FL- 12 Story Condo Partial Building Collapse, many still unaccounted for, Miami, 24 June 2021 #2

[SouthAussie]

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Engineers see inconsistencies between the building design and the amount of steel reinforcement in some areas.


BBM
Engineers who have visited the scene or examined photos of the wreckage of the Champlain Towers South condominium complex have been struck by a possible flaw in its construction: Critical places near the base of the building appeared to use less steel reinforcement than called for in the project’s original design drawings.

The observation is the first detail to emerge pointing to a potential problem in the quality of construction of the 13-story condo tower in Surfside, Fla.

The condo tower’s 1979 design drawings, provided by the town of Surfside and reviewed by structural engineers and The New York Times, indicate that the vertical columns in many parts of the building were supposed to provide a critical structural connection to horizontal slabs, embedded with eight rods of reinforcing steel — four in one direction, four in the other — near the tops of the slabs. But the reinforcing rods in the parking area, left exposed in many places after the parking deck slab slammed down to the lower level, appear to be fewer in number.

 

[bears10]

I don’t see why a private company would step in to help people who did not keep up on their home maintenance. I understand in the Champlain Towers case because of the collapse. But in the case of people who just have to move out temporarily because they neglected repairs — they are on their own. These are not apartment buildings. They are condominium complexes. Part of the responsibility of owning something is taking care of it.

while I agree to an extent, there are definitely owners who rent out their condos. I don’t know if the renters have a say or not. I’m not familiar with these types of communities.

 

[Jinkasaurus]

I am trying to imagine how the people who lived in the portion of the building that did not collapse are feeling right now, knowing they cannot go back into their units to retrieve items.

Yes, they should be thankful to alive above all else, but I am sure it is not easy knowing ALL of your belongings, furniture, perhaps photos or other important items are just going to be added to the pile one the building is destroyed.

 

[moonlessnight]

or their pets

I am trying to imagine how the people who lived in the portion of the building that did not collapse are feeling right now, knowing they cannot go back into their units to retrieve items.

Yes, they should be thankful to alive above all else, but I am sure it is not easy knowing ALL of your belongings, furniture, perhaps photos or other important items are just going to be added to the pile one the building is destroyed.

 

[moonlessnight]

the idea of living on a cruiseship might not be so appealing...

This is scary too. With the Delta variance gaining such momentum in Florida.... 6 firefighters have tested positive.

At Least 6 Firefighters Test Positive For COVID At Surfside Condo Collapse Search Site

 

[moonlessnight]

unfortunately, fully vaccinated people have gotten sick and a small percentage have died from Delta.

If they and the other first responders have all been vaccinated, it shouldn't be a problem. It's only a problem for people who have refused to get vaccinated or small children.

 

[Betty P]

In the clinics where I work we have been seeing fully vaccinated patients who have tested positive for COVID. The Delta variant is being blamed.

That's not surprising. Even when you're vaccinated, when you're exposed to unvaccinated people, you can pick up COVID 19. The difference is the vaccinated person either has no symptoms or very mild ones.

First responders in dangerous situations such as the tragic collapsed condo site in northern Miami should be protected with vaccines.

while I agree to an extent, there are definitely owners who rent out their condos. I don’t know if the renters have a say or not. I’m not familiar with these types of communities.

A few of the people evacuating the condo complex today mentioned they were renting. Renters have no control over maintenance of buildings. That's the responsibility of the owner (landlord) and the HOA. JMO, if the people being asked to evacuate a dangerous building are renters, they have legal recourse against their landlord, HOA, etc. IANAL, but it works that way in most states.

Complaints Against Negligent Landlord | Florida Premises Liability Lawyers

 

[JaxFlaGal]

This is scary too. With the Delta variance gaining such momentum in Florida.... 6 firefighters have tested positive.

At Least 6 Firefighters Test Positive For COVID At Surfside Condo Collapse Search Site

Well, that article said the firefighters who caught Covid working the collapse weren't from Miami-Dade... Looks like at least 7 cases were from the Jacksonville (Duval County) area. They sent 80, and 7 came home earlier than the rest after contracting Covid-19. 7 JFRD personnel contract COVID-19 during Surfside condo search

Duval County is an area of Florida with a lower rate of vaccination (47% of those over 12 years old) than the average in the state (58%). http://ww11.doh.state.fl.us/comm/_p..._archive/covid19-data/covid19_data_latest.pdf

 

[moonlessnight]

Will they air the demo? I am interested to see how different it looks from the collapse.

