Fast Food Workers Want $15/hr

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The Obamacare legislation had a BIG impact on many large restaurant chains and franchisees. Bottom line is unless the government is PRINTING MONEY they will run out of it, and that is exactly what is happening.

Not sure why, but the Denny's near me just disappeared after being in the same spot for years and years! We stopped there for breakfast yesterday and *poof* they're gone! I'm stunned as this place was always packed and I don't think we've ever been there that we didn't wait at least a few minutes to be seated. So many local restaurants are closing or have closed in the past year or so. Very sad for the owners and the many employees who lost their jobs.
 
Sonya, I don't know if small businesses are having trouble or not. Last I heard their health care costs were going to be subsidized. Did your Republican House kill that measure while maintaining tax cuts for the super-rich?

"Subsidized"??? Oh....that free magical money. I think subsidized means I will be paying for it in taxes. It ain't free.
 
So much of this thread, and all the posts that have stories about how sometime in the past, someone worked hard and got a raise or moved up - so much of it sounds, to my ears, like: "I got mine, too bad for the rest of you". Raising the ladder once you've made it up. Not realizing that for so many others, the ladder was never even in reach.

There's just absolutely no sense of solidarity with fellow human beings. I don't know how anyone lives life with that kind of attitude, I truly don't. I also don't get appeals to the constitution either, as if it were some sacred document handed down by god almighty himself written in stone. That piece of paper was written by very privileged white men over 200 years ago. Is that really where we want to freeze human and societal development?

I can only speak for my own post, but do you not agree that those who were unable to move up due to inability to make change should have been worked with and taught how to do it, so they could start climbing the ladder? Or do you think they should have just gotten the same raise as those who COULD do it, but keep doing the same job they'd been doing, just because they're human? (And I'm referring to those who WERE hard workers, reliable, etc but couldn't make change. The ones who stood around, showed up late all the time, wouldn't even have been considered, nor should they have)

It's not "too bad for the rest of you", it's "how can we help 'the rest of you' get into a situation where they can move up?" but not "let's just double your salary because you're human."
 
It's not "too bad for the rest of you", it's "how can we help 'the rest of you' get into a situation where they can move up?" but not "let's just double your salary because you're human."

In the U.S. the public school systems spend the MOST on the LOWEST achievers. The schools with a 50% drop out rate cost far more than the schools with high scores and a much higher graduation rate.

Makes sense right? Spend the most money on educating the lowest achievers with the highest drop out rates! Because that benefits the nation! Yuppers, tis' written!

Now China, they have this crazy notion of spending the most on the HIGHEST achievers, those that are bright and can benefit the most from education are given the best education.

Crazy concept that! Apparently the Chinese have common sense and that may be why they are a rapidly rising superpower.
 
I can only speak for my own post, but do you not agree that those who were unable to move up due to inability to make change should have been worked with and taught how to do it, so they could start climbing the ladder? Or do you think they should have just gotten the same raise as those who COULD do it, but keep doing the same job they'd been doing, just because they're human? (And I'm referring to those who WERE hard workers, reliable, etc but couldn't make change. The ones who stood around, showed up late all the time, wouldn't even have been considered, nor should they have)

It's not "too bad for the rest of you", it's "how can we help 'the rest of you' get into a situation where they can move up?" but not "let's just double your salary because you're human."

But aren't you sort of assuming that everyone is going to "move up"? We can't ALL be management/middle management/high level employees. There is always going to be a "lowest level" of work in society, otherwise we'd all be managers not producing/selling/providing any services at all.

There will always be people, whether through their own fault, or due to no fault of their own, that are either not smart enough, not healthy enough, not motivated enough, or simply not lucky enough, to "move up". Not to mention that there is no room for *everyone* to move up! Do we care enough about them to treat them with dignity? People wonder, for example, why fast food workers are often inept or cranky - maybe because they are paid and treated like crap, by both their employer and the public? When we pay people less than what it takes to live with dignity and not have to rely so much on social programs (which, incidentally, are often bemoaned by the very people unwilling to even consider increases in minimum wage! :banghead: ), we devalue them. We say to them, "you are not worth my extra few cents."
 
Sorry I perhaps have said Declaration of Independence and/or Comstitution, as there was a least one post earlier in thread which appealed to it.

In reality the constitution says nothing about minimum wage, or the government's obligation to provide free education, much less paying for all meals to feed the children receiving a free education, or free healthcare, or food stamps etc...

Our Founding Fathers were brilliant men. Bold men. They would be rolling in their graves if they saw the state of this nation now. Though of course if they could anticipate all future problems they would have only used European slave labor which was called "indentured servitude". The European slaves were cheaper, MUCH cheaper, and well....
 
