australia and is part of the official residence of the Australian Ambassador which fronts on 3120 Cleveland Avenue and backs on Woodland Drive (unsure of exact address of house that can be seen on Woodland but it is a 3100 blk address). Anyhow, its all part of the official residence of the Australian Ambassador, imo.

Therefore, from Google aerials, it appears to me that the Australian Ambassador has a considerable amount of his own off street parking available for hired help and visitors (except for maybe a big party) that he probably isn't too worried about a car or two parking next to the property on 32nd Street.

Thank you for looking into that. Having lived in the area I thought it was either an embassy or a residence of an ambassador/people tied to the embassy. It just has that "look" to it.

I would assume that that building has very high tech security, cameras, etc. Some have guards posted at driveways 24/7. But what do I know. Hopefully they can provide assistance as to who was coming and going.

 

[kammiemc]

I think, horribly unfortunately, that's exactly what this cold, cruel-hearted person did. He had a little pizza break for himself and went back to torturing. It is more than haunting. I can't for the life of me get that scream out of my head. It is beyond sickening and so, so, so, so very sad. Very hard to accept.

 

[Joe Friday]

Anyone have any theory as to how JW was able to open the garage door to gain access to the red car he said he left the cash in?

I doubt the door was left open all night. (That would draw suspicion to the house by neighbors or the security patrol)

I doubt the perp(s) told SS or one of the other to go open the door on his own after JW called 10 minutes away. (whoever would have left and gone for help)

A single perp couldn't have gone to open the door and leave the victims unguarded, unless all victims were securely tied and bound. (Someone would have made a break for it while the perp was in the garage)

I doubt JW would have had a garage door opener in his own car to SS's garage. (I guess we don't know what vehicle JW was supposed to be driving to deliver the money)

Looking at the Google Street View Map there is no walk thru door to enter the garage, nor is there a code box to open the door, that I can see. Link to street view map: https://www.google.com/maps/@38.926...!1e1!3m2!1scx-sLWNbzB9i-Y2bAUHGBA!2e0!6m1!1e1

Didn't JW think it was strange for SS to tell him to leave $40,000 in the front seat of a car that was blocked in by the red Audi? After all JW and SS must of known each other pretty well through racing and being employee/employer driving in the car together talking (think of driving Ms. Daisy here) and had to have some kind of suspicion when he was not instructed to just ring the bell or walk into the house as he might have done every other time he came to the house.

Sure would be interesting to know what JW said when LE asked how he got into the garage.

JMO

 

[Paulas88]

He son was being Torchered, that's what got SS to scramble to get as much cash as he could.

 

[corundogs]

I think DW knows whether he prefers pepperoni or cheese pizza, and he obviously prefers pepperoni.

I think the the cheese pizza was ordered with Philip in mind. Personally I favor the idea that this came from AS in placing the order, hoping not only to feed Philip but also to humanize the situation. "Breaking bread" together, even with one's captor, has had powerful symbolic weight for centuries if not millennia. She needed Wint to see Philip as a human being, to care even a little for Philip as a human being.

However, the gambit failed. Phillip did not eat the pizza, not even one bite. Here I favor the idea that Wint refused to feed him, even with a pizza right there.

I know hindsight is 20/20, but this in addition to everything else should have told SS that Wint had no regard for their lives and well-being. To refuse Philip food served no benefit in getting Wint cash. I presume that there was accompanying evidence of degradation, such as a refusal to allow bathroom breaks. "Will this man allow us to live? Is there any reason to believe this man values our lives?" These are the questions SS should have been asking himself. If Wint showed no ounce of humanity when he needed the family and VF alive, why would he show humanity when he no longer needed them alive? Why would a man with no sense of humanity allow these witnesses to live and be a threat to his freedom?

I can see AS telling Dominos "Just repeat our last order". But that is just my opinion. I just don't see her having a full on convo with the person at Dominos. That could easily have included "the CC on file". I order pizza A LOT and I know those are options - at least on the website, so I would assume it would be the same on the phone.

