FL - Jennifer Kesse, 24, Orlando, 24 Jan 2006 - #12

[Skully]

Again, just my thoughts, but why risk returning the car? He could have driven away with it, parked it miles away, drove it into a lake, any number of things, but he didn't, he returned it. He parked it in a place that had drug activity, maybe to throw off the police. He knew her. He may not have planned his, but then had to follow through. If he was an illegal, why not take the car? Rob her apartment too? No, she knew this person, most likely let them in. He knew her schedule.

I think they should go back to her place of work. JMO

 

[Skully]

If you drive to her apartment, and you take her car, that means your car is left behind. Maybe it's parked out of sight, if you are planning on taking her car, but that makes no sense, at least to me. So then you have to ask, why did he take her car at all, if he came in a car? Okay, he walked, then had to take her car to kidnap her, right? So now he has her and the car, why return it? How did you do that? You had help. So maybe it's 2 people, one drives the car and one takes her and her car to another location. Then if that is the case, why return her car? I keep coming back to that. You can't drive 2 cars at once, or you have to leave your car. Or you have help. But even if you have help, not getting rid of it, makes no sense, unless you what to make it look like she was at that location when she was taken, or some druggie took her. IDK.

 

[liz b.]

Mr. and Mrs. Kesse now say that law enforcement seized the contents of Jenn's vehicle's trunk and that they are not certain that items such as Jenn's briefcase and ipod were not in the trunk. In other words, (I take it to mean) no-one can be certain of what is actually missing.

Here is what doesn't make any sense to me--why would they seize the contents of the trunk, but not the DVD player strapped via seat belts to the back seat? I'm trying to recall a few pictures I have seen of the inside of the vehicle after it was released, and I think her car cell phone charger and some flip-flops were visible, too. (I'll try to look those pictures up, but someone probably knows exactly.)

So, why just seize the trunk contents? Surely, it couldn't be that they think she was in the trunk at some point?

Something really hinky about that strapped in DVD player imo. Was it dusted for prints ? was there a DVD in it ?

 

[wpaylor]

Does the driveway that the POI was walking down, after abandoning the car, lead to a major road or city street? Does anyone know?

 

[RosalindaA]

I just watched the interview with Jennifer's brother Logan and a group of reporters at the recent press conference (link in earlier post here). He was understandably very angry and perhaps this is what is needed now and perhaps even earlier. Someone killed his sister and has got away with it for 12 years, it is horrendous. The length of time really hit home for me as the last time I saw him was when he was a young lad and now he is a young Drew Kesse. And Jennifer was very like her mother and isn't going to get the chance to grow older.

I should just have made it clear in my last post that I doubt that Rob had anything to do with her disappearance. But I think it is possible that maybe Jennifer was confused about how things were going, maybe felt let down and that if someone from her past/present showed up offering her sympathy/affection she would be vulnerable to this. I don't think that makes her a bad person and just because she might have gone out with someone, stayed the night at someone's place doesn't mean she was being unfaithful, just that maybe she might have wanted to talk into the night and then sleep on the sofa without having to worry about driving back and being late for work.

I think it is really important to know what was in the car, I find it unlikely that JK would normally leave work devices in the trunk overnight but then a dvd player was left in the car but that's a much less significant/sensitive item. And who put the work stuff in there, although as the car was wiped, I'm sure these would have been too.

I agree the phones powering off at the same time does suggest that someone knew what they were about to do and were aware of phone pings, etc. I've only become aware the last 18 months after watching crime tv, but would that knowledge, 12 years ago in the USA have been likely only to be thought about by professional criminals or might "ordinary people" have been aware of it?

Did harm come to Jennifer that night in her apartment and the killer had the presence of mind to power off the phones, make it look like Jennifer had prepared to go to work, tidy up apartment and remove her in the early hours in her own car? He then had plenty of time to think and cover his tracks. Some methods of killing make very little "mess" or noise eg strangulation which is a common method used by males killing female exes or partners. And it is known anyway that virtually no forensics were done on her apartment which was contaminated, but careful police would still have tried a bit harder.

