FL - 17-yo Boy Shot to Death by Neighborhood Watch Captain

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Shooter of Trayvon Martin a habitual caller to 911

At the focal point of a shooting scandal: a mild-mannered neighbor who fixated on crime and focused on young, black males. By Frances Robles
frobles@MiamiHerald.com

Read more here:​
http://www.miamiherald.com/2012/03/17/2700249/shooter-of-trayvon-martin-a-habitual.html

Zimmerman told neighbors about stolen laptops and unsavory characters. Ibrahim Rashada, a 25-year-old African American who works at U.S. Airways, once spotted young men cutting through the woods entering the complex on foot, and later learned items were stolen those days.
“It’s a gated community, but you can walk in and steal whatever you want,” Rashada’s wife, Quianna, said.
They discussed the topic with Zimmerman when the watch captain knocked on their door late last year. Zimmerman seemed friendly, helpful, and a “pretty cool dude,” Ibrahim Rashada said.
“He came by here and talked about carrying guns and getting my wife more involved with guns,” he said. “He said I should have a weapon and that his wife took classes to learn how to use one.
“I do have a weapon, but I don’t walk around the neighborhood with mine!”
Actually, he does not walk around the neighborhood at all.
“I fit the stereotype he emailed around,” he said. “Listen, you even hear me say it: ‘A black guy did this. A black guy did that.’ So I thought, ‘Let me sit in the house. I don’t want anyone chasing me.’ ”
For walks, he goes downtown. A pregnant Quianna listened to her husband’s rationale, dropped her head, and cried.
“That’s so sad,” she said. “I hope our child doesn’t have to go through that.”
Travis Williams, a black 16-year-old who wears dreadlocks, said last year a man came to his house and accused him of stealing a bicycle. The police even came and checked the serial numbers on the bike in his garage.
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BBM

That's not just sad, it's outrageous. Why shouldn't this black man and his family feel safe walking around their own neighborhood without being profiled and singled out as "suspicious"?

“We are taking a beating over this,” said Lee, who defends the investigation. “This is all very unsettling. I’m sure if George Zimmerman had the opportunity to relive Sunday, Feb. 26, he’d probably do things differently. I’m sure Trayvon would, too.”
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BBM

Why would Trayvon have needed to do anything differently? What laws did he break? How could he have known he'd be hunted down by some over-zealous, armed watch captain?
 
Velouria said:
Shooter of Trayvon Martin a habitual caller to 911

At the focal point of a shooting scandal: a mild-mannered neighbor who fixated on crime and focused on young, black males. By Frances Robles
frobles@MiamiHerald.com

http://www.miamiherald.com/2012/03/17/2700249/shooter-of-trayvon-martin-a-habitual.html

BBM

That's not just sad, it's outrageous. Why shouldn't this black man and his family feel safe walking around their own neighborhood without being profiled and singled out as "suspicious"?

BBM

Why would Trayvon have needed to do anything differently? What laws did he break? How could he have known he'd be hunted down by some over-zealous, armed watch captain?
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Thank you for the links. Hihater was looking for them last night and couldn't find them.
 
Adrienne37 said:
The role of a neighborhood community watch captain is nothing more than a liaison between local law enforcement and the residents of the neighborhoods in which they are volunteering for. Why and how could he be considered law enforcement?

So in essence, if neighborhood watch captains are considered law enforcement, all of these captains across the US will now have the right to chase and murder innocent people who might just be out for a leisurely stroll if they happen to look or act suspicious? Wow, I guess I'm glad I'm not living in a neighborhood.
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I have no answer to your question Adrienne37. I am definitely NOT saying what GZ did was okay. My issue is that LE is calling this a justified shooting when it is EVIDENT, in my opinion, there was NOTHING justified about this.

I don't know that LE is considering GZ as one of them, but for all intents and purposes it appears they are - otherwise WHY aren't they investigating? I'm not saying that is right or wrong - I was just wondering if the standards for LE are different.

