FL - Somer Thompson, 7, Orange Park, 19 Oct 2009 #32

[doggies]

Am chiming in here, with virtually nothing to add, but want to get something out of my mind before I GO out of my mind. We have so many more questions than answers, so many more rumors than reports, but I seem to remember something, and would love to have it cleared up-I'm thinking I can't be the only one who is unclear on this concept...
So-someone mentioned that the church had been 'chosen' to hold the memorial service. IIRC, the church OFFERED to hold the service, just as the funeral home OFFERED to donate its services.
Which leads me to the question, how did the preacher know that DT had recently been 'saved'? I just can't get out of my head that DT and family did not belong to a particular church or follow a specific religious doctrine. I wish I knew why I think this, and no, it doesn't help us prove who killed Somer, but I do think it's important due to all the discussion of how the preacher acted/reacted, etc.
In other words, I was led to believe by the early reports that this preacher did not know the family.
DT, et al, would have been, in that case, his only source of information. No wonder he was surprised at ST's appearance there. The pastor was probably getting his information (who were wrong, as we know) just like everyone else-through the media. Remember-this was in the early days, and the conflicts were many.
Am I totally off base with what I think I remember?

 

[ccane]

I dont remember if 4mer mentioned her on here. I was referring to the hospitalization. They do not have the same father. PC is ACs father. and yes, she did live with ST and DT after the twins were born, IIRC.

I wonder with all the searches that have been done on DT why no court records have turned up showing that the father took the child?

How do we know this child is alive and well?

 

[ChickenPants]

Sorry I can't keep trying to go back thru these posts cause there is so much personal info, conjuncture, extraneous stuff, fashion, religion etc..

I don't see why it is so hard to post the answer to a simple question...maybe someone else can help me out here??

what was the reason the "reporter" gave for LE not releasing the COD?

(a link/info as to time on a video is also appreciated, but I would really like to hear peopel summarize it ...and /or give me a link to the posts where this was discussed...thanks)

Yes, I am sorry, too, for what probably sounds like mean-spirited remarks on my part. Why am I spending three hours on here the day after Christmas, anyway? Well, I just hold out hope like everybody else here. This little girl must have something special to do with our lives or we would not be here. I am very sad and frustrated about things that I see that were maybe not intentional or meant to happen - a little girl is dead. I want for it to be better. I am like the Arizona woman: Hug your kids and kiss them, don't let them lose their mummy, too. What difference does it make? I'm not going to make anybody change. I just want to say I have seen and see a lot of suffering every day, and of course there will always be suffering in the world. What I can't stand is MEANINGLESS suffering - suffering that can be avoided. There are remedies for just about everything. There is no excuse for suffering if people will make a choice to do something to help. So it doesn't help for me to be sarcastic. So my apologies to anyone who feels I am being argumentative. I have suspicions and theories and am very frustrated that there is not movement forward in this case.

 

[Chili Fries]

I'm going to throw this out there, even though I think it's nothing. These pictures were taken more than 3 weeks after Somer was killed so that's probably too long for the cuts to still be visible but...if you go to the photos from the Molly Hatchet/Red Jumpsuit Apparatus benefit concert on November 13th you'll see a guy with cuts on his face and neck. He's the dude in the gray homemade RJA t-shirt. Third row down, 1st and 2nd photos on the left.
http://photos.jacksonville.com/mycapture/folder.asp?event=889091&CategoryID=10519&ListSubAlbums=1

Please don't post his photo here, he's just some random guy at the benefit and that may be far too long for the cuts to be visible if they happened Oct 19th.

 

[LogicalMinds]

Yes, I am sorry, too, for what probably sounds like mean-spirited remarks on my part. Why am I spending three hours on here the day after Christmas, anyway? Well, I just hold out hope like everybody else here. This little girl must have something special to do with our lives or we would not be here. I am very sad and frustrated about things that I see that were maybe not intentional or meant to happen - a little girl is dead. I want for it to be better. I am like the Arizona woman: Hug your kids and kiss them, don't let them lose their mummy, too. What difference does it make? I'm not going to make anybody change. I just want to say I have seen and see a lot of suffering every day, and of course there will always be suffering in the world. What I can't stand is MEANINGLESS suffering - suffering that can be avoided. There are remedies for just about everything. There is no excuse for suffering if people will make a choice to do something to help. So it doesn't help for me to be sarcastic. So my apologies to anyone who feels I am being argumentative. I have suspicions and theories and am very frustrated that there is not movement forward in this case.

