GUILTY FL - Lonzie Barton, 2, Jacksonville, 24 July 2015 - #6

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Since Lonna was charged with neglect to Lonzie, why would the court & LE allow her to see the daughter while on bail when she could be a witness to the neglect?
Is there a link that says she is with her daughter? I haven't read anything about that. I'm sure child services are involved.

Just more speculation, but he didn't shut the car off. The car was running when found. It involved a process of opening the hood and flipping a switch (would have to know where it was or that it existed). If the car was stolen, remember it was flashy, it would help WRE's car jacking explanation and point to another perp. His theory just didn't work or he thought the police were really stupid....

He thought his car was flashy. In reality it was a 20 year old mismached junker. :floorlaugh:
He totally thought he was smarter than the police. He told his ex-gf as much when he was terrorizing her.
 
Wasn't LL charged with child neglect by her own admission to LE of knowing Lonzie was not in a good way, bruise on his head, vomiting, lethargy, and yellow fluid coming from his ears and that she admitted leaving him with RE to go to Wackos while she should of got Lonzie medical help instead? So LE don't have a weak case there IMO, because LL admitted her negligence after a third party gave that information to LE and LL didn't and couldn't really deny it after that.
Yes it is weak, because it is based entirely on her admissions. Confessions are the gold standard on TV shows, but in reality there must be corroborating evidence. By all accounts she is a liar. That actually makes her confession LESS credible than if she were a generally truthful person telling a consistent story.

It depends a lot on this third party and whether they witnessed the illness/injuries or was just told about it, and their details/impressions of severity. A good lawyer will tell the court something like this:

Lonzie spit up his dinner and had some minor discharge in his ears and seemed a little sleepy. He was prone to ear infections and had drainage tubes in his ears. He had no fever. Mom left the child with his regular caretaker. He has been on the wrong side of the law but had no history of violence against children. He promised to watch over Lonzie and let her know if his conditioned worsened. She planned to take him to the clinic first thing in the morning. As for the bruise, she was angry because Ruben didn't tell her about it but believed him when he told her it was accidental. Lonzie is a normal active toddler who falls down and gets bruises from time to time.

Forehead bruises are very common in active toddlers, any protruding body part that hits the ground or a table on the way down. The bruise behind the ear, however is a huge red flag...BUT Lonna is a not a professional and would not be expected to know that.

So, to reiterate, I am NOT defending either one of them, but they will have lawyers who will put on such a defense, and the prosecution has to prove beyond a reasonable doubt with a "confession" that keeps changing. It's all going to hang on the corroboration. Hopefully they are getting more evidence and the case is growing stronger under the radar.
 
Thanks for the pic you posted. I'm not able to see anything but what you've mentioned too. But Gut Instinct may have a better photo.

I didn't actually post the pic. but another poster did.
 
Yes it is weak, because it is based entirely on her admissions. Confessions are the gold standard on TV shows, but in reality there must be corroborating evidence. By all accounts she is a liar. That actually makes her confession LESS credible than if she were a generally truthful person telling a consistent story.

It depends a lot on this third party and whether they witnessed the illness/injuries or was just told about it, and their details/impressions of severity. A good lawyer will tell the court something like this:

Lonzie spit up his dinner and had some minor discharge in his ears and seemed a little sleepy. He was prone to ear infections and had drainage tubes in his ears. He had no fever. Mom left the child with his regular caretaker. He has been on the wrong side of the law but had no history of violence against children. He promised to watch over Lonzie and let her know if his conditioned worsened. She planned to take him to the clinic first thing in the morning. As for the bruise, she was angry because Ruben didn't tell her about it but believed him when he told her it was accidental. Lonzie is a normal active toddler who falls down and gets bruises from time to time.
Forehead bruises are very common in active toddlers, any protruding body part that hits the ground or a table on the way down. The bruise behind the ear, however is a huge red flag...BUT Lonna is a not a professional and would not be expected to know that.
So, to reiterate, I am NOT defending either one of them, but they will have lawyers who will put on such a defense, and the prosecution has to prove beyond a reasonable doubt with a "confession" that keeps changing. It's all going to hang on the corroboration. Hopefully they are getting more evidence and the case is growing stronger under the radar.

Well from what the third party told LE about Lonzie's condition it was serious enough to charge her with felony child neglect, so i guess we'll just have to wait and see.
But Yes, they are both liars in all of it, and it will be difficult for LE to decipher fact from fiction in it all, but i still think they should be able to put together a pretty good case. They did say they had lots of other evidence we haven't even heard about yet, and consequently they are pursuing a murder charge, and i think that it will be obvious considering there was no abduction and something really bad must of happened to Lonzie if they got rid of him and he still hasn't been found yet. 2+2 and all that.
 
