Found Deceased FL - Tammy Alexander, 16, Brooksville, 8 Nov 1979

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faithx said:
New audio clips share voice of Tammy Jo Alexander, found dead in 1979

"On Tuesday, Livingston County Sheriff Tom Dougherty released three audio recordings of Tammy Jo. The recordings were made from a tape held by her then-boyfriend. They are believed to have been recorded in July 1979 - four months before she was found dead."
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Wow. After following her case as a UID for so long, it gave me chills to hear her voice. She sounds so sweet with that surprisingly Southern twang. Thanks for sharing this.
 
Some thoughts on the crime scene. (If you live locally, please chime in on these speculations of mine.)

First, taking a look at where the crime took place, it would seem that one of two possibilities are likely. Either A.) the killer chose that section of Hwy 20 West (just after the fork off from Hwy 5) because it was the first area that was remote enough while traveling west from the Lima Family Restaurant and it was simply the first opportunity he saw that was far enough from residences, businesses, or farmhouses to avoid being detected (sight or gunshot). In this scenario, he just kept driving until it became remote enough to pull over and commit the murder. This would suggest that Hwy 20 was his chosen route, and that implies a destination of Buffalo, perhaps. (Consult a map on this. There's basically not much between the murder sight and the 30 odd miles to the outskirts of Buffalo, so perhaps Buffalo is where he was headed to begin with.) Or B.) the sight was NOT on the way to his destination and he did NOT just get lucky in finding the nearest remote location but instead was familiar enough with the area to CHOOSE that spot. Doesn't mean he was a local. Perhaps he'd frequented the place in the past and knew that that area was rather rural and away from homes. This would mean that he intentionally drove to that spot.

Why is this important? Well, Scenario A COULD mean that the murder wasn't well planned. He seemed to be getting along well with her at the restaurant. Perhaps an altercation took place and he snapped or he attempted a sexual advance, was rebuffed, and then got angry. All this while on route to his destination. But, Scenario B implies something more premeditated and that he knew the area very well. Perhaps he killed her there knowing it was remote then backtracked to travel to Rochester or some other destination. If you use the streetview function on Google Maps you'll see that it's really one of the very first areas while traveling west from Lima that is away from traffic, homes, businesses, etc. Did he KNOW this about that area, or did he just sieze that opportunity?

Finally, where were they coming FROM? No offense to Lima folks, but it's not the most well-known town, and it's certainly not the most direct route from major cities in NYS. So what were they doing up in the Finger Lakes area? How do you drop into the Lima Family Restaurant at 8-9 pm (dark in Nov.) on a Friday night in Lima, NY unless you know it's there and open? The drive from the restaurant to the murder scene would have taken around 15 minutes. Autopsy said they had eaten about 1 hr. or so prior to death. Unless they stayed at the restaurant for several minutes after eating, that leaves some time (45 minutes). What happened between leaving the diner and the murder?

I lean more to Scenario A above for a few reasons. First, it wouldn't be smart to take someone to a small town diner that's not very busy just before murdering them. The result is what you would expect. A waitress that could recall you very well. Second, as the waitress said, who buys someone dinner and then murders them an hour later? I guess, but it doesn't have the hallmarks of thoughtful planning to me. Finally, if it were his jacket that he loaned to her, it wasn't terribly smart not to take it with him. Not the sign of premeditation. Anyway, my speculations. Thoughts or hypotheses, anybody?
 
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Cicero2021 said:
Some thoughts on the crime scene. (If you live locally, please chime in on these speculations of mine.)

First, taking a look at where the crime took place, it would seem that one of two possibilities are likely. Either A.) the killer chose that section of Hwy 20 West (just after the fork off from Hwy 5) because it was the first area that was remote enough while traveling west from the Lima Family Restaurant and it was simply the first opportunity he saw that was far enough from residences, businesses, or farmhouses to avoid being detected (sight or gunshot). In this scenario, he just kept driving until it became remote enough to pull over and commit the murder. This would suggest that Hwy 20 was his chosen route, and that implies a destination of Buffalo, perhaps. (Consult a map on this. There's basically not much between the murder sight and the 30 odd miles to the outskirts of Buffalo, so perhaps Buffalo is where he was headed to begin with.) Or B.) the sight was NOT on the way to his destination and he did NOT just get lucky in finding the nearest remote location but instead was familiar enough with the area to CHOOSE that spot. Doesn't mean he was a local. Perhaps he'd frequented the place in the past and knew that that area was rather rural and away from homes. This would mean that he intentionally drove to that spot.