My personal (nonmod) opinion is that something is wrong here and for LE to brush it off like GZ's behavior was okay - after GZ was TOLD NOT TO CONFRONT Tray is inconsistent with "justice for all."

HTH,

Salem
 
Salem said:
Bumping Ynot's post here. Also, I want to remind everyone that it appears LE is NOT investigating this case. If LE is not going to do an investigation, then it makes even more sense for sleuths to ask the hard questions.

There are several posts that question the importance of Tray's suspension. BUT think about it like a sleuth..... what do we know from the suspension, that we wouldn't have known if no one had asked? We KNOW that Tray WAS NOT violent. His suspension was NOT for violent behavior. He was a GOOD kid. That is darn important.
While asking hard questions may be emotionally upsetting sometimes, it helps to look at it from both sides of the issue - how does it help the investigation? How does it hurt? Where it hurts, what information is needed to correct the hurt? Where can that information be found?

Don't mean to preach here, but just to remind everyone that the more information available, the more we might understand what happened and the more the cry for the justice might be heard.

LE needs to investigate this. If they read here - they might get an understanding of WHY they need to investigate.

Salem
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my bolding

I agree with you, we do know those things, we knew them early on, so shouldn't that have put to rest any suspension issue early on? Why continue to keep belaboring the same thing over and over, when it shows that it isn't a link to the crime, if it has no bearing on the crime, before it becomes just victim bashing?

Also I agree with you about asking hard questions, however, shouldn't those questions be based on the crime that occurred?

We wouldn't ask hard questions such as what kind of clothes or how much makeup a rape victim wore. We wouldn't be concerned about a kids grades or school record if they were killed in a driveby. We wouldn't ask if an adult was a good worker at his job if they were murdered walking down the street.

I'm confused as to what exactly hard questions mean and when it becomes just using things that don't have a bearing on the crime against them, just to portray the victim in a bad light.

JMHO
 
Salem said:
I have no answer to your question Adrienne37. I am definitely NOT saying what GZ did was okay. My issue is that LE is calling this a justified shooting when it is EVIDENT, in my opinion, there was NOTHING justified about this.

I don't know that LE is considering GZ as one of them, but for all intents and purposes it appears they are - otherwise WHY aren't they investigating? I'm not saying that is right or wrong - I was just wondering if the standards for LE are different.

My personal (nonmod) opinion is that something is wrong here and for LE to brush it off like GZ's behavior was okay - after GZ was TOLD NOT TO CONFRONT Tray is inconsistent with "justice for all."

HTH,

Salem
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Thanks Salem!! Definitely something wrong with this picture and so terribly sad and frustrating that this young man's murderer is out walking the streets along with us.
 
GZ might have had good intentions of preventing crime, but following people around is dangerous. For both sides, apparently. If he followed this teen, the teen took off running, then I fail to see why police aren't looking at GZ as an aggressor. Some mistakes-people have to pay for. I think this boy was scared of GZ and took off running. What kind of self-defense is that?
 
BBM - This is the quote from the family's lawyer Ben Crump:


"Trayvon Martin was shot dead after he took a break from watching NBA All-Star game television coverage to walk 10 minutes to a convenience store to buy snacks including Skittles candy requested by his 13-year-old brother, Chad, the family's lawyer Ben Crump said."

It's really neither here nor there when he left, or what time the game started, or how either of those relate to the time he was shot. I was merely trying to explain how local media was covering the All Star Game for hours before it actually started.

In a link Yoda posted earlier; http://www.alaskadispatch.com/article/trayvon-martin-911-tapes-who-screamed-help-shot-rang-out it states: "Trayvon had left his father's house, where he was watching a college basketball tournament, to go to a local convenience store, where he bought an iced tea and a bag of Skittles".

So, although it bears no relevance, it appears no one really knows what Trayvon was doing before he left his house.