Why can't you simply give me the "time" on the video to watch...or "tell me" what the reporter/s said?

I think that many people...me included...are not able to wade thru these many many posts/backbiting, and off topic stuff

I feel sorry for this little girl....this happened in my state...I would be happy to "do" something, to write a letter, email or make a call...but what??

this has become like a 2 person conversation...I notice that there is no "identification" of anyone's "side" or connection here...yet some seem to be connected

I for one find it very confusing and I don't think this is helping anything

I really wish someone...anyone...would answer my questions regarding COD and if there is video where this is discussed by insiders (reporters?) just summarize it for me...please thanks please thanks:banghead::banghead:

 

[LogicalMinds]

That kid looks like he has some acne...not cuts

I really feel there should be a limit to how many people are "suspects" on here..

Pretty soon the public might be afraid to go to any rally/funeral/vigil for a missing person ??

The "smoking gun" here is what the LE is NOT saying...and the "reason/s" they aren't saying anything...JMO

of course, few people want to talk about that

 

[Chili Fries]

I really wish someone...anyone...would answer my questions regarding COD and if there is video where this is discussed by insiders (reporters?) just summarize it for me...please thanks please thanks:banghead::banghead:

Time code 12:14:39 in the video.

 

[ChickenPants]

Am chiming in here, with virtually nothing to add, but want to get something out of my mind before I GO out of my mind. We have so many more questions than answers, so many more rumors than reports, but I seem to remember something, and would love to have it cleared up-I'm thinking I can't be the only one who is unclear on this concept...
So-someone mentioned that the church had been 'chosen' to hold the memorial service. IIRC, the church OFFERED to hold the service, just as the funeral home OFFERED to donate its services.
Which leads me to the question, how did the preacher know that DT had recently been 'saved'? I just can't get out of my head that DT and family did not belong to a particular church or follow a specific religious doctrine. I wish I knew why I think this, and no, it doesn't help us prove who killed Somer, but I do think it's important due to all the discussion of how the preacher acted/reacted, etc.
In other words, I was led to believe by the early reports that this preacher did not know the family.
DT, et al, would have been, in that case, his only source of information. No wonder he was surprised at ST's appearance there. The pastor was probably getting his information (who were wrong, as we know) just like everyone else-through the media. Remember-this was in the early days, and the conflicts were many.
Am I totally off base with what I think I remember?

SOmebody else prob already answered this.
Sad said that ST was the one who told the pastor DT had recently been saved and would he follow up with her. So, ST and Pastor had conversation, before or after the service or both? Maybe DT had faith but just did not belong to a church, and this is common, isn't it?

Re: church and funeral home.
Funeral home has lists of pastors of churches and works with them extensively. They go over every aspect of the funeral and the church service. The funeral home personnel is present at the service, as the casket must leave the service, etc.

If the church did indeed donate the services, and this is a high profile case, and the church had been informed that mom could not afford a funeral or didn't belong to a church or whatever...it doesn't matter. All funeral homes, churches and pastors follow the same protocols with funerals as I explained previously. A funeral of a child is especially sensitive. They would make sure they had everything beforehand because it is a highly emotional event. They would want to head off any possible outbursts that might occur. ESPECIALLY in a service that would be attended by thousands. THE PASTOR HAD TO KNOW THIS WAS GOING TO HAPPEN.

There is a photo somewhere on the web showing DT and the caption is that she was going to make the funeral arrangements. What arrangements did she need to make? What arrangements would you make? Generally, churches of various denominations have standard scriptures, even standard memorial cards (the Lord is my Shepherd, praying hands, poems, "footprints", the Virgin Mary) for people to take. They have contracts with printers who simply put the name of the deceased there. This is all routine. They interview the family and ask about any little personal anctedotes that will make the service meaningful. How does the family want the deceased to be remembered.

Then there is the standard service: opening prayer(s), homilies or sermons, songs, opportunities in some services for people to share memories, communion at some, closing prayers, etc. They go over each and every aspect with family and ask WHO WILL BE INCLUDED IN WHICH PART OF HTE SERVICE...who will follow the casket in and out, who will be pallbearers, everything.

