There are coordinates- LE saved a picture on one of their iPhones the night he was discovered. I’ll grab it from my laptop and post.
Identified! FL - Big Cypress Natl Preserve, Male Hiker, Denim & “Mostly Harmless” July 2018 - Vance Rodriguez#4
- Thread starter Gardener1850
- Start date
- Status
There are coordinates- LE saved a picture on one of their iPhones the night he was discovered. I’ll grab it from my laptop and post.
vivvensmortua
New Member
- Joined
- Jul 19, 2020
- Messages
- 4
- Reaction score
- 18
It has been said previously that on average he traveled 10 miles a day.
I have now listened to the 3 podcasts called Sworn Statement Episode 1, 2 and 3. They can be found through here Sworn Statement | Collier County, FL Sheriff
I have listened to the Deceased Hiker Update July 2020 found through the above as well.
I'm going to look a bit further into his notes, mostly to confirm or deny some things people have said.
The police agree with me, after getting various programmers to look at his notes that they are specs and code for a game, not a hiking app. There are keywords that indicate so and that say it's Screeps.
I think I've looked at and heard everything at least once now unless anybody can mention anything else.
I have listened to the Deceased Hiker Update July 2020 found through the above as well.
I'm going to look a bit further into his notes, mostly to confirm or deny some things people have said.
The police agree with me, after getting various programmers to look at his notes that they are specs and code for a game, not a hiking app. There are keywords that indicate so and that say it's Screeps.
I think I've looked at and heard everything at least once now unless anybody can mention anything else.
Nice! How about the two guys on July 3, coords for them?
branmuffin
Well-Known Member
- Joined
- Nov 9, 2015
- Messages
- 4,383
- Reaction score
- 39,206
Very early on, it was mentioned that he had a huge backpack that weighed 50 pounds or more. He'd had winter clothing as well as some pots and pans evidenced in the pics LE took of his campsite when he was found deceased. He bought a new two man tent in Hiawassee, Georgia. So he either traveled from New York to Hiawassee, Georgia with a different, bigger/heavier tent or he only stayed in hostels, shelters, private homes or slept outdoors without a tent. People commented on the size of his pack so for him to buy a new tent I thought maybe he had a big cumbersome tent that added to the weight. However, no one has ever mentioned any other type of tent he may have had up to the Hiawassee Georgia stop and even AFTER he bought the yellow tent his backpack still weighed over 50 pounds.
According to a website, backpackinglight.com the tent a Brooks-Range Mountaineering Foray two man tent weighs a scant 3 pounds. We know he wore denim jeans which average about one and a half pounds. If he had two pairs that's an extra three pounds. So we're up to 6 pounds for the tent and two pair of jeans.
I've been reading what is de rigueur for Section or Through hiking and camping is a sleeping pad. Usually 20 or 25 inches wide and 72 inches long. The average weight of one is about one pound. So now we're up to 7 pounds.
Then there's the sleeping bag. He definitely had one; you can see it in the pics inside his tent. I live in Canada, so I guess the warmth requirement for a sleeping bag here is probably a lot different than one in southern climes but he traveled from New York so he probably had one that fit both requirements. Most sleeping bags I've looked at that can handle such wide ranges of temperatures are fairly pricey, but weight is the deciding factor and the general consensus is nothing over 3 pounds. So now were at 10 pounds.
He carried cash. There is no evidence he carried anything else. Let's say he started out with $10K in cash. Ten grand in 20s weighs about one pound. Let's put it up to two pounds since everything he bought he made change for so he'd have an assortment of 10s, 5s and one's. That's two pounds and we're up to 12 pounds. That's 38 pounds still unaccounted for.
When I saw the insides of his tent it also looked like he had some kind of quilt. I could be wrong about that since after moving his body outside the tent to the white evidence sheet the officer's may have made a bit of a mess and it could be the sleeping pad I was seeing. Even so, for the sake of argument, let's say he did have one and it added another 1.5 pounds to his pack. Thirteen and a half pounds. Let's tack on the quarter pound for the Sea to Summit inflatable pillow and whatever you need to inflate it. That's 14 pounds.