 

[popsicle]

Anyone have any theory as to how JW was able to open the garage door to gain access to the red car he said he left the cash in?

I doubt the door was left open all night. (That would draw suspicion to the house by neighbors or the security patrol)

I doubt the perp(s) told SS or one of the other to go open the door on his own after JW called 10 minutes away. (whoever would have left and gone for help)

A single perp couldn't have gone to open the door and leave the victims unguarded, unless all victims were securely tied and bound. (Someone would have made a break for it while the perp was in the garage)

I doubt JW would have had a garage door opener in his own car to SS's garage. (I guess we don't know what vehicle JW was supposed to be driving to deliver the money)

Looking at the Google Street View Map there is no walk thru door to enter the garage, nor is there a code box to open the door, that I can see. Link to street view map: https://www.google.com/maps/@38.926...!1e1!3m2!1scx-sLWNbzB9i-Y2bAUHGBA!2e0!6m1!1e1

Didn't JW think it was strange for SS to tell him to leave $40,000 in the front seat of a car that was blocked in by the red Audi? After all JW and SS must of known each other pretty well through racing and being employee/employer driving in the car together talking (think of driving Ms. Daisy here) and had to have some kind of suspicion when he was not instructed to just ring the bell or walk into the house as he might have done every other time he came to the house.

Sure would be interesting to know what JW said when LE asked how he got into the garage.

JMO

Perhaps it is a code accessed garage and he went in that way and closed the door when he left.

 

[pinkandgreenmom]

My parents, who live about an hour away from me, have my automatic garage door programmed into their car so they can open my garage door any time. My parents don't have one of the physical remotes to open it, my dad was able to do something fairly easy (took less than 10 minutes) to set it up. Maybe JW had a similar set up?

ETA: there could also be a keypad outside the garage door? we have that as well for the kids

 

[jd dickinson]

Anyone have any theory as to how JW was able to open the garage door to gain access to the red car he said he left the cash in?

As the hired driver, JW may have had an opener with him to help with jockeying cars when needed, or knowledge of a garage door code.

Didn't JW think it was strange for SS to tell him to leave $40,000 in the front seat of a car that was blocked in by the red Audi? After all JW and SS must of known each other pretty well through racing and being employee/employer driving in the car together talking (think of driving Ms. Daisy here) and had to have some kind of suspicion when he was not instructed to just ring the bell or walk into the house as he might have done every other time he came to the house.

TexMex and I debated this earlier. TexMex wrote:

[W-1] left the money inside a car inside the garage of the family home. He sees the cars are all there, everything seems fine, people are home and will certainly retrieve the money very soon He's been told not to ring the bell because: a) the boy is sick, b) my wife is sleeping c) I'm on a conference call d) all of the above. What could be wrong about giving SS his own money from his own business after a company exec hands it to him after a trip to BOA? So he follows instructions.

I found the conference-call bit persuasive. I replied:

Ouch. You got me with the conference call. That's actually a really good reason. I can practically hear SS saying, "I'm going into a conference call in 5 minutes, so I won't be able to meet you in person. Just put the cash in the driver's seat of the Mosler, and I'll pick it up when I'm off the call."

The old "upcoming conference call" is a great way to cut anything short. No one questions it.

This was following the theory that SS directed W-1 to leave the money in the car only when W-1 called as instructed, 10 minutes from the house.

 

[Paulas88]

JW was told to call 10 min before arrival, I guess DW or crew could then open garage door

 

[birpu]

OK, I'm going all the way out on the limb:

I can't seem to come to any conclusion other than JW being guilty of trying to rip SS off. There are a lot of reasons why I got there. I think maybe there was a deal to get the Porsche for him - steal it. For money. I think the money was to pay Wint for stealing the car. Wint is supposed to not get caught. But Wint instead killed the family and burned the house because he's a cold-blooded psychopath. Then he delivered the car, but something went wrong there. It gets torched, too - either the deal went wrong or JW didn't show to pick it up in time, or realized the family had been killed and torched it himself, something.

