Discussion between the verdict and sentencing

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I don't think so Interested Bystander (although I usually tend to agree with your posts) as it's a separate charge/offence, but I do think that JM found OP guilty of CH instead of acquitting him to prevent an appeal and also so that he wouldn't appear to be getting off scot free. Just my opinion, and based on no legal knowledge or expertise :)

Not quite sure how I managed to write that. Brain not in gear, methinks. Thank you for pointing it out. In my head I was thinking CH but I obviously had a mental aberration along the way.:notgood:
 
May I just clarify a point.

Pistorius has now been convicted of CH, not charged.
An accused is charged with an offence before trial, and if found guilty is convicted of an offence.

He was taken to Court on the Charge of Murder with Intent-and the Judge ended up Ruling Charge of Culpable Homicide- that's what he's been Charged with, he's now just awaiting sentencing for this Charge, if I am correct on this ? He has therefore been convicted of Charge of CH, no ?
 
Sports Psychologist Ken Jennings says what Oscar Pistorius needs now is psychological healing.

“Oscar has gone through a lot, he is emotionally and mentally drained. What he now needs is some kind of healing process that will lift him out of his negative space. However, this healing process will take some time, I cannot say how long it will take, it won’t be overnight,” adds Jennings.

http://www.sabc.co.za/news/a/b829cb...o-compete-again:-Sports-Psychologist-20141609

I’d say 52 days is more than enough time to pick up where he left off with his last girlfriend.

This guy sounds really stupid...he does not need to "pick up" with any girlfriend...he has been having a relationship all along.
 
Hi IB, I can't find the judgment for this and I'm not having any luck Googling his name either. Can you help please?

I am still looking and very reluctant to give up but I have opened all my past history links and couldn't find it. What I didn't do was check whether there were any sub links - someone please tell me if that is possible. This is not my strongest point. I find it strange it doesn't appear in any of the main links. Can anyone else suggest what I can do to improve my history search?
 
http://www.iol.co.za/news/south-afr...hooting-tragic-mistake-1.1058485#.VBlpZ2SwLTY

that word 'mistake'.
also the fact that being religious is somehow mitigating.

was op a serious/regular church goer? prior to the event i mean... there are a couple of passing comments regarding religion in his book. it comes across that his mother was very religious.

At least this guy rushed his wife to hospital.
What did Oscar do ? He called his mate down the road and called Netcare who apparently told him to take Reeva to hospital with 3 gunshot wounds , one that blew some of her head off and brain tissue...............and an ambulance wasn't actually called to the House to help Reeva until Dr Stipp arrived and asked the Standers if an ambulance had been called - Oscar did very little to get Reeva immediate medical assistance.....which as far as most view that behaviour was just part of his delaying getting anyone of any authority to his house to see that crime scene - all indications of an attempt to cover up his so called 'mistake', and Oscar's guilt that the Intruder story came later to try excuse his actions.
 
I am still looking and very reluctant to give up but I have opened all my past history links and couldn't find it. What I didn't do was check whether there were any sub links - someone please tell me if that is possible. This is not my strongest point. I find it strange it doesn't appear in any of the main links. Can anyone else suggest what I can do to improve my history search?
Is there a link anywhere to the actual Judgement by Masipa online yet ? Someone on DS forum posted that they'd read it , the full version, but I have yet to see a link for it anywhere.
 
What were the conditions of his original bail, anyway? Does anyone have a link to these .. I can't seem to find anything via google (have looked on lisa's blog, too).
 
.. and why on earth was this condition set aside??
Oscar's staying at his Uncles, where as Nel said, the family own about 50 guns, -restricting Oscar to not carry a firearm on his person should have been a priority and obvious ruling, I also have no idea why that wasn't imposed. Oscar may have argued it's for protection-but as he was in Court on 4 Counts all crimes related to gun use and his recklessness,one being Murder Charge it's absolutely ludicrous this wasn't imposed- it says more about the Judicial System in SA and how blatantly bias they have been to Oscar or they are not as tough on gun crime as they purport to be.
 
“The video was filmed by an American company hired by the defence to reconstruct the shooting but Pistorius’s lawyers chose not to show it in court. They’re furious that the footage has apparently been sold on to Australia’s Channel 7. In a statement the athlete’s legal team said the video was obtained illegally. While the Pistorius family described its broadcast as a staggering breach of trust and an invasion of privacy”.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yxyoiuYbaO8

Judge Greenland is subsequently interviewed by Jason McCrossan:

JM: The Australian television station Channel 7 has come under lots of criticism mainly by the defence team for leaking footage of OP re-enacting the fatal shooting of his girlfriend which showed the South African Olympian stumbling forward awkwardly without his prosthetic legs and holding his arm out in front of him as if he was carrying a gun, the footage suggesting that Pistorius may be more mobile without his prosthetic legs than his defence team has claimed during the trial. Do you think this is likely to be damaging?

