GA - Former President Donald Trump indicted, 10 counts in 2020 election interference, violation of RICO Act, 14 Aug 2023

[Friday Fan]

I would have thought that Rudy and Co would have been better postponing the event, rather than being seen as
laughing stocks, once they realised it was the wrong 4 seasons.

I don't think the venue was a mistake.
I do think the name of the place drew the media to the venue and Rudy got his press conference. It was located right next to the interstate and Rudy was able to make a quick exit and get out of Philly ASAP.
___________
Just another case of how low it was going....

 

[SouthAussie]

Lizard people? WTH are lizard people?

My friend, you are obviously reading silly things like grand jury indictments and not reading the really important stuff about lizard people.

 

[Arkay]

On the point of Freedom of Speech, although I don’t want to go around in circles with anyone, and it’s been addressed 1000 times already, I feel compelled to briefly point out again….

Trump DOES have the right to free speech. Yes he does.

He can legally, according to the Constitution, claim from the 2020 election until his dying day that the election was rigged.
His last words, in fact, on his deathbed may well be “the election was rigged.”

He may sound like an idiot but he can say that.

What is NOT covered under Freedom of Speech is TELLING someone to commit a crime. What is NOT covered is making implicit threats that someone is committing a crime and is in deep trouble, even though that someone is innocent and merely going by the factual matter of how many votes were cast for each candidate.

What is NOT free speech is inciting a mob.

What is NO LONGER free speech is when CONCRETE ACTIONS are taken to encourage and bait people to impersonate public officials to pretend that they are electors when they are not.

It’s not free speech to declare that the states that didn’t vote for Trump had corrupt officials and corrupt machines when ACTIONS are taken to seize those machines, and thereby rip votes from citizens’ hands.


Funny how the same machines seemed to work just fine in states that did actually vote for Trump. Funny how no recount was necessary in those states.

It’s not part of this latest case, but in the same vein, it’s NOT free speech to flaunt classified information as trophies and souvenirs of when you were president just to show off and read aloud TOP SECRET INFO, when those actions threaten the nation‘s security.

I could go on but all of this has been said by me and my fellow posters ad infinitum.


I‘m in favor of the growing movement by some Republicans and Democrats that believe the 14th amendment, section 3, is what really should be in play here, the amendment that disqualifies anyone from holding office if he or she has ALREADY “engaged in insurrection or rebellion,” which many Constitutional scholars have already invoked.


IMO he should already have been disqualified.

We DO have more than one amendment to the Constitution.

Congressman Cohen Introduces Bill for Enforcing Fourteenth Amendment Section 3 Prohibiting Insurrectionists Serving in Office

WASHINGTON – Congressman Steve Cohen (TN-09), the Chairman of the Judiciary Subcommittee on the Constitution, Civil Rights, and Civil Liberties, today introduced a measure to enforce Section 3 of the Fourteenth Amendment prohibiting those who have engaged in insurrection or rebellion against the...

cohen.house.gov

JMO plus the Constitution.

 

[ilovewings]

On the point of Freedom of Speech, although I don’t want to go around in circles with anyone, and it’s been addressed 1000 times already, I feel compelled to briefly point out again….

Trump DOES have the right to free speech. Yes he does.

He can legally, according to the Constitution, claim from the 2020 election until his dying day that the election was rigged.
His last words, in fact, on his deathbed may well be “the election was rigged.”

He may sound like an idiot but he can say that.

What is NOT covered under Freedom of Speech is TELLING someone to commit a crime. What is NOT covered is making implicit threats that someone is committing a crime and is in deep trouble, even though that someone is innocent and merely going by the factual matter of how many votes were cast for each candidate.

What is NOT free speech is inciting a mob.

What is NO LONGER free speech is when CONCRETE ACTIONS are taken to encourage and bait people to impersonate public officials to pretend that they are electors when they are not.

It’s not free speech to declare that the states that didn’t vote for Trump had corrupt officials and corrupt machines when ACTIONS are taken to seize those machines, and thereby rip votes from citizens’ hands.


Funny how the same machines seemed to work just fine in states that did actually vote for Trump. Funny how no recount was necessary in those states.