I know this theory won't be popular. JW seems like a nice guy - but he's also highly covetous of that lifestyle and of the cars. And of money. And seems very narcissistic to me, and a little unctuous. Those people can be extremely nice - it gets them what they want from others. And they feel entitled to it. SS just replaced him in January as PS's coach. Then he got fired in March. He gets SS to hire him in mid-April. He needs money and sponsors for the races he has coming up. Maybe SS declined. Maybe he felt entitled to take it.

It's just another theory, but I don't see how he isn't involved in the money and car part of this. Too many coincidences. I hope I'm wrong, actually.

 

[katydid23]

Anyone have any theory as to how JW was able to open the garage door to gain access to the red car he said he left the cash in?

I doubt the door was left open all night. (That would draw suspicion to the house by neighbors or the security patrol)

I doubt the perp(s) told SS or one of the other to go open the door on his own after JW called 10 minutes away. (whoever would have left and gone for help)

A single perp couldn't have gone to open the door and leave the victims unguarded, unless all victims were securely tied and bound. (Someone would have made a break for it while the perp was in the garage)

I doubt JW would have had a garage door opener in his own car to SS's garage. (I guess we don't know what vehicle JW was supposed to be driving to deliver the money)

Looking at the Google Street View Map there is no walk thru door to enter the garage, nor is there a code box to open the door, that I can see. Link to street view map: https://www.google.com/maps/@38.926...!1e1!3m2!1scx-sLWNbzB9i-Y2bAUHGBA!2e0!6m1!1e1

Didn't JW think it was strange for SS to tell him to leave $40,000 in the front seat of a car that was blocked in by the red Audi? After all JW and SS must of known each other pretty well through racing and being employee/employer driving in the car together talking (think of driving Ms. Daisy here) and had to have some kind of suspicion when he was not instructed to just ring the bell or walk into the house as he might have done every other time he came to the house.

Sure would be interesting to know what JW said when LE asked how he got into the garage.

JMO

Being the driver, and being responsible for gassing up the cars, etc, he might have had a key to the garage. JMO

 

[katydid23]

I am not sure why DW would need JW's help or what kind of help he even could offer. ???

DW entered the home, without JW's help.

DW got SS to call around for money, w/out JW's help.

The only reason that JW brought the cash over was because SS set it up that way. Anyone could have dropped it off.

WHY did DW need Jw for this awkward, horrendous crime?

 

[birpu]

Anybody else wonder if LE hauled all the cars off to dust for fingerprints and compare them to that latent print found on the water bottle?

 

[jd dickinson]

Didn't JW think it was strange for SS to tell him to leave $40,000 in the front seat of a car that was blocked in by the red Audi? After all JW and SS must of known each other pretty well through racing and being employee/employer driving in the car together talking (think of driving Ms. Daisy here) and had to have some kind of suspicion when he was not instructed to just ring the bell or walk into the house as he might have done every other time he came to the house.

Adding to my prior reply ....

SS's coolness under fire, honed as a successful CEO and even in motorsports, turned out not to be an asset in this situation. We know Philip was screaming, and we know that Wint didn't trust either of the women to be on the phone, other than AS briefly with Domino's. But SS was cool under fire and was able to communicate with a variety of people, sometimes with extraordinary requests ($40K cash on almost notice, mysterious drop of cash in car, etc.), without anyone being suspicious enough to push further, let alone involve LE. Even poor VF's husband, banging on the door, was somehow sent away with a ludicrous call by SS, even when the husband knew that there were people in the house and cars parked everywhere.

Wint's had a masterful accomplice in SS, who also helped keep the others calm and quiet. I know what SS was trying to do and what he hoped would be the result of full cooperation, but I subscribe to the notion that anyone willing to tie up my family, while not wearing a mask, means to kill us all. In fact, that's the logical ending. Why should Wint leave four eyewitnesses alive?

