For Those Who Do Think Avery was Framed & Evidence Planted - Discuss

[dexter75]

BBM
Interesting? That's a nicer word than I would have used:gaah:

I was reading something else and came across this .... it's the preliminary hearing from December 2005. http://www.stevenaverycase.org/wp-content/uploads/2016/02/Preliminary-Examination-2005Dec06.pdf

I was looking at Pam's testimony (which has it's own issues lol) and realized that Sturdivant testified that day too.... he is from DCI and he is the one that saw Jost with the bone, the one that was 8 feet out from the burn area.

Page 99....
2 A. From the 8 feet south of that burn pit, I could
3 clearly see that there was some bone matter
4 located around the debris pile.

BBM... what? he could clearly see it and other officers walked around that place for 3 days at this point?

Oh and.... unless I missed it... there was absolutely no mention of a vicious dog. I have to run out for a bit, so maybe I just missed it and I don't have time to go back and look at the moment.

Interesting to read all of that knowing what was testified too and what we know now. IMO

 

[dexter75]

Those screenshots make me sick sick sick.

I do wonder WHAT would have happened, if they would have got Branden to say he took TH's panties..:thinking:

Make sure to read the screenshots on the document

 

[missy1974]

I was reading at reddit earlier today and saw a Memo that I had not seen before:


it comes form this link http://stevenaverycase.com/was-there-a-motive-to-frame-avery/#sthash.4nrFoTKc.Tj1SXIOR.dpbs

The sentence in the memo that reads "He then told me that in 95 or 96 Andy Colburn had told Tom Kocourek (former Manitowoc County Sheriff) that an officer from Brown County had told Colburn that Allen and not Avery might have actually committed the Beernsten assault" was part of the questioning in Kusche's deposition and I remember watching it and wondering where they were getting this from LOL So now I know

The most important thing is.... Kusche doesn't deny that Colborn said Allen and not Avery....he just doesn't recall Kocourek coming up at all. He even recalls asking if Lenk knew.

That line of questioning is at about 3:10 in the video
http://www.postcrescent.com/story/n...uit-video-sketch-artist-gene-kusche/81286006/

And they weren't worried at all.... as if

 

[Limaes]

Self deleted

 

[Jaiddie]

https://www.bostonglobe.com/metro/2...tice-system/6Wib5YpC7FJNa5OaFsaebM/story.html

'Second Drug Lab Scandal Engulfs State Criminal Justice System'

It's happening more and more often that proves there are mistakes that happen in lab tests that result in people being sent away on mistakes and false information. What is REALLY scary is it is happening nationwide. :notgood:

 

[Jaiddie]

http://fox11online.com/news/crime/homicide-investigation-in-manitowoc

This is an article from back in Feb about the Manitowoc resident who was shot one morning point blank in the chest and killed when he answered his door in the early morning hours. The curious thing about this case is that LE made a very strong statement publicly from the very beginning that this case has absolutely nothing to do with the Avery case, which I am unsure how they can state that so positively when the investigation was just starting. How can they know this positively so early in the case? Sluether's have also dug up the fact that the murder victim was arrested on 10/30/2005 on a Battery charge, and may have seen or heard something while in police custody back then pertaining to the set up of Avery (assuming there was a set-up in play, of course). They are speculating that this maybe a motive for why this man was targeted the way he was, so that he could not come forward with information about the Avery investigation if he had any. This is all just speculation, of course, but I thought I would bring it over here as it seems to be just another coincidence in the never-ending list of coincidences that seem to make up the Avery case. I have linked the criminal record of the victim below, to show his arrest in 2005.

https://wcca.wicourts.gov/caseDetai...&cacheId=&recordCount=0&offset=0&mode=charges

 

