Discussions on Formal Sentencing Hearing - Jodi Arias #5

[MeeBee]

The more I think about this Juror 17 issue, the more I think it's the right outcome. A life sentence frees the Alexanders from having to continuously having to go back to court to relive this nightmare, and the issues around this juror are a good lesson for Juan and future prosecutors to check out jurors a lot better during the selection phase .. if she lied to the court she will be raked over the coals and hopefully prosecuted for that, ALSO Nurmi and Wilmott cannot really claim a moral victory, 11 of those jurors wanted to impose death, and there will forever be questions around the lone holdout. Beyond that, Juror 17's husband number 2 is about to get his butt kicked on social media (and perhaps even in the real world) for trying to profit from this situation, and Jodi is going to Perryville for life and will soon fade away.

A fairly good outcome

That's the way I'm looking at it.

I agree Ms. G. I've been thinking about this and I feel this might have been the best possible outcome here for exactly all the reasons you stated.

Jodi will never have the satisfaction of being able to say the jury spared my life because they saw I was abused. Even the holdout appears to not have really said that in deliberations, only that she had mental issues that made it hard for her to cope. It's like getting the validation of the death penalty without giving her the death penalty, a sentence which will hang over the Alexanders until she dies and had a high chance of being overturned. 11 jurors and 2 alternates plus one would be alternate all said they wanted her to die, they saw right through her, she was a psychopath, she was a liar, she dragged Travis through the mud and he was a good guy, yes, with flaws. But not a monster.

And even if it's never proven or shown, there will always be questions about her holdout having a vendetta against Juan Martinez as the reason for sparing her life and being a problem juror. In the aftermath of the hung jury all the news was about this juror and this information that apparently never came out until after the trial.

This is going to seem like a petty comparison, but it's like in NFL playoffs when the Cowboys beat the Lions. There was a very controversial call in the game that madr everyone think it was a problematic win. You couldn't even be satisfied with it because of this cloud hanging over it and that's all anyone could see. The fix was in, some thought and the Lions should have won:. It was a very unsatisfying victory.

That is probably how Jodi and the defense feels now. Sure they "won..." but not really.

 

[wendiesan]

I don't like Civil cases as a second shot after a criminal one. To me that is the one that matters, I get that people don't agree with me, I just don't see an upside and in the end I think she hurts them over and over again. JMO

That's certainly possible.
However, I just think it would hurt them more to know that JA had made a ton of money from a book deal or a movie deal and was able to continue trashing their brother from her prison cell at the same time.

 

[ScarlettScarpetta]

Well, dang, I miss the "I heart *advertiser censored*" shirt.

What freaks me out is she could have been JA's sister. She never should have been on this jury.

 

[TartLemon]

I really don't understand what took the Warden so long to shut down the media stream. JA has been there for almost 7 years, leaving in @ a month. Seems to me the damage is already done. Why on Earth did he allow those ridiculous, narcissistic interviews right after the GUILTY verdict? The went long into the wee hours didn't they?

Closing the gate after the corral is emptied?

 

[wendiesan]

100% agree...just like first jury they agreed in advance not to disclose anything other than their own vote. If they had so many concerns they should have met with the judge privately first and maybe they did tell her all of this...I don't know. The names being released is very bad too.

In fact, releasing the names was illegal.

 

[Fuskier]

http://cdn-static.wildabouttrial.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/03/arias-minute.pdf

All I can say is OMG! (Scroll down to page 3). :gaah:

Thanks for this post Hez. Appreciated... demonstrates there was more information than what was known in the public domain. Gives sufficient context IMO.

 

[steelman]

Well, dang, I miss the "I heart *advertiser censored*" shirt.

He probably doesn't wear it when she is around him......that would be disrespectful......and you know what a big thing "respect" is in the gangster lifestyle.