It’s not part of this latest case, but in the same vein, it’s NOT free speech to flaunt classified information as trophies and souvenirs of when you were president just to show off and read aloud TOP SECRET INFO, when those actions threaten the nation‘s security.

I could go on but all of this has been said by me and my fellow posters ad infinitum.


I‘m in favor of the growing movement by some Republicans and Democrats that believe the 14th amendment, section 3, is what really should be in play here, the amendment that disqualifies anyone from holding office if he or she has ALREADY “engaged in insurrection or rebellion,” which many Constitutional scholars have already invoked.


IMO he should already have been disqualified.

We DO have more than one amendment to the Constitution.

Congressman Cohen Introduces Bill for Enforcing Fourteenth Amendment Section 3 Prohibiting Insurrectionists Serving in Office

WASHINGTON – Congressman Steve Cohen (TN-09), the Chairman of the Judiciary Subcommittee on the Constitution, Civil Rights, and Civil Liberties, today introduced a measure to enforce Section 3 of the Fourteenth Amendment prohibiting those who have engaged in insurrection or rebellion against the...

cohen.house.gov

JMO plus the Constitution.

Excellent and informative post!

 

[anneg]

The judge currently assigned to the Georgia case is Scott McAfee, a 34-year-old recent appointee to the bench.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/national-security/2023/08/15/judge-scott-mcafee-georgia-trump-case/

McAfee, a lifelong Georgian who lives in Atlanta, was nominated to fill a vacancy on the bench earlier this year by Gov. Brian Kemp (R), who had previously praised McAfee as “a tough prosecutor” who could “bring those to justice who break the law.”

Though McAfee was assigned the case soon after the indictment was handed up on Monday evening, it could be transferred to a different judge later in the process.

 

[Inthedetails]

On the back of a great post - didya know roughly 16 million (7%) Americans believe chocolate milk comes from brown cows? 12 million believe the United States is secretly run by lizard people. And the very same article touts 46% believing news agencies make up stories about Trump - largely skewed along party lines, mind you.

In the top slot though - hardly anyone knows anything about the constitution with a third polled in one study not being able to name a right protected by the first amendment.

10 Bizarre Things Americans Believe (According to Studies)

As famed American philosopher H.J. Simpson once so eloquently put it, 'facts can be used to prove anything that’s even remotely true.' Well, join us today as we discuss 10 studies showing that a not insignificant percentage of the American population believe in everything from lizard people...

www.toptenz.net

I wonder if the people who believe chocolate milk comes from brown cows get offended and lash out if you tell them the truth? If you pour chocolate into milk to show them how it's made, do they get mad and accuse you of insulting them? Do they demand a re-pour over and over?

Or are they glad to know the truth?


jmo

 

[anneg]

From Joyce White Vance (worth reading as usual, IMO):

The Devil Went Down to Georgia

By now you know that Trump has been indicted, for the fourth time, in Fulton County Georgia. His co-defendants include people like Rudy Giuliani and other lawyers like John Eastman, Sidney Powell (the “kraken”), attorney-general-wannabe Jeff Clark, and more, as well as lesser known figures in...

joycevance.substack.com

Excerpt:
Possibly the most important point for the future of democracy: In Georgia state proceedings, there are cameras. Not just for trial but every step of the way. That was literally true as we were all able to watch the indictment get hand-walked to the judge. This is what it means to have open courtrooms.

The impact when people can see it for themselves can’t be overstated. That’s especially true when it comes to hearing the evidence and the legal arguments the lawyers make. There is no excuse for not having cameras in federal courts. But I’m glad we have them in Georgia. It’s far more difficult for right wing media to call the prosecution a witch hunt when people can see it for themselves. Just like public opinion shifted in some unlikely corners when the public was able to view the trial and hear the evidence against the police officers who murdered George Floyd for themselves, I expect the same could happen [here].

There are a lot of crimes charged in the indictment, but they all center on five basic areas of misconduct:

• False statements around voting fraud made by Trump cronies, including Giuliani, to Georgia officials,
• The Sidney Powell led breach of voting machines in Coffee County,
• Trump’s calls to state officials, including Secretary of State Brad Raffensperger, begging them to overturn the election,
• the attacks on election workers like Ruby Freeman and Shaye Moss, and
• the creation of slates of alternate electors in an attempt to steal the election.