[missy1974]

http://fox11online.com/news/crime/homicide-investigation-in-manitowoc

This is an article from back in Feb about the Manitowoc resident who was shot one morning point blank in the chest and killed when he answered his door in the early morning hours. The curious thing about this case is that LE made a very strong statement publicly from the very beginning that this case has absolutely nothing to do with the Avery case, which I am unsure how they can state that so positively when the investigation was just starting. How can they know this positively so early in the case? Sluether's have also dug up the fact that the murder victim was arrested on 10/30/2005 on a Battery charge, and may have seen or heard something while in police custody back then pertaining to the set up of Avery (assuming there was a set-up in play, of course). They are speculating that this maybe a motive for why this man was targeted the way he was, so that he could not come forward with information about the Avery investigation if he had any. This is all just speculation, of course, but I thought I would bring it over here as it seems to be just another coincidence in the never-ending list of coincidences that seem to make up the Avery case. I have linked the criminal record of the victim below, to show his arrest in 2005.

https://wcca.wicourts.gov/caseDetai...&cacheId=&recordCount=0&offset=0&mode=charges

:thinking: lots of coincidences in this case..... too many.

 

[Jaiddie]

http://i.imgur.com/zIP5DBQ.jpg

A few of the news reports that came out after SA's arrest...it's no wonder he was found guilty, and these were all BEFORE Kratz's press conference cinched the deal on March 2, SMH. :sheesh:

 

[dexter75]

Ridiculous.

Totally irresponsible & downright ignorant journalists going after a great " headline " & failing to wait for the FACTS of the case to come out. Of course, WHO was their " source? " LE? Pffft..

Looking back, it doesn't seem like it would have made much difference WHAT the headline read as LE, the prosecution & JUDGE ( yep, I think he was either shady, or just an idiot who had too much faith in KK ) knew from the word GO that Avery was their man, and would be put away NO MATTER WHAT THEY HAD TO DO.

All just my very humble opinion once again

http://i.imgur.com/zIP5DBQ.jpg

A few of the news reports that came out after SA's arrest...it's no wonder he was found guilty, and these were all BEFORE Kratz's press conference cinched the deal on March 2, SMH. :sheesh:

 

[Jaiddie]

Ridiculous.

Totally irresponsible & downright ignorant journalists going after a great " headline " & failing to wait for the FACTS of the case to come out. Of course, WHO was their " source? " LE? Pffft..

Looking back, it doesn't seem like it would have made much difference WHAT the headline read as LE, the prosecution & JUDGE ( yep, I think he was either shady, or just an idiot who had too much faith in KK ) knew from the word GO that Avery was their man, and would be put away NO MATTER WHAT THEY HAD TO DO.

All just my very humble opinion once again

:yeahthat: Agree with you, 100%, on all counts!

 

[Dumas911]

Being a former investigator, and still a currant officer, I have lots of problems with the evidence recovery, how they found the vehicle, and BD confession. There should've been enough evidence in what was presented to cause a reasonable doubt. The MCSO is blatantly crooked. There's no way any of them should've been near SA home during the investigation. IMO the ONLY evidence that is damning in this case, but it could just as well been planted to. In any other court I would say there's plenty of questionable evidence and actions to warrant a retrial, or should've never been found guilty beyond a REASONABLE doubt!

 

[dexter75]

My thoughts all along:clap:

Being a former investigator, and still a currant officer, I have lots of problems with the evidence recovery, how they found the vehicle, and BD confession. There should've been enough evidence in what was presented to cause a reasonable doubt. The MCSO is blatantly crooked. There's no way any of them should've been near SA home during the investigation. IMO the ONLY evidence that is damning in this case, but it could just as well been planted to. In any other court I would say there's plenty of questionable evidence and actions to warrant a retrial, or should've never been found guilty beyond a REASONABLE doubt!

 

[Justiceseeker35]

My thoughts all along:clap:

4 months ago for me there were way too many suspects. It was overwhelming how many people could have murdered TH with endless scenarios. I think for me it was being stuck on the Salvage yard as the crime scene. Once you get past that and realize that TH left the salvage yard she drove away from the property to her Zipperer appointment. Many of the suspects become so implausible. Any of the Avery's, Dassey's or ST/BD, the German , Martinez, the JR theory they all crumble. Even a murder at the Zipperers becomes unlikely due to alibis. Most people don't deviate much from their day to day schedules. It's why my smart phone seems to always know exactly where I'm going. So TH most likely does Mondays as such- home, AT work, home, social life. There's some person in her life that knew that schedule. He wanted to confront her that day about something personal to them. A person like that would never risk a confrontation publicly. So the idea that he would follow her around place to place is impractical. This person has access to her home and would likely wait for her there. After a confrontation turns physical and deadly the perp needed a place to dump the body and the car and a person to blame or at least deflect blame on to and that's where SA comes in. Without SA the car and the body would probably have been found in the bottom of a lake. At this point everything found which ties SA to the crime was planted and fabricated by the MTSO. That all started with AC finding the car and calling in the plates.