 

[memoriesbymichelle]

The more I think about this Juror 17 issue, the more I think it's the right outcome. A life sentence frees the Alexanders from having to continuously go back to court to relive this nightmare, and the issues around this juror are a good lesson for Juan and future prosecutors to check out jurors a lot better during the selection phase .. if she lied to the court she will be raked over the coals and hopefully prosecuted for that, ALSO Nurmi and Wilmott cannot really claim a moral victory, 11 of those jurors wanted to impose death, and there will forever be questions around the lone holdout. Beyond that, Juror 17's husband number 2 is about to get his butt kicked on social media (and perhaps even in the real world) for trying to profit from this situation, and Jodi is going to Perryville for life and will soon fade away.

A fairly good outcome

That's the way I'm looking at it.

I tend to agree with you. I wanted the DP to wipe that smirk off her face, but since the hung jury she continues to spew venom where ever she can. I am glad the Sheriff is closing her down. And I'm glad that she will hopefully be in prison for the rest of her life (still waiting on that though), and I am glad that the Alexanders won't have to keep trying to keep her in. They may not see it right now, but I think down the road they may count this as a blessing. Plus, it doesn't seem like Jodi is very happy so, for THAT, I am extremely happy. Plus she cannot bandwagon on that other lawsuit now, and she won't get unlimited appeals. I am very happy. The juror issue is unfortunate but that's life. And I still hope that Nurmi will get his wish and he and Wilmott will be scrutinized for years and years and hopefully neither of them will ever have a budding career.

 

[Buttercup117]

It would be instant ratings and in the media biz it's all about getting the eyeballs for advertisers. That's just their angle for the pitch, has nothing to do with reality

All I can say is "way to go Sheriff Arpaio"!

 

[cady]

I really don't understand what took the Warden so long to shut down the media stream. JA has been there for almost 7 years, leaving in @ a month. Seems to me the damage is already done. Why on Earth did he allow those ridiculous, narcissistic interviews right after the GUILTY verdict? The went long into the wee hours didn't they?

Closing the gate after the corral is emptied?

Everyones hero Sherriff Joe, is an attention-seeker. JMO

 

[audreyparker]

It sounded to me as though JSS thought that two was enough, that they didn't need to take to time to talk with the other nine.
I think KN or JW may have made her anxious by their statements, IIRC, that because JSS was talking with the jurors one at a time, that she was interfering with the judicial process and so they should have a mistrial.

I agree. It was a win-win for the defense. If the judge replaced J17 with an alternate the defense could argue she interfered and caused a DP verdict and may pave the way to have the death sentence overturned. If the judge left her on, they knew enough about her to suspect/know she was their "only one" that was needed.

 

[Hatfield]

From Jeff Gold:
Jeffrey Evan Gold ‏@jeffgoldesq · 2m2 minutes ago

Judge Stephens issues copious "minute" justifying her #JodiArias #Juror17 decisions..
More of s written opinion than minute.

I think JSS did not read this part carefully enough....

"One court found proper grounds for removing a deliberating juror refusing to deliberate include: a juror’s unwillingness to engage in the deliberative process (not willing to participate in discussions with fellow jurors by listening to their views and by
expressing his or her own views; expressing a fixed conclusion at the beginning of deliberations and refusing to consider other points of view; refusing to speak to other jurors; attempting to separate oneself physically from the other jurors).
"

Sounds to me that is exactly what was going on and sounds to me JSS had every right to remove her and use an alternate.

 

[ScarlettScarpetta]

"The Supreme Court has instructed that a trial judge may not single out a lone “hold out”
juror and suggest he/she reconsider his/her position to allow the jury to reach a verdict. That
court found this conduct to be reversible error in State v. Huerstel, "

This to me from the Document about the Jurors, Is why it was the right verdict. It was never going to be better than that.
There was no way once this Juror was seated that it was going to go any other way.

 

[MeeBee]

Why am I being attacked for having an opinion? The Alexanders are not being attacked by me or even criticized. They will do what ever they want to without a nod to me in any way shape pr form.
I just see how bad this has been for them. They are wrecked from the death of their brother. If anyone here does not think that JA won't make it as ugly as possible for them again, they are not thinking.

It will be worse because it is not a criminal case with strict rules. She will hurt them over and over again.

