Florida's Stand Your Ground Law

[highflyer]

As regards iced tea and skittles, I've never figured out what that has to do with anything besides the media trying to portray him as a little kid. GZ was just going to Target for milk. Does that make him less threatening?

It shows what Trayvon was carrying, food. It is important. George was carrying a loaded gun.
As far as going for food stuffs, Trayvon actually did that and George did not.
The media is not trying to portray anything with it other than what it is.

 

[vlpate]

To me, it serves to emphasize that Trayvon was not carrying a weapon like GZ was.

It still has nothing to do with the case or the SYG law. A can of tea or a cell phone can become a deadly weapon.

 

[Concerned Papa]

It still has nothing to do with the case or the SYG law. A can of tea or a cell phone can become a deadly weapon.

Don't forget during his interview with Piers Morgan, RG Jr. let us know a tube of Chapstick and a toothpick could be a deadly weapon.....

 

[Karmady]

It shows what Trayvon was carrying, food. It is important. George was carrying a loaded gun.
As far as going for food stuffs, Trayvon actually did that and George did not.
The media is not trying to portray anything with it other than what it is.

Well, in the case linked upthread, the immune shooter was, of course, carrying a gun, but his attacker wasn't carrying anything but his fists. So he didn't even have the benefit of the "skittles and tea" argument (or whatever you want to call it). jmo

 

[AngelWings444]

It still has nothing to do with the case or the SYG law. A can of tea or a cell phone can become a deadly weapon.

But it wasn't, unless the "injuries" to GZ were from a can or cell. If that picture is authentic, it's not an ice-tea can, a cell phone or candy.

To me, anything on either of them is important. If Trayvon had anything else on him, like a screwdriver, you all would be arguing that he was carrying a weapon. He was not. GZ was.

 

[highflyer]

Well, in the case linked upthread, the immune shooter was, of course, carrying a gun, but his attacker wasn't carrying anything but his fists. So he didn't even have the benefit of the "skittles and tea" argument (or whatever you want to call it). jmo

The case up thread had little relevance to this case.

 

[AngelWings444]

Well, in the case linked upthread, the immune shooter was, of course, carrying a gun, but his attacker wasn't carrying anything but his fists. So he didn't even have the benefit of the "skittles and tea" argument (or whatever you want to call it). jmo

In the article referenced above, the attacker was speeding, was drunk and was beating the other guy in a one-sided fight.

Apples/Oranges.

 

[Karmady]

The case up thread had little relevance to this case.

Did you mean to say, in your opinion? In mine, it has so much relevance to this case that it practically mandates a not-guilty SYG decision unless there is evidence we don't know about that contradicts the State's investigator's standing testimony the State has no evidence of who started the physical altercation. And even then, if the investigator said that under oath and such evidence exists, well, that could be problematic for the State. And if there's new evidence about who started the physical altercation, I'll be surprised given what's gone on so far. jmo

 

[Karmady]

In the article referenced above, the attacker was speeding, was drunk and was beating the other guy in a one-sided fight.

Apples/Oranges.

But none of that was relevant to the decision except the part about who was beating whom. In this case, there is no evidence on that issue except George's testimony, John's eyewitness testimony, and maybe the boy. The State has conceded that they have none. We can agree to disagree, but I think you (nothing personal) are very much mistaken about the significance of that case. jmo

 

[vlpate]

But it wasn't, unless the "injuries" to GZ were from a can or cell. If that picture is authentic, it's not an ice-tea can, a cell phone or candy.

To me, anything on either of them is important. If Trayvon had anything else on him, like a screwdriver, you all would be arguing that he was carrying a weapon. He was not. GZ was.

The law does not require that both people be armed. Unarmed people kill people all the time. If Trayvon had his hand over GZ's mouth, as has been stated, and had he kept his hand over his mouth and asphyxiated him, he'd still be just as dead as if TM had been "armed". JMO

 

[AngelWings444]

The law does not require that both people be armed. Unarmed people kill people all the time. If Trayvon had his hand over GZ's mouth, as has been stated, and had he kept his hand over his mouth and asphyxiated him, he'd still be just as dead as if TM had been "armed". JMO

I know the law. Thank you. The article posted that was claimed to be a "great example" to this case, IMO, is not. JMO, and all that.

If Trayvon...exactly. We shall see, when the evidence is released.

 

[LambChop]

It still has nothing to do with the case or the SYG law. A can of tea or a cell phone can become a deadly weapon.

Or a burglary tool too, even. Oh, and fingernails could scratch someone's eyes out. lol But wait, TM was just walking home. If he were out to kill someone wouldn't he at least have taken a knife out of the kitchen drawer to do so. I guess kids just don't think about arming themselves when they set out to kill someone while they are on they're way home from the store.

Just the thought of having a can of ice tea in your hand or your cell phone and you bump into someone accidently and them using that as an excuse to shoot you because "they are having a bad day" is terrifying, absolutely terrifying. As a citizen who choses not to carry a gun I feel I should have the right to feel safe from those who do and have control issues. I've never had a problem with those who want to carry weapons but I'm beginning to see things much differently. If someone carrying a gun is allowed to make bad choices without accountability what happens to my freedom?????? jmo

 

[Elley Mae]

http://www.wftv.com/news/news/local/arraignment-set-george-zimmerman-case-tuesday/nNymm/

Sheaffer said in the coming month there could be a hearing to determine if the case is dismissed based on the "Stand your Ground" law.

