GA GA - Jenna Van Gelderen, 25, Atlanta, 18 Aug 2017 #3

[Shiressleuth]

I wish I lived in a place where any time a young woman goes missing, the idea she could be a victim of sex trafficking is so preposterous that it's not even considered. It must be nice.



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I'm sure we all would wish that.

 

[pamelado2]

Why I think the sex trafficking theory is preposterous:

1) Jenna has a good relationship with her family - her entire family is very involved in finding her. Her family knows her and doesn't think this theory is logical or true.

2) Jenna was voluntarily taking care of her cat. It was for a limited time.

3) Jenna would be considered "older", not a child easily groomed.

4) Jenna was interacting with some of her friends the night she disappeared.

5) She left behind her ID, debit card, etc.

6) Her phones are not functioning but she didn't leave them behind.

7) She left behind her clothes.

8) Her secrecy about her living arrangements seem to me to be more about asserting her independence than hiding what she was doing.

9) None of her friends have come forward with stories of her being involved in this life style.

10) There has been no confirmation of her guy friends, ex-boyfriend being a "pimp".

Sent from my Pixel XL using Tapatalk

 

[Bit of hope]

About the tapestry...
The actual description should be "vintage embroidered and appliqued table linen." I'm okay with calling it a tapestry, but if anyone is searching ebay and such, it would not be described as a "tapestry."

Shiresleuths looked it up and suggested that it is more like an Egyptian Khayamiya what IMO is very likely

 

[Shiressleuth]

Shiresleuths looked it up and suggested that it is more like an Egyptian Khayamiya what IMO is very likely

" a rose by any other name would smell as sweet"
Its also in BoH timeline so it must be right. :wave:

 

[noseynellie]

Why I think the sex trafficking theory is preposterous:

1) Jenna has a good relationship with her family - her entire family is very involved in finding her. Her family knows her and doesn't think this theory is logical or true.

2) Jenna was voluntarily taking care of her cat. It was for a limited time.

3) Jenna would be considered "older", not a child easily groomed.

4) Jenna was interacting with some of her friends the night she disappeared.

5) She left behind her ID, debit card, etc.

6) Her phones are not functioning but she didn't leave them behind.

7) She left behind her clothes.

8) Her secrecy about her living arrangements seem to me to be more about asserting her independence than hiding what she was doing.

9) None of her friends have come forward with stories of her being involved in this life style.

10) There has been no confirmation of her guy friends, ex-boyfriend being a "pimp".

Sent from my Pixel XL using Tapatalk

I'm not sure if this is what the other posts were about but in my mind, if it was something to be considered (I'm neutral at this point but it is a problem here) I wouldn't assume it was a voluntary thing. Young women, not just children, can also become victims. I'm not saying this happened to Jenna at all but just that this angle doesn't have to mean it was a voluntary choice, if that makes sense.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Shiressleuth]

Why I think the sex trafficking theory is preposterous:

1) Jenna has a good relationship with her family - her entire family is very involved in finding her. Her family knows her and doesn't think this theory is logical or true.

2) Jenna was voluntarily taking care of her cat. It was for a limited time.

3) Jenna would be considered "older", not a child easily groomed.

4) Jenna was interacting with some of her friends the night she disappeared.

5) She left behind her ID, debit card, etc.

6) Her phones are not functioning but she didn't leave them behind.

7) She left behind her clothes.

8) Her secrecy about her living arrangements seem to me to be more about asserting her independence than hiding what she was doing.

9) None of her friends have come forward with stories of her being involved in this life style.

10) There has been no confirmation of her guy friends, ex-boyfriend being a "pimp".

Sent from my Pixel XL using Tapatalk

Good points.
Also, she is broke but left behind her car, Her family have also publicly said these rumours have harmed the search (could be why flyers have disappeared)
:cow:

 

[Oriah]

I agree, shire. Speaking of search efforts, are there any notations anywhere regarding k9 searches, other than the search of and around the vehicle?

 

[BlkMtnGirl]

SBM
Regarding rumours of prostitution, Subie and family have strongly denied this both on this site and via MSM. Maybe you shouldn't go there IMO.

