France - Explosions and shooting in Paris, 13 November 2015 #1

[FindHG]

The French Defense Ministry just announce a large scale bombing of Raqqa, a major Islamic State organization stronghold.

Ten fighter jets hit a a recruitment and training camp, a depot and a control command center.

http://www.france24.com/en/ live stream




http://bigstory.ap.org/article/d126...test-france-holds-special-mass-attack-victims AP live updates

Four French officials have told The Associated Press that police questioned and released the fugitive suspect hours after the Paris attacks.

The questioning came when police pulled over a car near the Belgian border, hours after authorities had already identified Saleh Abdeslam as the renter of a Volkswagen Polo that was abandoned at the scene of the attack.

Abdeslam is now the focus of an international manhunt. One of his brothers detonated a suicide vest in central Paris and another was ultimately detained in Belgium.

He was one of three people in a car stopped by police Saturday morning, hours after the attacks that left at least 129 dead, the officials said.

Three French police officials and a top French security official confirmed all that officers stopped Abdeslam and checked his ID and then let him go.

The officials spoke only on condition of anonymity because they were not authorized to publicly disclose details of the investigation.

 

[cottonweaver]

EDIT

"Paris hospitals have revised the death toll back down to 129, as three people wounded on Friday night who subsequently died had already been counted as part of Saturday’s figure of 129."

the guardian 5 mins ago

 

[Friday Fan]

The French Defense Ministry just announce a large scale bombing of Raqqa, a major Islamic State organization stronghold.

Ten fighter jets hit a training camp, a depot and a command center.

http://www.france24.com/en/ live stream

Not to be cynical: But will it get worse before it gets better......(if you know what I mean)

I have to place trust that our govts know what they're doing. I would certainly have no idea how to handle this....

 

[gia2]

EDIT

"Paris hospitals have revised the death toll back down to 129, as three people wounded on Friday night who subsequently died had already been counted as part of Saturday’s figure of 129."

the guardian 5 mins ago

That is so good to hear. I've been so suprised the death toll didn't rise substantially yesterday and today. Whilst it's early days, it's definitely something to be thankful for.

 

[Friday Fan]

http://bigstory.ap.org/article/d126...test-france-holds-special-mass-attack-victims AP live updates

Four French officials have told The Associated Press that police questioned and released the fugitive suspect hours after the Paris attacks.

If I'm understanding this correctly, they questioned/released a guy and now realize he's an actual suspect.

Time for a chill pill.......

 

[FindHG]

Not to be cynical: But will it get worse before it gets better......(if you know what I mean)

I have to place trust that our govts know what they're doing. I would certainly have no idea how to handle this....

It was already getting worse for them, as the terrorists espoused revenge for being attacked in the Syria area. It may be possible that their operatives are moving elsewhere already expecting retaliation. They may have to cross borders as things get worse for them in Syria and Iraq. I bet many of them will not be angling for more of the same, so their provocation may be a measure of distraction as they regroup.

The three brothers who attacked, would indicate that they count on a high and a fail safe level of trust for their mass killings operations, as this is the third set of young brothers involved in terrorist attacks (Boston/Hebdo/Paris). So does that mean there could be more central strategic planning being very cautious about vetting a core of their operatives they choose for attacks? My guess would be, with the cross pollination between AQ and Daesh, that they're falling back on old recruits in place with high level of trust with a smattering of young trainees who have strong local cover. That would be a lot of logistics and movement.

 

[cottonweaver]

@FindHG - oh dear they let the fugitive go by mistake!!!

Anyway an update on him from a French official:

Goulet said that the suspect on the run is most probably the bomb-maker and is one of the three brothers thought to have been involved in the attacks. “With such heavy material, they need a professional.”

Despite publicly confirming the details, Goulet still urged caution because information is still being confirmed slowly.
Goulet sits on the Senate Foreign Relations Committee and was briefed on several of the names being investigated in connection with the attacks.

the guardian

 

[Mrs G Norris]

No way ...

 

[CARIIS]

Guys just trying to get there . ... but EST it is 421 qre these stapedes vidoeo packages hasppening now .... or is this yesterday


answer pls guys

is htis happening now 422 pm est time ? i am just coning bac k but i need to be grounded is this happening now???

 

[cottonweaver]

@FindHG

Your previous paste was accurate about the French US air strikes at Raqqa, only added detail is "massive and 20 bombs dropped"

The French defense ministry has said the “massive” airstrikes which hit Raqqa on Sunday night, was carried out in coordination with US forces. Twenty bombs were dropped, destroying a command center, jihadi recruitment center, a munitions depot and a training camp for fighters, the defense ministry said in a statement.

2 mins ago , Guardian

 

[DexterMorgan]

The French defense ministry has said the “massive” airstrikes which hit Raqqa on Sunday night, was carried out in coordination with US forces. Twenty bombs were dropped, destroying a command center, jihadi recruitment center, a munitions depot and a training camp for fighters, the defense ministry said in a statement.