He also had some pots and pans in there. There looked to be about a 2 quart sauce pan. I could see a couple of pots and pans in the tent. One of them had some orange on the handle. I checked out a couple of camping sets and one set had a detachable handle that had an orange button on it. GSI Bugaboo Base Camping Nesting set that is multi purpose: dishpan, cookpots, etc. I don't know if you can buy them separately but altogether the whole set weighs about nine and half pounds. Now we're up to about 25 pounds. Twenty five to go.
There's evidence of packs from Outdoor Research and Summit dry packs which are used to pack your sleeping bag and sleeping pads tightly as well as smaller ones that ensure your extra socks and other clothing remains dry. Empty their weight is negligible but a couple with socks, undies and a t-shirt might weigh 2 pounds. That's 27 pounds.
We can add in several bottle of water, perhaps some Gatorade and the waterpak he carried. Full they might weigh two or three pounds, empty, maybe less than a pound. Split the difference and we're at 29 pounds.
He had numerous notebooks of different sizes and quite a lot of different types of twine or lightweight rope. Between the two of those items I would think they wouldn't weigh more than 2 pounds. That's 31 pounds.
Then there is his actual backpack that he put all that stuff in. Judging by the images of him we see walking, the pack is huge, at least two feet long or longer and about a foot high and deep. I've been trying to find the inventory of MH's belongings including camping equipment but I can't find it. When I look at the images of MH with it on his back covered by that red tarp it doesn't even look like a normal backpack it looks more like a duffel bag. Can anyone point me in the right direction for an ID on the backpack? Just perusing listings of backpacks and duffel bags, the average weight of nylon or neoprene bags is about 2 or 3 pounds. Let's say 3 pounds. Now we're up to 34 pounds. We are still nearly 20 pounds off the weight of 53 pounds when a female hiker put it on the scale.
I'd really like to know what was missing from his pack.
As an aside, I did see some form of equipment that had writing on it, the words 'naig' in lower case. I can't find anything that relates to those letters, in the form of equipment. I did find two acronyms for two organizations. One was the National Association of Intercollegiate Gymnastics and the North American Indigenous Games. I also found some odd beer coasters on Amazon called Naig beer and Ale. I can't find any reference to that beer. It might be a company that prints a family name on articles as a novelty. Doesn't seem to be too many people with that name according to Ancestry.
Naig Name Meaning & Naig Family History at Ancestry.ca®
According to a website, backpackinglight.com the tent a Brooks-Range Mountaineering Foray two man tent weighs a scant 3 pounds. We know he wore denim jeans which average about one and a half pounds. If he had two pairs that's an extra three pounds. So we're up to 6 pounds for the tent and two pair of jeans.
I've been reading what is de rigueur for Section or Through hiking and camping is a sleeping pad. Usually 20 or 25 inches wide and 72 inches long. The average weight of one is about one pound. So now we're up to 7 pounds.
Then there's the sleeping bag. He definitely had one; you can see it in the pics inside his tent. I live in Canada, so I guess the warmth requirement for a sleeping bag here is probably a lot different than one in southern climes but he traveled from New York so he probably had one that fit both requirements. Most sleeping bags I've looked at that can handle such wide ranges of temperatures are fairly pricey, but weight is the deciding factor and the general consensus is nothing over 3 pounds. So now were at 10 pounds.
He carried cash. There is no evidence he carried anything else. Let's say he started out with $10K in cash. Ten grand in 20s weighs about one pound. Let's put it up to two pounds since everything he bought he made change for so he'd have an assortment of 10s, 5s and one's. That's two pounds and we're up to 12 pounds. That's 38 pounds still unaccounted for.
