FL 17 yo Trayvon Martin Shot to Death by Neighborhood Watch Captain #11

[Boytwnmom]

How did GZ know Trayvon didn't have a right to be there-did he know every single person who lived there and all their visitors? There are lots and lots of units there with lots of people of all colors I imagine and they all have friends and relatives. I have seen no official documentation that only black people have committed crimes in that neighborhood so drawing any conclusion about any individual based only on race is kind of ridiculous and highly likely to be as wrong as it turned out he was as Trayvon had every right to be there. As far as the rain thing, I find it completely stupid...I know of no one, especially a teenager, who stays in the house because of rain...sorry.

BASED on your post all black kids are suspect...But NO there are many black home owners in that community and it was not that GZ saw a black person NO...IF there were no previous robberies, I bet GZ would have just gotten his milk and gone home. Unless you think he is insane. PEOPLE DONT JUST SHOOT PEOPLE? unless they re nuts.
It was because there were 8 robberies that they CLAIM was done all by black people who did not live their.

GZ saw someone in the rain, (when most everyone stays in) who did not live there and he happens to also look like what they suspect the other robberies to have been caused by.

 

[AnaTeresa]

But, what about GZ makes you think he's a racist?
Besides the word that is inaudible that may or may not have been racist.

To be clear, I am not stating that I think GZ went hunting for a black person to shoot. However, I do think that TM's race played a factor in why GZ was suspicious of him (see his previous 911 calls, other residents feeling uncomfortable around him, the word in the 911 call). And it's not just GZ - I think that LE did not investigate this as thoroughly because the victim was black. Had this been a white teenager, I believe things would have been handled differently. GZ may not have been arrested, but it would have been a less murky case.

I don't think it's playing the "race card" to say that stereotypes still exist today based on skin color and that this likely played a part in the entire situation. To acknowledge that doesn't mean that I'm saying GZ was dressed up as a klansman going hunting - it's an acknowledgement of the factors at play that night.

 

[m00c0w]

Yes. They did in the Drew Peterson case....second wife, or was it???? Well, second to last wife who was found dead. They're still looking for his last wife. jmo

It's possible, yes, but if there was a major arterial perforation in this instance, they may not show up. All of the blood in the extremities would be diverted back into the core and pumped out of the body just as fast.

 

[Wise Old Owl]

:what: Telling stories :what:

If you knew that you have a child or brother that has been honest with you
You would not go to their side?
If you need to help a family member and you were not at the incident,
You wouldn’t ask the person to tell you exactly what happened?

I think they did come together as a family and try to help.

That does not make anyone mentally unstable.

BUT if I take your scenario...Trayvon can not tell his story...
so when his attorney comes out swinging "murder in cold blood"
is that not telling a real manufactured story????
Especially since an investigation s not over.

BBM

not necessarily. The attorney would be privy to certain things that have not been released. For example - AND THIS IS JUST AN EXAMPLE - I HAVE NO PROOF - but say, TM was shot in the back or his nose was, in fact broken. We don't know that. But I would think the family would. If that is the case - then the attorney would not be manufacturing stories. We just don't know. And keeping the entire nation in the dark and releasing little dribbles and drabs here and there are doing no good and just fueling the flames underneath an already simmering (and close to boiling) pot of trouble.


JMHO

 

[songline]

I have seen many innocent children die here in Southern California because of local gangs having shoot outs in the street. NOTHING is done by Rev Al or Rev Jesse to call these thugs out for THOSE murders. Nobody riots when those innocent babies and children and bystanders are killed. Nobody blinks an eye when a black shoots another black .

But this white man shoots a black teen and now we are going to have national riots?

They never come out when blacks are agains other blacks.
They never come out when they do not have one token white to attack.
They never come out when there is a realproblem....

I am not saying anyone framed GZ but it was a plum opportunity,
<modsnip>
:moo::moo::moo:

 

[gxm]

To me the dispatchers tone and inflection made it very clear.

IMO, JMO

Sent from LG Esteem using Tapatalk

And to me, it didn't. GZ's lawyer will be able to say that his client did not receive a direct stand down order. Because at no point did the dispatcher tell GZ to stop and go back to his car.

Further, GZ can say that he did stop following TM and was headed back to his car when he was jumped.

Note: I'm not saying GZ was jumped. Just that nothing about his story, IMO, is implausible. Personally, I don't see any clear scenario that can be proved beyond a reasonable doubt&#8230;yet.

 

[ThoughtFox]

I have seen many innocent children die here in Southern California because of local gangs having shoot outs in the street. NOTHING is done by Rev Al or Rev Jesse to call these thugs out for THOSE murders. Nobody riots when those innocent babies and children and bystanders are killed. Nobody blinks an eye when a black shoots another black .

But this white man shoots a black teen and now we are going to have national riots?

Why do you keep saying there are going to be "riots." Link?

Al Sharpton said he wanted to escalate "peaceful" demonstrations. That could just mean silent gatherings for all we know.

http://articles.orlandosentinel.com...-national-action-network-national-association

You know, Civil Disobedience is part of our heritage in the U.S., and so is the right to protest. :twocents: Injustice sort of brings that out in people.