@BrookeShaferTV
· 1m
JUST IN: 24 people confirmed dead in condo collapse in #Surfside. 124 unaccounted for. There are serious concerns about the remaining part of the building. County moving forward w/ demolition. Gov. said it will likely be brought straight down with some kind of charge. @CBSMiami

 

[Betty P]

unfortunately, fully vaccinated people have gotten sick and a small percentage have died from Delta.

Then unvaccinated people should get vaccinated or be quarantined. JMO.

 

[SouthAussie]

unfortunately, fully vaccinated people have gotten sick and a small percentage have died from Delta.

Not to get off track on this thread ... but I doubt that the rescue crews are aged. The aged are more susceptible and always have been.

BBM
Eight people under the age of 50 died after getting the Delta variant, the data showed. None was fully vaccinated, while two had received one dose of the vaccine.
“Someone aged 80 who is fully vaccinated essentially takes on the risk of an unvaccinated person of around 50 – much lower, but still not nothing, and so we can expect some deaths”
Vaccinated people are dying from the Delta variant, but in small numbers and almost all are over 50, UK data shows

 

[JaimeInLA]

while I agree to an extent, there are definitely owners who rent out their condos. I don’t know if the renters have a say or not. I’m not familiar with these types of communities.

In the event of a condo building being condemned, renters are in a much less precarious financial position than owners. The owners would still have to pay the mortgage. Because the owner violated the lease agreement by not providing a safe place to live, the renter can move out, and basically just walk away. They would no longer have to pay rent to that landlord. They would request their security delposit back and move on to a different place.

 

[GatorFL]

If so, that's shocking. One would think they are given priority in getting vaccinations, due to their work. If any of them made a conscious choice not to get vaccinated, there isn't much anyone can do for them.

First responders were given priority nationally. I'd guess the vaccinated number among them is closer to 75%.

 

[Dontknow?]

Surfside Condo Wreckage Hints at First Signs of Possible Construction Flaw

Engineers who have visited or examined photos of the wreckage of the Champlain Towers South condominium complex have been struck by a possible flaw in its construction: Critical places near the base of the building appeared to use less steel reinforcement than called for in the project’s original design drawings.

Reached by phone, Allyn E. Kilsheimer, a forensic engineering expert hired by the town of Surfside to investigate the collapse, said the investigation was still in its early stages. But he confirmed there were signs that the amount of steel used to connect concrete slabs below a parking deck to the building’s vertical columns might be less than what the project’s initial plans specified.

Surfside Condo Wreckage Hints at First Signs of Possible Construction Flaw

 

[Dontknow?]

Search and rescue efforts at collapsed Surfside condo paused for demolition preparation

Search and rescue efforts at the partially collapsed South Florida condo will temporarily pause as officials prepare for the demolition of the building's remaining units, Miami-Dade County Mayor Daniella Levine Cava said Saturday.

Search and rescue will resume on safe sections of the site once officials are cleared to do so, she said.

The number of confirmed deaths remains at 24, Levine Cava said, and 121 people are unaccounted for.

Surfside, Florida condo collapse: Search and rescue efforts paused for demolition preparation - CNN

(No more recoveries and less missing than this morning.)

 

[Hope32]

Hopefully they can check the building for any pets that were left prior to demoing the rest

 

[IceIce9]

First responders were given priority nationally. I'd guess the vaccinated number among them is closer to 75%.

As a first responder I was able to get my first COVID shot back in December, 2nd shot in January.

Sadly though some of the first responders I know have decided not to be vaccinated, even though were eligible months ago.

 

[Chelly]

Crews on lookout for pets in Florida condo building collapse | WFLA


MIAMI (AP) — It was a small moment of hope amid all the pain and devastation: a cat on Saturday was seen wandering a lower floor of the remaining flank of a 12-story condominium complex that partly collapsed near Miami.

 

[SuziQ]

 

[CrimeAway]

Crews on lookout for pets in Florida condo building collapse | WFLA

I think that the authorities are being disingenuous if they are just suddenly aware of a cat in the building. There have been reports of such for days now. JMO