(more at link)

 

[MyBelle]

>> snipped for focus<<

I'm curious how it works in other states -- in California, where I was a precinct worker for ten years until covid, voters always have the option of a paper ballot or the machine.

I live in a heavily Republican area and whether for authentic mistrust or just an aversion to 'newfangled' stuff, can count on my fingers the number of times anyone in my precinct used the electronic voting machine instead of a paper ballot.

Long before Trump, folks were wary of the machines. If they are unreliable or erroneous in any way, that should of course (IMO) be addressed and fixed. The democratic process is taken very seriously in the US and I have no doubt it would be/will be/has been addressed when problems arise. It sure looks to me like Trump merely glommed onto that as something to pretend was about him, when it truly has nothing to do with him. Same as absentee/mail-in ballots. IMO of course.

tldr: folks who want to vote using paper ballots should do so. Are there setups outside Californa that require the use of the machines?

BBM. Georgia doesn't offer that option. Georgia voters don't trust the machines and apparently don't have a choice in the matter.
JMO

Renewed call for paper ballots in Georgia flares up at crowded State Election Board meeting • Georgia Recorder

Renewed call for paper ballots in Georgia flares up at crowded State Election Board meeting, calls replace electronic Dominion voting machine

georgiarecorder.com

Several election integrity groups are ratcheting up the pressure on Georgia election officials to ditch the electronic voting machines the state purchased in 2019 in favor of paper ballots in time for the 2024 presidential election.

Dominion Voting System detractors accounted for the majority of the 100 people packed inside a state Capitol legislative committee room on Tuesday for a State Election Board meeting where several dozen people pushed to replace voting software that some cyber security experts say is a ripe target for hackers.

 

[Inthedetails]

BBM. Georgia doesn't offer that option. Georgia voters don't trust the machines and apparently don't have a choice in the matter.
JMO

Renewed call for paper ballots in Georgia flares up at crowded State Election Board meeting • Georgia Recorder

Renewed call for paper ballots in Georgia flares up at crowded State Election Board meeting, calls replace electronic Dominion voting machine

georgiarecorder.com

Several election integrity groups are ratcheting up the pressure on Georgia election officials to ditch the electronic voting machines the state purchased in 2019 in favor of paper ballots in time for the 2024 presidential election.

Dominion Voting System detractors accounted for the majority of the 100 people packed inside a state Capitol legislative committee room on Tuesday for a State Election Board meeting where several dozen people pushed to replace voting software that some cyber security experts say is a ripe target for hackers.

From the same link:

"Multiple state and federal investigations found no evidence of voting fraud in the 2020 presidential election, and multiple recounts confirmed Biden’s victory in Georgia."

 

[Stunned]

My friend, you are obviously reading silly things like grand jury indictments and not reading the really important stuff about lizard people.

After reading about it, I’m afraid my sister probably believes in that muckery also!

 

[Leilei]

BBM. Georgia doesn't offer that option. Georgia voters don't trust the machines and apparently don't have a choice in the matter.
JMO

Renewed call for paper ballots in Georgia flares up at crowded State Election Board meeting • Georgia Recorder

Renewed call for paper ballots in Georgia flares up at crowded State Election Board meeting, calls replace electronic Dominion voting machine

georgiarecorder.com

Several election integrity groups are ratcheting up the pressure on Georgia election officials to ditch the electronic voting machines the state purchased in 2019 in favor of paper ballots in time for the 2024 presidential election.

Dominion Voting System detractors accounted for the majority of the 100 people packed inside a state Capitol legislative committee room on Tuesday for a State Election Board meeting where several dozen people pushed to replace voting software that some cyber security experts say is a ripe target for hackers.

There is still the option to use a drop off or mail in ballot if they don't want to use the voting machines.

 

[Inthedetails]

After reading about it, I’m afraid my sister probably believes in that muckery also!

Welcome to the family. My sister-in-law does.

Edited to add: at least she used to. Not sure she still does and I don't ask.