Got to say I am not a huge fan of polygraphs especially as cold-blooded people are possibly going to be able to fool them. If they would have agreed I would have got every male significant other together with one of those really clever top interrogators, their results can be amazing, can be videoed and are admissible in court. But I suppose the ones you would really want would have "lawyered up" even at the time and certainly would now. Maybe if the Kesses get the records, civil suits might follow, or could it lead to a grand jury. Apologies as a UK person I don't really know how these work but it seems they have more powers to make people speak?

 

[wpaylor]

I just finished watching the press conference video with OPD, Mr. Kesse and son Drew Kesse. What a slap in the face for OPD to refuse to give them the case files and then hire a full time detective and wrap a bus with Jenn's picture after 12 years!!! It truly shows that it took the Kesses hiring lawyers and private detectives to get any action at all. I also viewed the video of the new detective, Teresa Sprague, who seems excited about delving into the case, even showing the limited boxes of case files, but it shouldn't have come to this!!!! The Kesses deserved better!!!!

 

[JnRyan]

I just finished watching the press conference video with OPD, Mr. Kesse and son Drew Kesse. What a slap in the face for OPD to refuse to give them the case files and then hire a full time detective and wrap a bus with Jenn's picture after 12 years!!! It truly shows that it took the Kesses hiring lawyers and private detectives to get any action at all. I also viewed the video of the new detective, Teresa Sprague, who seems excited about delving into the case, even showing the limited boxes of case files, but it shouldn't have come to this!!!! The Kesses deserved better!!!!

I didn't see the conference, but I just listened to it on 'Unconcluded' podcast. The police chief just seemed to be simply in damage control mode - trying to limit damage to the OPD. I got the impression from listening to him that Det. Sprague was being newly assigned to Jennifer's case to work exclusively on this case. When asked afterwards by the media, Drew Kesse said Det. Sprague has been on this case for 5 years. There really wasn't anything he said of substance that couldn't have been said by the Kesse's.

 

[rd_jfc]

Does the driveway that the POI was walking down, after abandoning the car, lead to a major road or city street? Does anyone know?

It's the apartment lane running alongside Texas, then it curves at corner and runs alongside Americana. Exit/entrances up front on Americana and of course there at Texas by the pool. The lanes running through the apartment complex have street names. A really good poster I'm sorry don't recall who now posted an aerial view with the named lanes in it. It's back several pages, last year some time.

 

[Truth Prevails]

Does the driveway that the POI was walking down, after abandoning the car, lead to a major road or city street? Does anyone know?

I'm not sure if this will help, but see what you think. You just have to click on it to make it larger.



I don't know how you feel about Google maps, but I'll add a link to one I made for Jenn's case. You can take a look and see if it helps.

https://drive.google.com/open?id=1dFczQr14UJRDEX3LZefAIMp5x_U&usp=sharing

 

[wpaylor]

I'm not sure if this will help, but see what you think. You just have to click on it to make it larger.

View attachment 129465

I don't know how you feel about Google maps, but I'll add a link to one I made for Jenn's case. You can take a look and see if it helps.

https://drive.google.com/open?id=1dFczQr14UJRDEX3LZefAIMp5x_U&usp=sharing

Thank you so much! It would seem that someone almost certainly had to pick up the POI!!!

Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk

 

[Truth Prevails]

Again, just my thoughts, but why risk returning the car? He could have driven away with it, parked it miles away, drove it into a lake, any number of things, but he didn't, he returned it. He parked it in a place that had drug activity, maybe to throw off the police. He knew her. He may not have planned his, but then had to follow through. If he was an illegal, why not take the car? Rob her apartment too? No, she knew this person, most likely let them in. He knew her schedule.