And this is very important: AS PART OF THEIR SERVICES, THE FUNERAL HOMES ALSO PREPARE THE OBITUARIES. AT least they did when I recently lost both my mother and father, I stood there telling the secretary exactly what I wanted placed there. The charge by the line (Dt's would have been free, of course) DT must have made a specific request of THE FUNERAL HOME to edit ST out of the obituary. I can't believe that the funeral home would not have shared this sensitive subject with the Pastor. REMEMBER, IT IS A HUGE VISIBLE CRIME.

So, yes the pastor would have known about ST if he watched media or had been told. But he also would have been clued in by the funeral home. It's a network of people that work very closely together in an intense world.

 

[LogicalMinds]

Time code 12:14:39 in the video.

THANKS!! Finally

but...I must say I was a bit disappointed.....

well the "explanation" was just something we have heard before..to not tip off the killer/or whatever....

now...let's think...what other case/s have they been so tightlipped...and why?

 

[Chili Fries]

That kid looks like he has some acne...not cuts

I really feel there should be a limit to how many people are "suspects" on here..

Pretty soon the public might be afraid to go to any rally/funeral/vigil for a missing person ??

The "smoking gun" here is what the LE is NOT saying...and the "reason/s" they aren't saying anything...JMO

of course, few people want to talk about that

It does look like cuts to me.

We don't post pictures or full names because we don't want to implicate innocent people. We can't narrow down the suspect list because there are way too many unknowns. If we narrowed down the list the conversation would be even more stuck on the family and SP and PC and many, including myself, don't believe any of them are the perp.

We see many cases where LE are very tightlipped about details so they don't give away anything they think would compromise the investigation or maybe even attract kooks who use it to give false confessions or lie about something to get involved.

A big missing piece here is whether Somer was sexually molested or not. If she were then an adult male is the likely perp, if not then I think it was probably a juvenile.

 

[ChickenPants]

Why can't you simply give me the "time" on the video to watch...or "tell me" what the reporter/s said?

I think that many people...me included...are not able to wade thru these many many posts/backbiting, and off topic stuff

I feel sorry for this little girl....this happened in my state...I would be happy to "do" something, to write a letter, email or make a call...but what??

this has become like a 2 person conversation...I notice that there is no "identification" of anyone's "side" or connection here...yet some seem to be connected

I for one find it very confusing and I don't think this is helping anything

I really wish someone...anyone...would answer my questions regarding COD and if there is video where this is discussed by insiders (reporters?) just summarize it for me...please thanks please thanks:banghead::banghead:

Well I have been having conversations with everybody else, and I noticed that nobody is answering your questions regarding the COD either. Unbelievable. No, I am not going to go back and sum it up for you. So keep on banging your head, but I'd suggest you just watch the video like we did.

 

[ChickenPants]

THANKS!! Finally

but...I must say I was a bit disappointed.....

well the "explanation" was just something we have heard before..to not tip off the killer/or whatever....

now...let's think...what other case/s have they been so tightlipped...and why?

What kind of logical explanation were you anticipating from a reporter?

 

[Noway]

I'm watching the video and will transcribe what I hear. (May not be exact; video was choppy for me and Jennifer was not at her best IMO.)


Jennifer Waugh Reporting
Funeral October 27, 2009

And understandably … because as police in general … having covered the police beat as long as I have … you know they’ll always tell you there are certain details that only the killer or killers will know.

And by releasing, for example, cause of death, that’s a ... that's a key, it’s one thing that’s … it’s usually not released to us right away.

You know, and that is one of the reasons why as you’ve seen now, and as the Sheriff said after Somer had been found … now you’ve seen the Sheriff come forward and he’s certainly updated and briefed everyone, but now the information that will be released from his office is extremely minimal, because again they are in essence banking on the fact that it’s very likely that the person responsible is in fact watching.



Hardly earthshattering reporting. IMO

btw, Perry is referred to as Diena's fiancée in that video. I didn't catch the time but it's just at the point when Diena and the family members are coming out of the church.

 

[ChickenPants]

I was looking for information to clarify the relationship between clergy and funeral homes, and came across this. It is interesting, if not directly related.
http://www.articleswave.com/people/funeral-etiquette.html

 

[doggies]

Thank you, Chicken Pants-your explanation re:funeral homes is exactly what my experiences have been when losing loved ones.
But as we've learned, here, and I'm sure Sadnpod will agree with me, is that the farther one gets removed from first-hand information, the farther afield one is. I have a friend who says she finds it very difficult to communicate in emails, posts, etc, because we cannot SEE the emphasis, the facial expressions, the tone of voice, etc. She's right. The same goes w/being told from someone who was told, etc. So yes, I know (first hand) how remarkably sensitive and calming funeral home personnel are-in publlic. I also know how difficult it would be to communicate someone's comments to someone else. That's all.
Oh-and you were right, again. I mis-read the post about DT. It indeed came from ST and not the pastor. Thank you and SnP for making sure I went back and read that.