 

[Stunned]

I wonder if the people who believe chocolate milk comes from brown cows get offended and lash out if you tell them the truth? If you pour chocolate into milk to show them how it's made, do they get mad and accuse you of insulting them? Do they demand a re-pour over and over?

Or are they glad to know the truth?


jmo

They still won’t believe you. Your making fake chocolate milk. IMO

 

[kaen]

BBM. Georgia doesn't offer that option. Georgia voters don't trust the machines and apparently don't have a choice in the matter.
JMO

Renewed call for paper ballots in Georgia flares up at crowded State Election Board meeting • Georgia Recorder

Renewed call for paper ballots in Georgia flares up at crowded State Election Board meeting, calls replace electronic Dominion voting machine

georgiarecorder.com

Several election integrity groups are ratcheting up the pressure on Georgia election officials to ditch the electronic voting machines the state purchased in 2019 in favor of paper ballots in time for the 2024 presidential election.

Dominion Voting System detractors accounted for the majority of the 100 people packed inside a state Capitol legislative committee room on Tuesday for a State Election Board meeting where several dozen people pushed to replace voting software that some cyber security experts say is a ripe target for hackers.

In my mind the people of GA can begin to organize to change that but until they do this is the system that they have. You have said repeatedly that this is a bi-partisan belief so I would hope that Dems and Repubs can reach across the aisle and organize. This is a great opportunity to make change and build on respect for differing points of view while optimizing points of agreement.

IIRC, GA was also a state that instituting rules that people could not bring food or water to people on line and other rules about voter rolls etc. The shame about all of that is that it does seem that there is partisan politics at play that reduce the impetus to work together to meet the needs of the voters of the state. No party should ever be looking at curtailing or dissuading voters, which it appears may be the case. We have many states where the majority is really one party with the other party having little opportunity to gain majority. With that, I reiterate that purging rolls or creating an uneven voting opportunity (fewer polling places, making it harder to vote for registered voters) does not unite but further politicizes an already fraught system at this point in time.

 

[MyBelle]

Texas has a law that everything must be counted within 24 hrs. (I think it's 7 pm on Wednesday) Early Votes are counted(tabulated) prior to the polls closing. (Boxes from the Early Voting Centers arrive on Friday evening after early voting closes. They are counted on Election Day) They are released once the polls close. Then as boxes are brought back to Election Dept, Election Day votes are counted.

This means that machines are required.

Our county was all electronic until 2019, until we went to paper/scan.
The scanners are at the polling sites and I believe results are stored on a USB drive, which is taken to the Elections Dept on Election Night.

A USB is loaded from 300 polling locations. The flash drives are tabulated and results are released to the public. However, the official results are not available for two weeks.
aa
The only time hand counted paper ballots are used are in very small jurisdictions.

__-
________________

Usually early voting results are posted around 8 pm, it could be later though because they aren't posted until every poll is closed. Around 9 pm, election day results begin to be posted. Usually most of the results are posted by midnight - 2 am.

____________________
As you know, Texas is basically a one party state. The minority party was the party that was wary of machines.
I feel that losing parties often feel the "system is rigged".

BBM. Do you have a link?

Texas' Secretary of State and Attorney General rejected Dominion voting machines multiple times because of reliability issues. I believe both are Republicans.
JMO

Officials raised concerns for years about security of U.S. voting machines, software systems

(The Center Square) – The Dominion Voting Systems, which has been used in multiple states where fraud has been alleged in the 2020 U.S. Election, was rejected three times by

www.thecentersquare.com

Officials raised concerns for years about security of U.S. voting machines, software systems​

(The Center Square) – The Dominion Voting Systems, which has been used in multiple states where fraud has been alleged in the 2020 U.S. Election, was rejected three times by data communications experts from the Texas Secretary of State and Attorney General’s Office for failing to meet basic security standards.

Unlike Texas, other states certified the use of the system, including Pennsylvania, where voter fraud has been alleged on multiple counts this week.

 

[MyBelle]

In my mind the people of GA can begin to organize to change that but until they do this is the system that they have. You have said repeatedly that this is a bi-partisan belief so I would hope that Dems and Repubs can reach across the aisle and organize. This is a great opportunity to make change and build on respect for differing points of view while optimizing points of agreement.

