FL FL - Kingfish Boat Ramp Murders, Holmes Beach, 1 Aug 1980

[liz b.]

I have also wondered on here about this being a revenge hit. Even though he was a pediatrician, there are situations where children die in hospitals from accidents or illness and the doctor gets blamed. Or it could have been a former patient that was left with some sort of permanent injury (guy was complaining about hurt ankle so he could have known he was a doctor).Could be the only reason IMO that he would have done it while the children where there and shot the kids before Dr Dumois. Revenge.

Sleuthster,
Yes,I think the hurt ankle ruse was directed ta Dr.Dumois because he was a doctor. LE stated that they went back and checked all of his patients' families. There does not appear to be that kind of motive there. No patients or their families would have had any reason to seek this kind of revenge.

 

[Lera213]

THank you, and I just got caught up from reading. Fascinating case! I'm still trying to process everything I read but, one thing is I think we should look at any other shootings with a small cal. 22 in the state of Fla within a year after this crime.

If it was a hit, or even a flippant killer who felt empowered and so self assured to kill in the open with people around he would in fact stay with the same weapon of choice.

I conclude that this killer did do his homework, knew the Police department was small, knew he could blend in after the fact and that is why the bicycle. If it was a hit, and he was from out of state, wouldn't he have checked into a hotel, not in the immediate area but somewhat close by to hear the news reports to see if he left any witnesses, and or to clean up loose ends?

I don't think now it was a past disgruntled family member of one of his patient because I'm sure before he fired a shot he would have said something like "This is for blah blah blah" No that theory for me is out the window.

I noticed in the blurry photo of the perp getting out of the car, shows him to be healthy in weight. Not skinny, wouldn't one of the boat people have less meat on their body? (I know not necessarily but)

OT: I lived in Melbourne Fl. at the time and do not remember hearing about this case.

 

[Lera213]

Also in that blurry photo it looked like the perp was wearing a short/long sleeve button oxford shirt.

This tells me the guy is middle income, older then 20, I would say more 30ish.

Has the FBI tried to enhance this photo? The person who took this photo, did he give a description?

Edit to add: Ok maybe not an oxford shirt, but a jacket, with writing on the back. Notice the waist, it looks to be a white band. First thought a belt but I'm thinking Jacket. I'm sure FBI can enhance it enough to get one word off the back if indeed it is a jacket with writing on it.

 

[Lera213]

I'm thinking this is one of those lone-wolf assassins, perhaps this wasn't his first but clearly not knowing there was another way out and went back by the scene kind lends me to think that he was still rusty in the planning.

 

[liz b.]

I'm thinking this is one of those lone-wolf assassins, perhaps this wasn't his first but clearly not knowing there was another way out and went back by the scene kind lends me to think that he was still rusty in the planning.

Lera213,
Not sure about the lone wolf part, someone was waiting to drive him away... Also,he left a good print on the boat. LE runs it every few years,but it has never drawn a match.

All JMO

 

[librabrat]

My local ABC Action News station has taken a renewed interest in this case. The first link is a complete writeup of the story, the photos, victims, suspects, etc, for anyone that doesn't know about this case. I didn't live here when this happened so I just learned about it from the writeup.

Kingfish Boat Ramp Murders 31 years ago
http://www.abcactionnews.com/generic/news/crime/Kingfish-Boat-Ramp-Murders

The second and third links are articles written on 8/1/2011 and 8/2/2011.

"Kingfish murders continue to baffle"
http://www.abcactionnews.com/generic/news/crime/Kingfish-Boat-Ramp-Murders

"Was Donald Frankos, aka Tony the Greek, involved in the Kingfish Boat Ramp Murders?"
http://www.abcactionnews.com/dpp/news/crime/was-donald-frankos%2C-aka-tony-the-greek%2C-involved-in-the-kingfish-boat-ramp-murders%3F

 

[liz b.]

My local ABC Action News station has taken a renewed interest in this case. The first link is a complete writeup of the story, the photos, victims, suspects, etc, for anyone that doesn't know about this case. I didn't live here when this happened so I just learned about it from the writeup.

Kingfish Boat Ramp Murders 31 years ago
http://www.abcactionnews.com/generic/news/crime/Kingfish-Boat-Ramp-Murders

The second and third links are articles written on 8/1/2011 and 8/2/2011.

"Kingfish murders continue to baffle"
http://www.abcactionnews.com/generic/news/crime/Kingfish-Boat-Ramp-Murders

"Was Donald Frankos, aka Tony the Greek, involved in the Kingfish Boat Ramp Murders?"
http://www.abcactionnews.com/dpp/news/crime/was-donald-frankos%2C-aka-tony-the-greek%2C-involved-in-the-kingfish-boat-ramp-murders%3F

Wow Librabrat.... Fascinating post. And somewhat plausible.

Couple of things : LE polygraphed Raymond about possible drug involvement a total of about 3 times. Apparently he always passed the LDTs... Also, it would have been fairly easy to kill Raymond when he was alone.Why wait until he was with 3 other people in a car ? I noticed that the last article stated that Raymond worked in Miami Beach, but I believe he was employed at the best hotel in Key Biscayne.He was the Bell Captain of the hotel. He was in a good position to meet and get to know the many Colombians who were guests at the hotel....

