Family wants to keep life support for girl brain dead after tonsil surgery #6

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This whole case saddens me, I can't imagine my baby girl dying and never being able to hold her in my arms. But at some point, reality has to kick in and the grieving process has to begin. Prolonging the grieving process by keeping a dead body around can not be healthy (physically or mentally).

<modsnip> So they know she's dead but can't accept it? Are in denial? I also noticed someone asked her if Jahi was out of coma yet, so they are telling people she is in coma, rather than that they took her dead body home?

This is one of the most bizarre things I've ever seen on the internet, and I've seen youtube.
 
kaki said:
Wow...that is sad. They actually believe she will recover...wow.
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I'm not sure I believe they think she will recover, but the longer they keep this tragic story in the news with their antics the more donations they'll receive. They are up to $55k so far.
 
kaki said:
Wow...that is sad. They actually believe she will recover...wow.
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Mother said she beleives that god will spark Jahi's brain "awake."
I am not sure why Jahi needs to be on a ventillator for that.
Clearly they do realize she needs to be kept on ventillator for her heart to continue beating, or they wouldn't have fought so hard to keep the ventillator plugged in.
 
jjenny said:
Dead person is dead. But you have been arguing that it's up to the relatives to decide that? How far are you willing to take this argument? If I don't believe my grandpa is dead, should I be able to sit his body up in my living room and keep on collecting his pension checks?
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Don't forget to feed him too. :rolleyes: :doh:
 
BetteDavisEyes said:
This family seems convinced that Jahi will be alright when she's fed. All the nutrients in the world are not going to help a brain dead girl. :moo:
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They are completly ignoring the whole concept of brain death. Sounds like they are really more focused on her lack of nutrients..i dont know why this shocks me though..at this point.
 
jjenny said:
Why? Why the heart stopping means dead but brain being dead doesn't mean dead? What if I just dont' believe that just because his heart stopped it means he is dead.
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I believe she's no longer viable. Jahi will pass soon. If that's what her mother needs to come to grips...so be it.
Just like I have no problem with other people dressing up and putting the corpse of their loved one on display to say good-bye.
We need to have compassion for the living.
The laws do need clarification and if Jahi's situation brings about clarity, and brings peace to her mothers heart...I can live with that.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
iamnotagolem said:
I'm not sure I believe they think she will recover, but the longer they keep this tragic story in the news with their antics the more donations they'll receive. They are up to $55k so far.
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That's where I am at right now. If she is alive they will keep recieving donations and she will be "disabled" so the malpractice cap stays high. I am really really disgusted that someone out there actually operated on this child's body. I will never understand how this isnt illegal.
 
Byrne is saying that Pope John Paul II, rewrote the papers where he said that brain death was acceptable but those papers weren't published before he died. Then they disappeared in the vatican. So Byrne and others published what Pope John Paul II supposedly wrote that disappeared......Ha! Ha! Ha!

eta: the program wasn't very long. Here is the link again for other that may want to listen later. Hopefully they will post it in the archives http://avemariaradio.net/resources/archives/
 
Melanie said:
Would Jahi still have a gag reflex?
l
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No.

No gag reflex.

That is one of the test of brain /brainstem death and has been tested by multiple physicians, including Dr. Fischer of Stanford.
 
BeginnersLuck said:
Byrne is saying that Pope John Paul II, rewrote the papers where he said that brain death was acceptable but those papers weren't published before he died. Then they disappeared in the vatican. So Byrne and others published what Pope John Paul II supposedly wrote that disappeared......Ha! Ha! Ha!
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Aside from the obvious :floorlaugh: .... Dear mother of all things good. And John Paul went to medical school where? :banghead:
 
dh109977 said:
That's where I am at right now. If she is alive they will keep recieving donations and she will be "disabled" so the malpractice cap stays high. I am really really disgusted that someone out there actually operated on this child's body. I will never understand how this isnt illegal.
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I truly believe it is, honestly. But we may not have any idea who the doctor was or where this was done. I'm hopeful that the coroner, courts, etc. know, and I personally hope we see some ramifications, because performing medical procedures on dead bodies is a scary thing. JMO.
 
wendiesan said:
Not sure if this is posted already. If so, let me know and I'll delete.

TODAY at 5:20 EST on Ave Maria Radio there will be a discussion/debate

Dr. Paul Byrne v. John Haas

John Haas is the director of the National Catholic Bioethics Centre.

Centre spokesman, John diCamillo, said that "medical doctors have the competence to determine death, as long as they do it in a rigorous fashion. That is legitimate with the Catholic church." (http://www.nbcbayarea.com/news/loca...-Jahi-McMath-With-Jesus-Christ-239314591.html)

According to what I read at the Ave Maria Radio site, it should be possible to hear the discussion live later today.
http://avemariaradio.net/resources/archives/

Dr. Paul Byrne's views regarding Jahi McMath's status as to living or deceased can be found at http://www.nbcbayarea.com/news/loca...-Jahi-McMath-With-Jesus-Christ-239314591.html

Obviously, there are differences of opinion within the Catholic church as well as within the general population. The last paragraph of the nbc article says:

"The Catholic Church does not believe there can be any opposition between faith and science since both are gifts from God, the source of all truth."

It could be an interesting discussion. It looks as though there may be a posting in the archives of AMR later this evening.
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This timeline covers the Church and State rulings on death.





http://www.coma.ulg.ac.be/papers/vs/death_unconsciousness_NatureRevNeurosci05.pdf
 
BetteDavisEyes said:
This family seems convinced that Jahi will be alright when she's fed. All the nutrients in the world are not going to help a brain dead girl. :moo:
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What kind of food does one insert into a deceased person and where does it go? This is too strange. I can't comprehend it.
 
ItsJustaName said:
Long time lucker here. I registered in order to post on this topic.

I believe that Jahi was a very sick girl before the surgery. I'm sure that she was told that there were risks associated with the surgery. I am equally sure that the nurses in the PICU did not tell Jahi and her guests to suction her.

If those things are true and Jahi's family had anything to do with her death, it makes perfect sense to me that in order to emotionally distance themselves from their actions, that they would vilify the hospital/nurses/doctors and be in denial about her death.

I don't think its that unusual for someone to accidentially cause harm (maybe rear ending a car) and to then try to come up with reasons why it was really the other dirvers fault(he stopped too fast). With most of us that process of denial resolves itself fairly quickly. Either with reason, or objective witnesses or judgment.

In this case, Jahi's family may not be able to accept the enormity of their actions and need to stay in denial. The grandmother in particular bothers me. As a LVN she should know how hard nurses and doctors work. The uncle is something else. The picture on his instagram with his arm around Dolan grinning is bizarre.

The mother is truly grieving. Nothing will convince her Jahi is gone. That type of grief speaks to me of deep feelings of guilt. Guilt that her daughter needed the surgery. Guilt that she agreed to it. Guilt that it wasn't done on a different day so there would be a different outcome. If she did anything that really could have affected the outcome (not tell drs about bleeding, making her talk, feeding her, suctioning) then that guilt would be overwhelming. I would fell suicidal if I had done anything that had caused my child's death. Blaming the hospital may the the only way she can cope.
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I feel this is insightful. I also think that NW by not pulling the plug feels that she has done everything to save her child in addition to demanding she be fed. I am thinking of her words "what kind of mother would I be if I let them unplug her." It is another way of coping with the guilt and greiving. Feeding seems to be an important part of mothering for her. JMO of course.
 
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