France - Five shot, four dead in French Alps, may have int'l ramifications #1
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from what Mr Martin said the area was quite popular, he says many people visit the area and park there cars to go hiking, he has done so in the past he said with his family, as to his story differing it only differs in that the French man says he did not see or hear any vehicles, the vehicles Mr Martin saw may have been and gone by the time the French man got to the hill as Mr Martin could not say at what point he saw the vehicles as he was going up the hill,
the interviewer did not ask the questions I wanted asking such as did he check if all car doors were locked, did he notice back tyre was flat, did he notice if car gear was in neutral/park thus it could not have rolled away even though engine was running, did it look like the bike had been parked up as if the cyclist had gone to investigate,
the interviewer did not ask the questions I wanted asking such as did he check if all car doors were locked, did he notice back tyre was flat, did he notice if car gear was in neutral/park thus it could not have rolled away even though engine was running, did it look like the bike had been parked up as if the cyclist had gone to investigate,
SophieRose
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The French cyclist had passed the RAF officer about 30 minutes earlier, so probably longer window time to have seen something than the French hiker.
jellybeanz
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I am pretty sure the RAF man was only 5 minutes behind Mollier.
In the first version of the story that is what was reported.
from his interview today I think he was further behind than 5 minutes, as he said it took him 30 minutes to cycle up the hill and he saw nothing but the dark coloured big car which he said was possibly a 4 by 4 and a motorbike,
from his statements it is more confusing than ever, it would be logical to assume that the murderer/s ran out of bullets thus they beat the 7 year old to try to kill her,
this then makes me think was the cyclist shot before the 7 year old, and they used up more bullets on him and only 1 was left which they shot at the 7 year old which didn't kill her, or did one bullet ricochet and hit her in the shoulder then the cyclist came upon the scene and they used the rest of the bullets on him and saw the 7 year old still alive and then tried to kill her,
she may have more information on the sequence of events if she is able to recall and recount what she has seen,
from his statements it is more confusing than ever, it would be logical to assume that the murderer/s ran out of bullets thus they beat the 7 year old to try to kill her,
this then makes me think was the cyclist shot before the 7 year old, and they used up more bullets on him and only 1 was left which they shot at the 7 year old which didn't kill her, or did one bullet ricochet and hit her in the shoulder then the cyclist came upon the scene and they used the rest of the bullets on him and saw the 7 year old still alive and then tried to kill her,
she may have more information on the sequence of events if she is able to recall and recount what she has seen,
The builder working on the house with a view to the road also said he saw the Al-Hilli car go up the road but did not see any other vehicle.
The RAF guy was on a bike. He said in his interview that it took about 30 minutes to cycle from the main road up the hill to the car park.
The "hiker" Philippe D and his two lady friends were in a car. How long would it take to drive that same distance? According to Mark Williams Thomas (he went there) it would take 5 - 7 minutes to drive from the main road to the car park
We don't know at what point between the main road and the car park the 4x4 and motorcycle passed RAF man but it sounds feasible to me that the 4x4 and motorbike had reached the main road and driven off before Philippe D started to drive up the hill.
rewatching interview he says the first thing he saw was the 7 year old prone on the ground moaning in front of the car, so he went to move her and try to help as the car was still running and he was worried it may run her over,
he has returned to France to do a re construction with the police to show them where everything was as he remembers with more detail
he has returned to France to do a re construction with the police to show them where everything was as he remembers with more detail
I haven't been able to watch the whole interview but I'm sure I read somewhere that he said he saw the cyclist first and thought it was an accident then saw the girl, who appeared to be "larking about". If he thought it was an accident, why would he think the girl was playing? If he saw the girl first, perhaps it wasn't obvious she'd been shot but surely it would have been obvious that cyclist had been shot - or did he not check on the cyclist until he'd turned off the engine and noticed the bullet holes in the window? I'm confused about the order of events
How fast was the French cyclist going??
From the full TV interview
"Er well, as I sort of approached the scene, the first thing I saw was a bike on its side and I’d seen a cyclist ahead of me much earlier, so I thought he was just er having a rest.”
As I got a little bit closer, a very young child stumbled out into the road and at first I thought she was actually just playing with a sibling. Because she sort of looked, from a distance like she was, you know, sort of falling over, larking about like a child would.”
he saw bike, saw 7 year old, helped her away from car due to car still running, went back towards car saw cyclist, at this point he was assuming it was car accident, moved cyclist as he was concerned he would be run over by car (why he didn't just switch car engine off instead of moving bodies is what I would ask) went to car drivers door/window saw it was shattered but not smashed saw what he thought was bullet holes, had cycling gloves on so pushed window in reached in turned car off, saw bodies with bullet holes in head lots of blood, did not see 4 year old, said it would be hard to see 4 year old hiding in back as bodies of females slumped in back seat, was now worried shooter could be in woods and he would be next, tried to ring on mobile phone no signal got back on bike and rode down hill for about 4oo yds came upon French group, D called for help, went back to scene as French man D wanted to check if they could help, 7 year old still unconscious left scene and headed back downhill and rescue services arrived soon after.
thats as much as I can remember
All previous reports said he was overtaken by the French cyclist
I doubt many of the press reports are that accurate, the French prosecutor, the magistrates and the gendarmes are keeping things very close to there chests so what the media is reporting is mostly speculation,
I agree they did say he was overtaken and in earlier reports it said about 5 mins before they reached the car. RAF man was a very keen and competitive cyclist -would he have not tried to keep up.
Yes, that has previously been reported in the press. That may or may not be correct.
I was just stating what the RAF man said in his BBC interview today.
ETA RAF man's statement doesn't preclude having been overtaken by Mollier much earlier in his journey up the hill
why would he wish to race when he was just out on his daily cycle and he had previously been cycling for over an hour that day and said in his interview he was tired as he cycled up the hill
which is why he has no vivid memory of the car or the motorcycle as he had his head down and was just cycling up the hill not looking round at anything
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