 

[sadnpod]

Am chiming in here, with virtually nothing to add, but want to get something out of my mind before I GO out of my mind. We have so many more questions than answers, so many more rumors than reports, but I seem to remember something, and would love to have it cleared up-I'm thinking I can't be the only one who is unclear on this concept...
So-someone mentioned that the church had been 'chosen' to hold the memorial service. IIRC, the church OFFERED to hold the service, just as the funeral home OFFERED to donate its services.
Which leads me to the question, how did the preacher know that DT had recently been 'saved'? I just can't get out of my head that DT and family did not belong to a particular church or follow a specific religious doctrine. I wish I knew why I think this, and no, it doesn't help us prove who killed Somer, but I do think it's important due to all the discussion of how the preacher acted/reacted, etc.
In other words, I was led to believe by the early reports that this preacher did not know the family.
DT, et al, would have been, in that case, his only source of information. No wonder he was surprised at ST's appearance there. The pastor was probably getting his information (who were wrong, as we know) just like everyone else-through the media. Remember-this was in the early days, and the conflicts were many.
Am I totally off base with what I think I remember?

ST had talked to DT after somers body was discovered and that is when the topic of her recently being saved was discussed, at least thats what ST told me and ST told the pastor. And Im with you that I dont think the pastor knew the family prior to this.

 

[LogicalMinds]

What kind of logical explanation were you anticipating from a reporter?

Well...I guess I was looking for something a bit more ..? more concerned about this case...and/or maybe some info on another case

I guess I expected to hear them say "well hey Sue, LE didn't give out any info in the xyz case cause of *advertiser censored*??? "...or "yeah, remember when LE was tightlipped about zox case cause it was an inside deal"..

I mean...like some "reference" to other cases


~~~~~
at this point..I will put out my own theories...

1) done by another child...maybe accident...coverup...rage...didn't mean to kill but struck her?? Yeah...relative, friend, schoolmate or???

2) coverup/rage from an adult who knew her...."I'm gonna tell">...maybe HE had been molesting her, touching her (not that afternoon)?

3) coverup/rage from an adult who knew her...not sexual motivated, just he (she?) angry that Somer was being difficult (indigo child)...hit her too hard..
"I'll tell">> flew into rage ...or hit her and she hit her head...

4) #2 but from one of the construction workers...I still remember that Somer spoke to them, very odd, that sticks out to me

5) offchance :not likely but still maybe...she "saw" something...drugs?? and was going to tell....she messed with someone's stuff...he hits her..."I'm gonn tell"...he kills her?

6) offchance :not likely but still maybe...accident at construction site, some guy panics and throws away her body?

of course..without knowing HOW she was killed...and was there sexual assault...or privious sexual assault? just very hard to say

and WHY?? why cover it up?? I think the manner of death/cause of death/ and the sexual assault info must lead to someone...but who?? we just don't have the facts...and I am trying to recall cases that remained this "tight lipped" this long

 

[sadnpod]

I wonder with all the searches that have been done on DT why no court records have turned up showing that the father took the child?

How do we know this child is alive and well?

I havent talked to ST today, but his mom just called and she remembers everything the way I told you. The father and child live in another state and there wasnt any court battles according to DeT. She also told me that this child does visit DT, last spring is the last time that she knows of. According to her, the child is alive and well. ST told me that the father does not want her to be involved in this mess. I think we should respect that. P M me if you have any more questions about her, ok?

 

[Noway]

I talked via PM with the WS member GrandmaJ, who is in the funeral business (not sure where) and she mentioned that it is common practice to lock (and seal) the casket.

She said she would try to get over here at some point if there were questions that she could answer.

 

[Noway]

I suppose it is possible that LE asked that the casket be closed so that the COD not be obvious to the public?

And while it is the place of the funeral home to make the suggestion (not LE) and the family could refuse, in this case, Diena did not. Could have been for many reasons: took advice of LE and/or funeral home that it would be better to not have this particular memory of Somer, to prevent tabloid photos, etc.

JMO