Why is this important? Well, Scenario A COULD mean that the murder wasn't well planned. He seemed to be getting along well with her at the restaurant. Perhaps an altercation took place and he snapped or he attempted a sexual advance, was rebuffed, and then got angry. All this while on route to his destination. But, Scenario B implies something more premeditated and that he knew the area very well. Perhaps he killed her there knowing it was remote then backtracked to travel to Rochester or some other destination. If you use the streetview function on Google Maps you'll see that it's really one of the very first areas while traveling west from Lima that is away from traffic, homes, businesses, etc. Did he KNOW this about that area, or did he just sieze that opportunity?

Finally, where were they coming FROM? No offense to Lima folks, but it's not the most well-known town, and it's certainly not the most direct route from major cities in NYS. So what were they doing up in the Finger Lakes area? How do you drop into the Lima Family Restaurant at 8-9 pm (dark in Nov.) on a Friday night in Lima, NY unless you know it's there and open? The drive from the restaurant to the murder scene would have taken around 15 minutes. Autopsy said they had eaten about 1 hr. or so prior to death. Unless they stayed at the restaurant for several minutes after eating, that leaves some time (45 minutes). What happened between leaving the diner and the murder?

I lean more to Scenario A above for a few reasons. First, it wouldn't be smart to take someone to a small town diner that's not very busy just before murdering them. The result is what you would expect. A waitress that could recall you very well. Second, as the waitress said, who buys someone dinner and then murders them an hour later? I guess, but it doesn't have the hallmarks of thoughtful planning to me. Finally, if it were his jacket that he loaned to her, it wasn't terribly smart not to take it with him. Not the sign of premeditation. Anyway, my speculations. Thoughts or hypotheses, anybody?
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Great post.

I'm local to the area and will try my best to answer some of your questions.

I will say that in many murders by killers, often times they will feed the victim beforehand.

My dad traveled frequently between Rochester and north-central PA during that time, for business. Pre-I-390 era, and he told me stories about it. 15 was the main north-south route in that area, back then. 5&20 would have been the main east-west route east of the area in question, prior to the completion of the NY State Thruway in the late 50's. Even so, 5&20 was still well-traveled back in the 70's, according to my dad. Although his route took him down 15 and points southward, occasionally his travels included both 5 and 20.

Dad knew quite a few diners along his routes, and years ago could even remember the names of waitresses who worked at them, and they knew him.

My guess would be this killer knew the area well enough, at least the roads like 5 and 20, maybe 15, too, but was not a regular at that diner in Lima. Had he been a regular, say, traveling salesman who stopped by there on occasion, they would have known his name or at least recognized him. As @Cicero2021 noted, even back then you didn't just stumble upon Lima, NY, or what have you, and MO is today it's even more off the beaten path.

That tells me, and this is my theory, the killer had planned to get rid of Tammy beforehand, as in this was not spur-of-the-moment decision. Could be the stop in Lima gave him more time to contemplate it, as well as do as I mentioned above, feed his victim before the murder.

Judging by the Wiki page, they may have traveled on the NY State Thruway prior to the murder, albeit maybe not together the whole time, which is interesting. Lima is a little bit south of it, and there would have been 3 or 4 exits within an hour's drive of Lima from that highway. My hunch is she was picked up on the Thruway/I-90 at one of the rest stops, which are frequented by truckers and travelers. I also wonder if she simply wanted to head south, to get out of NY and back to FL. The killer may have had other plans.

15 goes all the way to SC.

JMO
 
Really good info, Falling Down. The idea that they met up while traveling on the Thruway seems the most plausible to me as well. You can't help but wonder, though, what kind of person would, in such a short time, decide to randomly shoot a poor teenager that couldn't possibly offer him any harm. (A couple of hours or so?) One thing's for sure, I think he was definitely familiar with that route--not a regular, as you say--but knew of it, and I do think he was headed to Buffalo. Police should absolutely look at any suspect with a Buffalo connection.
 
November 11, 1979 was a Sunday, so she was killed Saturday night, early Sunday. We figured out homecoming was that Saturday as well. Dealing with Rochester to the North and 80 miles West to Buffalo. I-90 runs right to Manheim PA, where my Dad went to the car auctions back then. It is also a route one would take to FL- as 1-95 wasn't finished yet. Hitchhikers really weren't on the NY Thruway.
 
I might be overthinking this, or maybe underthinking, but I almost wonder if Tammy Jo did have some level of familiarity with her killer (as in known him well or at least traveled with him for a while, and he may have been known to others). I don't see another reason for him to have rummaged through her coat pockets to take her ID out. If she didn't know her killer, why would it be any harder for someone to link them if her name was known?
 