In reality the constitution says nothing about minimum wage, or the government's obligation to provide free education, much less paying for all meals to feed the children receiving a free education, or free healthcare, or food stamps etc...

Our Founding Fathers were brilliant men. Bold men. They would be rolling in their graves if they saw the state of this nation now. Though of course if they could anticipate all future problems they would have only used European slave labor which was called "indentured servitude". The European slaves were cheaper, MUCH cheaper, and well....

Yes, it says nothing about it, and my point was that anyone who appeals to either document as if they were handed down from heaven, isn't someone I can have a discussion with. Because I don't see either document as the be all/end all of how a society of civilized people should be set up and run. Nor do I think the progress of humanity - or just our nation - should be frozen in the standards of a small subset of privileged men who lived over two centuries ago. There is no mention of human rights, no mention of mention of things like work safety, social security, a social safety net, child labor protections, child abuse protections, elder abuse protection, any of the things that indicate to most people the progression and improvement of societies.

Bold they might have been, but they were only able to be so because they were lucky enough to be white protestant male property owners. Women, people of color, non-wasps, non-property owners certainly didn't have that luxury.
 
THANK YOU! Someone gets it.

How many people on this thread have ever tried to negotiate for something? Do you start at the price you want or do you start higher, give them room to chew you down?

If you want 10$ or 11$/hour, you surely don't start there.

I worked for a small business for 6 years. We had five employees. When times got tough, the Boss cut all our hours and went out and bought himself a Porsche...... THAT is how it rolls in America. And if you are one of the Porsche owners, the rest of us scum simply aren't willing to work hard enough.

And by-the-way, he got pi$$ed when I wouldn't complement his new car.

And it wasn't like it was his money to do with as he chose in the first place, right?

Sounds like he should've fired one employee & kept hours for the other 4.
 
But aren't you sort of assuming that everyone is going to "move up"? We can't ALL be management/middle management/high level employees. There is always going to be a "lowest level" of work in society, otherwise we'd all be managers not producing/selling/providing any services at all.

There will always be people, whether through their own fault, or due to no fault of their own, that are either not smart enough, not healthy enough, not motivated enough, or simply not lucky enough, to "move up". Not to mention that there is no room for *everyone* to move up! Do we care enough about them to treat them with dignity? People wonder, for example, why fast food workers are often inept or cranky - maybe because they are paid and treated like crap, by both their employer and the public? When we pay people less than what it takes to live with dignity and not have to rely so much on social programs (which, incidentally, are often bemoaned by the very people unwilling to even consider increases in minimum wage! :banghead: ), we devalue them. We say to them, "you are not worth my extra few cents."

You are right that not everyone will move up to upper or middle management. But the standard (based on most places I've worked) is a raise after 90 days, and an annual review/raise after that, just for doing your job.

I'll have to defer to others with specific fast food industry knowledge, but at the theater, anyone could move up if they met a few qualifications. We didn't have to wait for an opening. There could be 12 box office attendants working on a given shift - some of them might be working the snack bar or cleaning trash but they still get the box office pay.

You had to work there 90 days to become a cashier, and prove you could make change. You had to be available to work any shift. You had to have a good attendance record and no disciplinary actions.

30 days later, you could work in the box office if you continued to not have disciplinary actions, had good attendance, and an accurate cash register history. (Less than a $2 variance per shift)

You were being paid more because you were trained to do more things, so they had more choices of where they could use you. By the time you reached the box office, the pay was more than double minimum wage.

There were a couple people I remember that preferred to just clean the trash since they didn't have to deal with the public, and turned down chances to move up. Do you think they should be paid what the box office people were making? They are the ones who should stay at the lowest end, since they are choosing to be there!

I still stand behind what I've said earlier though, that I don't think raising the pay in fast food is the right answer, I think it will push the unskilled worker out of the job market because skilled workers will want their jobs.

I think the answer lies somewhere between changing the public assistance system in favor of those who work but can't make ends meet, and offering training to help people get the skills needed to get out of the minimum wage fast food jobs.

I'm not cold-hearted, I just think the domino effect of this proposition is going to end up hurting these workers more than it helps them.
 
That's so weird, I have worked for more than one company where the owners have gone without salary to get through a rough spot.

I currently earn $177.00 a week so I can pay my employees. If something doesn't soon change, I'll have to drop to $50 a week. I drive a 2002 vehicle and live in a 900 sf home. You're always going to find someone who is greedy and unscrupulous, but labeling all business owners like that is completely unfair.

I cannot speak to anyone's situation but my own but this same individual, when asked by one of his employees (single mother raising two children, one with a disability) for a raise, responded with "why give her more money, she is just going to spend it". :doh: No kidding genius. That is why we go to work. To earn money to spend.

So please, do not paint every small business owner with the same brush. Not all sacrifice for their employees, but bravo to those who do. Kudos for having some values and standing up for what is right.