I think they should go back to her place of work. JMO

If you drive to her apartment, and you take her car, that means your car is left behind. Maybe it's parked out of sight, if you are planning on taking her car, but that makes no sense, at least to me. So then you have to ask, why did he take her car at all, if he came in a car? Okay, he walked, then had to take her car to kidnap her, right? So now he has her and the car, why return it? How did you do that? You had help. So maybe it's 2 people, one drives the car and one takes her and her car to another location. Then if that is the case, why return her car? I keep coming back to that. You can't drive 2 cars at once, or you have to leave your car. Or you have help. But even if you have help, not getting rid of it, makes no sense, unless you what to make it look like she was at that location when she was taken, or some druggie took her. IDK.

Excellent thoughts, as always.

But I can't help thinking--what if it was simply a case of the perpetrator moving Jenn's car once he heard via his "grapevine" that Jennifer's parents were on their way. What if he had Jenn somewhere in the building and he just slipped out and moved her vehicle and walked back.

Had her vehicle still been parked in its assigned place when Mr. & Mrs. Kesse arrived, they probably would have torn that place apart looking for her with or without help from LE.

Anyway, whatever his reasons were, they definitely worked. Here we are 12 years later. Without answers.

 

[wpaylor]

Excellent thoughts, as always.

But I can't help thinking--what if it was simply a case of the perpetrator moving Jenn's car once he heard via his "grapevine" that Jennifer's parents were on their way. What if he had Jenn somewhere in the building and he just slipped out and moved her vehicle and walked back.

Had her vehicle still been parked in its assigned place when Mr. & Mrs. Kesse arrived, they probably would have torn that place apart looking for her with or without help from LE.

Anyway, whatever his reasons were, they definitely worked. Here we are 12 years later. Without answers.

Love your thought process, wouldn't his "grapevine" suggest that he knew her?

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[Truth Prevails]

Love your thought process, wouldn't his "grapevine" suggest that he knew her?

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Yes, I don't believe Jennifer was a victim of a random crime. But I can't find anything that would point to a motive for harming this young woman. She lead an exemplary life. Her last phone call places her in her own home, ready for bed and even in her bed. How does she go from being exactly where she should have been to vanishing without a trace?

Sometimes I lie awake thinking about Jenn, wondering if she had a good nights sleep before she encountered evil; or if that evil somehow entered her home as she slept. I really don't know. I find it frightening, really.

 

[wpaylor]

Yes, I don't believe Jennifer was a victim of a random crime. But I can't find anything that would point to a motive for harming this young woman. She lead an exemplary life. Her last phone call places her in her own home, ready for bed and even in her bed. How does she go from being exactly where she should have been to vanishing without a trace?

Sometimes I lie awake thinking about Jenn, wondering if she had a good nights sleep before she encountered evil; or if that evil somehow entered her home as she slept. I really don't know. I find it frightening, really.

I so commend her parents for keeping their sanity! Imagine going to bed every night for 12 years not knowing where your daughter is and what happened to her and why! I think it would drive me crazy, I just don't think I could stand it!

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[Topcat]

Maybe he had to return,,either to work or through other obligations (family perhaps)..and had no other way ..he was pretty particular on how he parked the car..maybe he was a new driver..

 

[Truth Prevails]

I didn't see the conference, but I just listened to it on 'Unconcluded' podcast. The police chief just seemed to be simply in damage control mode - trying to limit damage to the OPD. I got the impression from listening to him that Det. Sprague was being newly assigned to Jennifer's case to work exclusively on this case. When asked afterwards by the media, Drew Kesse said Det. Sprague has been on this case for 5 years. There really wasn't anything he said of substance that couldn't have been said by the Kesse's.

I find what the Kesse's are actually asking for, or at least their reasons for asking, is a little different than the "norm".

I'm hoping the unusual nature of their request may help them.

I wonder if they are thinking there could be specific tips that would lead strictly to Jennifer's whereabouts? If I recall correctly, Mr. Kesse said they are specifically interested in the tips received in the first two weeks of Jennifer's disappearance. After that, they were down to psychic tips, anyway.

Florida is a different state--maybe they will be more receptive.

Society owes this family. If this is what they really want; then I pray they are given the chance to look for their daughter in their own way.