When I saw the insides of his tent it also looked like he had some kind of quilt. I could be wrong about that since after moving his body outside the tent to the white evidence sheet the officer's may have made a bit of a mess and it could be the sleeping pad I was seeing. Even so, for the sake of argument, let's say he did have one and it added another 1.5 pounds to his pack. Thirteen and a half pounds. Let's tack on the quarter pound for the Sea to Summit inflatable pillow and whatever you need to inflate it. That's 14 pounds.
He also had some pots and pans in there. There looked to be about a 2 quart sauce pan. I could see a couple of pots and pans in the tent. One of them had some orange on the handle. I checked out a couple of camping sets and one set had a detachable handle that had an orange button on it. GSI Bugaboo Base Camping Nesting set that is multi purpose: dishpan, cookpots, etc. I don't know if you can buy them separately but altogether the whole set weighs about nine and half pounds. Now we're up to about 25 pounds. Twenty five to go.
There's evidence of packs from Outdoor Research and Summit dry packs which are used to pack your sleeping bag and sleeping pads tightly as well as smaller ones that ensure your extra socks and other clothing remains dry. Empty their weight is negligible but a couple with socks, undies and a t-shirt might weigh 2 pounds. That's 27 pounds.
We can add in several bottle of water, perhaps some Gatorade and the waterpak he carried. Full they might weigh two or three pounds, empty, maybe less than a pound. Split the difference and we're at 29 pounds.
He had numerous notebooks of different sizes and quite a lot of different types of twine or lightweight rope. Between the two of those items I would think they wouldn't weigh more than 2 pounds. That's 31 pounds.
Then there is his actual backpack that he put all that stuff in. Judging by the images of him we see walking, the pack is huge, at least two feet long or longer and about a foot high and deep. I've been trying to find the inventory of MH's belongings including camping equipment but I can't find it. When I look at the images of MH with it on his back covered by that red tarp it doesn't even look like a normal backpack it looks more like a duffel bag. Can anyone point me in the right direction for an ID on the backpack? Just perusing listings of backpacks and duffel bags, the average weight of nylon or neoprene bags is about 2 or 3 pounds. Let's say 3 pounds. Now we're up to 34 pounds. We are still nearly 20 pounds off the weight of 53 pounds when a female hiker put it on the scale.
I'd really like to know what was missing from his pack.
As an aside, I did see some form of equipment that had writing on it, the words 'naig' in lower case. I can't find anything that relates to those letters, in the form of equipment. I did find two acronyms for two organizations. One was the National Association of Intercollegiate Gymnastics and the North American Indigenous Games. I also found some odd beer coasters on Amazon called Naig beer and Ale. I can't find any reference to that beer. It might be a company that prints a family name on articles as a novelty. Doesn't seem to be too many people with that name according to Ancestry.
Naig Name Meaning & Naig Family History at Ancestry.ca®
After looking at the July 3 two hikers at Noble video again thoroughly, I would disagree that they were in the open area. It appears they were by the far end tree line on the right on the map Gator posted. One of their 2 tents almost right at the trees and the other a few feet away. I believe they were there because MH was near the beginning of it where the red is and they gave his area lots of space. The grass was only about 8-12 inches, not a few feet. Unless MH was tucked away in the trees, they could easily have seen his tent. Their video pans around yet no MH tent to the left or right. So, I would say he's fairly far away from them. Again, it will be interest to see and hear what Gator finds when he goes there.
Last edited:
I have thought about what tent did he have before this two man big one, yes. I believe I've seen his sleeping bag rolled up in a bag with a draw string in one pic. Having done races in the woods for many hours, I would not assume that any weight is scant
The owner of the shop that sold him the tent said they couldn't get rid of the heavy thing and it was odd for MH to want it for thru-hiking. The difference between 2.7 and 3 pounds can be huge. A lighter. His winter jacket and gloves. Food. He had some fuel. Knife, utensils, maps, cases, covers, compass?, emergency kit?, toothbrush and paste, cleaner/soap, wallet, bandana, flip flops. You haven't really mentioned why you're going here though. I think it is obvious he had a bigger backpack and carried more weight than anybody, whether it's 40 or 50 lbs. Are you questioning whether he got rid of some of his stuff somehow or...? Are you questioning the person who weighed it?