I wonder if the details Henry Lee Lucas gave in his confession for her murder have been compared with the details for this UID case
 
evilwise said:
I wonder if the details Henry Lee Lucas gave in his confession for her murder have been compared with the details for this UID case
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Sorry, which UID?

I don't think he killed any UIDs. He got all the details about the murders he confessed to from LE. JMO.
 
Springrain said:
Sorry, which UID?

I don't think he killed any UIDs. He got all the details about the murders he confessed to from LE. JMO.
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Lucas confessed to killing Tammy in 2000 if I recall correctly. I suppose if the information he gave had been accurate she would have probably been identified before now - however he might have misremembered the location but gave other details that turned out to match.
 
Springrain said:
I might be overthinking this, or maybe underthinking, but I almost wonder if Tammy Jo did have some level of familiarity with her killer (as in known him well or at least traveled with him for a while, and he may have been known to others). I don't see another reason for him to have rummaged through her coat pockets to take her ID out. If she didn't know her killer, why would it be any harder for someone to link them if her name was known?
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The jacket was large on her- and I think it was his. I'd say he took his personal effects out of the pockets
 
Roselvr said:
I feel that while he may be a trucker; they came up in the wagon. That color wagon was not typical to your area from what locals have told my group.
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I know this is a response to an old post, but I've been following this case, and I feel very strongly that Tammy Jo was probably riding with a trucker north up 390 but she got off at or before Hwy 20 because the trucker was probably headed to Rochester, and that wasn't where she was wanting to go. It's very possible that a trucker dropped her there so that she might get a ride to wherever else she was headed (Boston?). I think it's also very possible that she met someone at that drop off location who agreed to take her into town for a bite to eat. (A local or perhaps someone familiar with Lima area.) There's no way a big rig could park near the Lima Family Diner. Just not enough room. So, while she may have been riding with a trucker up to NY, it's very unlikely that a trucker took her to that diner and then killed her. Diner guy, in my opinion, is not a trucker just passing through but someone who's familiar with the area. Interestingly, there's a rest area to the south at Mt. Morris. Was it there in 1979??
 
Cicero2021 said:
I know this is a response to an old post, but I've been following this case, and I feel very strongly that Tammy Jo was probably riding with a trucker north up 390 but she got off at or before Hwy 20 because the trucker was probably headed to Rochester, and that wasn't where she was wanting to go. It's very possible that a trucker dropped her there so that she might get a ride to wherever else she was headed (Boston?). I think it's also very possible that she met someone at that drop off location who agreed to take her into town for a bite to eat. (A local or perhaps someone familiar with Lima area.) There's no way a big rig could park near the Lima Family Diner. Just not enough room. So, while she may have been riding with a trucker up to NY, it's very unlikely that a trucker took her to that diner and then killed her. Diner guy, in my opinion, is not a trucker just passing through but someone who's familiar with the area. Interestingly, there's a rest area to the south at Mt. Morris. Was it there in 1979??
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The rest area has been there a long time, in fact I took a nap there while on a 14 hour drive home to Rochester in 1997.

I-390 was completed north of Dansville, to the interchange w/I-590 in Brighton, NY, 1980-1982-ish. I vaguely remember seeing a section of it shortly after it opened, Brighton/Henrietta area, around that time. Now...I don't know which sections from Dansville opened when, just that the road was not continuous from Dansville to Rochester until '82.

There had been a proposal to run the road right into downtown Rochester, but it was blocked by the federal government. So another proposal had to come along, which took some time. Once it was approved, sections were completed and connected from Dansville to Rochester during the time I noted above, say sections of the road.

Apparently "tan station wagon" was given as a description of the vehicle:

Unsolved: Who killed Tammy Jo Alexander, aka 'Caledonia Jane Doe'?

Hope this helps.
 
medium.com

Caledonia Jane Doe: The Story of Tammy Jo Alexander

On November 10, 1979, the body of a teenaged girl was found in a field, in Caledonia, New York. This was off U.S Route 20, near the Genesee…
medium.com medium.com

en.wikipedia.org

Murder of Tammy Alexander - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org en.wikipedia.org

www.thedailynewsonline.com

LISTEN: Sheriff’s Office releases audio recordings of Tammy Jo Alexander as search for killer continues

CALEDONIA – As part of an ongoing effort to bring her murderer to justice, the Livingston County Sheriff’s Office today released snippets from an audio recording made by Tammy Jo
www.thedailynewsonline.com www.thedailynewsonline.com
 
We all know how Sherri Jarvis' killer is referred to as the I-45 killer, Libby and Abby's killer is referred to as Bridge Guy, etc.

Has any such name been given to Alexander's killer?
 
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