The thing is I don't think the Alexanders really care about that. They have known every step of this way this would be painful. They are doing this for Travis. They are enduring this for Travis. They knew if they continued to pursue the death penalty it would be painful and there would be things said that would be hard to hear and make them angry. They do it anyway because they feel it is the right thing even if it hurts them. I would think it makes them feel strong.

Jodi uses that exact kind of thing as a bargaining chip or a weapon and they don't let her win. She says I'm going to hurt you as much as I can so back off and they say so what? Bring it. They don't let her hurt them or hold any power over them to where they are too afraid to do what the feel is right. Most families do appear to pursue these kinds of actions after their loved one's murder trial so I don't see how the Alexanders should be any different.

 

[Mindmatters]

I in no way shape or form intend to defend the actions of j17....but, it was also asked of the other jurors if they felt j17 was now deliberating. Those quoted did note an improvement after speaking in chambers.

Yes, this is what is stated. But for me the fact that they all of the other 11 jurors concluded and agreed that she initially refused to deliberate is the real issue at hand, and potentially paying lip service after the fact is a very, very real possibility--which would be all but impossible to determine.

Another thing is IF this juror lied to JSS when she was questioned about the whether or not she engaged in any social media activity regarding the LOA, The Secret, or Dirty Little Secret while sitting as a juror, and/or attempting to introduce this into legal deliberations then it is absolutely imperative that she be charged and prosecuted for that.

At the end of the day, if we are serious enough to ask people (jurors) to consider death as a sentence for crimes, we must be serious enough to ensure that jurors (especially on Captial Murder juries) are held to the highest standard allowable by law IMO.

 

[daisydomino]

I'm completely satisfied with all the answers about J17 provided in that PDF (as I understand them.) Jurors have a right to privacy. Nobody needed to look at her Facebook before she was impaneled. She swore under oath that she could be unbiased. They can't subpoena her Facebook or ISP logs or waterboard her, so accept that she's telling the truth. Her opinion, while really different than mine (ours) is valid.

She still deserves respect and privacy now.

 

[Madeleine74]

I noticed something after the verdict and then the media interviews with the 11 jurors:

The sheer pain, regret, guilt and emotions expressed by the 11 jurors in their media interviews seemed to have somewhat of a soothing effect on TA's family. Like it helped them to see that most of the jury not only took this case seriously, but took the fate of this case seriously and understood how devastating it was (and would be) to the family and they also felt devastated.

Maybe it's about shared pain or seeing that the jury suffered too, but I noticed it and thought it was helpful that the jury spoke out about their feelings as that (inadvertently) reached the Alexander family in a way no one else could. Afterall, it's hard to be mad at 11 people who wanted so desperately to resolve the case in the exact way you had hoped they would and feel so terrible and sad about not getting to a unanimous resolution that they are in tears about it.

 

[MeeBee]

I really don't understand what took the Warden so long to shut down the media stream. JA has been there for almost 7 years, leaving in @ a month. Seems to me the damage is already done. Why on Earth did he allow those ridiculous, narcissistic interviews right after the GUILTY verdict? The went long into the wee hours didn't they?

Closing the gate after the corral is emptied?

I think the only damage done was to Jodi herself, as far as the interviews go. They just expose her for the narcissistic little control freak that she is and it completely undermines her future evil media ruined my chance for a fair trial appeal since she is the one who was constantly courting them.

 

[Amster]

Attention getting is such an addictive drug.....

 

[tcrockett]

Yes, this is what is stated. But for me the fact that they all of the other 11 jurors concluded and agreed that she initially refused to deliberate is the real issue at hand, and potentially paying lip service after the fact is a very, very real possibility.

Another thing is IF this juror lied to JSS when she was questioned about the whether or not she engaged in any social media activity regarding the LOA, The Secret, or Dirty Little Secret while sitting as a juror, and/or attempting to introduce this into legal deliberations then it is absolutely imperative that she be charged and prosecuted for that.

At the end of the day, if we are serious enough to ask people (jurors) to consider death as a sentence for crimes, we must be serious enough to ensure that jurors (especially on Captial Murder juries) are held to the highest standard allowable by law IMO.

Oh I absolutely agree with you. I think, though, that JSS did just enough to ensure that this verdict stands in spite of how F'd up it is