Last edited:
Hmm, I think this may be a good one I thought about after reading Muffin's (if I may call her that. Maybe BM is better, I don't know), backpack post. If he knew he wasn't coming back. If he knew he wasn't going to use stuff such as his heavy coat ever again, why wouldn't he toss it?! Why would you carry around lots of extra weight on uncomfortable bad knees if you're sure you're never going to need it again?! It doesn't make sense which means he did not premeditate his demise.
GatorFL
Well-Known Member
- Joined
- Jan 1, 2009
- Messages
- 2,341
- Reaction score
- 15,933
All his hiking gear looks good to me.
I can't be sure but his pack looks like a Deuter and I think he was using a Mountain Warehouse rain cover on it. I think it's a Deuter 65+ 10 and that's a 6lb pack.
The tent before the Foray, who knows. He could have been tarping it. I don't like sleeping under a tarp for a few reasons. That may have been lighter even than what he used before. The Foray is a good, light tent. He also had a Tyvek footprint under it, which he carried.
He ditched the jeans before any of the pictures. Even when he was photographed in pants they looked like hiking pants, not jeans. But from photos we know he was carrying his winter gear: jacket, pants, gloves, bandana.
Pot, Nalgene bottle, cutlery, stove and fuel canister. All the other stuff you mentioned and you add in consumables and he could easily be 53 lbs, IMO. A little weight on an item here or there adds up quick. Ultralight hikers cut the tags off everything even their clothes.
One thought, if he wasn't coming off trail frequently he had to carry a lot of food. Even bars get heavy. Ever pick up a Clif Bar? They're heavy for their size.
I have a very similar setup, right down to the clearance tent and cheap trekking poles. My long run backpack is an Osprey Atmos 65. I use a 2 person tent, an MSR knockoff called a Featherstone Peridot. That's 9 lbs right there between pack and tent. Tent-I'm a little bigger than MH, 5'10" 215# and no other person is fitting in with me. I have a Hammockgear burrow, it's a sleeping bag that you can open like a blanket. Nemo sleeping pad. Pillow. Sometimes I carry a titanium grill grate other times a stove and fuel can. Water bladder, also a second bladder for dirty water and a Sawyer filter and tubing. Fire kit. Gun. Knife. Towel and soap. Titanium pot. Titanium cutlery. Headlamp. Stuff sacks. Trekking poles from Amazon. A couple other small items, portable bidet, fingernail clippers, spare clothes and socks. Flip flops. Cell phone and keys. I'm around 40# without water, food and other consumables. I hike over 50# and like MH I don't like to go more than 10-12 miles in a day. 20 is my max. It adds up quick and water is the heaviest thing. Even in wintertime, hiking from water source to water source, I average almost 1l of water an hour. More in the summer. So he had to be carrying a lot of water when he was moving.
My trip to Nobles won't be an overnight. I'll use my Gregory 30L pack with 3l bladder, knife, fire kit, tent, different gun w more ammo, food, maybe a bottle of water, Sawyer with tubes and dirty water bag, raincoat, poles. I'll probably be 25-30# all in.
I can't be sure but his pack looks like a Deuter and I think he was using a Mountain Warehouse rain cover on it. I think it's a Deuter 65+ 10 and that's a 6lb pack.
The tent before the Foray, who knows. He could have been tarping it. I don't like sleeping under a tarp for a few reasons. That may have been lighter even than what he used before. The Foray is a good, light tent. He also had a Tyvek footprint under it, which he carried.
He ditched the jeans before any of the pictures. Even when he was photographed in pants they looked like hiking pants, not jeans. But from photos we know he was carrying his winter gear: jacket, pants, gloves, bandana.