Also, I've seen lots of calls for boycotting Florida until they fix the loopholes in the "Stand Your Ground" law. That's perfectly legal, too. Not the same thing as a riot.

 

[LiveLaughLuv]

Q: What could the charges be?

A: If Zimmerman is charged, he could most likely face second-degree murder or manslaughter charges at the state level. If convicted of the second-degree murder charge, he could potentially face up to life in prison because a gun was used.

Federal prosecutors could charge Zimmerman with a hate crime if they think there is evidence he was motivated by racial bias. That charge can carry the death penalty in the most severe instances, or up to life in prison.

Federal prosecutors could also accuse Zimmerman of using his official authority to violate Martin's rights -- known as a "color of law" case -- but they would have to prove that Zimmerman was acting in some official capacity, similar to a police officer or government official. Zimmerman was a volunteer neighborhood watchman.

http://www.insidebayarea.com/ci_20281800/trayvon-martin-facts-case


Very interesting that if the authorities believe this was a crime motivated by race/hate, GZ's got lots to be worried about...

I believe GZ was acting as a 'self appointed' CWC...so that could also apply to the 'color of law' case mentioned above...

Chris Tutko, director of Neighborhood Watch for the National Sheriffs' Association, said Zimmerman broke some cardinal rules.

First, he approached a stranger he suspected of wrongdoing.

"If you see something suspicious, you report it, you step aside and you let law enforcement do their job," Tutko said. "This guy went way beyond the call of duty. At the least, he's overzealous."

Second, Zimmerman carried a handgun. Police departments and sheriff's offices that train volunteers advise them never to carry weapons — though Zimmerman broke no laws by doing so because he has a concealed-weapons permit.

"There's no reason to carry a gun," Tutko said.

The Neighborhood Watch at Retreat at Twin Lakes, where Zimmerman lived and was chosen as coordinator by his neighbors, was formed in September, Dorival said. It is not registered with the national group, but there is no registration requirement. The Sanford Police Department provides training and community signs, and informs residents about crime trends and prevention.

Sanford and the Volusia County Sheriff's Office have another volunteer program called Citizens on Patrol. In Volusia, those volunteers ride two to a Sheriff's Office-issued car. They undergo background and driver checks, an hourlong interview and 60 hours of training.

"We don't want any cop wannabes or people thinking they're going out and acting like cops and making arrests," sheriff's spokesman Gary Davidson said. "If we think that's the motivation, we're going to weed them out."

http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/os-trayvon-martin-neighborhood-watch-20120321,0,5554619.story

I wonder how GZ was able to slip under the radar...for I certainly believe he is a wannabe cop..especially this fateful night with Trayvon..

lease: Justice for Trayvon Martin

 

[Dr.Fessel]

BBM. My question is: What if the bruises didn't have time to form? Does anyone know if bruises can form after death?

The damage that causes bruising ( broken blood vessels) will be there, the bruising color can show up after death, the blood can flow to the skin by gravity. A lot of times neck bruising from strangulation will not show up on the skin but the damage from the broken blood vessels can be seen when the autopsy is done.

I think at one point Zimmerman had Martin in a headlock. I really hope they check his neck. IMO

 

[wishuwerehere]

I have seen many innocent children die here in Southern California because of local gangs having shoot outs in the street. NOTHING is done by Rev Al or Rev Jesse to call these thugs out for THOSE murders. Nobody riots when those innocent babies and children and bystanders are killed. Nobody blinks an eye when a black shoots another black .

But this white man shoots a black teen and now we are going to have national riots?

You are right about where's the outrage for these other young black males who are being killed by each other on a daily basis. I'm right there with ya. I believe the outrage for this case has come about because Zimmerman was not arrested when it seems clear to many that he should have been.

jmo

 

[m00c0w]

Had they arrested Zimmerman in the first place for the cold-blooded and brutal murder of Trayvon Martin, none of this would have happened. So instead of blaming Sharpton and Jackson, why don't we put the blame back where it belongs and that's on GEORGE ZIMMERMAN? All it takes at this moment is an arrest warrant and he's off the streets.

~jmo~

And that would be a complete disembowelment of our justice system. We do not function or run or have decisions made by mob rule. To arrest him before due process is taken would be vastly irresponsible and give credence to those who believe those that talk the loudest should get their way.

 

[LambChop]

I have seen many innocent children die here in Southern California because of local gangs having shoot outs in the street. NOTHING is done by Rev Al or Rev Jesse to call these thugs out for THOSE murders. Nobody riots when those innocent babies and children and bystanders are killed. Nobody blinks an eye when a black shoots another black .

But this white man shoots a black teen and now we are going to have national riots?

Maybe because those thugs are not claiming self defense when they are arrested. No one wants to see young men killed period. If TM was white we'd still feel the same way. Isn't it bad enough some young men have to die serving our country and many can't even get that far because they have been gunned down by gangs. Gangs are a big problem and in most intercities LE does the best they can. If a gang member doesn't listen to his mother I doubt they will listen to Rev Al or Rev Jesse. The proof is in the pudding. jmo

 

[OneLove]

Exactly.