I think there will be a good case against RE & LL because no one stole Lonzie, no one else to blame in his being missing except RE & LL.
Unless they come up with a zannie the nanny, god forbid!
 
It will be curious to know if WRE wiped the steering wheel off with his T-shirt. (like a car thief would) LE knows and it would be more evidence in a cover-up.

That's why he took his Tshirt off??? !!!
 
Well from what the third party told LE about Lonzie's condition it was serious enough to charge her with felony child neglect, so i guess we'll just have to wait and see.
But Yes, they are both liars in all of it, and it will be difficult for LE to decipher fact from fiction in it all, but i still think they should be able to put together a pretty good case. They did say they had lots of other evidence we haven't even heard about yet, and consequently they are pursuing a murder charge, and i think that it will be obvious considering there was no abduction and something really bad must of happened to Lonzie if they got rid of him and he still hasn't been found yet. 2+2 and all that.
Therein lies the issue....the standard of proof to ARREST someone (probable cause, more likely than not) with a crime is much lower than that required to PROSECUTE (reasonable probability of conviction), and still lower than that required to CONVICT(beyond all reasonable doubt). That is why a very small percentage of those charged with crimes are actually convicted. I don't mean to be pessimistic, I have plenty of faith they are building a stronger case, but on new separate charges rather than building directly on the facts presented in these.

I think the neglect charges are intended to be temporary just to hold them. They have released just enough probable cause to support charges, but not enough to convict. You don't have to put everything in the charging documents, but it is a tricky game to hold back major points of evidence. I think they are deliberately tailoring the current charges to very specific acts of neglect, SEPARATE from that which caused Lonzie's death. That is a smart move, it leaves the field wide open for murder charges later and lets them keep evidence under wraps as part of an ongoing investigation. If they draw the line that the current neglect charges caused to his death, they could set up a speedy trial situation where Lonna is aquitted for neglect and can't be charged later with murder because of double jeopardy. Angela Corey is a brilliant prosecutor and I'm sure is thinking all of this through.
 
i believe he was charged with sales. i dont think it violates TOS to say that.

I am not saying EB was a drug dealer as i dont think that has ever been mentioned by JSO but perhaps whatever drug $ he hid that night...storage locker or buried somewhere...that LL would have access to and or as a bond for EB. jmo and probably not accurate...also think he refused to go to hearing as Op mentioned upstream so it was postponed? have no clue obviously
 
3, lonzie, lily and an older boy whose dad's initials are MC. saw this on her history of court dockets.

so given all we have learned, how many children does LL have? THanks in advance for your feedback sleuthers.
 
Two points: google lb photos. The mainstream photo in boots in zoom shows two black eyes or bruising from healing black eyes. A sore on his lips.

In the pic with the bottle, if you zoom u will see a bruised right arm that almost looks broken. I do not believe he is sucking on that bottle...it looks more like it was placed to look that way. The swelling on the back of his head is much more than a bruise. The back of his head is severely swollen. I am not sure I believe L is alive in this pic and if so, the pic was taken VERY soon after and if he passed. It does look like EB is holding him up ...not in his arms but with his arm. please understand this is jmo. Little L....fly with the angels my love.

I said the same thing earlier and I totally agree with what u have said here!

They took photos thinking the time stamp would prove he was alive at that time.

My heart breaks for this beautiful little boy! He did not deserve this. His sister didn't either!


All JMVOO
 
I'm thinking he took his T-shirt off, bc it would have been to identifying if captured on video.
He would have had to take shirt off to reduce it from being soaked due to 97% humidity at the time but also could have used it to wipe prints, like an ungloved opportunistic car thief might.
 
Continuing on that note, it is curious to me that Ruben's neglect charges are based entirely on his statement of his activities that night, primarily leaving Lonzie alone in the car between 1:00 and 2:17 am. This demonstrates the conundrum of depending solely on confessions for evidence against a person. They have determined that to be a lie, and believe Lonzie was probably already dead during that time frame. So they charged him with lying. What is problematic is that now he is currently charged with two counts that directly disprove one another. I don't see how they can let that stand. They are going to have to drop the neglect charge, or completely refile it. I KNOW they have more evidence but it is the documentation that matters. You can't hold somebody in jail on and say "well the evidence I used to lock him up turned out to be all wrong, but don't worry , I have more evidence I'll show you later, just trust me". You also can't say "Well either this happened or that happened, either way he is guilty". Either/or can never constitute probable cause. Again, I have full faith in Angela Corey...it just has me very very curious.
 
lol yesterday was my SIL, her son and her ex husband's birthday as well as m,y ex husband's sister's birthday.

