GUILTY GA - Jorelys Rivera, 7, Canton, 2 Dec 2011 - #4

[TheDuchess]

I fostered my daughter prior to adopting her (Illinois.). She gets a check each month until she is 18 even though she is formally adopted. It is about $400 a month or about $4800.00 per year. If I had done that for 6 kids I would be getting about $30,000.00 per year.

 

[Crosby87]

Jorelys mother chose to have an open coffin visitation. Respectfully the body wasn't in that bad of a condition. One of the WS members last night said she appeared to be sleeping. That leads me to believe the body was put into the dumpster but not - said with the utmost of respect-compacted.

This is why I am angry with LE. We were led to believe she was brutally stabbed several times, severely beaten, her blood was splattered throughout the vacant apartment and her body was disfigured however if this was true imo, the family would not have had a public viewing especially one week after she was murdered. I personally feel LE exaggerated these facts.

 

[Magdalyn]

Several media reports said RB was denied bond but his court appointed lawyers have yet to file a motion requesting bond which takes place at his arraignment so the Judge did not rule on this issue yet.

Several media reports had headlines which said RB was denied bond which misleads the public who perhaps didn't see his initial hearing or understand what went on during RB's 7 minute court appearance imo.

Thanks for clearing that up!

I doubt he gets it. From what I've read there are judges in Georgia who flat out always deny bond for murder charges, and even if his judge wasn't one of them, they had the guy show up to the courtroom in a bullet proof vest. I think the judge is well aware that there would be high potential for vigilantism upon RB the moment he stepped out the detention center doors.

And even if he did get it, I don't think there's anyone in his family who could put up that kind of bond.

 

[Magdalyn]

I hate to criticize LE also, but I have FB friends local to the area. All last weekend they were spreading infomation about this missing child and questioning why no Amber Alert was posted.

Here it's called Levi's call, but there have to be specific criteria met (same with Amber Alert).

There has to be a description of their abductor, and with Amber Alert, a description of a car, I believe.

http://amber.gbi.georgia.gov/00/channel_modifieddate/0,2096,67865199_67868071,00.html

 

[Magdalyn]

This is why I am angry with LE. We were led to believe she was brutally stabbed several times, severely beaten, her blood was splattered throughout the vacant apartment and her body was disfigured however if this was true imo, the family would not have had a public viewing especially one week after she was murdered. I personally feel LE exaggerated these facts.

I don't think they were lying. The medical examiner corroborated the stabbing and blunt force trauma to the head in his autopsy report (as well as sexual assualt iirc). Head wounds bleed a lot as do arteries when they are cut, and you can have either or both those kind of wounds without being disfigured. I don't rememeber any of the LE saying she was horribly disfigured. I think we interpeted the GBI director's refusal to describe in detail what he saw as her being horribly disfigured.

I don't think anyone at the mortuary saw her torso, her genital area, or the back of the poor child's head. :twocents: :seeya:

ETA: In many cases, and not to be crude, morticians can do amazing things with putty, glue, theatrical makeup, and wigs.

 

[Hickory Born]

Comments swirling on FB that the family was asked not to come to the court appearance for their safety.

I think this is some kind of cop-out or excuse. I do not think the Court or LE would tell the family to stay away because of "their safety." LE has guarded/protected other high profile criminals' families during Court hearings.

Wonder if any of the family has visited RB in jail?

 

[belimom]

Thanks for clarifying "real" mother :woohoo:
I am also an adoptive Mom & bio Mom :great:
I just looked up GA. homeschool compulsory attendance and it is "between 6th and 16th " birthday.
So, legally they could have told Mom to shove it once they turned 16:anguish:

bbm

OT - Same here...

 

[abagale]

I just wanted to add something- In Georgia, you cannot legally homeschool foster children. You CAN legally homeschool adopted children.

I have a friend and she homeschools her 3 daughers but has a foster child she is trying to adopt. The adoption took a while so she had to send him to school because of this law.

Someone asked this in the other thread and I never saw it answered. I still have 11 pages of this one to go, so forgive me if that's a repeat.

