France - Explosions and shooting in Paris, 13 November 2015 #2

[Mrs G Norris]

I wonder how welcoming state governments will be when refugees arrive? I hope they are welcoming and supportive, especially in states where the refugees will be most feared and vilified. Maybe the people can follow their leaders' leads. Hate only breeds more hate.

I think people need to be educated about Islam and the different groups involved. It might help.

 

[Momoffourboys]

Chilling details about the terrorists.

Paris killers' details emerge

This...
French police arrested Abdeslam and three others at the Belgian border a few hours after the attack, but they were permitted to cross the border because they were not in the database of wanted individuals.

http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-4726642,00.html

 

[Sonya610]

Even if the voice of the people is uneducated? They could always stand up and appease the voters by giving them some facts, but no, it's simpler just to pander to the fear mongering put forward by certain media empires.

Uneducated???? A lot of Americans are sick of MOST immigration regardless of where the immigrants come from, that has nothing to do with being "uneducated". The fact that these immigrants are coming from the ME isn't helping matters any, it isn't like we are screening them and selecting the ones that would be of most benefit to our society.

 

[Trino]

I think we can predict anti-Islamic outbreaks in the US. If I were a Muslim, yes, I would be frightened, but I would definitely try to fit into my surroundings by dress, location, and low-key actions. Sometimes you have to bend rules and ideology.

 

[Sonya610]

I think people need to be educated about Islam and the different groups involved. It might help.

I considered reverting to Islam a while back, it has nothing to do with being "ignorant" about Islam. Nevertheless I still don't want hundreds of thousands of Syrian refugees being let into the US.

It has very little to do with religion and a whole lot to do with culture.

 

[cottonweaver]

These two articles I really recommend, they are very different , from different view points

The first - why we should stay calm and measured
http://www.theguardian.com/commenti...mbs-hostage-syria-islamic-state-paris-attacks

The second - why we need to start asking more questions and inform ourselves better.( For example, in this case, on details eg. On ease of getting a fake passport)
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...-suspected-Paris-terrorist-travel-Europe.html

( I didn't know any of this til I started posting on this thread. Like Leah said, I'm on the fence on many things, I don't have ANY answers, but we can ask the questions of our authorities and hold them to account.)

 

[Trident]

I think people need to be educated about Islam and the different groups involved. It might help.

That would be as easy as sorting out the Baptists from the Methodists from the Lutherns. My son and I had this discussion an hour ago. He was all for getting rid of the "bad" ones and letting the "good" ones live in peace - and he has lived all over the ME so a body would think ... 'Course he had no answer when I asked how a body could tell.

 

[CARIIS]

Because if they were already sure the refugees coming over were perfectly safe, why would they be stopping them now? Or are politicians just reacting to public sentiment with little regard to the reality of the situation in a grab for vote?


OK I think I just answered my own question, there is nothing wrong with the refugees heading over, and our politicians and punishing innocent folk for polularist reasons.

I totally agree everyone will be hysterical fo rthe next 3 days and then it will go back until the enxt event

 

[bluesneakers]

That would be as easy as sorting out the Baptists from the Methodists from the Lutherns. My son and I had this discussion an hour ago. He was all for getting rid of the "bad" ones and letting the "good" ones live in peace - and he has lived all over the ME so a body would think ... 'Course he had no answer when I asked how a body could tell.

If one wanted to learn about Christianity he or she would learn about Methodists, Baptists and Lutherans. It has nothing to do without sorting them out. That's not the point. Studying history, culture, language - all of it helps us understand each other. If people in a city knew more about the refugees coming to live there maybe they would be less likely to fear them and treat them with disdain.

 

[BayouBelle_LA]

Had the problem been dealt with when the notorious 'red line' was crossed I doubt we would be having this refugee crisis.

 

[CARIIS]

where is snowden when we need him !!

 

[Foxfire]

http://gov.georgia.gov/press-releases/2015-11-16/deal-georgia-will-not-accept-syrian-refugees

Deal: Georgia will not accept Syrian refugees

November 16, 2015
Gov. Nathan Deal today announced that he will not accept Syrian refugees in Georgia and called upon President Obama to suspend the resettlement program in the United States. Since 2012, Deal has demanded that the federal government limit the number of refugees sent to Georgia.

“In light of the terror attacks in Paris, I’ve issued an executive order directing state agency heads to prevent the resettlement of Syrian refugees in Georgia,” said Deal. "Further, I call upon the Obama administration to work with the Georgia Emergency Management Agency/Homeland Security to confirm the backgrounds of the 59 Syrian refugees recently resettled to ensure they do not pose a security threat to our citizens.

Until the federal government and Congress conducts a thorough review of current screening procedures and background checks, we will take every measure available to us at the state level to ensure the safety of Georgians.”

 

[Trident]

If one wanted to learn about Christianity he or should we learn about Methodists, Baptists and Lutherans. It has nothing to do without sorting them out. That's not the point. Studying history, culture, language - all of it helps us understand each other. If people in a city knew more about the refugees coming to live there maybe they would be less likely to fear them and treat them with disdain.

I already have plenty of Muslims living in my area - even had one working with machinery in a burka for GS. Had one knock on my door and when I looked out the peep hole what did I see? A pair of eyes looking out of a mask. This is a bad joke says I. It took me a while to figure out it was another one of our citizens wearing the outer garment. Then there was the one working in the library. I could go on.

No one is stupid or uneducated. It simply is very hard to tell a radicalized one from a sane one, thank you very much.