Yoda said:
In an earlier post there is a link to one of many msm articles that said half time. There is also a link to the family attorney saying he left during the game. According to when TM was shot and the NBA site, linked earlier, TM was shot before the game began.
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Yoda said:
TM did not live in the neighborhood. Race could have nothing to do. From my personal experience it does not matter what race a person is in our neighborhood if they are unfamiliar. My previous post on an earlier page explains pattern behavior of those that reside and frequent a neighborhood.
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If GZ couldn't see that Tray was black, then how could he see if Tray was someone who lived there or not? How does he know that someone is a stranger or out of place if he can't even determine race? Either GZ knew Tray was both black and a stranger or he made a determination based on nothing more than a hoodie.



Yoda said:
Originally media and the lawyer reported TM left to get snacks for his brother , it was a 10 minute walk. 1. The distance from the 7/11 to the house was not a quick 10 minute walk.
2, media and lawyer also say he left during half time of the NBA all stargame. TM was shot at about 7:17. The all star game didn't start until 7:30. When the media reports incorrect information or the family attorney releases info that doesn't line up it cast doubt on everything that is released.

Ditto. you owe me a coke!
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The first report I read said that Tray "took a break from watching coverage of the game" which could have been pregame coverage. Also, I believe I looked on google maps earlier and it was a 0.9 mile walk, which could easily be 10 minutes. I don't think there is anything that doesn't line up except possibly poor reporting. (i.e., "during the game" vs. "during coverage of the game")


Why would Trayvon have needed to do anything differently? What laws did he break? How could he have known he'd be hunted down by some over-zealous, armed watch captain?
Click to expand...

EXACTLY!!! What could Tray have done differently? What would you have advised your teen to do differently? I honestly don't know. He did what I have told my sons to do if someone approaches them in a car - RUN AWAY.
 
the more i read about the self defense laws in fl, the more i feel that the one who had the right to stand their ground and defend themselves was Trayvon Martin! all imo!
 
I guess I am seeing it differently Annalia. I think the info about the suspension is important because it shows that Tray was not a violent kid. I think knowing this about his character adds further support to show that GZ did NOT act in self-defense. I'm not seeing it as bashing the victim - I'm seeing it as supporting the victim. It shows that it would have been inconsistent with Tray's character to confront GZ. While character evidence can only be used in certain circumstances in court - in real life the information is important in assessing GZ's credibility, in my opinion.

Why would GZ feel it necessary to defend himself against a non-violent teen? GZ acted out of his own zealous desire to prove himself - he did not act out of any need to defend himself, in my opinion. He should be brought up on 1st degree murder charges - not let go because he was defending himself. GZ instigated and caused the situation that resulted in Tray's death. In my mind, he did it with premediation and reckless disregard for human life.

GZ sat in his car and watched Tray. He called 911 and discussed his intent to confront this teen, knowing full well he had NO legal authority to do so, and then GZ did confront this teen, without legal authority and against the direction of LE. GZ knew he was armed and when he got out of his car, he fully intended to apprehend Tray without legal authority, knowing that he (GZ) had the full force of his weapon with him. That to me, ladies and gentleman, is MURDER IN THE 1ST DEGREE, ACTING WITH A DEPRAVED HEART AND MALICE AFORETHOUGHT. (nonmod Salem on her tallest soap box)

Salem

Actually -- there should be NO victim bashing here (said in my sternest Mod voice).
 
jjenny said:
GZ might have had good intentions of preventing crime, but following people around is dangerous. For both sides, apparently. If he followed this teen, the teen took off running, then I fail to see why police aren't looking at GZ as an aggressor. Some mistakes-people have to pay for. I think this boy was scared of GZ and took off running. What kind of self-defense is that?
Click to expand...
I wonder why Trayvon couldn't get away from GZ. Is it possible that GZ took a shortcut to be able to catch Trayvon?
 
RANCH said:
I wonder why Trayvon couldn't get away from GZ. Is it possible that GZ took a shortcut to be able to catch Trayvon?
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I don't know, but just because GZ appears to be overweight doesn't mean he can't run fast (especially short distances).
 
"The answer may lie in police records, which show that 50 suspicious-person reports were called in to police in the past year at Twin Lakes. There were eight burglaries, nine thefts and one other shooting in the year prior to Trayvon’s death.

