Follow the Money....

[KateB]

Some posts were moved to this new thread to discuss the home office in more detail:

Mark Sievers Home Office photos released 1-07-2016

 

[mikeinmo]

Some posts were moved to this new thread to discuss the home office in more detail:

Mark Sievers Home Office photos released 1-07-2016

with an "Office" in that disarray i wonder why they have the IRS lien against them complete shambles. I would be embarrassed for anyone to see it.

 

[1&2&3]

Just thought of something. If or when MS gets arrested, what are his chances of bailing out? I realize it will depend on the charges.

My main concern is if he bails out, will he be able to get the girls back?

Maybe that is what the $40,000.00 is for. Who is going to come to his rescue?

 

[FightTheOstrich]

Just thought of something. If or when MS gets arrested, what are his chances of bailing out? I realize it will depend on the charges.

My main concern is if he bails out, will he be able to get the girls back?

Maybe that is what the $40,000.00 is for. Who is going to come to his rescue?

I'd love to know what kind of cash MS has access to. I bet he cashed out TS's IRA. Then there's the $40,000.

He can collect social security survivor benefits for the kids. Although one interesting caveat is that the children must attend elementary or secondary school full-time. And I suspect MS isn't exactly on top of that. I wonder if multiple agencies could use this stipulation to require the girls to attend public school.
https://www.ssa.gov/planners/survivors/onyourown4.html

He maybe collecting unemployment benefits.

I doubt there's enough equity in the house to cover bail. His van isn't worth a dime.

I don't know if he'd have enough to cover attorney fees and bail. Because if MS is charged his attorney fees are going to be huge.

 

[AZlawyer]

I'd love to know what kind of cash MS has access to. I bet he cashed out TS's IRA. Then there's the $40,000.

He can collect social security survivor benefits for the kids. Although one interesting caveat is that the children must attend elementary or secondary school full-time. And I suspect MS isn't exactly on top of that. I wonder if multiple agencies could use this stipulation to require the girls to attend public school.
https://www.ssa.gov/planners/survivors/onyourown4.html

He maybe collecting unemployment benefits.

I doubt there's enough equity in the house to cover bail. His van isn't worth a dime.

I don't know if he'd have enough to cover attorney fees and bail. Because if MS is charged his attorney fees are going to be huge.

The school attendance requirement is just to extend benefits from age 18 to age 19.

 

[Frigga]

Just a question is it a known fact that they were/are upside down on the house?

 

[FightTheOstrich]

The school attendance requirement is just to extend benefits from age 18 to age 19.

Darn, I was hoping it could be used against MS. Strange wording though, how many 19 year olds are still in elementary school.

 

[AZlawyer]

Just a question is it a known fact that they were/are upside down on the house?

From the official records of Lee County, here's what it looks like to me.

They bought the land (Lots 27-30) for $257,000 in Feb. 2005, and got 2 mortgages at the time ($205,600 plus a $51,400 HELOC) to finance the purchase 100% (remember when that was a thing?).

In August 2005, they got a $438,000 mortgage to finance construction of the home on the land (mostly on Lot 30).

In Dec. 2005, the HELOC from the original land purchase ($51,400) was increased to $70,400.

In March 2007, they took out an additional $100,000 mortgage.

Starting in May 2009, they were facing foreclosure on the bigger mortgage from the original land purchase ($205,600). They sold the vacant parts of the land (Lots 27-29, pretty much) for $109,000 and were able thereby to pay off (or settle) the original land purchase mortgage and the HELOC.

So still remaining are the big construction loan ($438,000) and the extra $100,000 loan. But payments have no doubt been made through the years. The big one was a 30-year mortgage and the other one 20 years. Let's say the loans are both at about 6% fixed and no big extra payments have been made, then they might owe a total of about $430,000 by now.

Zillow estimates the value of the home at $450,000, which is not necessarily super-accurate, but would mean that they are not likely underwater, although certainly there isn't much equity.

 

[atthelake]

From the official records of Lee County, here's what it looks like to me.

They bought the land (Lots 27-30) for $257,000 in Feb. 2005, and got 2 mortgages at the time ($205,600 plus a $51,400 HELOC) to finance the purchase 100% (remember when that was a thing?).

In August 2005, they got a $438,000 mortgage to finance construction of the home on the land (mostly on Lot 30).

In Dec. 2005, the HELOC from the original land purchase ($51,400) was increased to $70,400.

In March 2007, they took out an additional $100,000 mortgage.

Starting in May 2009, they were facing foreclosure on the bigger mortgage from the original land purchase ($205,600). They sold the vacant parts of the land (Lots 27-29, pretty much) for $109,000 and were able thereby to pay off (or settle) the original land purchase mortgage and the HELOC.