IIRC, GA was also a state that instituting rules that people could not bring food or water to people on line and other rules about voter rolls etc. The shame about all of that is that it does seem that there is partisan politics at play that reduce the impetus to work together to meet the needs of the voters of the state. No party should ever be looking at curtailing or dissuading voters, which it appears may be the case. We have many states where the majority is really one party with the other party having little opportunity to gain majority. With that, I reiterate that purging rolls or creating an uneven voting opportunity (fewer polling places, making it harder to vote for registered voters) does not unite but further politicizes an already fraught system at this point in time.

BBM. Partisan politics is allowing voters to be approached by a political party while waiting to vote. My state forbids it and poll workers make sure it doesn't happen.

JMO

 

[Cubby]

I don't expect Meadows to care. But I expect that the same Trump fans who have published the grand jurors' names and addresses online and sent Fani Willis death threats and insults using the N word most certainly will, and act accordingly.

Trump opened the Pandora's box for the type of behavior described above. It's sad that we now expect people to behave this way. ALL of these incidents/cases combined lead me to believe Trump belongs behind bars and sentencing, when it happens, should include enormous fines. (And if people are dumb enough to part ways with their money for DT let them.)

 

[sds71]

CodyAlcorn
@FultonSheriff issues statement on possible threats against the County grand jury, who handed up indictments against Trump and 18 co-defendants


"We take this matter very seriously and are coordinating with our law enforcement partners to respond quickly to any credible threat..."

 

[Leilei]

BBM. Partisan politics is allowing voters to be approached by a political party while waiting to vote. My state forbids it and poll workers make sure it doesn't happen.

JMO

DBM - corrected

 

[Cubby]

On the point of Freedom of Speech, although I don’t want to go around in circles with anyone, and it’s been addressed 1000 times already, I feel compelled to briefly point out again….

Trump DOES have the right to free speech. Yes he does.

He can legally, according to the Constitution, claim from the 2020 election until his dying day that the election was rigged.
His last words, in fact, on his deathbed may well be “the election was rigged.”

He may sound like an idiot but he can say that.

What is NOT covered under Freedom of Speech is TELLING someone to commit a crime. What is NOT covered is making implicit threats that someone is committing a crime and is in deep trouble, even though that someone is innocent and merely going by the factual matter of how many votes were cast for each candidate.

What is NOT free speech is inciting a mob.

What is NO LONGER free speech is when CONCRETE ACTIONS are taken to encourage and bait people to impersonate public officials to pretend that they are electors when they are not.

It’s not free speech to declare that the states that didn’t vote for Trump had corrupt officials and corrupt machines when ACTIONS are taken to seize those machines, and thereby rip votes from citizens’ hands.


Funny how the same machines seemed to work just fine in states that did actually vote for Trump. Funny how no recount was necessary in those states.

It’s not part of this latest case, but in the same vein, it’s NOT free speech to flaunt classified information as trophies and souvenirs of when you were president just to show off and read aloud TOP SECRET INFO, when those actions threaten the nation‘s security.

I could go on but all of this has been said by me and my fellow posters ad infinitum.


I‘m in favor of the growing movement by some Republicans and Democrats that believe the 14th amendment, section 3, is what really should be in play here, the amendment that disqualifies anyone from holding office if he or she has ALREADY “engaged in insurrection or rebellion,” which many Constitutional scholars have already invoked.


IMO he should already have been disqualified.

We DO have more than one amendment to the Constitution.

Congressman Cohen Introduces Bill for Enforcing Fourteenth Amendment Section 3 Prohibiting Insurrectionists Serving in Office

WASHINGTON – Congressman Steve Cohen (TN-09), the Chairman of the Judiciary Subcommittee on the Constitution, Civil Rights, and Civil Liberties, today introduced a measure to enforce Section 3 of the Fourteenth Amendment prohibiting those who have engaged in insurrection or rebellion against the...

cohen.house.gov

JMO plus the Constitution.

Perhaps all of these cases are leading to enforcing the 14th amendment. Could be conviction/s would be necessary?