Pot, Nalgene bottle, cutlery, stove and fuel canister. All the other stuff you mentioned and you add in consumables and he could easily be 53 lbs, IMO. A little weight on an item here or there adds up quick. Ultralight hikers cut the tags off everything even their clothes.
One thought, if he wasn't coming off trail frequently he had to carry a lot of food. Even bars get heavy. Ever pick up a Clif Bar? They're heavy for their size.
I have a very similar setup, right down to the clearance tent and cheap trekking poles. My long run backpack is an Osprey Atmos 65. I use a 2 person tent, an MSR knockoff called a Featherstone Peridot. That's 9 lbs right there between pack and tent. Tent-I'm a little bigger than MH, 5'10" 215# and no other person is fitting in with me. I have a Hammockgear burrow, it's a sleeping bag that you can open like a blanket. Nemo sleeping pad. Pillow. Sometimes I carry a titanium grill grate other times a stove and fuel can. Water bladder, also a second bladder for dirty water and a Sawyer filter and tubing. Fire kit. Gun. Knife. Towel and soap. Titanium pot. Titanium cutlery. Headlamp. Stuff sacks. Trekking poles from Amazon. A couple other small items, portable bidet, fingernail clippers, spare clothes and socks. Flip flops. Cell phone and keys. I'm around 40# without water, food and other consumables. I hike over 50# and like MH I don't like to go more than 10-12 miles in a day. 20 is my max. It adds up quick and water is the heaviest thing. Even in wintertime, hiking from water source to water source, I average almost 1l of water an hour. More in the summer. So he had to be carrying a lot of water when he was moving.
My trip to Nobles won't be an overnight. I'll use my Gregory 30L pack with 3l bladder, knife, fire kit, tent, different gun w more ammo, food, maybe a bottle of water, Sawyer with tubes and dirty water bag, raincoat, poles. I'll probably be 25-30# all in.
GatorFL
Well-Known Member
- Joined
- Jan 1, 2009
- Messages
- 2,341
- Reaction score
- 15,933
Or he didn't want the trail angel to know his name or address. Hiding his identity.
GatorFL
Well-Known Member
- Joined
- Jan 1, 2009
- Messages
- 2,341
- Reaction score
- 15,933
What piece of equipment? Nalgene water bottle?
branmuffin
Well-Known Member
- Joined
- Nov 9, 2015
- Messages
- 4,383
- Reaction score
- 39,206
I have thought about what tent did he have before this two man big one, yes. I believe I've seen his sleeping bag rolled up in a bag with a draw string in one pic. Having done races in the woods for many hours, I would not assume that any weight is scant
The things you mentioned wouldn't add up to 20 pounds of weight. There were two different types of fleece apparel in the pics. Either one would weigh less than half a pound. Lighters, tooth brushes, etc would be negligible weight. He apparently didn't have a wallet according to other hikers, he carried his cash in plastic ziploc bags.
I'm not questioning the veracity of the hiker who weighed the backpack, I believe it to be true, considering so many people commented on the size of it.
I am questioning where the rest of his stuff went. He bought all the things he needed to compact and streamline his belongings and equipment. He added a tent to the equation in Georgia but didn't appear to get rid of one that he replaced it with, unless like I said he didn't have one to begin with. He obviously had something in there that he wasn't willing to part with.
It was back up in his first leg of his Florida trail journey that he mentioned he had stayed with his sister in either Sarasota or Fort Myers. I'm wondering if he did go to visit his sister sometime in January. He may have left some articles there. Gator has said that you're not really a through hiker if you don't do the whole trail, you're a section hiker if you only hike certain portions. It's quite possible that MH's intentions were good about hiking the whole trail but maybe if he stayed longer at his sister's (I believe that he did; he told people in different locations the same story) he decided to skip a couple of portions. Maybe he just picked up the trail further south since he wanted to avoid the heat, humidity and storms of the coming season.