In all, police had been called to the 260-unit complex 402 times from Jan. 1, 2011 to Feb. 26, 2012."

I wonder how that neighborhood compares to others right around it.

http://www.miamiherald.com/2012/03/17/2700249_p2/shooter-of-trayvon-martin-a-habitual.html
 
I am so glad to see this active on Websleuths!!! Living in Florida, I was aware of the injustice early on, yet it was barely covered in the local media and there was nothing in the national news. I will admit that I sent the info to Nancy Grace and begged that they cover the story!! I assume others did the same, as Vinnie Politan started covering it the very next day. I signed a change.org petition early on, now they have over 337,000 signatures!!! (Not sure if it is okay to link here, but it should be easy enough to find). My biggest frustration has been the horrible discussions going on in the local media. So nice to come here and find it being discussed in the usual orderly Websleuths manner!! Trayvon will have justice. I knew there was a reason the 911 calls were not released (until they filed a public records request in the courts). I never doubted that George Zimmerman was acting as a wannabe cop and murdered this innocent boy in cold blood.

I have two questions that I cannot find answers to. Is it true that Trayvon is 6'3"? I see it published that he weighs 140, not sure if the 6'3" part is a rumor. Also, is it true that he was suspended from school? If so, what was the reason for that? Not that it makes a difference, just curious because of some of the negative comments in other places.

I am changing my bookmark into Websleuths from Caylee Anthony to this thread today. Caylee's justice was thwarted by fools, Trayvon's family will make sure the same will not happen to him!!!
 
Summary

1. Never display a handgun to gain "leverage" in an argument, even if it isn't loaded or you never intend to use it.

2. The amount of force that you use to defend yourself must not be excessive under the circumstances.

Never use deadly force in self-defense unless you are afraid that if you don't, you will be killed or seriously injured;
Verbal threats never justify your use of deadly force;
If you think someone has a weapon and will use it unless you kill him, be sure you are right and are not overreacting to the situation.

3. The law permits you to carry a concealed weapon for self-defense. Carrying a concealed weapon does not make you a free-lance policeman or a "good samaritan."

4. Never carry your concealed weapon into any place where the statute prohibits carrying it.

This is not a complete summary of all the statutes and court opinions on the use of deadly force. Because the concealed weapons statute specifies that concealed weapons are to be used for lawful self-defense, we have not attempted to summarize the body of law on lawful defense of property. This information is not intended as legal advice. Every self-defense case has its own unique set of facts, and it is unwise to try to predict how a particular case would be decided. It is clear, however, that the law protects people who keep their tempers under control and use deadly force only as a last resort.

From this link: http://licgweb.doacs.state.fl.us/weapons/self_defense.html
 
Yoda said:
The answer may lie in police records, which show that 50 suspicious-person reports were called in to police in the past year at Twin Lakes. There were eight burglaries, nine thefts and one other shooting in the year prior to Trayvon’s death.

In all, police had been called to the 260-unit complex 402 times from Jan. 1, 2011 to Feb. 26, 2012.

I wonder how that neighborhood compares to others right around it.

http://www.miamiherald.com/2012/03/17/2700249_p2/shooter-of-trayvon-martin-a-habitual.html
Click to expand...

I think it is important to note that 42 police calls came from George Zimmerman. My understanding from miscellaneous reading I have done was that this is a middle class gated community in a "good" area, but these statistics seem to conflict with that idea. Would especially love to know more about the other shooting.
 
The new law codified in Florida Statutes 776.013(3)(2006) states:

A person who is not engaged in an unlawful activity, and who is attacked in any other place where he or she has a right to be has no duty to retreat and has the right to stand his or her ground and meet force with force, including deadly force if he or she reasonably believes it is necessary to do so to prevent death or great bodily harm to himself or herself or another or to prevent the commission of a forcible felony.
From this link:http://www.hessingerlaw.com/Articles/Self-Defense-and-Floridas-Stand-Your-Ground-Law.aspx
 
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