 

[Jaiddie]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z7jDf5wWdDQ&feature=youtu.be&app=desktop

'Brendan Dassey: A True Story of a False Confession'

This is a conference that BD's attorney's held recently, April 6th I believe. While it is long (over 2hours), I recommend watching it because it even contains clips of BD interrogation that was not included in MaM, and quite clearly shows how the confession was a false confession and that BD is obviously innocent. After watching this I am even more sickened by the fact that Fassbender and Wiegart received awards for their disgusting work on this case. :furious:

Edit: included more information.

 

[missy1974]

4 months ago for me there were way too many suspects. It was overwhelming how many people could have murdered TH with endless scenarios. I think for me it was being stuck on the Salvage yard as the crime scene. Once you get past that and realize that TH left the salvage yard she drove away from the property to her Zipperer appointment. Many of the suspects become so implausible. Any of the Avery's, Dassey's or ST/BD, the German , Martinez, the JR theory they all crumble. Even a murder at the Zipperers becomes unlikely due to alibis. Most people don't deviate much from their day to day schedules. It's why my smart phone seems to always know exactly where I'm going. So TH most likely does Mondays as such- home, AT work, home, social life. There's some person in her life that knew that schedule. He wanted to confront her that day about something personal to them. A person like that would never risk a confrontation publicly. So the idea that he would follow her around place to place is impractical. This person has access to her home and would likely wait for her there. After a confrontation turns physical and deadly the perp needed a place to dump the body and the car and a person to blame or at least deflect blame on to and that's where SA comes in. Without SA the car and the body would probably have been found in the bottom of a lake. At this point everything found which ties SA to the crime was planted and fabricated by the MTSO. That all started with AC finding the car and calling in the plates.

This reads like my own "MaM journey". When I first watched the show, and then came here, I really thought it was more likely than not that SA was guilty (I have never once thought BD was), but something was just not right with the system. As time has gone on, and as more and more was available to us, I think it's more likely than not that he is not guilty now. I had to get past the Salvage yard too.... and that only leaves me with a few viable scenario's. I agree with you that it was probably someone who knew her routines. And there is only one that comes to mind that knew way too much about her every day routines.

I still have my doubts about his innocence, I don't think there is anyone that should feel 100% about his guilt or innocence unless they did the murder. I have yet to read a theory that convinces me that SA is guilty, and I have read a ton of theories that give me reasonable doubt.

It's been pretty quiet this past week or so.... I have a feeling it's the calm before the storm LOL I'm hoping that Zellner files something at the end of the month, but the reality is that she might file for an extension, so we will see!

 

[missy1974]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z7jDf5wWdDQ&feature=youtu.be&app=desktop

'Brendan Dassey: A True Story of a False Confession'

This is a conference that BD's attorney's held recently, April 6th I believe. While it is long (over 2hours), I recommend watching it because it even contains clips of BD interrogation that was not included in MaM, and quite clearly shows how the confession was a false confession and that BD is obviously innocent. After watching this I am even more sickened by the fact that Fassbender and Wiegart received awards for their disgusting work on this case. :furious:

Edit: included more information.

Here is an article, and Buting comments about the O'Kelly interview with BD

http://www.houstonpress.com/arts/go...rsation-on-justice-lecture-tour-at-uh-8388907

“People are surprised that he was, number one, taken out of class, without an attorney or parents present, the lawyer allowing him to be interrogated by the police, and also his own investigator (who had bias against the defendant), to have him go in and try and basically coerce his client into confessing, telling him how to draw diagrams,” says Buting. He says that, when he and Strang first saw the documentary, it was a shock. Not only was the videotape not turned over to the defense, it was galling to see that the investigator was using a preprinted form with “I am sorry for what I did” and “I'm not sorry for what I did” as the only two choices for the accused. “And especially to see him, the investigator, using a preprinted form, which means he's used it in other cases, or ones after that,” says Buting. “That was pretty shocking, so we get questions about that.”