 

[LiveLaughLuv]

The law does not require that both people be armed. Unarmed people kill people all the time. If Trayvon had his hand over GZ's mouth, as has been stated, and had he kept his hand over his mouth and asphyxiated him, he'd still be just as dead as if TM had been "armed". JMO

What does meet force with force mean?

(3) A person who is not engaged in an unlawful activity and who is attacked in any other place where he or she has a right to be has no duty to retreat and has the right to stand his or her ground and meet force with force, including deadly force if he or she reasonably believes it is necessary to do so to prevent death or great bodily harm to himself or herself or another or to prevent the commission of a forcible felony.
(4) A person who unlawfully and by force enters or attempts to enter a person’s dwelling, residence, or occupied vehicle is presumed to be doing so with the intent to commit an unlawful act involving force or violence.
(5) As used in this section, the term:
(a) “Dwelling” means a building or conveyance of any kind, including any attached porch, whether the building or conveyance is temporary or permanent, mobile or immobile, which has a roof over it, including a tent, and is designed to be occupied by people lodging therein at night.
(b) “Residence” means a dwelling in which a person resides either temporarily or permanently or is visiting as an invited guest.
(c) “Vehicle” means a conveyance of any kind, whether or not motorized, which is designed to transport people or property.

http://www.leg.state.fl.us/statutes...ing&URL=0700-0799/0776/Sections/0776.013.html

 

[LiveLaughLuv]

http://www.wftv.com/news/news/local/arraignment-set-george-zimmerman-case-tuesday/nNymm/

Sheaffer said in the coming month there could be a hearing to determine if the case is dismissed based on the "Stand your Ground" law.

Yes, could be if MOM decides this is a case for SYG defense...He has stated he doesn't know yet as he still hasn't seen GZ's statements to police..

COULD is the operative word..

and ACorey has already stated, should GZ use this as a defense she will fight it...she doesn't see this as a SYG defense...so, we shall see

 

[Gin]

It still has nothing to do with the case or the SYG law. A can of tea or a cell phone can become a deadly weapon.

JMO/IMO
I guess I'm missing the point here? A 9mm loaded with hollowpoint bullets was the deadly weapon used to kill.

Tea, Skittles and a cell really aren't even in the same ballpark.

 

[Reader]

Interesting comments on SYG law in this debate....

http://www.sun-sentinel.com/news/lo...-lawson-lamar-debate-20120509,0,6601621.story

The candidates were also asked, in light of the ongoing Trayvon Martin controversy, for their take on Florida's controversial Stand Your Ground law. Both Lamar and Jaeger said the law is often "misunderstood."

Williams went further, saying that the law "turns law enforcement into lawyers," forcing them to decide if someone is immune from prosecution before making an arrest.

Ashton's response: "It's wrong, it needs to be repealed, end of story."

I of course agree with Williams and Ashton....

 

[Karmady]

Interesting comments on SYG law in this debate....

http://www.sun-sentinel.com/news/lo...-lawson-lamar-debate-20120509,0,6601621.story



I of course agree with Williams and Ashton....

If SYG turns police officers into lawyers, why did SPD getting the prosecutor to make the call the night of the shooting?

 

[Reader]

If SYG turns police officers into lawyers, why did SPD getting the prosecutor to make the call the night of the shooting?

So that DID happen?

The SYG law says the LE agency is the one to determine whether there is probable cause to arrest if the force used was illegal. To bring in the prosecutor (and judge father) of GZ that night was improper and unnecessary. The LE agency is the one that is supposed to make that decision on their own, according to that law, not the prosecutor.

Bringing in the prosecutor at the point they did makes me believe they found something questionable about what George said that did not match the evidence they found so were reluctant to make a decision not to arrest on their own. They wanted back up and assurance that the prosecutor would not overrule them and file charges.

There is also the story of the detective wanting to file charges which nobody supporting GZ wants to accept, and maybe the chief wanted him to be overruled.

This law to me has turned the legal system upside down...making the LE agency act legally as prosecutors and judges.

IMO

 

[Reader]

Florida Senator Chris Smith and his task force on the SYG law have completed their report and forwarded it to the govenor. In his letter to the gov, Sen. Smith said:

On April 5, 2012 Senator Chris Smith convened an independent Stand Your Ground Task Force, comprised of members drawn from law enforcement, state prosecutors, public and private defense attorneys, and other legal experts. This Task Force was charged with reviewing the current “Stand Your Ground” law found in Chapter 776 Florida Statutes and developing recommendations to improve the statute to increase public safety.

The Task Force began its work by hearing public testimony from various members of the community and identifying the problems which have arisen from the implementation of the Stand Your Ground statute. The committee discussed the issue at length and agreed that the statute is too broad and a significant, unnecessary, and dangerous departure from the traditional law of self-defense.

Link to the report and comments:

http://floridastandyourground.org/