If posters actually look at post 1 on this thread, the last MSM item explains where family state rumours have actually harmed the search efforts.

I have been here every day from the very first posts, actually I totally agree with you that the rumors may have been harming search efforts, especially in the beginning. I am still hesitant to "go there." I just don't see any other leads going anywhere. I fervently wish I did. If the "new friends" are not involved in trafficking, then (of course) I think this is a false lead and a rumor. My own opinion, etc. It would be interesting to know what LE knows, but that is just being selfish on my part. I am grateful that we are not allowed to post rumors from social media, and I am also grateful we are allowed to express opinions and theories here.

 

[believe09]

RSBM
FYI you can find the origin in BoH timeline at around 1130pm. It is on the missing persons flyer linked in the timeline. However, I cannot see it anymore in the current flyer so it has recently been removed. Perhaps Subie can confirm this fact as still being correct or not.

Hi and TY. Yes I found it on the timeline, but some kind of computer madness is making it difficult for me to snip the piece of the timeline that discusses this witness knowing Jenna was in her mother's car and what the source of the siting of Jenna and the passenger was.

 

[believe09]

Subie-I hope the investigation is moving forward. It feels to me like there is progress being made as the timeline becomes more and more detailed regarding her movements. I so appreciate you as a resource!!

-Do you know who is removing your flyers?

-Is it still accurate to say that someone witnessed Jenna driving her mother's car and that there was a male passenger?

Many thanks.

 

[believe09]

I have been here every day from the very first posts, actually I totally agree with you that the rumors may have been harming search efforts, especially in the beginning. I am still hesitant to "go there." I just don't see any other leads going anywhere. I fervently wish I did. If the "new friends" are not involved in trafficking, then (of course) I think this is a false lead and a rumor. My own opinion, etc. It would be interesting to know what LE knows, but that is just being selfish on my part. I am grateful that we are not allowed to post rumors from social media, and I am also grateful we are allowed to express opinions and theories here.

I do want to say in our defense, we have a good amount of information from subie referencing two butt dials from a number that links to some kind of trafficking.

Has there been a change to that position as a possibility? I feel like we set aside the prostitution rumor on the earlier threads, but trafficking is not typically voluntary and it seems that this is a worry given the Instagram and phone number that dialed Jenna late Friday night 8/18.

 

[Stanly]

I do want to say in our defense, we have a good amount of information from subie referencing two butt dials from a number that links to some kind of trafficking.

Has there been a change to that position as a possibility? I feel like we set aside the prostitution rumor on the earlier threads, but trafficking is not typically voluntary and it seems that this is a worry given the Instagram and phone number that dialed Jenna late Friday night 8/18.

IIRC the butt dials link to an Instagram account 'with references to pimping'. What may be someones idea of pimping i.e i dont know....posts by a young lad giving it the big I AM talking about women and how much money has, might just be a bragging post and there is nothing untoward.

'With references to pimping' could mean anything. JMO.

Sent from my SM-A320FL using Tapatalk

 

[Shiressleuth]

Hi and TY. Yes I found it on the timeline, but some kind of computer madness is making it difficult for me to snip the piece of the timeline that discusses this witness knowing Jenna was in her mother's car and what the source of the siting of Jenna and the passenger was.

IKWYM. I started to quote the whole post number 1 with the aim of just quoting the one link, but gave it up as a bad job as I kept deleting what I wanted to keep. Smart phones are not much good with notsmart owners like me. Anyway it's there, as we have both discovered and now everyone knows where to look, (now it has changed. :smile: ).

 

[believe09]

SBM
Regarding rumours of prostitution, Subie and family have strongly denied this both on this site and via MSM. Maybe you shouldn't go there IMO.

If posters actually look at post 1 on this thread, the last MSM item explains where family state rumours have actually harmed the search efforts.

11.00 p.m.
•Pocket Dial fromPerson 3, T2 # 324 VI By voicemail on Metro pcs Jenna. Number (also a metro pcs number) is tied to anInstagram account with references to pimping and clubs on Cambelton Rd .

This is the snip of the timeline that seems to suggest the possibility of trafficking to me. I agree that the family has forcefully put to rest the idea of Jenna participating voluntarily in this. Trafficking is rarely voluntary in my experience.