They saw the O'Kelly/BD incident for the first time when they watched the documentary! That is crazy! I don't think it would be part of discovery in SA's case, but I'm not sure, maybe?

 

[Jaiddie]

http://www.americanbar.org/news/abanews/aba-news-archives/2016/05/aba_announces_2016s.html

MaM is receiving a Silver Gavel award from the ABA:

"The American Bar Association today announced its selections for the 2016 Silver Gavel Awards for Media and the Arts, which recognize outstanding work that fosters the American public's understanding of law and the legal system. This is the ABA's highest honor in recognition of this purpose."

This goes out to all of the people, since the documentary's release in December, who have been shouting out that MaM was just a "defense advocacy piece that was highly bias", and therefore should be ignored. :tongue::razz:

 

[meduza65]

Not going to read thru the multiple threads because my brain can't comprehend all the info and I have read many of them after the series came out. Dassey was clearly coached for his confession. Poor kid is getting screwed especially comparing the so called evidence to his confession and the extra coaching from his public pretender to write his statement. Sad Sad Sad!! I haven't found nor read anything more about the dog. Was it a cadaver dog or just a narc dog? For some reason they made sure to show that one was called into the scene in the series. Did this animal flag the fire pit before the cops found her body there? Did it flag any other areas, like the trailer where Teresa was supposedly killed, per Dassey, or the garage where the shell was found but luminol tests showed no blood, or ever the burner barrels? If so, how long was it after they had already searched the area and their 8 day crime scene saga and no family was allowed on their property? I have watched a few other videos, like where the female cop states, his trailer was clearly SPOTLESS when she entered. Ummm the videos provided in the film, that's not what I call spotless. His desk wasn't neat, in my terms, but spotless is not something I would use to describe it. IF Dasseys confession was true, where is all the blood? You are going to tell me the only blood found from her was in the trunk of her vehicle, along with Avery's blood, but they found a spent shell in the spotless garage with no blood evidence? She was obviously chopped up somewhere, so where's the blood? It wasn't at the Quarry either.

 

[dexter75]

Well how about that, my friend?!?! :happydance:

http://www.americanbar.org/news/abanews/aba-news-archives/2016/05/aba_announces_2016s.html

MaM is receiving a Silver Gavel award from the ABA:

"The American Bar Association today announced its selections for the 2016 Silver Gavel Awards for Media and the Arts, which recognize outstanding work that fosters the American public's understanding of law and the legal system. This is the ABA's highest honor in recognition of this purpose."

This goes out to all of the people, since the documentary's release in December, who have been shouting out that MaM was just a "defense advocacy piece that was highly bias", and therefore should be ignored. :tongue::razz:

 

[dexter75]

CALL ME CRAZY lol, but I've NEVER thought Avery guilty of this murder. ( I know I know )
Reason being, there is/was just many times things/evidence was/wasn't there, or SCREWED up, or NOT photographed, or NOT written down, or COULD have been planted/found by THE SAME LE that SHOULDN'T have even been ON THE PROPERTY..etc. etc. etc. it just goes on & on for me. From the beginning, if ya really think about it, just too many coincidences. IMO

This reads like my own "MaM journey". When I first watched the show, and then came here, I really thought it was more likely than not that SA was guilty (I have never once thought BD was), but something was just not right with the system. As time has gone on, and as more and more was available to us, I think it's more likely than not that he is not guilty now. I had to get past the Salvage yard too.... and that only leaves me with a few viable scenario's. I agree with you that it was probably someone who knew her routines. And there is only one that comes to mind that knew way too much about her every day routines.

I still have my doubts about his innocence, I don't think there is anyone that should feel 100% about his guilt or innocence unless they did the murder. I have yet to read a theory that convinces me that SA is guilty, and I have read a ton of theories that give me reasonable doubt.

It's been pretty quiet this past week or so.... I have a feeling it's the calm before the storm LOL I'm hoping that Zellner files something at the end of the month, but the reality is that she might file for an extension, so we will see!