I had a foster child age 5 who needed to be signed up for Kindergarten. I also at that time had a daycare. The case worker asked me if I would homeschool the child. I told I don't have a homeschool. The caseworker was bummed about my response. She said that she thought it would be a good move for me to homeschool the child. (child had some real antisocial issues). I live in GA.

 

[belimom]

I just wanted to add something- In Georgia, you cannot legally homeschool foster children. You CAN legally homeschool adopted children.

I have a friend and she homeschools her 3 daughers but has a foster child she is trying to adopt. The adoption took a while so she had to send him to school because of this law.

Someone asked this in the other thread and I never saw it answered. I still have 11 pages of this one to go, so forgive me if that's a repeat.

I had a foster child age 5 who needed to be signed up for Kindergarten. I also at that time had a daycare. The case worker asked me if I would homeschool the child. I told I don't have a homeschool. The caseworker was bummed about my response. She said that she thought it would be a good move for me to homeschool the child. (child had some real antisocial issues). I live in GA.

From what I found (I posted it upthread), you can definitely homeschool foster children in Georgia. It seems to be on a case-by-case basis and up to the caseworker and judge...?

 

[Magdalyn]

Saw this when I was looking for new news regarding the case. Sort of off topic, but not.

View From a Cop: Hard Facts on Child Abductions After Jorelys Rivera

http://sandysprings.patch.com/artic...acts-on-child-abductions-after-jorelys-rivera

 

[georgiagirl]

This is why I am angry with LE. We were led to believe she was brutally stabbed several times, severely beaten, her blood was splattered throughout the vacant apartment and her body was disfigured however if this was true imo, the family would not have had a public viewing especially one week after she was murdered. I personally feel LE exaggerated these facts.

What I am about to say is MY perspective and MY opinion...

I feel the need to respond to this as I also went to the viewing and saw Jorelys..... IMO, it was beyond disturbing. She looked like her face had to be completely reconstructed like one of those busts made of clay. To me, it was very obvious and there was nothing and I mean nothing natural looking about her face at all. I think the enmbalmer did the best he could but it was so upsetting to me that I felt sick and broke down in the parking lot after leaving and just sat in my car and cried. I am just now able to talk about it. The reason I wanted to see is because I guess I felt I could somehow share in their pain and grief even more, I know that sounds weird but that is how I felt. I wish I had never seen that.... It will haunt me forever. God bless that family.....

 

[abagale]

Another point, but again, maybe not worth pursing:
If RB’s mom established GA residency, why is NY paying for adult foster/adopted legal adults?
RB and CB are 20 y/o, SP/B is 26, CS is married (older than 20), SB is ~? last year HS tops?
So, if all ‘children’ are adults under NY stipend and living for years in Georgia … get my drift?
Maybe she (mom) got her last state paycheck and all the sons still at home had to flee or ?

RB’s mom left her home two months ago ~Sept/Oct (RB moved from the newer residence during/after this transition ~ Nov).
… why are all 4 adult sons still at home, RB moved out in Nov. , 3 sons still there, and sis got married and was already out.

Just asking you all to back up and see this, please.

What the remaining sons and mom do now are their business(es), but one flew the coop.
(Sister already did.)

http://www.nrcyd.ou.edu/state-pages/state/ga

Info taken from link above for Georgia- Youths can remain in Foster home until 21 providing and only providing:
The youth has an educational plan in place and signs an agreement with the resource provider and the county. The youth may remain until 21.5 years if the additional 6 months will allow time to complete an educational program.

This situation is commonly seen in kids that have been in foster care for a while and will age out of the system.

 

[abagale]

Could the stipend be related to any disability payments?

Also, ftr, it really doesn't matter all that much in GA what the schoolboards want, there's a state law and it's pretty lenient over all IF they are your kids. (Naturally or by adoption.)
NY State is tougher to homechool in- on paper. I've met a lot of New Yorkers that unschool. You have to have an approved curriculum there but there's ways they get around it so they can teach and do what they want.
I do not mean to sound as if I am trying to put homeschooling on trial- I have only seen it be very successful compared to public school, so I totally advocate it. I just thought that might be a relevant tidbit to his background.

I have a relative that adopted a disabled boy. (His IQ is low with the mildest MR to qualify as MR) He got some sort of disability. I'm not sure what happened with all that, but when he got to adult age, she put him in a grouphome and she commented that they'd take his whole check. (So there must have been some money coming in.)