I think this is a stumbling block for police investigators. They intuit that Wint must have had an accomplice to control those four murdered people for so long. He did: SS.

At the same time, I know SS was only trying to save his family and VF from harm. He was motivated by his heart and his belief in the humanity of fellow man, even a captor. But his son had the better instincts.

I would be interested in a discussion about what SS's right move should have been, at various points. For example, cowardly as this sounds, I think SS getting out of the house himself would have been a great move, at any opportunity including the very first moment he came home. Would Wint escalate to murder knowing that he was leaving a surviving witness? The rational move would be to try to physically stop SS from leaving and, failing that, getting out of that house himself. What kind of criminal is going to stay cornered in a house in order to escalate his crime?

SS presumably carried a cell phone. Run for the door, yelling "I'm calling 911!" Get to the street. Call 911. Game over in 3 - 4 minutes. If Wint had any brains at all, he'd be using those minutes to get out of the neighborhood.

I also believe, and this is proven, that thinking through scenarios and decisions in advance helps make those decisions immediate and successful in real life. This happened to me in one emergency situation, and I reacted instinctively - but only because I had thought through what I was willing to risk, and I was therefore not afraid of violence, nor did I freeze in surprise or caution. Part of my interest in this case is trying to think through the proper decisions that should have been made. As a society, we need to be smarter and not just victims to criminals. Don't let the bad guys win the same way again and again. Next time, we'll be prepared, but only if some lessons are learned.

Do you think 4 guys with box cutters are ever going to control a U.S. commercial jet again? They weren't even about to keep control of the 4th plane that day, because the passengers had learned what happened to the first 3 planes. This is how a society keeps the upper hand.

 

[birpu]

I am not sure why DW would need JW's help or what kind of help he even could offer. ???

DW entered the home, without JW's help.

DW got SS to call around for money, w/out JW's help.

The only reason that JW brought the cash over was because SS set it up that way. Anyone could have dropped it off.

WHY did DW need Jw for this awkward, horrendous crime?

Maybe it was the other way around. JW wanted Wint's help. ?

 

[Joe Friday]

JW was told to call 10 min before arrival, I guess DW or crew could then open garage door

If there was a crew then they needed to come and go in some vehicle. You would think someone had to have noticed a strange car, van, truck parked outside the home over night or someone had to drive the get away car before the house was set ablaze.

I can tell you one thing. A crew of perps didn't leave in a Porsche 911. A Porsche 911 is basically a two seater. There are back seats, but trust me you there is not enough leg room for an adult to sit there. As you can see in the pic there isn't even enough room for a child seat.

 

[SpanishInquisition]

I am not sure why DW would need JW's help or what kind of help he even could offer. ???

DW entered the home, without JW's help.

DW got SS to call around for money, w/out JW's help.

The only reason that JW brought the cash over was because SS set it up that way. Anyone could have dropped it off.

WHY did DW need Jw for this awkward, horrendous crime?

We don't know how JW got in and as you point out there was no reason that JW was needed to drop off the money. SS didn't need JW and could have just had the AIW employee that was the bank signatory do the whole thing. JW is some rooking employee of SS's who had only been there a few weeks after he got fired from his last job - why use him if you don't have to - and we don't know whose idea it was to use JW. We also don't know what conversations JW overheard in his capacity of SS's driver, like perhaps hearing SS talk about AIW's bank accounts, so JW could have indeed helped DW by telling him about the accounts and how much was in them as well as who SS talked to about them. Everything you say may be true, but we can't just say for sure that it is true.

 

[Joe Friday]

Anybody else wonder if LE hauled all the cars off to dust for fingerprints and compare them to that latent print found on the water bottle?

LE could have dusted for prints where the cars were parked. Although leaving the cars outside in the drive way for a week might not help the cause if they were looking for prints on the outside of the cars.

My suspicion is they took them somewhere to be processed for forensics, trying to find DW's DNA inside one of the vehicles.

Wouldn't that put a twist in THINGS?