Snipped quote from the "Kesse Family Letter:" ... Let me repeat that; Authorities at this point are more concerned about the prosecution of an unknown Abductor case if ever solved, as opposed to finding Jennifer. That is where our systems priorities are, not where this family’s are. The only thing that matters at this point is the recovery of Jennifer Kesse, everything else will fall in place. ...
http://jenniferkesse.com/

 

[Skully]

Excellent thoughts, as always.

But I can't help thinking--what if it was simply a case of the perpetrator moving Jenn's car once he heard via his "grapevine" that Jennifer's parents were on their way. What if he had Jenn somewhere in the building and he just slipped out and moved her vehicle and walked back.

Had her vehicle still been parked in its assigned place when Mr. & Mrs. Kesse arrived, they probably would have torn that place apart looking for her with or without help from LE.

Anyway, whatever his reasons were, they definitely worked. Here we are 12 years later. Without answers.

okay, lets say he didn't have a car, he walks there, or jogs there. He still has to use her car to take her away, and he has to get someone to return it, (guy/girl In photo) but that means getting someone else involved. That's risky. Unless you know that girl, you date her, or the guy is a trusted friend, or relative. Did Jennifer jog? or do distance running? Just curious if any one knows. I am convinced this person knew her, either by work, or family, friends, hobbys, but he knew her.

 

[Truth Prevails]

okay, lets say he didn't have a car, he walks there, or jogs there. He still has to use her car to take her away, and he has to get someone to return it, (guy/girl In photo) but that means getting someone else involved. That's risky. Unless you know that girl, you date her, or the guy is a trusted friend, or relative. Did Jennifer jog? or do distance running? Just curious if any one knows. I am convinced this person knew her, either by work, or family, friends, hobbys, but he knew her.

I, too, believe he knew her. I guess to your list, I would add--with some reluctance--the "condo workers" who had seen her coming and going on a daily basis and would simply come to know her by sight.

Early on in this case it was known that Jennifer did belong to a gym. In fact, there was discussion that someone from her gym may have been involved in her disappearance. Nothing came of it, though, and I don't know how official anything surrounding that ever was.

Mrs. Kesse has recently said on the Unconcluded Facebook page that Jennifer did not belong to a gym. I believe that was because they don't want anyone dredging up old discussions about it.

Jennifer was also said to have been a member--at least at one time--at the gym where James Hataway was a personal trainer.

 

[Skully]

I, too, believe he knew her. I guess to your list, I would add--with some reluctance--the "condo workers" who had seen her coming and going on a daily basis and would simply come to know her by sight.

Early on in this case it was known that Jennifer did belong to a gym. In fact, there was discussion that someone from her gym may have been involved in her disappearance. Nothing came of it, though, and I don't know how official anything surrounding that ever was.

Mrs. Kesse has recently said on the Unconcluded Facebook page that Jennifer did not belong to a gym. I believe that was because they don't want anyone dredging up old discussions about it.

Jennifer was also said to have been a member--at least at one time--at the gym where James Hataway was a personal trainer.

thank you, I never heard the discussion about the gym, but if her mom says she wasn't a member, then she would know. I was asking about jogging because years ago there was a vague connection to Michelle Parker and this case that. I think this person, although never connected to Jennifer, was a jogger. So theorizing about the car, the jogging came to mind. If you drive to a crime scene, and take the victim's car, you leave your's behind and have to return for one but why return the other? That has always bothered me. On another note, I am working with different resources regarding satellite images from 10 years ago. It has been challenging but there are places that archive images from Google and private companies and counties that do it too. Sometimes you get lucky and get an image from the date of a crime, and if you are real lucky you get a lead. Maybe her parking lot or surrounding areas would be a good start.

 

[Skully]

Speaking to the theory a worker may have done this, I have always doubted it, only because it was too risky, they would have to have resources, such as a car, a place to take her, or another vehicle, and the big one, Jennifer would never open a door to them. She had mace on her key ring, she was smart and was leary of them already. I really feel she trusted this person, enough to go outside or let them in, or at least open the door.