I'm really leary of the foster care system b/c even though I know some good people that foster, I don't think they'd do it IF NOT for the money, and when someone has a bunch of kids..well it makes me wonder what their deepest motivations are.

The other thing is that I know someone who has a child of her family member that is special needs. She gets a good bit of $$ and I was surprised to recently find out that she's always TOLD the child that he's adopted, but he IS NOT.

Could RB have some sort of very mild mental disorder or developmental disorder? Could the mom have been collecting kids with special needs for income and labor to do chores ad nauseum if you get my drift, and to support her?

Could RB have come to hate young children for being able to live a social, carefree life and go to school- a life that he never got to live?

Could he have been dumb as a rock and set up so that someone could have 2 victims instead of one?

It's funny others feel like someone else was involved. I got those vibes too.
It's just random thoughts running through my head.

I agree with what you said about foster parents collecting kids for income. So sad. The problem though is sometimes if DFCS sees that you as a fp qualify to keep lots of kids, they will push more kids off on you. It is even possible that Ryan Brunn's adopted parents were foster parents too to other kids. That scares me a lot. It is important to know that DFCS treats foster homes sort of like a business, which then attracts people who are in it for the money. When you are raising children for the money, you make mistakes. DFCS makes mistakes all of the time. DFCS job primarily is to push paper to the courts and process children. It is the foster parents in most cases that love the children.

 

[Jayarre]

A couple of years ago there was a case in Florida and I can't remember the name but a lady from NY had 11 adopted children and moved to Fl and was investigated when one of the children was wandering the streets. They were unable to account for some of the children but the lady had been receiving payments from NY for all of the children and no one was keeping track of them. All the children had disabilities.

http://www.nytimes.com/2007/07/31/nyregion/31abuse.html

Found the story.

 

[Crosby87]

Thanks for clearing that up!

I doubt he gets it. From what I've read there are judges in Georgia who flat out always deny bond for murder charges, and even if his judge wasn't one of them, they had the guy show up to the courtroom in a bullet proof vest. I think the judge is well aware that there would be high potential for vigilantism upon RB the moment he stepped out the detention center doors.

And even if he did get it, I don't think there's anyone in his family who could put up that kind of bond.

You are welcome and I agree with you as to why he might not be able to bond out of jail but I went back and found the post in thread #3 which cited several reasons why RB should be granted bond:

1. His attorneys believe their client is innocent
2. He has no prior criminal record
3. He isn't a flight risk

RB's attorneys said they are proceeding as if their client is not guilty.

Can the Judge deny an accused bond if they feel his life would be in danger if he was released before the case goes to trial? RB is currently segregated from the other inmates for his own protection.

I tried to find RB's booking details which I believe includes the inmates height and weight but I couldn't find him.

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showpost.phpp=7424855&postcount=875

 

[Dr. Know?]

Bluesky, The judge can deny bond or make it so high no one could afford it. There is no proof that RB isn't a flight risk. Frankly, he'd be safer behind bars than for the public to know he was out.

You might remember the fiasco of when Casey Anthony was let out on bail. There was a live cam 24/7 almost and sooo many protesters. Many verbal almost physical fights on the A's front lawn too.

I doubt he'll let RB out on bail. jmo

 

[Crosby87]

Here it's called Levi's call, but there have to be specific criteria met (same with Amber Alert).

There has to be a description of their abductor, and with Amber Alert, a description of a car, I believe.

http://amber.gbi.georgia.gov/00/channel_modifieddate/0,2096,67865199_67868071,00.html

That's the reason I heard why no Amber Alert/Levi's call was issued after Jorelys was reported missing but over the weekend LE stopped and checked cars with dogs trained to detect drugs.

 

[marazul]

While this is definately the most difficult thing to discuss, I have to agree with Georgia Girl regarding my shared opinion that LE did not exaggerate her wounds. I also attended the viewing of Jorelys, and have attended enough funerals/wakes/viewings to have some sort of baseline opinion as to the appearance of the deceased, and I will agree that while Jorelys looked suitable for viewing, it was VERY OBVIOUS that the funeral home did extensive work (makeup, possibly prosthetic tissue) to make her suitable for viewing. Had I gone in not knowing that she was the victim of a violent murder, I would have been shocked by her appearance.