Is the theory of trafficking completely off of the table as well?

 

[sassysleuthie]

I wish I lived in a place where any time a young woman goes missing, the idea she could be a victim of sex trafficking is so preposterous that it's not even considered. It must be nice.



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

same! unfortunately, when somebody goes missing, all angles have to be addressed. in a perfect world, jenna just wanted some time alone and took off. and will be back when she's ready. hopefully that is the case.

it would be counterproductive to not look at ALL sides... is that incorrect? as unfortunate as the theories are, they are merely that - theories. the goal is finding her. process of elimination.

 

[Stanly]

This is the snip of the timeline that seems to suggest the possibility of trafficking to me. I agree that the family has forcefully put to rest the idea of Jenna participating voluntarily in this. Trafficking is rarely voluntary in my experience.

Is the theory of trafficking completely off of the table as well?

It is for me IMO

Regardless of statistics in Atlanta, and no i am not from there so this is just MO, she does not fit the criteria. As per my previous i dont think you can base the theory simpky on someones comnent that 2 missed calks were from an account linked to trafficking or references to pimping. What people should be asking is how is it linked to trafficking? There is no backpage ad, the rumours were quashed. If you weigh up all the evidence towards trafficking there isnt anything that could convince me personally. It might well be the case...none of us know for certain... but there needs to be hard evidence to convince me not just links to statistics and being told that not being an Atlantan (is that a word?), we dont have a clue how big the issue is. Yes, it might be a HUGE worrying issue there but that does not necessarily mean that this is the case here.

Like i said, it might well be the case and as much as i can read about it won't help until we have evidence from LE or the family.

Sent from my SM-A320FL using Tapatalk

 

[Shiressleuth]

IIRC the butt dials link to an Instagram account 'with references to pimping'. What may be someones idea of pimping i.e i dont know....posts by a young lad giving it the big I AM talking about women and how much money has, might just be a bragging post and there is nothing untoward.

'With references to pimping' could mean anything. JMO.

Sent from my SM-A320FL using Tapatalk

And it was an incoming bum dial too so no real connection as such imo.

 

[Shiressleuth]

same! unfortunately, when somebody goes missing, all angles have to be addressed. in a perfect world, jenna just wanted some time alone and took off. and will be back when she's ready. hopefully that is the case.

it would be counterproductive to not look at ALL sides... is that incorrect? as unfortunate as the theories are, they are merely that - theories. the goal is finding her. process of elimination.

Yes it would be productive to look at all sides and angles. And as we have discussed prostitution all ways to Sunday, any chance we could now move on to other theories, like jealous ex or a secret to hide or foul play for instance. Unless other evidence shows up of course. :cow:

 

[noseynellie]

Whenever I've had a "pocket dial" there has been conversation/music, etc. in the background that gives me the impression that it was accidental and the person didn't know the phone was recording.

How do we know that this person didn't intentionally try to call her at those times? Subie said at one point that he might have made those calls because she didn't show to meet him (he was the guy who asked her to meet him closer to her apartment/Lindbergh). If that's the case, they aren't pocket dials. They are intentional calls. Which is it?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Stanly]

Whenever I've had a "pocket dial" there has been conversation/music, etc. in the background that gives me the impression that it was accidental and the person didn't know the phone was recording.

How do we know that this person didn't intentionally try to call her at those times? Subie said at one point that he might have made those calls because she didn't show to meet him (he was the guy who asked her to meet him closer to her apartment/Lindbergh). If that's the case, they aren't pocket dials. They are intentional calls. Which is it?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

As per the timeline:

'Who ever it was thatcalled at 11:30 left a 2 min long voice mail and their phone was in theirpocket.'

I would guess a 2 min 'in the pocket' call would be unintentional.

From looking around online last night i saw loads of ads for rooms to rent 'females only' and in return for cleaning etc... Jenna may have potentially called one of these numbers and they called her back at 11pm but she didnt answer and then that person accidentally called at 11:30pm.so that might explain the links with that number. If that number only ever called those 2 times and it wasnt saved on her phone then chances are its nothing.

Sent from my SM-A320FL using Tapatalk