2 mins ago , Guardian


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Its just stunning how long these locations have been sitting there; But it takes 100s of deaths and injured to now decide to bomb the locations.

I truly don't understand. These camps and command depots are out in the open for the taken. Do we also watch them set these things up as well. Good grief.
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[CSIDreamer]

I dont know but I worry that those fleeing in panic could be shot accidently. There was more than one terrorist. It's a tough call for sure.
ETA- then there is the fact that a hand gun is competing with an AK47

But it only takes one bullet. Granted, you're competing with a spray.

 

[DanceCard]

@FindHG

Your previous paste was accurate about the French US air strikes at Raqqa, only added detail is "massive and 20 bombs dropped"

2 mins ago , Guardian

My thoughts are with the innocent people who will also be caught up in this, whose lives must have been horrendous for so long now.

 

[RANCH]

But it only takes one bullet. Granted, you're competing with a spray.

In my opinion these events took place well within handgun distances. Armed civilians certainly could have made a difference.


JMO

 

[Susza]

Uh

Because in my brain that means there are less refugees than reported and the potential for more terrorists to get through borders. Just from reading this thread, I know that at least two of the dead terrorists signed in on refugee lists in the Mediterranean area. They were coming to die last night in Paris. They weren't fleeing their living conditions. Killers slipping over borders does not make me happy.

Lets try not to mix things up. There are hundreds of thousends of refugees who need our help now and I think we we have to welcome them and make them feel secure. Impossible to close borders and watch them being killed in their countries.
Yes, this might also allow killers to enter - but don t forget, some of the killers grew up in France, Germany, Belgium, ...
We must find other solutions. All together we need to learn to be solidaire, fight poverty, intolerance and religious fanatism.
Instead of trying to get richer and richer, lets slow down, think, learn and share.

 

[cottonweaver]

My thoughts are with the innocent people who will also be caught up in this, whose lives must have been horrendous for so long now.

Both in Paris and in Raqqa of course

 

[gia2]

In my opinion these events took place well within handgun distances. Armed civilians certainly could have made a difference.


JMO

Perhaps armed citizens could have taken out the terrorists as they were reloading, but how many people across France would die per year due to people being armed? Situations like this are so rare, but domestic disputes and violent crimes are not. Bring guns onto our streets and there would be more death in the long run, surely.

I also don't think many Europeans would carry a gun anyway, that's not our mentality. It's not the way we live. l

 

[FindHG]

Raqqa was the first city and main administrative center Daesh took from Assad's forces. Kurds are advancing to the East and North of Raqqa. Iran's Hzbla/Assad/Russia advancing in to West of Raqqa. US seems to have good intel on movements of their leaders, as the recent strikes indicate, according to Adam Pletts who spoke by phone.

6 Iraqi intel officials had informed French intel that an attack on France had been planned in Raqqa, prior to the attacks.

President Obama and Putin's tete a tete:

[the two agreed to erm more of the same... it seems, negotiations for political transition but will the Russians make it stick with Assad?]

Remain far apart on the nature of the transition.

G 20 want to step up border controls, air travel security and cracking down on Daesh banking.

http://www.france24.com/en/

 

[cottonweaver]

US foreign policy hawks seized on the Paris terrorist attacks to argue for more aggressive military intervention in the Middle East, writes Dan Roberts :

Following a Democratic television debate on Saturday that was dominated by calls for a tougher response to Islamic State radicals, leading Republicans joined the fray on Sunday in a series of political interviews that also saw linked attacks on immigration and calls for more intelligence surveillance.

“This is clearly an act of war and an attack on one of our Nato allies, and we should invoke Article 5 of the Nato agreement, and bring everyone together to put together a coalition to confront this challenge,” Senator Marco Rubio said on ABC.

He was joined by his Florida rival Jeb Bush, who also demanded the US lead a new war to “eradicate Isis from the face of the earth” and warned that screening of Muslim refugees from Syria was unlikely to be fully effective in preventing terrorist infiltration of the US.

[...]“We should focus our efforts as it relates to refugees on the Christians that are being slaughtered,” he added, suggesting that specific efforts should take place to determine individuals’ religion before refugees were admitted into the US.

http://www.theguardian.com/us-news/...epublican-response-isis-military-intervention

Oh dear! Perhaps time to slow down as Susza just posted?

 

[CSIDreamer]

In my opinion these events took place well within handgun distances. Armed civilians certainly could have made a difference.


JMO

I totally agree. It's just the logistics of drawing a bead on a terrorist while "dodging" an AK47. Chances are they're wearing bulletproof vests. You're going to have to get a head shot, gut shot, or artery. More reason for people to head to the range.

Too much hunting talk in my world yesterday. It's spilling over into "how to kill a terrorist".