Thanks for an intriguing and fascinating post. Drugs were always something I had suspected.... MOO

 

[librabrat]

You are absolutely welcome. I do have one correction: The second link is incorrect. Here is the link to the article "Kingfish murders continue to baffle." (Includes a 6 minute news video about the case and Frankos.)

http://www.abcactionnews.com/dpp/news/local_news/investigations/kingfish-boat-ramp-murders-continue-to-baffle-investigators

 

[librabrat]

An article was updated today on my local ABC news website. (8/11/2011)

"Miami In 1980 Was A Place Under Siege By Drug Traffickers"
http://www.abcactionnews.com/dpp/news/crime/miami-in-1980-was-a-place-under-siege-by-drug-traffickers

 

[CrimeSolver]

Thanks for the new info, librabrat. I'm so glad the case is being stirred up again.

I don't quite understand the sequence of the Matzke murder, but I suppose Matzke witnessed the shootings from where he was adjacent to - or across from - the scene, jumped into his coupe (the crashed car in the photos), and followed the gunman to the Foodway where he was shot.

 

[librabrat]

Thanks for the new info, librabrat. I'm so glad the case is being stirred up again.

I don't quite understand the sequence of the Matzke murder, but I suppose Matzke witnessed the shootings from where he was adjacent to - or across from - the scene, jumped into his coupe (the crashed car in the photos), and followed the gunman to the Foodway where he was shot.

Exactly right.
"....The gunman walked away from the scene. He headed toward a Foodway grocery store less than half a mile away.
The car accident caught the attention of a man across the street. That man was retired Colonel Robert Matzke . When Matzke catches up with the mysterious man at the Foodway parking lot, eyewitnesses say the two spoke briefly, and as Matzke started driving away in his Fiat, the stranger shot him...."

This is where we see the pics of Matzke's small car crashed into another in the parking lot.
The fact that this case has been so ignored by the media as the years went by is just nuts. :shakehead:

 

[librabrat]

I'm weird - Every single crime case I come across, I automatically start the calculations of how old I was and what I was doing around the same time the case was going on. I love late 1960's to early 1980's cases and so I figure I was anywhere from 3 years old (Manson family) and playing w/blocks to 16 years old (Diane Downs) and hanging 'round the corner store. Completely oblivious to these fascinating cases that I would come to obsess over, 20 years later.. :detective:

 

[kline]

I'm weird - Every single crime case I come across, I automatically start the calculations of how old I was and what I was doing around the same time the case was going on. I love late 1960's to early 1980's cases and so I figure I was anywhere from 3 years old (Manson family) and playing w/blocks to 16 years old (Diane Downs) and hanging 'round the corner store. Completely oblivious to these fascinating cases that I would come to obsess over, 20 years later.. :detective:

Your not alone!
I do the same thing Im always placing myself in time in relation to these older cases.
I graduated from High School in 1980 in Montana.
Long way from the Coke saturated state of Florida that year.

 

[librabrat]

@Kline: You made me smile :crazy: I thought I was the only one in the world.

 

[librabrat]

Local News Station WFTS ABC Action News has produced a 30 minute primetime special on The Kingfish Killer. (Kudos to their production team for pouring their hearts and souls into a network-quality piece.. and producer Doug Iten, who has tirelessly put countless personal hours into reviving this case...)
The link below has the special in 3 parts for anyone who isn't familiar with the case (and Jamison Uhler is pretty easy on the eyes to boot!):

http://www.abcactionnews.com/dpp/news/local_news/investigations/i-team-special-report:-the-kingfish-killer

 

[LawAbidingCitizen]

Wow never read about or heard of this case before coming upon this thread. While its a complete shot in the dark, the first name that came to mind was Carl Eder. He committed a SOMEWHAT similar crime when he was sixteen in California. A father picked Eder up hitchhiking, felt empathetic, allowed Eder to stay in his home for about a month,while the father was at work Eder murdered the wife and four kids! The crime happened over FIFTY years ago to date.

Eder was sent to prison but ecasped in 1974, he would've been 40 at the time this crime occurred. I dont think these murders were random. I think this was planned and that the perp and at least one of the victims crossed paths at some point and time, even if its was a brief encounter. Also could be a case of murder for hire. With the crime being planned and possibly a case of murder for hire, it seems more so unlikely Eder was involved but he's sociopath and STILL a fugitive so.....

 

[trisha_mc]

The link to the 30-yr anniversary story wasn't working for me, so try this one instead:

http://www.bradenton.com/2010/08/01/2473301/holmes-beach-horror-murders-unsolved.html

I just came across this case tonight, and think it might be time for WSers to take another look at it.

Thanks in advance to all who have the time to at least read the story I have linked above!

 

[Ravynne]

The link to the 30-yr anniversary story wasn't working for me, so try this one instead:

http://www.bradenton.com/2010/08/01/2473301/holmes-beach-horror-murders-unsolved.html

I just came across this case tonight, and think it might be time for WSers to take another look at it.

Thanks in advance to all who have the time to at least read the story I have linked above!

Wow, I just got done reading this article. It is unbelievably sad this hasn't been solved, this was the only link that worked for me, I guess because it is the latest article. Where are the images for this case? I would like to take a look at them. If anyone has a link TIA.

 

[Ravynne]

Just found this link...

http://www.abcactionnews.com/news/l...f-looking-into-the-kingfish-boat-ramp-murders

 

[G&AMom]

Wow, never heard of this case until stumbling across it here today. It's distressing to see that two children were killed and the killer never caught.

I realize this won't really do anything to solve the case, but the one thing that jumped out at me was that the killer started shooting while the car was moving. I'm sure the car was moving slowly since it was trailing the boat behind it and they had just started up but . . . . you kill the driver of the car you're in? There's no way to predict what would happen. Suppose the car veered into an oncoming lane and was hit by someone else? I think one of the articles said the perpetrator steered the car to the side of the road, but even so he would not really have the car under control. Doesn't that seem like this guy was not a professional, or at least experienced? Curious what others think.