Also, I agree that there is no agenda to "blame" LE. My concern is that local LE was on scene Friday at 7pm through Monday morning and did not identify the crime scene, the body, or have a firm suspect. Then Monday morning with GBI help, the crime scene was identified, the body was recovered, and apparently the suspect was identified sometime Monday/Tuesday (under surveilance Tuesday PM earliest). Niether the crime scene or the body-as far as we know- had been MOVED since Friday, so the fact that the GBI accomplished in a few hours what the local LE was unable to accomplish from Friday afternoon through Monday morning at the very least suggests that maybe they could have done a better job.

 

[westie mom]

What I am about to say is MY perspective and MY opinion...

I feel the need to respond to this as I also went to the viewing and saw Jorelys..... IMO, it was beyond disturbing. She looked like her face had to be completely reconstructed like one of those busts made of clay. To me, it was very obvious and there was nothing and I mean nothing natural looking about her face at all. I think the enmbalmer did the best he could but it was so upsetting to me that I felt sick and broke down in the parking lot after leaving and just sat in my car and cried. I am just now able to talk about it. The reason I wanted to see is because I guess I felt I could somehow share in their pain and grief even more, I know that sounds weird but that is how I felt. I wish I had never seen that.... It will haunt me forever. God bless that family.....

This case has emotionally affected me like no other since the Sara Tokars case many years ago, and it - along with this post - succeeded in pulling me out of the lurkdom I've enjoyed at WS dating back to Laci's case!

I, too, went to the viewing Friday evening as I felt compelled to personally pay my respects to Jorelys and convey my heartfelt sympathy to her family. Heck, I even went home after work to change into something pink after seeing that request posted here...not many things would pull me into 50+ miles of rush-hour traffic on a Friday going somewhere I had no idea how to navigate, but this case did.

I totally agree with GeorgiaGirl...the funeral home staff deserves medals for the work they did to make even a family viewing possible. It was clear that this poor angel had suffered massive facial trauma, and it took a Herculean effort to reconstruct her face as much as they were able to. With that said, let's just leave it that the face I saw Friday bore little resemblance to the various photos that have been in the media, particularly her mid-face around the nose and eyes. While that vision has haunted me all weekend making it possible only just now for me to talk about it, I will forever remember the warm hugs I received in return from Dad, Mom and Aunt...through their devastation, it was as though they were trying to comfort all of us there.

Fly with the angels, sweet girl. May those she has left behind somehow find some peace in the fullness of time. I can't say what I'd like to about the in jail, as I'd like to avoid a TO on my first post!!

 

[grandmaj]

Cosmetology today allows for us to grant a family wish to have a viewing, where years ago it was not possible.

While Jorelys may not have looked natural which is terribly upsetting, for some families it is important that a viewing occur. Some of it is religious background. But mostly it is important for the family to be able to work through their final goodbye. I'm sure the prep work was difficult, and that the Director counseled the family about what to expect. But if the family needed this viewing, then it was important that it occur.

I'm a funeral director. Except in very rare instances, we will work with a family and their wishes in order to move them through the process of saying their final goodbye. I have been upset many times by the condition of the victim. I will always counsel the family ahead of time. The final choice is theirs alone, whether to view or not view.

Regardless of the final cosmetic outcome, we do our best to allow the family to hold a child's hand, to kiss a forehead and in the case of infants to sit in a rocking chair and rock the baby for however long it takes to allow them to say their forever goodbye.

Believe me the family found comfort in having this time with a baby who was taken in the most horrific way from them. They just needed to lay their hands and eyes on her. It is all part of a process. To not do this for a family can deny them a chance to work through a difficult process. They needed to hold and hug her. They needed to have hours when other people could also say their goodbyes and comfort them.

For whatever reason the family needed this and the emotional aspect is more important in my opinion than the actual condition of Jorelys.

All of the injuries have been clearly documented during the autopsy process. I don't think a viewing is an indication that the injuries were not as severe as stated by LE. That has been documented and will be used at trial. IMO there are probably details that we haven't even been told about yet. RIP Jorelys.