 

[CARIIS]

Exactly! We've been told by security forces that it is difficult to monitor the communication of ISIS members because of the channels they're using, so we need people who will think outside of the box to access those channels. That very well might be Anonymous. They've certainly proven they are capable of accessing secure information and causing disruption where they've wanted in the past.

I don't think you should write them off because some may be young or 'living in their parent's basement'. It really doesn't matter. Some of these people are dedicated, very intelligent and innovative. They can gain an exceptional level of knowledge very young.

I have a friend like this from school. At 11 or 12 he hacked the school network and stopped anyone logging in and using any of the computers (not just students, the admin couldn't access student records or anything). He was told off by the police and the school had to get experts to sort out the mess he'd made. He was told he'd get expelled if he went within so many feet of a computer again.

He ended up hacking the school payment system and removed the IT staff's salary from being paid, they didn't realize until after he should have been paid and it caused so much trouble for him. He did loads of things to taunt them, most of the time they couldn't prove it was him. He ended up getting expelled, but now works as a professional penetrator (he is a consultant and his job is to try to hack systems to see how vulnerable they are, then he finds ways to fix them). He earns so much money. He just loves the challenge.


Sorry for the long post, I just wanted to share how some very young people (even 15+ years ago) can know a huge amount and know what professionals just don't learn formally.

I so agree with you == we got 6 years that shut down the power grida of their choice , meanwhile NSA is spening 454.454.878.2260.454. of our dollars to keep us safe to store that you and I just shared a choclate chip recipe

it is laughable , sc#ew our choclate chip recipres --- this apparently (based on the OCt third arrival of a CEO in this ,,, and you know me and you and I are sharing choclate chip precferances fo some darn coookies-----get IT togehter people

and we are finding all sorts of stuff that they knew, and did nothing, but they dont like our chocolate cooke reciptes ---its laughable .........


ok I am just settling into all of my esteemed WS and now its breaking that they all knew all kinds of cr*p --- screw our recipes


come on guys ................................ follow people that are planning on tgerrorizing the city of Paris it is syouid --- I like pecans...........give me a break

 

[bluesneakers]

I already have plenty of Muslims living in my area - even had one working with machinery in a burka for GS. Had one knock on my door and when I looked out the peep hole what did I see? A pair of eyes looking out of a mask. This is a bad joke says I. It took me a while to figure out it was another one of our citizens wearing the outer garment. Then there was the one working in the library. I could go on.

No one is stupid or uneducated. It simply is very hard to tell a radicalized one from a sane one, thank you very much.

We were discussing how refugees might be treated when they settle into US towns and cities, not how to tell a good person from a bad person. Sorry if you misunderstood. The truth is though, lots and lots of people in America are uneducated about Islam and people from the Middle East. It couldn't hurt if they learned a few facts and were able to put away their superstitions and prejudices.

Why on earth would you fear someone working in a library?

 

[NSS]

I think we can predict anti-Islamic outbreaks in the US. If I were a Muslim, yes, I would be frightened, but I would definitely try to fit into my surroundings by dress, location, and low-key actions. Sometimes you have to bend rules and ideology.

Like the German Jews huh?

I thought that the freedom from religious persecution was one of the US founding principles?

I guess we can remove that from the American dream ------which one are you willing to forgo next?

 

[bluesneakers]

I so agree with you == we got 6 years that shut down the power grida of their choice , meanwhile NSA is spening 454.454.878.2260.454. of our dollars to keep us safe to store that you and I just shared a choclate chip recipe

it is laughable , sc#ew our choclate chip recipres --- this apparently (based on the OCt third arrival of a CEO in this ,,, and you know me and you and I are sharing choclate chip precferances fo some darn coookies-----get IT togehter people

and we are finding all sorts of stuff that they knew, and did nothing, but they dont like our chocolate cooke reciptes ---its laughable .........

How much money have we spent on the TSA and how safe has it kept us? One guy tries to get on a plane with a bomb in his shoe and now ALL of us have to take off our shoes. Meanwhile the terrorists have moved on and odds are will never try another shoe bomb.

It's hard not to get cynical and discouraged, isn't it?

 

[Elley Mae]

Like the German Jews huh?

I thought that the freedom from religious persecution was one of the US founding principles?

I guess we can remove that from the American dream ------which one are you willing to forgo next?

bbm

Freedom of religion in the United States

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freedom_of_religion_in_the_United_States

 

[Trident]

We were discussing how refugees might be treated when they settle into US towns and cities, not how to tell a good person from a bad person. Sorry if you misunderstood. The truth is though, lots and lots of people in America are uneducated about Islam and people from the Middle East. It couldn't hurt if they learned a few facts and were able to put away their superstitions and prejudices.

Why on earth would you fear someone working in a library?

Never said I did fear her. In fact she and I had a lovely chat about why she was dressed like that, everything covered except hands and face, since she obviously was not from the ME. One of the women I used to work with was married to a Syrian. He seemed very nice and she had a lot of nice gold jewelry.

Quite frankly I don't think we should take in any more immigrants/refugees from anywhere. We can't even take care of the problems we already have, let alone possible terrorists.

 

[NSS]

bbm

Freedom of religion in the United States

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freedom_of_religion_in_the_United_States

Apologies, but I couldn't find the part that says I should try to fit into my surroundings by dress, location, and low-key actions. Sometimes you have to bend rules and ideology.

In fact it says

Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion,or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.