JG: There’s a lot of discussion about it and we don’t know all the facts at the moment, but from my point of view there’s a very, very, very important issue that now has arisen. A lawyer/advocate cannot lead evidence in court that he or she knows to be untrue. Now Derman’s evidence in particular seemed – and I put it no higher than that – seemed to say that Oscar had very, very little mobility. A short video that I saw seemed to suggest that he had just about normal mobility in terms of an effectiveness test as opposed to an efficiency test. So his evidence appears to be irreconcilable with what we’ve been shown on that video which in simple language would mean that he has lied and it would also mean that if the defence team, if the lawyers and/or advocates that are acting for Oscar knew the true position and then led this evidence to the contrary, the implications and repercussions of that are enormous and could actually lead to disbarment. I am saying this simply as a possibility, Jason. At the moment we don’t – the issue is not clear. I’m simply saying that on what I see on the video and when I compare that to Derman’s evidence, potentially there’s a very serious problem here.

JM: I saw a statement earlier on which said the prosecution team have not seen that video. However, what about Judge Masipa? Do you think she’s likely to have seen the video and if and when she does, do you think she’ll have to act on it, and what would that action look like?

JG: Your question is this: Is she aware of it? The answer is yes and no. As a human being I have no doubt whatsoever that she’s aware of it. As a judge she is not aware of it. In other words, she cannot take any cognizance of that video until it is actually presented in court, and that I believe will probably happen simply because if I were Gerrie Nel I would leave no stone unturned but to expose the existence of this video because it gives the lie or seems to give the lie to the evidence of Professor Derman. You know, Derman said that as regards disabled persons and OP, flight was not an option because he had no mobility. This completely torpedoes the whole premise of his evidence and has a knock-on effect. So I suspect that State counsel will make application one way or the other to get this video before the court.

JM: And so does that then mean that all Mr Derman’s evidence could be just struck out of the court records?

JG: No. What it would mean, if what I suspect is right, it would mean that at the end of the trial the State would be able to argue that he has been guilty of mendacity and that therefore his evidence – he has no credibility and any reliability. It would destroy his evidence. And I have said there are other repercussions. If I was the Court I would want to know from the defence why this evidence was led in view of the fact that this video existed. It seems improbable – you see, this video was commissioned as part of an expert’s report and the person who conducted the test and compiled the report came to the conclusion that it was only consistent with innocence on the part of OP – it therefore seems improbable that the video was not made available to the defence.

http://www.podcastpedia.org/podcasts...is-N-Greenland

All of the above makes sense to me. So the DT hire the company to make the video and then don't watch it - balderdash. I have absolutely no respect for the defence team at all. We've all seen the smoke and mirrors, badgering of the ear witnesses, particularly Michelle Berger, to the point where everyone was talking about it, the delaying tactics used by Roux - his next couple of witnesses weren't available because they have young children when it turns out they in fact work ... the list goes on and on.

To expose the total hypocrisy of this verdict in light of what we know at least informs others who aren't so aware.


:judge:
 
At least this guy rushed his wife to hospital.
What did Oscar do ? He called his mate down the road and called Netcare who apparently told him to take Reeva to hospital with 3 gunshot wounds , one that blew some of her head off and brain tissue...............and an ambulance wasn't actually called to the House to help Reeva until Dr Stipp arrived and asked the Standers if an ambulance had been called - Oscar did very little to get Reeva immediate medical assistance.....which as far as most view that behaviour was just part of his delaying getting anyone of any authority to his house to see that crime scene - all indications of an attempt to cover up his so called 'mistake', and Oscar's guilt that the Intruder story came later to try excuse his actions.

I think the stories are too similar to be a co-incidence; the religion, mistake, ringing Netcare (and probably not saying anything - just registering a call), whereas at least Mdunge did take his wife to hospital. Highly suspicious to me.
 
Sports Psychologist Ken Jennings says what Oscar Pistorius needs now is psychological healing.

“Oscar has gone through a lot, he is emotionally and mentally drained. What he now needs is some kind of healing process that will lift him out of his negative space. However, this healing process will take some time, I cannot say how long it will take, it won’t be overnight,” adds Jennings.

http://www.sabc.co.za/news/a/b829cb...o-compete-again:-Sports-Psychologist-20141609

I’d say 52 days is more than enough time to pick up where he left off with his last girlfriend.


Sports Psychologist Ken Jennings says it will be difficult for convicted athlete, Oscar Pistorius, to attract public support should he return to athletics.