So still remaining are the big construction loan ($438,000) and the extra $100,000 loan. But payments have no doubt been made through the years. The big one was a 30-year mortgage and the other one 20 years. Let's say the loans are both at about 6% fixed and no big extra payments have been made, then they might owe a total of about $430,000 by now.

Zillow estimates the value of the home at $450,000, which is not necessarily super-accurate, but would mean that they are not likely underwater, although certainly there isn't much equity.

Would an attempt at HAMP account for paperwork ?

The IRS lien from what I've seen would have had two or three mailings prior to that to notify them.

 

[AZlawyer]

Would an attempt at HAMP account for paperwork ?

The IRS lien from what I've seen would have had two or three mailings prior to that to notify them.

I haven't paid attention to the paperwork people are talking about.

I agree about the IRS lien, though. This was not the first communication. Are you thinking MS was trying to refi due to the IRS trying to collect?

 

[Deleted member 159541]

From the official records of Lee County, here's what it looks like to me.

They bought the land (Lots 27-30) for $257,000 in Feb. 2005, and got 2 mortgages at the time ($205,600 plus a $51,400 HELOC) to finance the purchase 100% (remember when that was a thing?).

In August 2005, they got a $438,000 mortgage to finance construction of the home on the land (mostly on Lot 30).

In Dec. 2005, the HELOC from the original land purchase ($51,400) was increased to $70,400.

In March 2007, they took out an additional $100,000 mortgage.

Starting in May 2009, they were facing foreclosure on the bigger mortgage from the original land purchase ($205,600). They sold the vacant parts of the land (Lots 27-29, pretty much) for $109,000 and were able thereby to pay off (or settle) the original land purchase mortgage and the HELOC.

So still remaining are the big construction loan ($438,000) and the extra $100,000 loan. But payments have no doubt been made through the years. The big one was a 30-year mortgage and the other one 20 years. Let's say the loans are both at about 6% fixed and no big extra payments have been made, then they might owe a total of about $430,000 by now.

Zillow estimates the value of the home at $450,000, which is not necessarily super-accurate, but would mean that they are not likely underwater, although certainly there isn't much equity.

Thanks AZ, I believe you are fairly accurate in this detailed assessment. When you factor into the picture the brutal murder that took place in the home, I doubt this house could sell unless it was a complete steal, well below fair market value. So I think it is safe to say that he is underwater. Could there be other home equity loans that are not recorded?

 

[howonkee]

Thanks AZ, I believe you are fairly accurate in this detailed assessment. When you factor into the picture the brutal murder that took place in the home, I doubt this house could sell unless it was a complete steal, well below fair market value. So I think it is safe to say that he is underwater. Could there be other home equity loans that are not recorded?

BBM

In my mortgage career, I once worked for what they call a "hard money lender". This lender was basically a small business and what they did was loan money to people against their house, but leave the loan unrecorded. He charged exhorbitant interest, like 15% and the loans were fairly short term, like a year or two. He then assigned those loans in percentages to other private investors who were willing to take a big risk for a potential big return. He would monitor the other loans against the property, which were usually a first and a second. Most of the time when a borrower is going to default, they will stop paying the second because the second won't foreclose like the first will. So if his borrowers stopped paying on the second, he would make the payments for them for a few months to see if they were going to default before calling the loan. Picture Guido and you don't want to meet up with him in a dark alley, if you know what I mean. No, really I don't think he was like that, but he had ways of pressuring the borrowers for his money, ways that I knew nothing about.

 

[AZlawyer]

Thanks AZ, I believe you are fairly accurate in this detailed assessment. When you factor into the picture the brutal murder that took place in the home, I doubt this house could sell unless it was a complete steal, well below fair market value. So I think it is safe to say that he is underwater. Could there be other home equity loans that are not recorded?

BBM

In my mortgage career, I once worked for what they call a "hard money lender". This lender was basically a small business and what they did was loan money to people against their house, but leave the loan unrecorded. He charged exhorbitant interest, like 15% and the loans were fairly short term, like a year or two. He then assigned those loans in percentages to other private investors who were willing to take a big risk for a potential big return. He would monitor the other loans against the property, which were usually a first and a second. Most of the time when a borrower is going to default, they will stop paying the second because the second won't foreclose like the first will. So if his borrowers stopped paying on the second, he would make the payments for them for a few months to see if they were going to default before calling the loan. Picture Guido and you don't want to meet up with him in a dark alley, if you know what I mean. No, really I don't think he was like that, but he had ways of pressuring the borrowers for his money, ways that I knew nothing about.