It seems to me like GZ was on a mission to rid his neighbood of these "hoodlums". No black kid in a hoodie with Skittles and an iced tea in his pocket should be walking the streets on his way home, looking at the houses he passes.

God forbid.

YA, and let's not forget that Trayvon should have RUN all the way straight home after being suspected and disrespected by GZ. ( sarcasm)

Those remarks are beyond offensive. I'd like someone to tell THOSE people to run all the way straight home simply because I don't happen to like the way they dress and think they need to get off MY street. ~grumble~

 

[songline]

BBM

not necessarily. The attorney would be privy to certain things that have not been released. For example - AND THIS IS JUST AN EXAMPLE - I HAVE NO PROOF - but say, TM was shot in the back or his nose was, in fact broken. We don't know that. But I would think the family would. If that is the case - then the attorney would not be manufacturing stories. We just don't know. And keeping the entire nation in the dark and releasing little dribbles and drabs here and there are doing no good and just fueling the flames underneath an already simmering (and close to boiling) pot of trouble.
JMHO

IMHO a good case hold much close to the vest. Or else they either delude it, or create a mess or worse.
BUT in any case TM’s lawyer is not accountable with his claims at all.
they do no owe us information - they owe us an investigation.

I too think GZ should be charged maybe aggravated assault or something and then released on bail so tht they can go on investigating...And not keep the file simmering and blowing up.

NO I do not see how this attorney is going at this to be about seeking justice for Trayvon.
:moo:

 

[HiHater]

And that would be a complete disembowelment of our justice system. We do not function or run or have decisions made by mob rule. To arrest him before due process is taken would be vastly irresponsible and give credence to those who believe those that talk the loudest should get their way.

Are you just as outraged that he was not arrested? The police failed to give Trayvon Martin "due process" by freeing his killer with shaky evidence...IMO

 

[tlcya]

And that would be a complete disembowelment of our justice system. We do not function or run or have decisions made by mob rule. To arrest him before due process is taken would be vastly irresponsible and give credence to those who believe those that talk the loudest should get their way.

Because m00, absolute power corrupts absolutely. No one is suggesting (I don't think) that WE get to decide to arrest or not. But WE do get to cry foul if those we give that power and duty to do not do their duty and arrest someone. It is the most American thing in the world for the public to police our city, county and government officials to insure they are acting accordingly. The argument is that GZ received something waaaaaay beyond due process for reasons unknown to us as yet.

 

[annalia]

Why do you keep saying there are going to be "riots." Link?

Al Sharpton said he wanted to escalate "peaceful" demonstrations. That could just mean silent gatherings for all we know.

http://articles.orlandosentinel.com...-national-action-network-national-association

You know, Civil Disobedience is part of our heritage in the U.S., and so is the right to protest. :twocents: Injustice sort of brings that out in people.

Also, I've seen lots of calls for boycotting Florida until they fix the loopholes in the "Stand Your Ground" law. That's perfectly legal, too. Not the same thing as a riot.

Correct, after reading the actual article, that's exactly what's he's saying. He's not saying we're going to escalate peaceful demonstration into riots, he's saying we're going to have an escalation IN the peaceful demonstrations. Meaning, more peaceful demonstrations. Peaceful is the key word if kept in context.

If George Zimmerman is not arrested in the shooting death of Trayvon Martin soon, the Rev. Al Sharpton will call for an escalation in peaceful civil disobedience and economic sanctions.

Personally I don't like AS, but he keeps getting blamed for trying to incite riots when he hasn't done that at all, in this particular case.

JMHO

 

[m00c0w]

Are you just as outraged that he was not arrested? The police failed to give Trayvon Martin "due process" by freeing his killer with shaky evidence...IMO

We don't know what evidence there is. That's the point. Now another prosecutor is on the case and he still hasn't been arrested. If it was so evident, I don't see why it's taking this new investigation so long. There's clearly more to it than anyone outside of the investigation knows. Let justice run its course. They disagreed with the initial investigation, so they effectively got a second opinion. Now that second opinion is taking place. Let them work.

 

[m00c0w]

Because m00, absolute power corrupts absolutely. No one is suggesting (I don't think) that WE get to decide to arrest or not. But WE do get to cry foul if those we give that power and duty to do not do their duty and arrest someone. It is the most American thing in the world for the public to police our city, county and government officials to insure they are acting accordingly. The argument is that GZ received something waaaaaay beyond due process for reasons unknown to us as yet.

And I don't disagree with that. However, the notion I got from the other poster was that all it takes is an arrest warrant and everyone would go away and be satisfied. What if no arrest warrant comes, for whatever reason?

ETA: It seems more like the concern is that Zimmerman get arrested, not that the judicial process takes place in whatever form it may be.

 

[tlcya]

For what its worth, I do agree with posters who feel the Good Rev. Al Sharpton adds nothing but further controversy to this already controversial situation.

I think that man should keep his thoughts and opinions to himself, but then, I have thought and wished that for years. Not gonna happen, unfortunately.