I also think he shaved and had a haircut between the time some of those pictures that were taken in December based on the length of his beard and hair taken on his discovery in July.
branmuffin
Well-Known Member
- Joined
- Nov 9, 2015
- Messages
- 4,383
- Reaction score
- 39,206
I think you are right. I couldn't see the end of the word. It looked like it ended after the 'g'. What I thought was an 'i' is really an 'l'. It makes perfect sense now that you mention it. Thanks for the clarification.
Laughing
Rarely Speechless
- Joined
- Jan 4, 2010
- Messages
- 15,584
- Reaction score
- 60,693
Oh duh yeah if it looks like naig on a Nalgene bottle, it probably used to read nalgene!
Please remember sunscreen & insect repellant....
branmuffin
Well-Known Member
- Joined
- Nov 9, 2015
- Messages
- 4,383
- Reaction score
- 39,206
If it's normal to carry a 50 pound pack why did so many people comment on the size of MH's pack? Do you usually carry a ratio of your own body weight? If that's what most hikers do, it doesn't really make sense because I was on a website where lots of people were showing their pre-hiking weight and what they weighed at the end. Some people lost more than 50 pounds, many more in the 30 pound range. How can you balance your requirements for backpacking when there is the understanding that most through hikers will lose a considerable amount of weight?
branmuffin
Well-Known Member
- Joined
- Nov 9, 2015
- Messages
- 4,383
- Reaction score
- 39,206
Yup, duh is right! I've been set straight. Now I don't have to go looking for someone called Naig.
GatorFL
Well-Known Member
- Joined
- Jan 1, 2009
- Messages
- 2,341
- Reaction score
- 15,933
Personal choice, the decision is that you give up distance for comfort. Lots of people opt to go ultralight, lots go heavy. It depends on a lot of things for each individual.
Everyone loses weight while hiking, my average 5 mile burn is about 1000 calories.
I would never carry a journal or anything paper other than a couple scraps of newspaper to help start a fire. But lots of hikers do carry a journal. I carry my cell, sometimes I'll carry a mini solar charger and I can text or play games if I'm bored. I carry a firearm for personal protection. Not many do. We can open carry while hiking here in FL, I usually carry concealed a small S&W 38 Airweight pistol. But if there are large game animals like bears, gators, panthers, I carry a larger firearm with more ammo, usually a Colt .45 pistol and several clips. And I open carry.
Little stuff adds up super fast. I like a nice tent, cooking options, towel and soap, etc. Extra 2-3 lbs right there. Aleve, Tums chewables, benadryl. Ear plugs. Carmex. Off, I never go on a hike without it. Sometimes water purification tabs. I'll take them to Nobles since there is a gator in the pond.
I'm also a foodie and bring fresh meat, usually steaks, for the first nights meal. Some potatoes, a couple small onions. Sometimes a bottle of WT101. Mini spice rack. Couple lbs there. For other days I like dried food like ramen noodles, I am a master at doctoring them up with canned chicken. Maybe some tuna pouches or some SPAM for another meal. Instant oatmeal. I'm a coffee fanatic, my kitchen looks like a Starbucks but I carry instant coffee on the trail. As heavy as I go the weight of a French press isn't worth it. Anyway food bag is usually 4-5lbs.
Water is 2.2lbs per liter. He was probably carrying 3l when he broke camp. 6.6 lbs.
Like I said most thru hikers have somebody stashing supplies for them. A wife or GF or mom to Fedex stuff back and get new gear.
Last edited:
branmuffin
Well-Known Member
- Joined
- Nov 9, 2015
- Messages
- 4,383
- Reaction score
- 39,206
Based on your last posts regarding what you bring and what other hikers bring on their hikes I have revised my position that he had extra stuff in his pack that mysteriously disappeared.
I think I went down that path because of the constant comments regarding the size of the backpack MH had, but based on your input it sounds like many people carry that much weight when they hike, renewing supplies as they diminish.
- Status