Thank you. What's funny is my best friend of 21 years.. Her daughter was born 2 years ago today on my birthday! Weird huh!


Sent from my iPhone 6 using Tapatalk
 
Continuing on that note, it is curious to me that Ruben's neglect charges are based entirely on his statement of his activities that night, primarily leaving Lonzie alone in the car between 1:00 and 2:17 am. This demonstrates the conundrum of depending solely on confessions for evidence against a person. They have determined that to be a lie, and believe Lonzie was probably already dead during that time frame. So they charged him with lying. What is problematic is that now he is currently charged with two counts that directly disprove one another. I don't see how they can let that stand. They are going to have to drop the neglect charge, or completely refile it. I KNOW they have more evidence but it is the documentation that matters. You can't hold somebody in jail on and say "well the evidence I used to lock him up turned out to be all wrong, but don't worry , I have more evidence I'll show you later, just trust me". You also can't say "Well either this happened or that happened, either way he is guilty". Either/or can never constitute probable cause. Again, I have full faith in Angela Corey...it just has me very very curious.

I was wondering about that too. How can they charge him with neglect if it is all based on lies by RE and not having the children in the car?
 
Nonetheless, Hackney said, she left Lonzie and his 5-year-old sister in the care, custody and control of Ebron and left to go to work at Wacko's, an adult entertainment venue.

Ebron, who kept drugs at the apartment Lauramore shared with her children, would routinely take Lauramore with him on drug deals, Chief Hackney told reporters. "She found it in the best interest of Lonzie to have him in the car" too, he said.

Lauramore has had phone contact with Ebron since Lonzie's disappearance, according to police. Last Friday, she gave an exclusive interview to First Coast News, saying she believed her son was still alive.

That's after investigators announced the child had been murdered, not abducted, as Ebron had told police on July 24 when he reported him missing. Surveillance video obtained from a neighbor's home discredited that narrative, police said.

"We are still full speed ahead at making a murder case, especially against Ruben Ebron," Hackney said. "...I will take the truth from either of them, at any given time."
http://www.11alive.com/story/news/c...r-faces-judge-child-neglect-charges/32009141/
 
Sometimes I feel like I'm trying to do the puzzle with only 1/4 of the correct pieces 1/4 wrong pieces and 1/2 missing. So frustrating to keep the lies, truths and hypothesis separated.
Like LL's involvement. I was positive that she wasn't involved, then thought her actions/ reactions were strange , then thought her involvement was neglect and now after hearing the story from the girl that gave her the ride home it's obvious LL's actions are disturbing. She either knew what was going to go down before it happened are does an amazing job compartmentalizing in major trauma.
On her ride home (because WRE didn't want to wake kids as she tells it). She either lied to the gal and already knew about the "car abduction". (Why??? Seems like that would be a very valid reason to bum a ride) or found out on way home ( why then keep it a secret and ask to be dropped off a block away). We have to assume she found out before stopping at Pine Crest Apartments. But then why not freak out in front of co worker and have her speed to your house? Why the drop off and the lie to JSO officer. All this lying does not addup -even if she didn't know, wouldn't she freak out when JSO starts talking about missing 2 year old. I would think you would drop any pretenses of not knowing a drug dealer once it became known your son was missing while in his care.
Was her plan to lurk around and not be seen? Maybe go get the car? This fracture of logic is unnerving me.
 
Continuing on that note, it is curious to me that Ruben's neglect charges are based entirely on his statement of his activities that night, primarily leaving Lonzie alone in the car between 1:00 and 2:17 am. This demonstrates the conundrum of depending solely on confessions for evidence against a person. They have determined that to be a lie, and believe Lonzie was probably already dead during that time frame. So they charged him with lying. What is problematic is that now he is currently charged with two counts that directly disprove one another. I don't see how they can let that stand. They are going to have to drop the neglect charge, or completely refile it. I KNOW they have more evidence but it is the documentation that matters. You can't hold somebody in jail on and say "well the evidence I used to lock him up turned out to be all wrong, but don't worry , I have more evidence I'll show you later, just trust me". You also can't say "Well either this happened or that happened, either way he is guilty". Either/or can never constitute probable cause. Again, I have full faith in Angela Corey...it just has me very very curious.

I think the neglect charge can stand because Lonzie went missing while under Ebron's responsibility. The explanation for his disappearance turned out to be a lie, and Ebron has offered no other explanation of how the boy disappeared. Ebron neglected his responsibilities as an adult in charge of a child by evidence that there is no longer a child.

JMO,.
 
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