And FWIW, I did the payroll and paid the bills. I knew what everyone there made. I knew what the score was. And these women were making well below the average for the job they were doing.
 
And it wasn't like it was his money to do with as he chose in the first place, right?

Sounds like he should've fired one employee & kept hours for the other 4.

You mean he "deserved" that Porsche because he "earned" it by cutting our hours??

What kind of message is that sending? Tough titties for one of you, but I still got MINE!!!
 
How do they do that without taking a salary? Maybe because, unlike the poor and working poor, they have the privilege of having access to lines of credit to help float them? Or in the past they made enough to put some money aside for such a situation, whereas someone making less and living paycheck to paycheck does not?

Business owners, large or small, have access and privilege that the working and lower classes to not, to help them through such a situation. They are lucky. Not everyone is.

I'm always curious when people are so anti people having the opportunity to provide not only for themselves but others, why they are so anti. Without the private sector there could be no public sector.
 
You mean he "deserved" that Porsche because he "earned" it by cutting our hours??

What kind of message is that sending? Tough titties for one of you, but I still got MINE!!!

So he didn't own the company that paid for your salary and ultimately his porsche?
 
Yes, it says nothing about it, and my point was that anyone who appeals to either document as if they were handed down from heaven, isn't someone I can have a discussion with. Because I don't see either document as the be all/end all of how a society of civilized people should be set up and run. Nor do I think the progress of humanity - or just our nation - should be frozen in the standards of a small subset of privileged men who lived over two centuries ago. There is no mention of human rights, no mention of mention of things like work safety, social security, a social safety net, child labor protections, child abuse protections, elder abuse protection, any of the things that indicate to most people the progression and improvement of societies.

Bold they might have been, but they were only able to be so because they were lucky enough to be white protestant male property owners. Women, people of color, non-wasps, non-property owners certainly didn't have that luxury.

We have to have a basis for a government, if not the Constitution, then what?
 
It really bothers me that these corporations take advantage and benefit from the infrastructure our tax dollars pay for - education, transportation, health care.

Just sayin'.

Yes, how dare they get any type of tax break for providing jobs, that enable people to pay taxes, and education, and provide any sort of healthcare to employees...it's all the governments job.

/sarcasm
 
We have to have a basis for a government, if not the Constitution, then what?

I said a few times, it should not be the be all/end all. It's fine as a starting document. It's fine as a beginning. But again, it should not be ALL there is to a society.
 
I'm always curious when people are so anti people having the opportunity to provide not only for themselves but others, why they are so anti. Without the private sector there could be no public sector.

Who said they are anti-people-havingthe-opportunity-to-provide-for-themselves-as-well-as-others?

Being in fair of a living wage, or just a higher minimum wage, in no way makes a person anti-whatever-it-was.
 
I currently earn $177.00 a week so I can pay my employees. If something doesn't soon change, I'll have to drop to $50 a week. I drive a 2002 vehicle and live in a 900 sf home. You're always going to find someone who is greedy and unscrupulous, but labeling all business owners like that is completely unfair.

my car is older, AND the air just went out, right as our heat wave happens. :banghead:

This economy has wreaked havoc on my personal economy, but somehow one foot in front of the other, one project in front of another and we make it through as long as we can.

It irritates me that people think that all or even most small business owners or conservatives in general have this safety net...I don't! What little I had was gone along time ago. I still make better money doing AND am able to be at home with my kid doing what I do now. I have had little part time jobs in the last couple of years to tide us over but if I had to pay for child care on top of it, I'd have lost money. I'd never see my child if I went back to the corporate world and those hours, and I'd probably be arrested after dealing with one too many entitled employees, who can't understand revenue doesn't equal profits.
 
In the U.S. the public school systems spend the MOST on the LOWEST achievers. The schools with a 50% drop out rate cost far more than the schools with high scores and a much higher graduation rate.

Makes sense right? Spend the most money on educating the lowest achievers with the highest drop out rates! Because that benefits the nation! Yuppers, tis' written!

Now China, they have this crazy notion of spending the most on the HIGHEST achievers, those that are bright and can benefit the most from education are given the best education.

Crazy concept that! Apparently the Chinese have common sense and that may be why they are a rapidly rising superpower.

The worst education decision, IMO, was when the trade schools were phased out. There was a time when we let kids choose either a trade to learn in high school or the college bound courses. Today, think of how many of the kids leaving HS or dropping out early could instead be enticed to learn a trade. There are so many new green technologies that could be put in place with the right people. Alot of the development in these areas is stymied due to the fact that the only folks really qualified are often degreed workers who demand top pay. Computer programmers, mechanics, etc. They still did 1/2 day of academics and then 1/2 of tech. We really need to revisit this concept. Many kids are just not college bound.
 
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