Jennings says Steenkamp's death will continue to haunt him, thereby affecting his performance.

"Over the last 18 months he has not trained nor has he competed against one. During this period an athlete normally tends to lose their edge and self-confidence. An athlete needs support from the public and the media. This support fuels their performance and heightens their desire for achievement. If Oscar ever gets back on the world stage of athletics, he will have to deal with feelings of shame and embarrassment," adds Jennings


Good!
 
Oscar's staying at his Uncles, where as Nel said, the family own about 50 guns, -restricting Oscar to not carry a firearm on his person should have been a priority and obvious ruling, I also have no idea why that wasn't imposed. Oscar may have argued it's for protection-but as he was in Court on 4 Counts all crimes related to gun use and his recklessness,one being Murder Charge it's absolutely ludicrous this wasn't imposed- it says more about the Judicial System in SA and how blatantly bias they have been to Oscar or they are not as tough on gun crime as they purport to be.

Totally agree with you .. but, I was referring to the bail condition about him not being charged with violence again women, which I quoted in my post .. this was the bit I quoted ..

The conditions Judge Bam set aside were:


• that he not be charged with an offence relating to violence against women while on bail; and
 
I think the stories are too similar to be a co-incidence; even the religion, mistake, ringing Netcare (and probably not saying anything - just registering a call), whereas at least Mdunge did take his wife to hospital. Highly suspicious to me.

i agree, huge co-incidences. one main difference though... no mention that mdunge crept to the bathroom shouting and screaming like a woman.

oscar had to 'disappear' the argument in his version.
 
He was taken to Court on the Charge of Murder with Intent-and the Judge ended up Ruling Charge of Culpable Homicide- that's what he's been Charged with, he's now just awaiting sentencing for this Charge, if I am correct on this ? He has therefore been convicted of Charge of CH, no ?

He's been convicted of the crime of Culpable Homicide.

People are charged before going to trial. They remain charged until the trial is over, and then they are either acquitted or convicted.
 
Ken Jennings is a moron. Yes OP was so emotionally drained. That's why he went clubbing during the trial to pick up girls.

But that was "self-harming behavior" while in his 'negative space'. :facepalm:
 
admittedly the post-shooting behaviour differs... but the incident is startlingly similar. and if this was in the news at the time... there goes masipa's argument as to why op immediately had the intruder story, and stuck to it.

sorry to repeat the content but i am so amazed by the similarities:

In his plea, Mdunge said he and Thobile were asleep at their home when he was woken at about 00:00 on 13 April 2011 “by a strange noise like a window opening”.

He thought that a burglar was trying to get into the house.

'Fearful of his life'

“The accused was fearful of his life and grabbed the gun that he keeps in his bedside pedestal drawer at night for protection from unwanted intruders in his home.

“The accused then made his way to the entrance door of the room and could hear the noise coming from the bathroom.

“The accused then slowly made his way to the bathroom door to investigate the noise, thinking that the burglar was hiding in the bathroom.

“As the accused reached the bathroom door, the bathroom door suddenly slid open and the accused, afraid for his life, panicked at being startled by the door suddenly opening and he fired a shot from his gun at the person who opened the door.

“After the accused had discharged the shot he realised that it was his wife that he had shot, thinking she was a burglar, it was said in Mdunge’s plea statement.

It added that Mdunge “immediately” rushed Thobile to Mediclinic Hospital.


http://www.news24.com/SouthAfrica/News/Man-who-shot-wife-in-error-can-sympathise-with-Oscar-20140407

I guess if you do happenstance to visit the toilet in the night in SA it's okay for someone to mistakenly kill you? Not sure (without husbands background)what to think of this case.
But still?!!!
I'm thinking Scott Peterson wishes he'd thought of this method of operandi.


JMO
 
What were the conditions of his original bail, anyway? Does anyone have a link to these .. I can't seem to find anything via google (have looked on lisa's blog, too).

I have found this which in fact includes handing guns in. I have decided the press aren't too accurate in their reporting but then I should have know that shouldn't I!

"Chief Magistrate Desmond Nair had set bail at 1 million rand (£73,000). The 26-year-old track star was also ordered to hand over his passports, turn in any guns he owns and keep away from his upscale home in a gated community in Pretoria, which is now a crime scene.

He cannot leave the district of Pretoria without his probation officer's permission and is not allowed to consume drugs or alcohol, the magistrate said."

Oscar-Pistorius-reports-to-authorities-under-bail-conditions.html

BUT I recall he also had to report to the police. It seems he did not go to the police station but met them (probably at Uncle A's at a guess). This family run rings around SA Law.

I will see if I can find with the actual bail hearing papers.
 
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