Yeah, what howonkee said would be about the only way a loan like this would NOT be reflected in the recorded documents. No actual bank or reputable lender would fail to record a lien.

 

[mikeinmo]

Darn, I was hoping it could be used against MS. Strange wording though, how many 19 year olds are still in elementary school.

The extention from 18 to 19 is not for the elementary level but for the total school experience K to 12 in some cases not with home schooling such as child going to college some benefits extend to 23 of they are still in school. at least in Mo.

 

[human]

The extention from 18 to 19 is not for the elementary level but for the total school experience K to 12 in some cases not with home schooling such as child going to college some benefits extend to 23 of they are still in school. at least in Mo.

Social Security is Federal, so whatever state one is in it should not matter. Maybe the older age is for a special needs child?

 

[SeesSeas]

Here is a link to information about Social Security Survivor Benefits For Children:
https://www.ssa.gov/pubs/EN-05-10085.pdf

This publication is very brief, and includes age and schooling criteria in determining a child’s eligibility for SS survivor benefits.

 

[DeDee]

https://drive.google.com/folderview...sp=drive_web&tid=0B717FUtKwdU8VjNJU2JYclg5Mk0

On closer look, those yellow coins do look like Krugerrands to me.

In studying the money photo again, the short stacks of gold coins may be Krugerrands. If so, comparing it to the size of the silver dollar plastic containers, my best guess would be they are the 1/10 oz. The link takes you to a photo of a 1/10 oz Krugerrand compared to the size of the American dime.

http://www.cmi-gold-silver.com/krugerrand-gold-coins/

Next to the container with the white top marked "US silver dollars" is another container with a white lid. My eyesight is not as sharp as it was once but the word looks like "Cadmium". Cadmium (Cd) is a metal on the element chart with an Atomic #48. It can be extremely poisonous. It is found in nearly everything: air, soil, batteries, artists paints, etc.

Cadmium is an extremely toxic metal....

In February 2010, cadmium was found in an entire line of Wal-Mart exclusive Miley Cyrus jewelry. The charms were tested at the behest of the Associated Press and were found to contain high levels of cadmium. Wal-Mart did not stop selling the jewelry until May 12 because "it would be too difficult to test products already on its shelves".[9] On June 4 cadmium was detected in the paint used on promotional drinking glasses for the movie Shrek Forever After, sold by McDonald's Restaurants, triggering a recall of 12 million glasses.[10]
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cadmium
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cadmium_poisoning

photo of the metal:
http://familywellnesshq.com/heavy-metals-sources-toxicity/

Sooo, could MS have been shaving/filing Cadmium to poison the air in TSs bedroom or put into a joint or pipe if TS smoked? Or sprinkle a little dust on her food? Is that why he insisted on a cremation? I realize half of this post could be erroneous based on what I see is the spelling on the container with the white top.

 

[No it's not]

In studying the money photo again, the short stacks of gold coins may be Krugerrands. If so, comparing it to the size of the silver dollar plastic containers, my best guess would be they are the 1/10 oz. The link takes you to a photo of a 1/10 oz Krugerrand compared to the size of the American dime.

http://www.cmi-gold-silver.com/krugerrand-gold-coins/

Next to the container with the white top marked "US silver dollars" is another container with a white lid. My eyesight is not as sharp as it was once but the word looks like "Cadmium". Cadmium (Cd) is a metal on the element chart with an Atomic #48. It can be extremely poisonous. It is found in nearly everything: air, soil, batteries, artists paints, etc.

Cadmium is an extremely toxic metal....

In February 2010, cadmium was found in an entire line of Wal-Mart exclusive Miley Cyrus jewelry. The charms were tested at the behest of the Associated Press and were found to contain high levels of cadmium. Wal-Mart did not stop selling the jewelry until May 12 because "it would be too difficult to test products already on its shelves".[9] On June 4 cadmium was detected in the paint used on promotional drinking glasses for the movie Shrek Forever After, sold by McDonald's Restaurants, triggering a recall of 12 million glasses.[10]
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cadmium
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cadmium_poisoning

photo of the metal:
http://familywellnesshq.com/heavy-metals-sources-toxicity/

Sooo, could MS have been shaving/filing Cadmium to poison the air in TSs bedroom or put into a joint or pipe if TS smoked? Or sprinkle a little dust on her food? Is that why he insisted on a cremation? I realize half of this post could be erroneous based on what I see is the spelling on the container with the white top.

The container, US ARMY CAVALRY COIN maybe?

 

[The Butler Did It]

Perhaps the word is 'catalog'? Coin catalogs are widely published.

 

[KateB]

My guess is Canadian. Old Canadian silver coins had similar silver content as the old US silver coins did.